Author Topic: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend! (Updated 08/27/2011 - r7538)  (Read 61515 times)

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Offline chief1983

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
All previous Antipodes features are in trunk now, and this is based off trunk after those merges, so yes, it includes them all.
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Offline Admiral LSD

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
In $FS2\data\players (where $FS2 represents where you have installed FreeSpace 2, preferably in "C:\Games") there is a "single" and a "multi" folder.

I was kind of hoping the opportunity would have been taken to fix this mess (and bring the Windows builds into line with the Linux and OS X ones)...
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Offline General Battuta

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
In $FS2\data\players (where $FS2 represents where you have installed FreeSpace 2, preferably in "C:\Games") there is a "single" and a "multi" folder.

I was kind of hoping the opportunity would have been taken to fix this mess (and bring the Windows builds into line with the Linux and OS X ones)...

Fix what mess?

 

Offline Admiral LSD

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Storing user data in non-user locations.
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Offline General Battuta

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Like moving them to Documents or some **** like that?

 

Offline Admiral LSD

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
I was thinking %APPDATA% or %LOCALAPPDATA%, but Documents would probably be better as it's easier to direct users to to grab debug logs and whatnot (which is probably why commercial games are increasingly taking that approach).
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Offline Echelon9

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
I was thinking %APPDATA% or %LOCALAPPDATA%, but Documents would probably be better as it's easier to direct users to to grab debug logs and whatnot (which is probably why commercial games are increasingly taking that approach).

Note that Mantis 2118 - Move all configuration and logging data on all platforms to %APPDATA% already covers this. As well, the Mac location currently used is not correct, so if we're changing the Windows location we should change the Mac one as well in one swoop.

 

Offline Admiral LSD

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Any idea when that one swoop will be though? Even if we ignore Vista, 7 has been out in one form or another for two years and there's been almost no movement on this issue in that time. I realise it's not your mess to begin with, but it's long past crunch time for cleaning it up.
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Offline Echelon9

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Any idea when that one swoop will be though? Even if we ignore Vista, 7 has been out in one form or another for two years and there's been almost no movement on this issue in that time. I realise it's not your mess to begin with, but it's long past crunch time for cleaning it up.
I don't know, this is something for the Windows SCP devs to look at, I'm just adding in a change from the Mac side. Although, I agree there are big benefits to doing this.

I believe that by making this change, FS2_Open should run without the user being Administrator, as the program won't be writing to the Program Files directory.

 

Offline Admiral LSD

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Windows Vista/7 already have a system in place to take care of programs writing to protected directories (which helps to partly absolve Microsofts role in creating the mess in the first place), but it's no substitute for devs doing things right from their end not to mention it can result in a little head scratching if you aren't aware of what's going on because the only clue provided is a "Compatibility Files" button on the Explorer toolbar which is both easy to miss and provides almost no info on what it actually does (it's also a pain to recreate virtual stores from scratch, like when you're restoring a computer you've formatted). Moving all this to a non-protected directory would not only clean things up a hell of a lot, but make that directory somewhere readily accessible, like Documents\FS2 Open or something, and, like I mentioned earlier, it becomes easier to direct users to for pulling out debug logs and whatnot.
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Offline Zacam

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
While it may be "user" data in terms of storing the Players settings and what have you, it makes sense that it is being stored in the APPLICATION directory as it is the application that needs to use it.

Many programs though (like blender, for instance) do at least prompt for where you would like for user specific application data to be stored, and I don't see a problem with giving FSO that flexibility of usage, but I detest the idea that we should change one static location for another, especially when the other is in and of itself a user controlled variable.

And that still doesn't address the game install location issue of both Vista and 7 having UAC protections on the Program Files (and/or Program Files (x86)) directories which is why it is still a good idea to have FreeSpace 2 installed to somewhere OTHER than either of those folders.
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[08/01 16:53:11] <sigtau> EveningTea: I have decided that I am a 32-bit registerkin.  Pronouns are eax, ebx, ecx, edx.
[08/01 16:53:31] <EveningTea> dhauidahh
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[08/01 16:53:40] * EveningTea froths at the mouth
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Offline Shivan Hunter

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Anyone care to elaborate on why /Freespace2/data/ is actually a bad place for fs2_open.log files? Other than that, well, it isn't?

 

Offline Zacam

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Anyone care to elaborate on why /Freespace2/data/ is actually a bad place for fs2_open.log files? Other than that, well, it isn't?

It isn't, really. But the "mess" referred to isn't just about the log file, but also about where the players pilot files are stored and other things.
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[08/01 16:53:11] <sigtau> EveningTea: I have decided that I am a 32-bit registerkin.  Pronouns are eax, ebx, ecx, edx.
[08/01 16:53:31] <EveningTea> dhauidahh
[08/01 16:53:32] <EveningTea> sak
[08/01 16:53:40] * EveningTea froths at the mouth
[08/01 16:53:40] <sigtau> i broke him, boys

 

Offline chief1983

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Once the installer installs an application, it should probably stop writing to its own program folder.  It's been a bad practice for over a decade, and some apps are still designed poorly to do it from the start.  Even Steam writes to its own folder, but I don't ever install those kinds of apps to Program Files anyway.
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Offline mjn.mixael

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Hmm, one thing I noticed when switching to FSPort and back is that this doesn't seem to like campaigns that replace other campaigns. FSPort's main campaign is freespace2.fc2. It gave me an error saying that the current campaign save file is incorrect. It still created a new .csg for FSPort and everything worked fine, but the error may cause some confusion down the road. I'm not sure if there is a code fix for this or if we should recommend that MODs no longer replace freespace2.fc2 like that.

