Author Topic: A Knossos dilemma  (Read 1557 times)

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This is almost a lore question, but it's related to mission design, so I'm putting it here.

So, I'm going to have a mission (or two missions, rather) wherein our heroes, comprising the HLD Apocalypse and her battlegroup, attempt to escape a system while being pursued by Shivans. The system is connected to the next by a Knossos portal. This is set prior to FS2, and so the Apocalypse had no prior knowledge of such devices.

The plan for the mission was this: the battlegroup heads through the portal with the Shivans right behind them. On the other side, the Apocalypse opens fire on the device, while the fighters and bombers hold off the Shivans coming through the portal until it's been destroyed. The problem is this: in all known examples, Knossos devices exist only on one side of a node, rather than there being a portal on each end.

Now, there are three potential solutions.

1. Place only one portal, at the destination. The problem with this answer is that this would require the Apocalypse battlegroup to go through an ordinary subspace node with no plan. Then they would come out the other side, see the portal, and somehow immediately come to the decision to destroy it. This is awkward and implausible, but more importantly, it cuts out the planning phase of the operation, and reduces the opportunities to present the Apocalypse battlegroup as competent and forward-thinking. Although admittedly, genocidal apocalyptic cults aren't typically known for those qualities. (Another problem is that these Knossi are supposed to be closed until the Apocalypse arrives, which is why there aren't Shivans on the other side. Unless the Apocalypse can somehow activate the portal from inside subspace, this wouldn't make any sense.)

2. Place only one portal, in the system they're leaving. This would require the battlegroup to do something like planting a timed explosive on the portal to destroy it after they've gone through, and it would also pretty much destroy the original gameplay conceit. Oh, and it would result in an even more Forced-Entry-like experience.

1. Just have two portals. This is hardly farfetched, since Knossi are deployed to stabilize jumpnodes. It's not like you couldn't have two nodes that were both unstable. This seems to be the best solution, but there's an issue with a disconnect between the characters and the player. The characters, not being familiar with Knossi, might easily assume that there will be a second portal on the other side. But the player will know that there usually isn't, and will expect the characters to be wrong. And there's no opportunity for an explanation when they turn out to be correct anyway, since the characters have no reason to believe this was unlikely.

What I'm thinking of doing is this: have the characters discover the Knossos, scan it, and figure out that it was created to stabilize the node. They're also able to determine that the exit point of the subspace corridor is giving off similar readings, so there's probably a portal on the other side that they can destroy.

I think I just answered my own question, but anyway. Thoughts?

 

Offline DefCynodont119

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Use Three systems, with the middle system having just nodes, so have them 1: enter the portal in the first system, 2: fly short distance from node-to-node in seconded system, (In FS lore, and in some FS1 missions, nodes can be clustered less then 3km from each other)  and blow up the portal in the third.

as for the now existent middle system/mission, make it a short cutscene mission.

If you are worried about mission number or being able to replay the previous mission, make the mid system part of one of the other missions with an "in-mission jump" use the Background changing SEXP to add to the illusion.

Tutorial for in mission jumps:
http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/Tutorial_-_In-Mission_Jumps I think Axem made a script that automates most of that as well, ask him for help or look at examples from the Between the Ashes Campaign.

Hope this helps!
« Last Edit: August 15, 2017, 12:28:32 am by DefCynodont119 »
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Offline Trivial Psychic

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This could be a special case.  The Ancients created Knossos tech, tried to stabilize the node to System-A, but due to [Insert technobabble here], they couldn't.  Then, after exploring several other systems, they make it to System-A via another route.  Because of a wealth or resources in System-A, the Ancients wanted a more direct route to bring them back to their home systems, rather than through the several other systems the alternate route required.  Therefore, their scientists concluded that a Knossos on both ends would stabilize the node and permit travel.
The Trivial Psychic Strikes Again!

 

Offline Mito [PL]

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I think there was a mod that used 2 Knossi for a single node, but I can't be very sure about that. It was 'Into the Depths of Hell' IIRC.
How do you kill a hydra?

You starve it to death.

 

Offline Cyborg17

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If you choose option 1, you could also have the battlegroup scan the unknown node for stability on the way into the first node to make sure that it is usable.  They then detect a highly unusual and almost completely unstable signature. It is stable along a regular pattern or something, almost as if it is artificial.

  The arrival of a large shivan fleet forces them through against their better judgement, and if you give them about 90 seconds to scan and discuss the node and their options on the other side, then they can connect destroying the knossos with the unusual subspace signature and decide to attack the node - not necessarily even kill it. "Because of its low stability, maybe we can collapse the subspace pathway by damaging the artificial node structure."  Or something along those lines.

You could even have pieces of the knossos missing or damaged already to make low stability and attack more plausible.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2017, 05:25:38 am by Cyborg17 »

 
If you choose option 1, you could also have the battlegroup scan the unknown node for stability on the way into the first node to make sure that it is usable.  They then detect a highly unusual and almost completely unstable signature. It is stable along a regular pattern or something, almost as if it is artificial.

  The arrival of a large shivan fleet forces them through against their better judgement, and if you give them about 90 seconds to scan and discuss the node and their options on the other side, then they can connect destroying the knossos with the unusual subspace signature and decide to attack the node - not necessarily even kill it. "Because of its low stability, maybe we can collapse the subspace pathway by damaging the artificial node structure."  Or something along those lines.

You could even have pieces of the knossos missing or damaged already to make low stability and attack more plausible.

Oh, that's a good idea. Especially since part of the catalyst for the next section of the plot is that the people living in the next system, which is only accessible via two Knossos'd nodes, have been having a war, and the other one is on the verge of destruction when the battlegroup arrives...

Well, I guess there's still the problem of how they get through the node if the portal is supposed to be inactive.

 
Quote
Well, I guess there's still the problem of how they get through the node if the portal is supposed to be inactive.

You could say that the node is stable enough that very small craft can traverse it in small numbers. Upon finding the node, the Apocalypse sends an Anubis or Isis through to scout... and then the node suddenly stabilizes, as the scout finds the portal and accidentally activates it. This also helps makes the crew look "competent and forward-thinking".

Retail implies that the Ancients and Vasudans had peaceful contact in their history, and if you want to, you could even tie this into that. If the portal's subspace signature resembles that of a Vasudan jump drive, then the debrief could speculate that the scout's transit is what caused the node to reactivate. That answers the "no Shivans" question nicely - they could send a fighter or two through, and maybe have in the past, but there's no benefit to doing so, so they don't any more.

  
Aha! Our perfect solution! And, it makes for a more interesting "quiet" mission before the big portal run than "you jump into the system and there's a Knossos, RTB".

Fantastic. Thanks for your help, guys!