Hard Light Productions Forums

General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: Firesteel on May 29, 2017, 07:38:19 pm

Title: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on May 29, 2017, 07:38:19 pm
Hey HLP, I thought it'd be appropriate to share my kicking off a series of undetermined length on Freespace on the board. I'm planning on doing quite a few videos on the retail campaigns and then switching over to the community stuff (probably in some kind of chronological order with the exception of ST:R being a segue into talking about 2). Let me know what you guys think of this as an introduction and any suggestions you have as far as showcasing the community stuff or if I should just use General Battuta's guide as a blueprint for going through the campaigns on here.

Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Mongoose on May 29, 2017, 08:07:10 pm
Fixed your embed there.  Don't post the HTML, just put the actual video ID inside the [yt] tags.

And I don't have the time to watch the whole thing right now, but the bit I saw sounds really good. :yes:
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on May 29, 2017, 09:20:04 pm
Thanks for that. I hardly ever post YT links here.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Luis Dias on May 30, 2017, 03:31:35 am
Wow and right at the start a big shoutout towards my direction! Thanks :D
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: starlord on May 30, 2017, 11:54:40 am
Great. Could you please LP the memories of the great war campaign series if you can?
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: The E on May 30, 2017, 12:30:51 pm
Excellent intro, Firesteel, looking forward to more!
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: mjn.mixael on May 30, 2017, 12:47:31 pm
Agreed with The E. Excellent intro. I'm definitely interested to see more.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on May 30, 2017, 02:10:25 pm
Glad you guys like it so far! I'm not a let's player but I can definitely look at Memories of the Great War and see how much I can figure out as far as doing something analytical.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: PVD_Hope on May 30, 2017, 03:19:01 pm
Awesome. An insightful discussion of a worthy game series. Thanks a bunch!

I like the way you described the sense of powerlessness, horror, and even wonder that the retail campaigns gave to the player. You put into words something that I've sensed for a long time but couldn't put into words - it was the atmosphere that drew me in with Freespace 1, and the reason why that game is my favorite of the two. I thought it pulled off that isolation, wonder, horror... maybe just a little better than the second. Both games did it real well though.

Not to mention you're an excellent commentator. You take your time but your voice isn't dull, and I can tell that you mean what you say. Are you taking lessons or something? :P

Can't wait to see more! Keep it up!
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: starlord on May 30, 2017, 03:54:51 pm
Many thanks. Many of those campaigns deserve some form of attention.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on May 30, 2017, 04:51:17 pm
Thank you for the kind words. I'm also a playwright and I've done a fair amount of cold readings of both complete and in progress works, so that's probably helping me out.

From a narrative standpoint, I find the two games surprisingly different for how similar their style and pacing is. The Shivans are (re)introduced at mission 4 or 5 depending on the game and there's some kind of rebellion/splinter group keeping the T-V war wounds fresh. Freespace 1 has a special place in my heart because of how it introduces the Shivans (part of the next video) and how it makes the wait for the Avenger and shields a brutal affair on higher difficulties. (I spent hours replaying the Hammer and the Anvil for that medal, and about 35% of the time it was because I got too trigger happy with the HOL right at the end).

FS2's version of Out of the Dark, Into the Night (The Great Hunt) is probably the best example of the difference in the attitude of the GTVA vs. the GTA and PVE and something they'll dearly pay for as FS2 progresses.

Most of the stuff on HLP deserves more attention for how much effort and love is put in, and maybe at some point I'll get off my ass and relearn FRED so I can finally make the mini-campaign I've been sitting on for 2 years.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Droid803 on May 30, 2017, 05:54:48 pm
Great stuff.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Axem on May 30, 2017, 09:17:05 pm
Very cool stuff. I look very forward to the future entries. (And thanks for that name drop ;) <3 <3 <3)

(Just as a small critique, I felt you had a few sentences that you spoke a little too fast (You have a very nice voice (so don't rob us of that time by rushing!)))
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: jg18 on May 30, 2017, 10:02:26 pm
Agreed, very cool stuff. :yes: Also looking forward to seeing more.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on May 31, 2017, 12:38:23 am
Thanks guys, and yes, there are a few of those moments (I need to breath more :D)
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Nyctaeus on May 31, 2017, 09:27:19 am
Great stuff! Especially useful for newcomers.

One tip: talk a little bit slower. Make some pauses between individual parts of the video. While native english speakers probably won't have problems with understanding this, players from non-english countries may find this problematic.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Goober5000 on May 31, 2017, 12:45:16 pm
Great work on the video, and I appreciated the name-drop as well. :)

Firesteel, the single most important thing I would suggest is to work on your cadence.  Your enunciation is good, volume is good, and speed is good (albeit slightly faster than probably necessary).  But your cadence is very regular, which makes the narration sound somewhat like the Architect's speech (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKpFFD7aX3c) in the unofficial Matrix sequel.  Try varying it a bit, and taking some pauses.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Xelion on May 31, 2017, 12:56:33 pm
I enjoyed that :yes: It was an enlightening 81/2 minutes. You bring up some good points that I've never thought about.

