[StarSlayer]

That worked out for MH17.

[Dragon]

What worked out? I don't know, what does MH17 has to do with this? It was a civilian airliner (I don't think they have IFF) shot down by a bunch of Ukrainian rebels (whom I wouldn't credit with being able to operate IFF). They even claimed the kill until it transpired it was about a civilian plane (yes, they somehow managed to mistake a Boeing 777 for an An-26). Rest assured, actual Russian Air Force (or Air Defense Force, dunno whose SAMs are getting sent) very much can tell their targets apart.

[Col.Hornet]

And here they are. Russian SAMs arrived to Syria:

[Mika]

Interestingly, the UAz is still being used  I also did not know that the Russians have copied the Hum-Vee as well. They, of course, are going to deny any allegations copying the Hum-vee as it being part of their own research. I did not know the situation with skilled technical people is so bad that they now have to copy even the jeeps!

Adding S400 to Syria, well, I'll have to say it's gonna get interesting. Hopefully those Russians this time know their IFF and are REALLY careful about who they are going to fire as NATO aircraft are operating in Syria anyways. So let's see how Russians define the Turkish border this time. It would be quite bad if F-16 was downed within Turkish borders with the system. Would also be interesting to know how many F-22s can reach the area.

Would anyone venture a guess if Turkey is going to close Russia from Syria by closing Bospor?

[Dragon]

UAZ is a classic example of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mentality. It's a great off-road car, as far as they go. When everything that could break down does so, you're left with just the UAZ. As for the Hum-Vee, it's actually an Iveco. A rather common military utility car, used by Russians, among others.

I don't think Turkey is gonna mess with Bosporus. They've pissed off Russians enough with that plane, and they didn't have Europe on their side in this.

[Col.Hornet]

UAZ doesn't break?   
Last time I hanged out with my friend for a military vehicle meeting <Borne Sulinowo 2014> we had a great pleasure to experience all kind of problems. The most common were constantly clogged fuel filters <but that's sh**** fuel's guilt I guess> and problems with fuel injectors. On the way home we were running on one cylinder only

Back to the topic. I'm interested how it will develop. Apart from SAMs Russians also deployed additional aircraft <10 multi-role fighters>. They won't be deploying bombers without escort now. So the Turks will have to think at least twice before they pull the trigger.

[Aesaar]

Those don't look like HMMWVs at all.  They've Iveco LMVs, which is an Italian design the Russians bought a couple years ago.  Smaller and lighter than the Tigr, so fits on a plane better.

[NGTM-1R]

What worked out? I don't know, what does MH17 has to do with this? It was a civilian airliner (I don't think they have IFF) shot down by a bunch of Ukrainian rebels (whom I wouldn't credit with being able to operate IFF). They even claimed the kill until it transpired it was about a civilian plane (yes, they somehow managed to mistake a Boeing 777 for an An-26). Rest assured, actual Russian Air Force (or Air Defense Force, dunno whose SAMs are getting sent) very much can tell their targets apart.

If you honestly believe that a system that complex was operated by rebels, that's amusing. If you really believe that civilians don't squawk when queried by IFF, that's sad. (Protip: civilian transponders squawk constantly for collision-avoidance purposes. Hell, traffic control radar doesn't even actually see civilian aircraft directly in a lot of cases, just their transponder squawk. Military aircraft are usually capable of faking a civilian ID if they want to, for that matter, so the ID isn't always valid.)

If you think that the air defense troops and the air force are the same entity in Russia, you really shouldn't even be a part of this discussion.

[Dragon]

All wrong. Of course I know that Air Force and Air Defense Force are different entities (Duh, you would know if you thought a little what I wrote!). In case you don't know, Russian Air Force also operates its own SAM systems. In particular, ABMs (it doesn't seem to have S-400s, though, just 53T6 missiles). Those S-400s are Air Defense Force.

And yes, a system this complex can be operated by the rebels. How? By reading the bloody manual. This has come up before on Polish news. There are two kinds of manuals for these systems. One of which is an "operational" manual describing a detailed procedure for actual users of the system, the other amounts to "press this button to launch missile" and is meant for technicians servicing it. Buk system is pretty complex, but it has a TELAR vehicle which is essentially a self-contained SAM platform. Using such a platform, it's possible to go through the whole procedure with a single vehicle, as long as you know where to point the radar (which they did, likely by sight). Indeed, it has been said (on the same Polish news) that the plane went down faster than it would have with a properly trained crew. This meant they ignored (or didn't know) the usual pre-launch procedures, target identification and so on.

TBH, you're underestimating how easy it is to gain a rudimentary understanding of even a complex system. I was able to take off and fly around in DCS: Black Shark after less than a day of just reading the manual and starting at buttons (yes, using the "full realism" setting, without automatic startup). Launching weapons from an F-16 in another detailed sim took me about this long. If you have instructions and can follow them, then you can operate any system you have a manual for. Those years of training? They're required to operate them effectively, that is to say, against other people with years of training. Shooting down an airliner that doesn't even suspect someone could try is a trivial affair that pretty much only requires launching any missile at it.

Yeah, so my mistake about IFF. Didn't think collision avoidance squawks and IFF are the same system. Still, even in case IFF is not reliable, a military TA radar can tell an airliner from a fighter. A missile guidance radar likely can't, but the rebels wouldn't bother with that anyway. Regular troops certainly would check their target before launching SAMs.

[Mika]

UAZ doesn't break?   
Last time I hanged out with my friend for a military vehicle meeting <Borne Sulinowo 2014> we had a great pleasure to experience all kind of problems. The most common were constantly clogged fuel filters <but that's sh**** fuel's guilt I guess> and problems with fuel injectors. On the way home we were running on one cylinder only

This is more in line with what I witnessed as well. GRAZ (the heavy truck) worked better for the moments I saw it, but even then, the newer vehicles what we had were better. Yes you could get the UAZ to fire the engine in cold and it could probably run with whale oil, but it was more a question of how long it took. Sometimes the generality simply doesn't work. I suppose you could design a gun that fires a 5.56 mm round and a 7.62 mm round, but it wouldn't be great at doing either of them.

Interestingly, the S400 covers part of Israel and Cyprus. I guess the guys manning the station there are the among the brightest lads in Russian Forces. There's no room for any mistakes here.