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Regardless of whether or not you agree, what do you think of my essay?

Fantastic essay!
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Good essay!
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Alright essay.
3 (12%)
Bad essay.
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Terrible essay!
1 (4%)
Too long; didn't read.
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Snuffleupagus
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Author Topic: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?  (Read 30254 times)

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Offline Nakura

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I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
I happened to write a five-page essay to foster a healthy debate. I wrote it up in a period of about 45 minutes, but after proofreading it, I like the way it's turned out. I would, however, like feedback on the essay, if you wouldn't mind. Of course, we can also use this topic to discuss the right to bear arms and efforts by authoritarians to limit that right. Below is the essay I wrote:


   Let me start by saying that I am a gun owner and NRA member, but I’m open to some gun control, namely background checks, but only with the provisions that we have further constitutional protections of the right to bear arms.

   Let’s look at a ban on semi-automatic firearms and/or so-called “assault weapons.” What is a semi-automatic firearm and what is an “assault weapon?” A semi-automatic firearm is a firearm that can fire one bullet each time you pull the trigger; this differs from a fully-automatic weapon, which continues to fire as long as the trigger is held down, or ammunition is depleted. An “assault weapon” is a semi-automatic (or occasionally bolt-action) rifle that has certain cosmetic features, such as a barrel shroud, telescoping stock, bayonet lugs and/or pistol grip. The so-called “Federal Assault Weapons Ban” in 1993 banned these so-called “assault weapons;” the ban later expired in 2004.

   Why does the gun control lobby call these rifles “assault weapons” when they are no more or less deadly than other semi-automatic rifles? In fact, there is no difference between a semi-automatic firearm and an “assault weapon,” aside from certain cosmetic features. Bolt-action rifles are actually more deadly than a so-called “assault weapon,” such as the previously banned AR-15 rifle; this is because the AR-15 (and other firearms like it) fire .223 Remington rounds, which are considerably smaller than your average hunting rifle ammunition. To say that so-called “assault weapons” aren’t used for hunting is an incorrect statement, in fact, the AR-15 is the most popular rifle in the United States, in part due to it’s .223 rounds, which are considered better for hunting small game (such as rabbits) and even some deer.

   The Federal Assault Weapons Ban of 1994 was considered a failure by both criminal experts and the United States Department of Justice. A 2004 report from the Department of Justice showed that only 2% of all firearm murders were committed with semi-automatic rifle. That same report concluded that: “Should it be renewed, the ban's effects on gun violence are likely to be small at best and perhaps too small for reliable measurement. [Assault weapons] were rarely used in gun crimes even before the ban.”; source: http://crim.sas.upenn.edu/jerry-lee-center-criminology/
In 2011 the FBI released statistics that show that you’re more likely to be murdered with a hammer, than you are with any kind of rifle, including so-called “assault weapons;” source: http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8

   In addition, semi-automatic rifles were banned in the United Kingdom (since 1988) and Australia (since 1996), and both of such bans have been failures. A 2005 report by the Bureau of Crime Statistics in Australia reported: “Gun ownership is rising and there is no definitive evidence that a decade of restrictive firearms laws has done anything to reduce weapon-related crime, according to NSW's top criminal statistician.
The latest figures show a renaissance in firearm ownership in the state - a 25 per cent increase in three years. And the head of the Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research, Don Weatherburn, said falls in armed robberies and abductions in NSW in the past few years had more to do with the heroin drought and good policing than firearms legislation.
Even falls in the homicide rate, which have been steady, began long before the gun law debate provoked by the Port Arthur massacre in 1996.

   Nationwide, the proportion of robberies involving weapons is the same as it was in 1996, while the proportion of abductions involving weapons is higher, the latest Australian Bureau of Statistics fiures reveal. They show a mixed result in firearms-related offences since the mid-1990s. There has been a fall in firearms murders (from 32 to 13 per cent) but a rise (19 to 23 per cent) in attempted murders involving guns.” Source: http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/gun-laws-fall-short-in-war-on-crime/2005/10/28/1130400366681.html
And in the United Kingdom, violent crime (including homicide) rates have been on the rise since the 1960s, correlating ominously with the 1968 gun control law, which heavily regulated civilian gun ownership. Of course, correlation does not equal causation, but it is rather telling that gun control isn’t a solution to violent crime. In fact, statistics show that, if anything, gun control actually increases violent crime rates.


