Author Topic: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3  (Read 33512 times)

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Offline ARSPR

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
I asked only because I got the impression you have to use a prog to extract the contents of one of the main vp files (whereby you can access the mediavp directory), then recompile the vp files with the patches to complete the process... 

Having read the FAQ, it seems all i have to do is create a mediavps folder and dump them in there.  That done, I see no visible changes to the desired effect.

The name of the folder is irrelevant. With a launcher flag (-MOD Dir1,Dir2,...,Dir_n) you set the subdirs within Freespace2 folder where the program looks for files. So, firstly, it looks in Dir1 then in Dir2 and so on and at the end it looks in the main FS2 folder (if you dont type a -MOD flag, it only looks in this folder).

Within any of these folders, FS_Open.exe firstly looks for files in \data subfolder structure (i.e. individual not vp-contained files). Don't worry very much about this structure but if you want to know more you can read (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,39114.0.html). After \data, it starts looking inside vps in alphabetical order so it will look in aaa.vp previously to bbb.vp. (Vps also contain a \data structure).

When it finds a needed file in aaa.vp it stops searching, so it doesn't matter how this file is in bbb.vp. (This is the reason to make SCP vp additions to be called mv_*.vp, as the first retail vp is root_fs2.vp. In this way if you have a better Texture.jpg in mv_textures.vp it will override the old retail one, and of course aaa.vp files will override mv_*.vp ones)

When you set up the MOD tab, you are really 'typing' a -MOD flag, (look at it in Features Tab upper command line). What the Launcher does is setting:
-MOD List of subdirectories in PrimaryList, Selected subdir in the MOD tab, List of subdirectories in SecondaryList
where PrimaryList or SecondaryList are read from the mod.ini file you type as plain text inside the Mod Dir as explained in FAQ. But the used names for directories are really irrelevant. If there's no mod.ini or this mod.ini hasn't got these entries, Launcher only sets -MOD Selected subdir in the MOD tab.

So, the best way to install mediavps is copying them all in its own subfolder (call it as you want but 'mediavps' can be a good and clear name), and then make FSOpen use it through the MOD tab, (so their improvements or changes will override retail fs2 files). Then If you install a 'real' mod and you want to make this mod use media vps too, make a folder for it, (use any name you want), select that folder within Launcher MOD Tab and create a mod.ini file inside the Mod folder to point to 'mediavps' folder through SecondaryList entry. You can swap between mods with the MOD tab.

To add any patch to mediavps, copy its vp in 'mediavps' and be sure it has a name BEFORE mv_*.*
« Last Edit: June 22, 2006, 01:19:49 pm by ARSPR »
IF YOU HAVE TROUBLES WITH FS2:
  • Please, please, please, READ and UNDERSTAND the sticky threads in FreeSpace & FreeSpace Open Support board.
    A lot of people are willing to help you, but, as anyone can understand, seeing the very same "issues" repeated again and again can become quite depressing. Please, spend a bit of time trying to solve the issue by yourself.
    (Lobo deserves a monument).
  • Then, if you aren't still able to solve your issue, feel free to ask for help in that same board.
    FYI, most of the troubles are caused by wrong mod installations which lead to either missing data or undesired cross-effects between them. Always follow the mod installation instructions and keep a clean FS2 installation as explained in the sticky threads. Two additional links about how the game handles game data:
  • If you think that you've discovered a bug, mantis it.
    Provide as much info as you can, and try to narrow it down. A lonely "FS2 doesn't work" is not a good report.

Whoever Hanlon was: Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
Albert Einstein: Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe.

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Offline karajorma

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
The name is technically irrelevant but I'm trying to get people to standardise on names. It's much easier to ask a newbie if he has a Freespace2\mediavps\ folder than it is to explain what a media VP folder is and what you'd expect to find in it so that they can search for it themselves.

Furthermore when distributing a mod it is much easier if everyone is using a unified set of folder names as you can add a mod.ini already configured to look in the mediavps folder. If everyone uses their own naming system this quickly breaks down and can even cause file precidence problems.

Diomedes I suspect I know what your problem is. Have you gone to the mod tab of your launcher and chosen the mediavps folder as your selected mod? If you don't take this step you'll run FS2 without any of the enhancements in the media VPs.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2006, 01:47:03 pm by karajorma »
Karajorma's Freespace FAQ. It's almost like asking me yourself.

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Offline ARSPR

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
The name is technically irrelevant but I'm trying to get people to standardise on names. It's much easier to ask a newbie if he has a Freespace2\mediavps\ folder than it is to explain what a media VP folder is and what you'd expect to find in it so that they can search for it themselves.

