Author Topic: GTB Ursa  (Read 32322 times)

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Offline Hades

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Engine pylons are weak-looking because they're not done. Yes, the engines will be hollowed out. Cockpit yet to be done, mid section mostly undetailed. GTCv Deimos and GTD Orion being uvmapped.
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL

 

Offline CKid

Still looks like a brick. I like it.  :yes:
If I agreed with you, we would both be wrong

 

Offline Cyborg17

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I don't know if I like the hollowed out engines.  But the rest is awesome and it is your model. 

 

Offline Hades

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By 'hollow' I simply mean the internal greebling modeled; sort of like in the Medusa's engine blocks but overall it'll still feel like it has similar mass to the retail model in that area.
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL

 
I almost regret when I'll destroy Ursas ;)
gj

 

Offline BirdofPrey

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GTCv Deimos and GTD Orion being uvmapped.
and the Apollo? When can I fly that beauty?  WHEN, you're evil making us wait so long *cries*
====
Anyways, I think it's not too bad so far.  Some engine greebling will be nice rather than the old smooth surfaces.  I think the bomb launchers seem odd, though.  While I can agree to some rounding off, the launchers were at least rectangular, and this strays quite a bit.  The main reason that it bugs me, though is that we have seen the Ursa sitting on that surface, and those points don't seem like something you'd want to set down on.  The rest is great and I can't wait to see what you do with the rest of it.

You might consider making the bottom faces closer to being equally wide.
An alternative: landing pads that restore the rectangular profile on the main body, while the missile launching mechanics can be whatever other shape.


On a side note, if I am not mistaken all 22 of the apparent missile launch points on the Ursa are assigned to banks.  What are the potential effects from you modelling a different number?
The Great War ended 30 years ago.
Our elders tell stories of a glorious civilization; of people with myths of humanity everlasting, who hurled themselves into the void of space with no fear.

In testing: Radar Icons

 

Offline Zacam

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The conversation on this will remain civilized.

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Don't repeat it here, take it over there.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2015, 09:49:38 pm by Zacam »
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Offline BrotherBryon

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It's a very good start, I'm defiantly interested in seeing where you take this one Hades.
Holy Crap. SHIVANS! Tours

 

Offline Ulala

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Looks like the Ursa to me. Great start, looking forward to seeing this develop further.
I am a revolutionary.

 

Offline Dragon

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The conversation on this will remain civilized.

Previous content now located HERE

Don't repeat it here, take it over there.
So, you cut out all the negative criticism while leaving the positive one (and a single indecisive one)... Way to go. Just for the record, not everyone is as welcoming of the new design as the posters above, in a more decisive way, to say the least.

 

Offline Lorric

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Dragon I don't think it's like that.

BirdofPrey's comment is the one that sparked off the discussion, and that post is still here and really it sums up what the issue is with the launchers. Does any of the rest of that stuff really need to be here? Does it bring anything constructive to the thread? It's just filling up the thread with posts of people arguing with each other and getting nowhere. It's not as if the stuff that got moved has been thrown out, it's still there for the discussion to continue. And Hades is obviously still working on the model. If Hades were to change something else while that discussion about the launchers was still raging on in here, it would be difficult to discuss it, or if he posted something about something else it would just get swamped in the posts about the launchers.

 

Offline Scotty

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Cut the crap Dragon.  That wasn't constructive criticism in the slightest, and the modeler is in no way beholden to listen to you rant about it.  If you have a problem with moderation use a PM.

 

Offline -Norbert-

  • 211
I think my post was constructive rather than destructive, so I'll risk reposting it here:

The angled and rounded missile launchers are aesthetically pleasing... which the Ursa shouldn't be in my opinion. It was a very utilitarian and somewhat rushed job built mainly to carry the Harbinger and as many of them as possible, so changing the design to something more elegant doesn't really seem to fit the idea behind the ship for me.

If you don't want to make the pods fully rectangular, Spoon has posted this alternative (I favour the left, broader missile pod) in the split-off section, which seems like a reasonable compromise between your and the original variants.

That's not to say the model is bad, quite the contrary, it is very nice work, it's just doesn't quite fit my idea of what the Ursa should be like.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2015, 01:49:54 am by -Norbert- »

 

Offline BirdofPrey

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I am thinking making the inside of the launcher come to a right angle while keeping the bevel on the outer side could be a good compromise.  The angular inside does keep some of the blockiness, and leaves a broad flat surface on the bottom for the ship to sit on, while at the same time, the outer bevel could mirror the top to give some visual continuity and also prevent the ship from being too fat and square.

