[Narvi]

After well over 15 years of playing FS2 with mouse and keyboard, I finally went and bought a joystick (your basic Extreme 3D Pro) for THE AUTHENTIC EXPERIENCE, and let me tell you, I am complete balls at it now.

Can't hit dingus, all my reflexes are tuned to keyboard so I can't roll or pitch or yaw for love or money, and I'm not used to handling a joystick so my hand hurts five minutes in.

I was going to play ST-R again but since I'm getting wiped in the first mission... maybe not. I am not the great space pilot jockey.

Might be time to go back to basics, start the vanilla campaign on easy like I did as a wee babby, and scale up, me thinks! i mean, it's still kind of fun. It's important to try new things.

So, got any preferences for joystick use? Sensitivity settings? Any amusing stories?

[Macfie]

I've been using a joystick since I started.  I found with a mouse I couldn't turn fast enough to hit anything.  Before the joystick I couldn't pass the third training mission in the FS1 campaign.  The first joystick I had was a sidewinder pro.  It would only control pitch and yaw and had a trigger.  It was better than a key board but you had to use the keyboard to roll and fire missiles.  The joystick didn't last long before the springs broke and it developed a continuous left turn.  Getting the first joystick where I could roll at the same time I turned made such a huge difference.  I went through a series of joysticks all lasting about 6 months before failing in one direction or another.  I finally bought an Extreme 3D Pro that finally after 11 years has failed so will get another.  I find for me setting the sensitivity and deadband at three dots works best for me.   

[mosshadow]

Maybe you need to change sensitivity?

[Phantom Hoover]

^{i always said m+kb was perfectly good}

[AdmiralRalwood]

^{i always said m+kb was perfectly good}

* AdmiralRalwood fistbumps Phantom Hoover

[Mongoose]

Performance-wise sure, but what self-respecting actual pilot would be caught dead flying with a little plastic oval?

[Droid803]

Precision aiming is a lot easier with a mouse, but turning is much more fluid with a joystick.
I used to switch between the two depending on what was necessary (usually stuck to joystick, mouse only for "sniping" or nailing that one hard-to-hit erratically swerving 'fury ai' fighter in a 1v1)

Then I discovered converging autoaim as a table option.

[BirdofPrey]

Definitely a good assessment. I've been doing a lot of interface testing lately which requires me to jump in to the game for only a few minutes, so I can;t be bothered to set up the joystick only to have it be in my way when I go back to editing, so I've ended up using the mouse rather often.  The mouse is great for nailing those long range shots, but it is pretty bad when it comes to a turning fight since, no matter the sensitivity, at some point you have to pick up the mouse and reposition it, and going in a straight line is BAD.

I'd say, though, it's the throttle I end up missing more than the joystick.  The mouse still allows for fine turning maneuvers, but doesn't give throttle control, and the keyboard is granular rather than continuous, and with the default bindings I find the throttle keys to be in a bad position.  Also I miss all those buttons at my fingertips without moving my hand (I could set up the Nostromo for FS, but that'd be pointless since I actually PLAY with a HOTAS)

[BritishShivans]

^{i always said m+kb was perfectly good}

* AdmiralRalwood fistbumps Phantom Hoover

* BritishShivans joins in the fistbumping

[niffiwan]

I use an Extreme 3D Pro with sensitivity to max and deadzone to min.  I reckon being able to use it effectively is mostly muscle memory, and building up enough strength/control in the appropriate muscles that you can move the stick around evenly and fluidly, especially when trying for precise aiming at small targets. Don't get me wrong, I find the mouse is always better at that, but with enough practise you can get pretty good at it with the joystick as well.

[jr2]

Definitely a good assessment. I've been doing a lot of interface testing lately which requires me to jump in to the game for only a few minutes, so I can;t be bothered to set up the joystick only to have it be in my way when I go back to editing, so I've ended up using the mouse rather often.  The mouse is great for nailing those long range shots, but it is pretty bad when it comes to a turning fight since, no matter the sensitivity, at some point you have to pick up the mouse and reposition it, and going in a straight line is BAD.

