Author Topic: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session  (Read 5660 times)

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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
Someone get me off my ass and force me to read Bookttuta already.  It's been gathering dust on my shelf for half a year.

Okay Mongoose, either read it or I'll steal it from you.
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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
"Leviathan wakes" part1, by James S.A Corey.

Went quickly through first 50 pages and I really enjoyed it. My plan is to read all the books available and then watch "The Expanse" series.

 

Offline The E

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
So I recently got struck by the MilSF bug again, and decided to go back to the subgenre's beginning. Specifically, Heinlein's Starship Troopers.
This is a book I last read more than 20 years ago, long before I started to read fiction in english. Let me tell you, reading MilSF in german is supremely weird. In english, military speak (i.e. the particular tone and vocabulary soldiers adopt) doesn't carry strong moral connotations, and if they do, they're mostly positive. When translated into german however, that tone takes on an extra, nazi-flavoured dimension. As a result, while I do remember liking the book and even finding some of its politics reasonable (hey, I was 12, give me a break), I have soured on it considerably since.
So I tried reading it again. And it's immediately apparent why this book was so formative, and why it is so revered among certain groups of readers and writers. It is very well written, and because Heinlein never succumbs to the temptation of going into too much detail about the technology of his universe, it has not succumbed to zeerust as much as most works from its time period have (well, apart from the way characters talk, of course; the vernacular is distinctly 50s american, and thus comes across as a bit weird in this day and age). The book adopts a distinct tone, that of the veteran dictating his memoirs or talking about what he did during the war in a bar or something. It's a very good choice, allowing Heinlein the freedom to jump from anecdote to anecdote (and back and forth in time) without really breaking the flow of the story.

The books' major theme is that of command responsibility. Over and over again, the question of what it means to have power over others is brought up, as is the question of what the moral implications of that power are. Starship Troopers offers us a world in which the military's sense of responsibility is held as superior over what a mere civilian can aspire to; indeed, to be a citizen in full command of all the rights and responsibilities a citizen in a democratic society has requires that one serves in the armed forces for at least 2 years. Veterans, we are told, are innately more aware of the moral implications of having authority, and are thus able to govern more responsibly.

To say that I have issues with that concept now would be an understatement. But this book is helpful in understanding the points of view of so many modern conservative-flavoured authoritarians (like, for example, the (Sad|Rabid) Puppies crowd or the Baen people): To them, the idea that political power isn't a priviledge that is earned (as power in a military setting is), but rather one that is considered innate to each citizen is abhorrent. In Starship Troopers, putting the military in charge works out just fine: Civilian life seems pretty utopian and peaceful (at least, what little we know of it), assuming one can get over the judicial system having switched from a rehabilitation-based one to one based on swift and brutal punishment (public flogging being the go-to punishment for pretty much anything, we are told at one point that someone getting 10 lashes for insubordination and assaulting a superior officer is less than what someone caught speeding gets).

So, overall, what do I take away from this? Well, I am still pretty much convinced that the book's morals are firmly rooted in a vision of humanity that is deeply negative, deeply misanthropic. A good society, it tells us, is one that is fascist; Only when the welfare of the individual is subordinated to the welfare of the state does the individual prosper. It describes a world in which violence is a necessary tool not just in terms of violence against other states (the very first scene describes a raid against a civilian city the protagonist takes part in, ordnance flies freely, and at one point, our hero uses a flamethrower to incinerate someone who made the bad choice of stepping on the street), but also as a tool to teach people to be good citizens.
It's still a well-written book. It's still definitely worth reading and discussing. But as a vision of the future, it is something to be avoided.
If I'm just aching this can't go on
I came from chasing dreams to feel alone
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I really need lifе to touch me
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Offline Damage

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
Starship Troopers is a classic no doubt about it.  (I'm sorry to say I've not read more of Heinlein's work, apart from Stranger in a Strange Land.)  It's one of those books I pick up and reread about once a year, hoping for the day when my kids will be interested in reading it with me.  (Ender's Game and LoTR are also on this list.)


Meanwhile, Dune!
I didn't feel like putting anything here.  Then I did it anyway just to be contrary.

 

Offline StarSlayer

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
I always felt that by incentivizing military service as the only rout towards political power you degrade the very values that Heinlein felt made veterans  uniquely suited towards decision making.

Anyway

Shaara ACW Trilogy:
-Gods and Generals
-The Killer Angels
-The Last Full Measure


James S. A. Corey
-Leviathan Wakes
“Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world”

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
I've had some design studio press books for about four years now. I'm just going back through them all. In particular I'm focused on Scott Robertson - how to draw. It's very good. (I figured a book is a book)
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
- Blue Planet: Battle Captains
-Battle of Neptune
-Between the Ashes 2
-Blue planet: Age of Aquarius
-FOTG?
-Inferno R1
-Ribos: The aftermath / -Retreat from Deneb
-Sol: A History
-TBP EACW teaser
-Earth Brakiri war
-TBP Fortune Hunters (I think?)
-TBP Relic
-Trancsend (Possibly?)
-Uncharted Territory
-Vassagos Dirge
-War Machine
(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

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Offline The E

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
I've been reading Shadow of Victory by David Weber.

What a dreadful slog the Honor Harrington series has become is more evident than ever in this book. It's 800 pages of setup and recap of events that have already been set up and recapped in A Rising Thunder, Storm from the Shadows and Shadow of Freedom (the three preceding books). To Weber's credit, he at least managed to write new text for all the chapters in this book (unlike previous installments of the series, where certain chapters were copied wholesale between books). Weber himself has assured his fans that all the added stuff in this book is required to set up the next installment, which will definitely (he promises) move the timeline forward, but I for one am reaaaalllyyyy skeptical about that.
If I'm just aching this can't go on
I came from chasing dreams to feel alone
There must be changes, miss to feel strong
I really need lifе to touch me
--Evergrey, Where August Mourns

 

Offline StarSlayer

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
Has anyone tried the Manticore Prequels he has been doing with Timothy Zhan?  Or more specifically are they any good?
“Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world”

 

Offline The E

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
I've read the first one, which wasn't bad? It didn't leave much of an impression either way; It was however nice to read a story in that universe with battles that had actual stakes.
If I'm just aching this can't go on
I came from chasing dreams to feel alone
There must be changes, miss to feel strong
I really need lifе to touch me
--Evergrey, Where August Mourns

 

Offline AdmiralRalwood

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Re: The HLP Book Club - 2016 session
Has anyone tried the Manticore Prequels he has been doing with Timothy Zhan?  Or more specifically are they any good?
I read the first one and liked it; actually, I think that was the last Honorverse book I read.
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schrödinbug (noun) - a bug that manifests itself in running software after a programmer notices that the code should never have worked in the first place.

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(the very next day)
<MageKing17> this ****ing code did it to me again
<MageKing17> "That doesn't really make sense to me, but I'll assume it was being done for a reason."
<MageKing17> **** ME
<MageKing17> THE REASON IS PEOPLE ARE STUPID
<MageKing17> ESPECIALLY ME

<MageKing17> God damn, I do not understand how this is breaking.
<MageKing17> Everything points to "this should work fine", and yet it's clearly not working.
<MjnMixael> 2 hours later... "God damn, how did this ever work at all?!"
(...)
<MageKing17> so
<MageKing17> more than two hours
<MageKing17> but once again we have reached the inevitable conclusion
<MageKing17> How did this code ever work in the first place!?

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<MageKing17> It was all working perfectly until I actually tried it on an actual mission.

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