Furthermore when distributing a mod it is much easier if everyone is using a unified set of folder names as you can add a mod.ini already configured to look in the mediavps folder. If everyone uses their own naming system this quickly breaks down and can even cause file precidence problems.

Good idea. As your FAQ is nearly The FS2 Bible, why don't you create a last subchapter in Installing FreeSpace called Naming Conventions where:

1. Make a brief explanation about how and where fs_open looks for files.
2. Make list of mostly known MODs with a proposal for its 'official' folder names.
3. Make a deep explanation about how and where fs_open looks for files (the thread I posted before full with Taylor's explanations can be a good source).

Ooops, I think we are going quite off-topic.  :wtf:
IF YOU HAVE TROUBLES WITH FS2:
  • Please, please, please, READ and UNDERSTAND the sticky threads in FreeSpace & FreeSpace Open Support board.
    A lot of people are willing to help you, but, as anyone can understand, seeing the very same "issues" repeated again and again can become quite depressing. Please, spend a bit of time trying to solve the issue by yourself.
    (Lobo deserves a monument).
  • Then, if you aren't still able to solve your issue, feel free to ask for help in that same board.
    FYI, most of the troubles are caused by wrong mod installations which lead to either missing data or undesired cross-effects between them. Always follow the mod installation instructions and keep a clean FS2 installation as explained in the sticky threads. Two additional links about how the game handles game data:
  • If you think that you've discovered a bug, mantis it.
    Provide as much info as you can, and try to narrow it down. A lonely "FS2 doesn't work" is not a good report.

Whoever Hanlon was: Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
Albert Einstein: Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe.

Dell Dimension 9200 - Vista 32-bit Ultimate
Core 2 Quad Q6600 @2.4GHz - RAM 2 GB DDR2
nvidia 8800 GTX - Integrated Sigmatel Audio

 
Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
You're right, I didn't use a mod tag, I'll do that and see what results I turn up.

Well explained, thanks. :yes:

 
Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
The good news is that I no longer have trail particles with black blocks around them.  The bad news is I still have ship-death explosion partciles with black blocks around them... 

 

Offline ShivanSpS

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
Nope, but here is a basic rundown of CVS commits since RC2:
 - "Y" targetting bug fixed
 - fix for warpout if player is docked to something
 - FBO fixes to allow better use in scripts
 - fix error handling in ds_get_free_channel() for OpenAL
 - fix super-functional counter-measures (fixes repeating evade sound and incompatible network packet and restores game balance)
 - make sure to use mission specified envmap (if one exists) over a static generated one
 - add -disable_fbo cmdline option to help troubleshoot ATI render errors with -env (allow -env to work with default cubemap or mission specified envmap only)
 - fix -img2dds related Assert()/crash on really small images that tried to rescale
 - fix green outline on PCX images compressed with -img2dds or when using -pcx32
 - disable depth render buffer that some ATI cards seem to have trouble with
 - disable automatic mipmaps for generated envmaps since the chain gets broken (it produces some black images for unknown reasons)
 - plus various debug related and big endian fixes

What you mean?

What about the ATI envmap problem?
« Last Edit: June 22, 2006, 05:33:03 pm by ShivanSpS »

 

Offline taylor

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
What you mean?
About the warpout issue you mean?  Not sure there, it's just something that Goober fixed, and I'm don't really know what it was about.

What about the ATI envmap problem?
It's a problem with FBOs and ATI's sucky drivers.  Env works fine in ATI, it's the render-to-texture support (FBOs) which is messing up for some reason.  I already know that my changes didn't really help all that much for ATI cards, but not all of them were messing up in the first place.  If you have the default envmap in place, or an envmap specified in the mission itself, then you can use that for the envmap and use -disable_fbo to fix the problems while still getting envmaps.

 

Offline Goober5000

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
What you mean?
About the warpout issue you mean?  Not sure there, it's just something that Goober fixed, and I'm don't really know what it was about.

:lol: I wonder what mischief I could cover up with a vague "fixed" comment. :D

It's for the problem where something - such as a support ship - warps out while docked to the player's ship.  The player used to get sent to limbo, but now he gets sent to the debriefing screen as he should.

 

Offline IPAndrews

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
Anyone else getting black boxes around particles and nebulae?
Be warned: This site's admins stole 100s of hours of my work. They will do it to you.

 

Offline Wanderer

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
Most likely media issue... Open the graphic files and check that they wont have full alpha enabled. That is unless you have proper alpha blending made for the effects. That is if you have 32-bit TGAs or DXT5s or u8888s in use you might get these problems
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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
Anyone else getting black boxes around particles and nebulae?