I'd say, though, it's the throttle I end up missing more than the joystick.  The mouse still allows for fine turning maneuvers, but doesn't give throttle control, and the keyboard is granular rather than continuous, and with the default bindings I find the throttle keys to be in a bad position.  Also I miss all those buttons at my fingertips without moving my hand (I could set up the Nostromo for FS, but that'd be pointless since I actually PLAY with a HOTAS)

Can you bind the mouse wheel?

After well over 15 years of playing FS2 with mouse and keyboard, I finally went and bought a joystick (your basic Extreme 3D Pro) for THE AUTHENTIC EXPERIENCE, and let me tell you, I am complete balls at it now.

Can't hit dingus, all my reflexes are tuned to keyboard so I can't roll or pitch or yaw for love or money, and I'm not used to handling a joystick so my hand hurts five minutes in.

I was going to play ST-R again but since I'm getting wiped in the first mission... maybe not. I am not the great space pilot jockey.

Might be time to go back to basics, start the vanilla campaign on easy like I did as a wee babby, and scale up, me thinks! i mean, it's still kind of fun. It's important to try new things.

So, got any preferences for joystick use? Sensitivity settings? Any amusing stories?

Joystick response curves (test builds).

[BirdofPrey]

Can you bind the mouse wheel?

Probably.  Think I have it set as weapon switch at the moment.  I haven't really done any rebinding for the mouse since I only use it when I am jumping into the game for 5-10 minutes to test that things are working; I use a joystick for actual play sessions.

Joystick response curves (test builds).

That work with a Saitek X52 Pro?
I ask because, from what I hear, the X52 has a non-linear response curve programmed in already.
A response curve that isn't the best.  I still find the finest maneuvers a bit dodgy at times, still (one of these days, maybe I'll do the magnet mod)

[jr2]

Hmm, see here (bit of discussion):

https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/148471/saitek-x52-x52-pro-request-and-discussion

Supposedly this mod helps.

Oh, and you should look at this if you want to do the mod, it's an updated video from the one posted in that thread:

[BirdofPrey]

aaaand, now it's TOO sensitive in the middle.

Oh nevermind.  Somehow the profiler software bugged out and forgot where I set my sensitivity levels

[wardog300k]

i agree with Phantom Hoover

[jr2]

aaaand, now it's TOO sensitive in the middle.

Oh nevermind.  Somehow the profiler software bugged out and forgot where I set my sensitivity levels

Post back after some flying and let us know if this makes it easier for you. 

[BirdofPrey]

I wouldn't know since the Saitek software can't seem to save that detail.  Of course it's a total pain in the ass with every game I even NEED to set everything in the crappy profiling software.
The problem I am having setting sensitivity IN game is it basically just lowers the min and max values from the joystick, so you don't turn as fast when the stick is fully over, and what good is something like a Ulysseys if you can't actually get it to turn.



God I miss my sidewinder.  It was always tight and accurate.  I hope stuff like Elite and Star Citizen makes flight sims come back into vouge, so companies start selling more/better joysticks without the absurd prices. All we have now is either crappy, super expensive or no twist (with my desk pedals is too much trouble, but companies seem to like modeling joysticks on a real plane sometimes even for just one game rather than for end-user usability across various things)

[Klaustrophobia]

Twist axis is the ****.  The rudder rocker on my x45 is... adequate, but damn do I miss my cyborg 3d gold.  I once made a guy in multi kill himself trying to follow me as I flew a uly through one of the Ganymede dogfight maps.  I also remember racking up 20-30 kills per mission back in the day.  Can't come anywhere close to that any more.  I constantly overshoot in dogfights, I used to be dead on all the time.  Not sure that is the result of the joystick, skill atrophy, or this mysterious change in joystick behavior under windows 7 (vs. XP) that I have seen people post about before, but don't understand at all.

[Dragon]

Last time I used a twist axis in a realistic flightsim, I nearly broke my wrist. Pedals FTW. They're a pricey addition, I admit, but nothing beats those (at least CH ones) for both immersion and precision, though.

[BirdofPrey]

I do admit the tension required to twist my Saitek makes it hard to hit most of the top buttons.   Makes it hard to use dumbfire missiles against fighters.   The leftmost button is my countermeasures and I don't think I want to change it.

Still pedals don't work well for my desk situation.


On an immersion side note,  at the moment spacecraft use twist sticks rather than pedals, but they aren't fighters.