I do agree looking like a rush job hacked together does fit the profile of the ship, but it doesn't have to be a bunch of boxes bolted together.  Some angling is good, it's just at this point, the bottom of the launchers don't seem to jive with the rest of the design (even with the slight curve to the main hull and the beveled corners, the main hull is still relatively rectangular), or the fact it sits on the launchers from what we have seen.  Those cowlings on the top look great, and mirroring the overall shape would be a good starting point for the bottom.
The Great War ended 30 years ago.
Our elders tell stories of a glorious civilization; of people with myths of humanity everlasting, who hurled themselves into the void of space with no fear.

In testing: Radar Icons

 
You know, I actually thought the opposite: I'd prefer a hard corner on the outside and a bevel on the inner edges.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 

Offline Aesaar

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I don't understand why people think a ship designed in a hurry needs to look like little Timmy pieced it together from bits of scrap he found outside.  Real life fighters and bombers designed in a hurry don't look hacked together, and that's because the airframe is probably the simplest part of aircraft design.

The complex part is what you put inside the airframe.  Engines, sensors, stuff like that.  The Ursa being a rushed bomber doesn't mean every piece of it was designed in a hurry.  It means the designers would go looking for previously designed systems they could use instead of starting from scratch.  Maybe they took the sensors and fire control off the Athena, the engines off the Valkyrie, and the reactor from a Medusa.  The box that holds it all together?  That's trivial.  The Germans had the Me-262's airframe done long before they had working engines to put on it.  Which is why it didn't look like a cobbled together POS.

I'll add that the GTA probably started the design process years before the thing made it to the front lines.


Anyway, I like Spoon's edit more than the curved pods because it fits in better with the rest of the ship's sharp lines.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2015, 01:01:30 pm by Aesaar »

 

Offline Lorric

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Anyway, I like Spoon's edit more than the curved pods because it fits in better with the rest of the ship's sharp lines.
I'd just like to second this. I'll take the change over how it was previously, but I do think it clashes pretty badly with the rest of the ship, and Spoon's edit is much better.

 

Offline castor

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I don't understand why people think a ship designed in a hurry needs to look like little Timmy pieced it together from bits of scrap he found outside.  Real life fighters and bombers designed in a hurry don't look hacked together, and that's because the airframe is probably the simplest part of aircraft design.
It's not just the design though. Compromises may be needed also to enable quick manufacturing capacity ramp-up.

 

Offline Hades

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I don't understand why people think a ship designed in a hurry needs to look like little Timmy pieced it together from bits of scrap he found outside.  Real life fighters and bombers designed in a hurry don't look hacked together, and that's because the airframe is probably the simplest part of aircraft design.
It's not just the design though. Compromises may be needed also to enable quick manufacturing capacity ramp-up.
This isn't how mass manufacturing works. Hell, this isn't even how engineering works. If you want a good example of mass manufacturing, look at the US Sherman tank design; which used shared parts, were very modular, and very easy to maintain. Was it thrown together with spare planks and duct tape found behind the designer's house? No, it used welding and metal like any 'special' or non-mass produced tank there was.

Another point to note is that no-where in retail FreeSpace des it say that the Ursa, was in fact, designed and rushed into production in a rush (or even after The Great War broke out), to my knowledge.

Anyway, I'm not making the pods anything short of tapered towards the end. I'm still debating keeping it curved or making it look like Spoon's suggestion. Either way, the shape of the pods being tapered like they originally were showed as and as they are now benefits the ship's profile in my eyes. It gives it character, it makes it more than a lumpy, blocky mass of boxes; it even makes it look somewhat intimidating - which it is, to capitalships.
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL

 

Offline BirdofPrey

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Considering there aren't any other curves that actually stand out (I know most of the hull has a gentle curve, but it's not overly noticeable), I think having curved bottoms clashes with the design just as much as those sharp points (again, not seen elsewhere on the design).

What did you think of the idea to keep the taper, but just on one side? 
I can do a mockup myself, but GIMP was being a pain in the ass earlier.
The Great War ended 30 years ago.
Our elders tell stories of a glorious civilization; of people with myths of humanity everlasting, who hurled themselves into the void of space with no fear.

In testing: Radar Icons