Did you download Taylors fixed VPs?

 

Offline IPAndrews

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
Since I'm running TBP stand-alone, no I didn't.
Be warned: This site's admins stole 100s of hours of my work. They will do it to you.

 
Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
Anyone else getting black boxes around particles and nebulae?

Isn't that what I've been saying?  I'm also running TBP standalone.  So I guess we're stuck for now?

 

Offline ShivanSpS

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
It's a problem with FBOs and ATI's sucky drivers.  Env works fine in ATI, it's the render-to-texture support (FBOs) which is messing up for some reason.  I already know that my changes didn't really help all that much for ATI cards, but not all of them were messing up in the first place.  If you have the default envmap in place, or an envmap specified in the mission itself, then you can use that for the envmap and use -disable_fbo to fix the problems while still getting envmaps.

Ahh, but in "fs2_open_r_KARA_20060509" build everything works fine, or that build does not have Env map or FBO support?

 

Offline IPAndrews

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
Yes Kara's special class changing build he did for me works fine too. No black boxes.
Be warned: This site's admins stole 100s of hours of my work. They will do it to you.

 

Offline neoterran

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
not having any black box problems.. but i'm not using the mediavps zeta.. seems like the problems are due to the state of the mediavps.
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Offline taylor

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
Anyone else getting black boxes around particles and nebulae?
TBP just has to fix their data like everyone else.  I've been telling everyone to use proper image formats for a long time now so I have absolutely no pitty for those who still aren't.  You have to either fix the data so that it works, or I have remove the new blending feature and all of the mods lose the new things they can do with effects.  I don't currently plan on removing the new feature since it would be nice to get it in 3.6.9 for mods.  Data can be fixed later, the new feature would have to wait for a new version, so it's better (to me at least) to just let the mods fix their own data.

Ahh, but in "fs2_open_r_KARA_20060509" build everything works fine, or that build does not have Env map or FBO support?
Nope, that build didn't have the env or FBO code.  It was added a few days after that build.

Yes Kara's special class changing build he did for me works fine too. No black boxes.
The new blending mode wasn't 100% enabled until RC2.  But, again, it's an issue with the media, not the code.  This is just like an issue with changes to tbls in new builds, only this time it's affecting graphics.

 

Offline neoterran

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3


TBP just has to fix their data like everyone else.  I've been telling everyone to use proper image formats for a long time now so I have absolutely no pitty for those who still aren't.  You have to either fix the data so that it works, or I have remove the new blending feature and all of the mods lose the new things they can do with effects.  I don't currently plan on removing the new feature since it would be nice to get it in 3.6.9 for mods.  Data can be fixed later, the new feature would have to wait for a new version, so it's better (to me at least) to just let the mods fix their own data.

this is definately the correct approach to take, because otherwise there is no impetus to change the graphics formats. for those who it affects, you don't need to run 3.6.9, you can use an older build and you will have everything look fine until it is fixed.


I for one appreciate the new changes and they're necessary for the engine to continue to improve and for newer mods to look better.
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Offline taylor

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Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
I have a problem with the release candidates. Every time I select one in the launcher and click run, it shows the SCP screen before the pilot screen just as it should, but then it immediately shrinks to my desktop's task bar and when I click it, it enlarges, but only enough to fill up a quarter of the screen. What's going on here? How do I stop this from happening?
It was a bug, fixed it last night.  It should work properly in the final 3.6.9, or the next RC build if there is one.

Also, I just got a new video card "Viper X1600 Pro 512MB AGP8X" made by Radeon, and I got a new monitor which now is a flat screen FPD LCD 17'' monitor, but when I play SCP and turn my ship in mission, it blurs a little in the process of turning (everything on the screen but is most noticible when there is target info next to my selected target and the name and distance number is blurred as turning). It never did this with my CRT monitor. Is it a setting? Can I fix this?
That's just an LCD for you.  If you get an LCD with a fast enough response time then you may not see the blurring.  Or it would at least be minimized.  There is nothing we can do about this though, it's a hardware limitation.

Also, with this monitor, I am required to play Freespace 2 with 1024x768 resolution to prevent the textures from being pixelized, but when I use this resolution, it shrinks the font and hud in Freespace 2. Is this supposed to happen and is there a way to play with 1024x768 resolution and keep the hud and font size the same as if I was playing in 640x480?
Do you have sparky_hi_fs2.vp installed?  That gives you the hi-res graphics, otherwise it may look strange.  But other than that I'm not really sure what you are referring to, other than it just being a higher resolution.

 
Re: 3.6.9 Release Candidate 3
I've got an 8ms LCD, and the blurring is barely noticable for me.