Are youtube CCs always this inaccurate.. odd, I'm sure there meant to be better.

I must say, every time I see another video on this game, the graphics just blow me away :D
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on May 31, 2017, 02:06:35 pm
Good advice Goober and something I've been slowly trying to work on, albeit very slowly.

And yes, YouTube's CCs are as bad as you think, turn them on with any video and you're in for some hilarity if they're algorithmically generated.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Bryan See on May 31, 2017, 02:22:20 pm
Well and informative. It helps to understand what FreeSpace is. :)
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on June 02, 2017, 01:58:25 pm
As far as my upload schedule (which barely exists still) I'm planning on doing a Freespace video every other upload to break it up both for the channel's sake and so I don't go too far down the rabbit hole and never come back  :D. The next upload will be about Prey 2017 and why I'm having such a hard time getting into it, so don't worry, after that I'll be looking at how FS1 uses everything in its opening moments and missions to build an entire world with as little text as possible!
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: General Battuta on June 02, 2017, 02:47:18 pm
Will you be addressing the Vasudan foothold on Vasuda Prime? Is it implicit that the Terrans have established a base on Terra Prime??
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: General Battuta on June 02, 2017, 02:49:30 pm
All I'm trying to insinuate is the modest proposal that every genuinely interesting element of the FS universe comes from FS2 :battuta:
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on June 02, 2017, 03:06:54 pm
That is indeed a modest proposal. As I see it, FS1 created a foundation equivalent of rooting a house near the mantle and FS2 then went on to build a gorgeous house with a ridiculous amount of expandability.

So I guess what I'm saying is that I find the details surrounding operation thresher and all it implies interesting.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Phantom Hoover on June 02, 2017, 03:56:05 pm
 I think Battuta's perspective is that FS1's sole contribution was to provide something for FS2 to eat.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: General Battuta on June 02, 2017, 05:28:59 pm
That IS my opinion but I am a grouch and also not the one putting a ton of effort into a cool video series, so please carry on
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on June 02, 2017, 05:56:11 pm
Maybe, just maybe I'll be able to provide a few decent counterpoints to your opinion. Freespace 2 is easily one of the best sequels of all time.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Phantom Hoover on June 03, 2017, 01:30:15 pm
That IS my opinion but I am a grouch and also not the one putting a ton of effort into a cool video series, so please carry on

also while we're talking about freespace analysis, i remember you saying once that freespace 2 has incredible ludonarrative harmony 'even down to the interface art' — could you elaborate on that? do you mean that it's dark, dreary and clinical, with little concession to wing commander-style cosy skeuomorphism?
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on June 03, 2017, 03:00:32 pm
The main menus in FS change depending on where you are in the campaign and act as a hub for both the software itself and the experienceb (they are flight decks). On top of that the story has no presumption of agency and has more interest in making you feel small than powerful (even in FS1, you destroy the Eva but it costs the Galatea). FS2 goes all in on this principle with the Sathanas. (I'm on my phone so I'm not typing any essays here).

The HUD is a utilitarian as hell design and is reminiscent of a lot of modern military systems with a few more flourishes here and there.

A lot of the ships in FS aren't designed with aerodynamics in mind (ursa or herc anyone?) But are designed around target profiles or maximizing fields of fire (FS2 leviathan's aa beams, the pegasus's razor thin profile, or the deimos's turret coverage while looking like a rounded brick).
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: FIZ on June 03, 2017, 05:38:12 pm
Thank you for posting this.

I was watching something else when I had this sudden urge to dive back into the FS universe.  Was frustrated from how out of date all my installers are, no idea if wxLauncher was up to date with bested graphics, joystick covered in ash. 

This video was a counterweight to my impulse.  Go back.  Enjoy the original tale.  Remember why, after ~15 years ago, this game spoke out to me in a big box store.  Remember in the impetuous of youth you played as god almighty... on easy. 

Flash.  You tire of easy settings.  The enemy is smart too.  I fumble between settings justifying it with AI accuracy.  Still remember.  I don't mind being a pawn if the game makes sense.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on June 12, 2017, 02:56:36 pm
Just so this is somewhere a little more central, my current plans for video releases is Freespace every other video. The next upload will be about immersive sims (like Prey 2017 and Bioshock) then looking at the first part of Freespace 1, then something talking about VA-11 Hall-A, then more Freespace, and so on.
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: mjn.mixael on June 29, 2017, 12:44:46 pm
MOAR VIDEOS REQUIRED
Title: Re: Starting Some Analysis
Post by: Firesteel on June 30, 2017, 03:08:45 am
I'm working on it (see my forum text). I've been busy working on this Prey video that's ballooned because of my need for footage and slowly warming up to the game 11 hours in. The  next Freespace video will hopefully not take me a month but I'm moving next week so we'll see. The topic is something I've already had drafts of so that process should be faster.