Author Topic: The Shivans, Why do they do what they do?  (Read 24601 times)

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Offline copiae

  • 23
The Shivans, Why do they do what they do?
Finally, the wacky theory.


So, what did Bosch see that was different to those experienced researchers before him? Well, the monologues of the ancients call the shivans "the destroyers... the revenge of an angry cosmos". What if Bosch took this literally, and saw the Shivans _as_weapons? Superficially, this theory makes a great deal of sense. The shivans are extremely resistant to heat and cold, which is very useful for designing ships that utilise beams, and for fighting in space. They have very hard bodies, with weapons embedded in them, and have ships capable of tremendous destruction. They are also fearless fighters.


So, Bosch saw the shivans as constructed weapons. Indeed, this fits in with thier displayed intelligence levels. The last thing you want in a weapon is too much intelligence, but some intelligence is also necessary in order for it to function correctly. An easy way to do this is have a collective intelligence going - No unit has enough intelligence to be dangerous, but as a whole, there is sufficient intelligence to wage war. Incidentally, This also explains thier relatively stagnant technological development. From just before the great war to just after the second great war, the terrans had gone from being hopelessly outclassed to just about on par, in terms of technological development, and the behaviour of the shivans after the Lucifer was destroyed (Perhaps if thier, uh, node for getting commands from the collective intelligence vanishes, then they are forced to use thier own limited intelligence, hence their "erratic" [I'm reading this as strategically stupid] behaviour).


Of course, making the shivans out as weapons raises two questions.

1) Who made them...

2) And for what purpose?


Since both are linked, I'll answer them together. What we know is that they appeared after the Ancients had pretty much conquered thier known galaxy, and that they did not appear in force... rather, they sort of appeared in one system, beat the ancients, and spread from there. Then, the shivan fleet began systematically destroying system after system (and by destroying, its implied something like Vasuda Prime), until they destroyed the Ancients completely, paving the way for the Terrans and the Vasudans. Then, along came the Terrans and the Vasudans. This time, the Shivans did something differently. Rather than systematically destroy them (which they were more than capable of doing), they went straight for Vasuda Prime, torched that planet, and made a beeline for earth. Seems kinda odd, doesn't it?


My theory is quite simple, actually. The shivans are weapons, made by entities who either exist in subspace, or are ...sensitive to it. Maybe whenever an intra-system subspace jump is made, (i.e. not in the inter-system corridors), subspace gets "torn", and enough tearing results in the very fabric of the space-time continuum being ripped to shreds. Speaking of space-time, an interesting conjecture here is that subspace also contains the capability of time travel (as space and time are linked, after all). These entities are far enough removed from both the ancients and humanity (either in terms of space, or time), that it is easier to create a self-replicating weapon and send it to eliminate the disruptions, then to come themselves and eliminate it.


Ok, there is actually a bit of data in the game that "proves" the Shivan-subspace disturbance link. Look at when and how the Shivans attacked us. In any wartime, subspace jumps are going to be at thier peak (as forces are constantly moving around, seeking an advantage). It as at this time that the Lucifer fleet attacks, oddly not systematically, but going for the capital planets... I think that this is because the level of our subspace disturbance wasnt enough to be a "nuisance" (maybe this means that the Shivans use a different sort of battle plan?).Fast forward to humanity after the great war. Here, the shivans leave us well alone. Odd that. If they were so hell-bent on our destruction in this period, I'm sure they would have found some random unstable node and used it, which seems to indicate that they had no reason to, or did not want to (although this seems like circumstantial evidence, to say the least). Maybe we were below the threshold of Subspace use for being annihilated, again.


Now, the reason why I mentioned language earlier is that in order for Bosch to have communicated with the Shivans, there MUST be some commonality, indicating that the Shivans were of a Terran, Vasudan, Ancient, or other known species creation. If subspace allows space travel, then Shivans being of Terran design is a certain possibilty. However, I've been doing some thinking on this, and I am going to reject it. Theres just too many inconsistencies (the grandfather paradox, for one) in this thinking. The only way out of the inconsistencies is to view time as static -> The Terrans HAD to make the shivans and send them back in time to kill off the Ancients and let the Terrans prosper. However, theres very little in Freespace, or Freespace2 to support this, and when I say very little, I mean nothing else. I think its much easier to say that Volition were unaware of the philosophy of language.


Anyway, if Bosch saw the Shivans as weapons, maybe he surmised the reason why they came to be created (subspace disturbions). Maybe it is because of this that Bosch knew that conflict with the Shivans was inevitable. This is all well and good, but Bosch must have learnt two other things as well somehow: How and what to communicate with the Shivans in order to get them to take him to thier creators. Once he is with thier creators, Bosch presumably thought that he could get them to stop thier Shivan forces, or teach him (and greater humanity) the secrets of how to use subspace properly.


Finally, I'd like to reject Petrarchs theory in the ending, at least partially. If they used a supernova to get home, why not do it at another system? Why Capella, Perhaps he is right in saying they used the supernova to get home (perhaps the destruction of a star leads to a destabilisation of subspace, such that ordinarily impossible modes of transport become possible. Maybe, instead, the Shivans simply had no reason to return home, prior to meeting Bosch.


There are so many things I've left unanswered, and unexplored here ( Shivans using subspace, Differing technological capabilites of the Lucifer fleet and the Shivan armada, Comm Nodes, and the Ship of Fools just to name a few), but frankly, I've already written a lot about this, and I honestly doubt anyone here is going to read it. Maybe in a few weeks or months, I'll get my act together, and create the Bosch manifesto (in tribute to the Shivan manifesto), which explores everything in much greater detail.

What I would like more then anything else for now is for people to pick holes in my theory.

 

Offline Kie99

  • 211
The Shivans, Why do they do what they do?
Shivans often use intra-system jumps, if intra system jumps were so bad then they wouldn't have been created with this ability, they would have developed light speed travel or something like that.
"You shot me in the bollocks, Tim"
"Like I said, no hard feelings"

  

Offline copiae

  • 23
The Shivans, Why do they do what they do?
Quote
Originally posted by kietotheworld
Shivans often use intra-system jumps, if intra system jumps were so bad then they wouldn't have been created with this ability, they would have developed light speed travel or something like that.


Maybe the system they use is similar, but not quite the same... i.e. maybe a subspace jump thats not as disruptive. Of course, if its a small change thats required, this does beg the question of why the 'fix' wasn't dropped off at Terran/Vasudan/Ancient HQ. Problem solved, and no DSFI or II :).

The problem with this reasoning as well is that presumably Bosch knew that this was the key to an 'alliance' with the Shivans... so that it was something obvious enough for him to figure out, yet elusive enough for them not to have figured out. :wtf: Or maybe, the Shivan creators simply did not consider Terrans, Vasudans or Ancients to be capable of implementing the change. This is not so far-fetched... Consider the prevalent attitude of people towards tribal natives in the 18th and 19th century regarding education.


Maybe, the Shivans even tried to be friendly towards the Ancients in the absolute beginning, but as is stated in the ancient monologues, they were total bastards towards foreign races, and tried attacking them, causing the Shivans to retalitate, and deviate from thier original intent...  *Shrug*


An alternate answer is that the system they use is totally different, but uses the same medium (kinda like the difference between a propellor engine and a rocket).


Thanks for the reply =)