I also got various crashes when selecting Vasudan Imperium through FSPort. Here's the log

[attachment deleted by admin]
« Last Edit: December 20, 2010, 11:10:02 pm by mjn.mixael »
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Offline Zacam

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Actually, FSPorts main campaign is freespace.fc2. However, it includes a copy of freespace2.fc2 that advises that you can't (or shouldn't) play the FreeSpace 2 Campaign with FSPort assets loaded.
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[08/01 16:53:11] <sigtau> EveningTea: I have decided that I am a 32-bit registerkin.  Pronouns are eax, ebx, ecx, edx.
[08/01 16:53:31] <EveningTea> dhauidahh
[08/01 16:53:32] <EveningTea> sak
[08/01 16:53:40] * EveningTea froths at the mouth
[08/01 16:53:40] <sigtau> i broke him, boys

 

Offline Zacam

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend!
Changelog Post for ANtipodes 8 Build 6876.
Incorperates Trunk features up to 6875.

Antipodes relevant/related fix commits detailed below.


Code: [Select]
------------------------------------------------------------------------
r6850 | karajorma | 2010-12-15 04:24:20 -0800 (Wed, 15 Dec 2010) | 1 line
Changed paths:
   M /branches/antipodes/code/pilotfile/csg.cpp

Might want to check that index is in bounds.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
r6853 | Zacam | 2010-12-15 04:39:52 -0800 (Wed, 15 Dec 2010) | 1 line
Changed paths:
   M /branches/antipodes/code/pilotfile/plr.cpp

I honestly have no idea what I have done here, but this should resolve Mantis 2353. (Tested on New pilot and converted)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
r6856 | Zacam | 2010-12-15 21:57:22 -0800 (Wed, 15 Dec 2010) | 1 line
Changed paths:
   M /branches/antipodes/code/pilotfile/pilotfile_convert.h
   M /branches/antipodes/code/pilotfile/plr_convert.cpp

Mantis 2353: Doesn't resolve Importing/Converting older players, but now Cloning a pilot will retain Axis/Invert as well as sensitivity and dead zone.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
r6857 | Zacam | 2010-12-15 21:58:50 -0800 (Wed, 15 Dec 2010) | 1 line
Changed paths:
   M /branches/antipodes/code/menuui/barracks.cpp
   M /branches/antipodes/code/menuui/playermenu.cpp

Mantis 2354: Barracks can now be used to switch between Single/Multi Gameplay.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
r6859 | Zacam | 2010-12-15 23:15:30 -0800 (Wed, 15 Dec 2010) | 1 line
Changed paths:
   M /branches/antipodes/code/controlconfig/controlsconfigcommon.cpp

From Karajorma: Fix for Mantis 1708 "Training messages do not take into account multiple binds for controls"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
r6860 | Zacam | 2010-12-16 15:52:39 -0800 (Thu, 16 Dec 2010) | 1 line
Changed paths:
   M /branches/antipodes/code/menuui/playermenu.cpp

Potential fix for reported mainhall issues. Caused by my own commit 6677 and only partly corrected for in 6692. (note: I'm unable to reproduce the reported issues, so it's anybodies guess)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
r6872 | karajorma | 2010-12-20 07:59:16 -0800 (Mon, 20 Dec 2010) | 1 line
Changed paths:
   M /branches/antipodes/code/mission/missionparse.cpp

Fix a bug where persistent variables were copied on top non-persistent variables that happened to have the same name.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
r6873 | karajorma | 2010-12-20 08:01:19 -0800 (Mon, 20 Dec 2010) | 1 line
Changed paths:
   M /branches/antipodes/code/mission/missioncampaign.cpp

Fix a bug in persistent variable handing which was corrupting pilots.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

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"If you can keep a level head in all this confusion, you just don't understand the situation"

¤[D+¬>

[08/01 16:53:11] <sigtau> EveningTea: I have decided that I am a 32-bit registerkin.  Pronouns are eax, ebx, ecx, edx.
[08/01 16:53:31] <EveningTea> dhauidahh
[08/01 16:53:32] <EveningTea> sak
[08/01 16:53:40] * EveningTea froths at the mouth
[08/01 16:53:40] <sigtau> i broke him, boys

 
Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend! (Updated 12/21/2010 - r6876)
I guess I really like the fact that I can play this game without ever installing anything!  (except the OpenAL piece)
I have the whole folder "FreeSpace2" with all the MediaVPs, campaigns, etc.  on my D: drive.  (about 17GB) 
I also have a complete copy of this folder on my external USB drive. 
I love the fact that everything can be kept inside just one folder, and I never have to "install" the game in order to play it, just copy the folder and done!  This is the same regardless of which OS I am using.  I have copied the folder from WinXP, to Vista, and Windows 7,  and never had to install, or worry about the C:\docs and settings, or C:\program files.

it just works!
 :)

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend! (Updated 12/21/2010 - r6876)
Agree with that. I like the portability, I don't like the notion of writing to external locations.

 

Offline chief1983

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Re: Antipodes 8 - Pilot, Attend! (Updated 12/21/2010 - r6876)
Well, maybe we can retain the existing behavior as a portability mode.  I don't necessarily want to eliminate current behavior, but I think we need to move it to trying to behave like a proper application.
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Nuclear1:  Jesus Christ zack you're a little too hamyurger for HLP right now...
iamzack:  i dont have hamynerge i just want ptatoc hips D:
redsniper:  Platonic hips?!
iamzack:  lays