Author Topic: Delenda Est (spoiler!)  (Read 40184 times)

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Offline qwadtep

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
I haven't had any luck isolating everything, but the old mission file (edited to accommodate for the Karuna model changes) runs precisely as it used to on RC5, no uberbombers or failure screens in sight. I'm attaching it for others to confirm, and as a hotfix until we figure out exactly what changed.

The Katana and Altan Orde did still weirdly lose health after the Imperiuse arrived, which might be a weird collision problem with the Carthage.

Digging through the file itself, it seems that all of the Carthage's turrets have been set to BP2-General (prepatch they were FS2-Captain) which could be contributing the the Katana's problems. I also feel like the Wargods frigates were firing a lot more missiles prepatch, so they might be getting disarmed somehow. Haven't managed to figure out where the bombers' crack dealer is yet.

[attachment deleted by ninja]

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Turret AI should change literally nothing in the game, I don't think it's referenced at all in the code.

 

Offline qwadtep

  • 28
Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
That's what I thought, too, which is why I found it weird that it was changed.

 
Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Turret AI should change literally nothing in the game, I don't think it's referenced at all in the code.
Because AI profiles that are not referenced anywhere have never caused problems in Delenda Est before. :p

 

Offline qwadtep

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
In any case, it's easy enough to test. I'm more worried that there's a SEXP bug somewhere that's making uberturrets as well as uberbombers.

 

Offline niffiwan

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
I added a debug statement to the RC6 code, then played Delenda Est on Very Easy until the Katana was destroyed (just after the Imperieuse arrived but before it opened fire, so mission failed).  For a quick explanation I'm logging:

1) the ship taking damage
2) how much damage was applied to the ship (after all other calculations are complete, e.g. armour mods / subsystem damage / etc)
3) what weapon did the damage

Code: [Select]
Index: code/ship/shiphit.cpp
===================================================================
--- code/ship/shiphit.cpp    (revision 8748)
+++ code/ship/shiphit.cpp    (working copy)
@@ -2141,6 +2141,8 @@ static void ship_do_damage(object *ship_obj, object *other_obj, vec3d *hitpos, f
  }
  }
  ship_obj->hull_strength -= damage;
+ // check who is causing what damage & to whom
+ mprintf(("Damage: A took B from C:i%s,%f,%s\n",shipp->ship_name,damage,Weapon_info[weapon_info_index].name));
  }
 
  // let damage gauge know that player ship just took damage

This needs some refinement as the 3rd field doesn't capture stuff like the beam names, collision "names", etc, despite that this has showed some interesting data.

Code: [Select]
$ grep Damage fs2_open.log | grep Katana | cut -d',' -f 2 | awk '{ sum+=$1} END {print sum}'
85266.8
grep Damage fs2_open.log | grep Katana | grep Apocalypse | cut -d',' -f 2 | awk '{ sum+=$1} END {print sum}'
42302.1

The Katana takes approximately half its damage (42k out of 85k) from Apocalypse torpedoes.  :wtf: 

That doesn't seem right, maybe its own torps are hitting itself, or perhaps someone else is firing into the Katana?  I'm going to see if I can find how to reference who launched these torpedoes but it'll be probably 4-5 hours before I can look at this again, so I'm just throwing this out there in case someone else wants to dig further in the meantime.
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Offline Aesaar

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Does the game factor in LOD geometry when checking whether or not a weapon hits?  If it does, then torpedoes launched from turret36 (second launcher on top, closest to the conning tower) are hitting the conning tower.  This is because LOD1-3 are all 60m or so further forward than LOD0 (and the turrets) are.  The LODs are offset in PCS2 to resolve this, but it obviously doesn't keep.  If you remove that offset, the LODs look misaligned like they are ingame.

I'm going to try Delenda Est with the old Karuna model, see if that solves the problem.

EDIT: It did.  Tried Delenda Est, and apart from the 20 to 4 FPS, it played just fine (well, as well as it can at that FPS).  There was a marked increase in the survival rate of the Indus and Katana.  Tried Collateral Damage, and the Akula made it with a good 30% health left (before SSMs), whereas before it almost always died.  The problem is almost certainly with KarunaMk1.pof.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2012, 02:34:42 am by Aesaar »

 

Offline qwadtep

  • 28
Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Makes sense. I'll play with the detail distances to confirm after some sleep, provided you haven't done it yourself by then.

 

Offline The E

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Could you try again with this Karuna model: http://blueplanet.fsmods.net/E/KarunaMk1.7z
If I'm just aching this can't go on
I came from chasing dreams to feel alone
There must be changes, miss to feel strong
I really need lifе to touch me
--Evergrey, Where August Mourns

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
ahahahaha

 

Offline niffiwan

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  • Eluder Class
Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
I've done some testing with the Karuna linked by The E, in Collateral Damage (it's faster to test with than Delenda Est :)) it seems to have made a fairly big difference, the Akula took ~9k self Apocalypse damage with the new model, and ~28k with the old model.
Creating a fs2_open.log | Red Alert Bug = Hex Edit | MediaVPs 2014: Bigger HUD gauges | 32bit libs for 64bit Ubuntu
----
Debian Packages (testing/unstable): Freespace2 | wxLauncher
----
m|m: I think I'm suffering from Stockholm syndrome. Bmpman is starting to make sense and it's actually written reasonably well...

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Can you also check this vs. the old old model? How much Apocalypse self-damage does it deal?

 

Offline Cyborg17

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  • Life? Don't talk to me about life....
Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Sounds like this is a good day.  :D

 

Offline Kolgena

  • 211
Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Nice. Aside from properly centering the LODs, what else was changed in the Karuna a few posts up?

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
The_E didn't mention anything else

 

Offline The E

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Well, I did fix the texture assignment for the extra greebles on the engine block on lod0 so that it looks as intended.
If I'm just aching this can't go on
I came from chasing dreams to feel alone
There must be changes, miss to feel strong
I really need lifе to touch me
--Evergrey, Where August Mourns

 

Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Oh I gotta catch that for HWBP, always bothered me.
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

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Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Y'all should change the tech room description

Quote
... It would not be an exaggeration to suggest that the Apocalypse is the single greatest reason why the Federation fleet has not yet been shattered. GTVA UEF warship commanders and fighter pilots have struggled to effectively screen their own ships from incoming outgoing Apocalypse flights...

 :D

 

Offline qwadtep

  • 28
Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Did some testing. Ain't a LOD problem. Torpedoes from turret36 go right through the misaligned LOD1+ tower.

(Engaging a locked Deimos directly above it at ~900m, $Detail distance: (0, 10, 30000, 30000))

Karuna still takes 7% self-damage though, persisting at all LODs even with The_E's fix. Only occurs in combat. Can't figure out exactly where it's coming from--doesn't even cause impact or damage spew and I ramped it up to big-circular-anime-explosion levels to check.

I suppose the next thing is to start systematically disabling turrets to isolate the problem... ugh.

e: looks like it's just splash from Apocalypse explosions. Apparently the radius is much, much bigger than they look, on the order of 1km or so. Probably best to be careful with those broadsides.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2012, 03:16:12 pm by qwadtep »

 
Re: Delenda Est (spoiler!)
Don't missiles not have collision detection with the ship that they are fired from anyways?