Source: http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp

   Meanwhile almost no other first-world country (including Albania, Andorra, Austria, Belgium, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Canada, Finland, France, Greenland, Ireland, Italy, Republic of Korea, Montenegro, Netherlands, New Zealand, Northern Ireland, Norway, San Marino, Singapore, Sweden, Switzerland, etc.) has banned semi-automatic rifles or handguns, yet they don’t have mass shootings or high crime rates. Source: http://www.gunpolicy.org/

   So what about mass shootings? Will mass shootings stop if we ban semi-automatic rifles and/or so-called “assault weapons?” Both Australia and the United Kingdom experienced mass shootings after their gun bans. In Australia there was the Monash University massacre in 2004 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monash_University_shooting) and in the United Kingdom there was the Dunblane massacre in 1996 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_massacre) and Cumbria (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumbria_shootings) massacre in 2010. Prior to the 1997 Hungerford massacre in the United Kingdom, which led to the 1988 ban on semi-automatic firearms, there were zero mass shootings in Great Britain. In the United States we experienced arguably the worst school shooting in American history, the Columbine High School massacre, which was committed during a time in which both “assault weapons” and so-called “high capacity magazines” were banned.

   Okay, so banning semi-automatics won’t stop mass shootings, but will banning magazines stop them? Not according to the United States Department of Justice, (cited from the previously linked to report):
It is not clear how often the outcomes of gun attacks depend on the ability of offenders to fire more than ten shots (the current magazine capacity limit) without reloading.

   During the Columbine High School massacre, a massacre that took place when so-called “high capacity magazines” were banned, the attackers used thirteen magazines. In the Viriginia Tech massacre, the attacker used nineteen magazines. These attacks show that magazine bans do not work.

   Why are “assault weapons” called that, when they are no more or less deadly than non-“assault” weapons? The gun control lobby is surprisingly open about why; they released this statement in a 1988 report and said report is currently readable on their website:
“Assault weapons are a new topic. The weapons' menacing looks, coupled with the public's confusion over fully automatic machine guns versus semi-automatic assault weapons—anything that looks like a machine gun is assumed to be a machine gun—can only increase the chance of public support for restrictions on these weapons.”
Source: http://www.vpc.org/studies/awaconc.htm

   As you can see in the above document, the gun control lobby openly admits to intentionally misleading the public, by conflating semi-automatic rifles with fully-automatic rifles. Fully-automatic machineguns have been heavily regulated since the 1930s and the sale of new fully-automatic machineguns has been virtually banned since the Hughes Amendment in 1986. Even still, there are over 60,000 legal owners of fully-automatic machineguns in the United States, and there have been no crimes committed with such firearms.

   Now that we’ve covered semi-automatics, let’s discuss handguns, shall we? Handgun bans have been tried before both in the United States and around the world, and resulted in dismal results each time. Handguns were banned in the United Kingdom in 1997 and homicide rates have rose 15% since the ban. Handguns were also banned in Chicago and the District of Columbia, and homicide rates also rose drastically on both occasions; the handgun homicide rate in Chicago by 40% since the ban and the homicide rate in the District of Columbia rose by 73% since the ban (http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp). The Center for Disease Control released a study showing that handguns were used in self-defense up to ten times more than they were used to commit crimes, saving up to three million lives a year (http://www.iom.edu/Reports/2013/Priorities-for-Research-to-Reduce-the-Threat-of-Firearm-Related-Violence.aspx).

   What about background checks? The national background check system was created in 1993, with the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act. This law mandates that any firearm transaction between a firearms dealer and a private citizen, result in a background check being performed on the buyer. This does not, however, mandate background checks for private firearms transactions. In other words, I can give a firearm to my best friend as a birthday present, without requiring a background check.

   What is the so-called “gun show loophole?” The “gun show loophole” is the (factually wrong) idea that firearm sales at gun shows are not subject to background checks. Any regular dealer at a gun show is required to perform a background check on the buyer. However, if I’m a normal person visiting a gun show and happen to run into someone who wants to buy a gun, and I happen to own that gun and want to sell it, I can sell it without a background check, so long as I don’t do it on a regular basis.

   Some laws have been proposed to ban the so-called “gun show loophole.” These proposed laws, however, are not aimed at background checks at all. It would criminalize all private firearms sales, regardless of whether or not they take place at a gun show. Then there’s the proposed “universal background check” idea, which would have created a database of all gun owners who obtained their firearms from a private individual. This proposed law was far more strict than the current law concerning firearms dealers. The law concerning firearms dealers requires that information regarding the background check be deleted within 48 hours, provided the background check goes through; however, the proposed “universal background check” law would have required that firearms obtained through private sales be de facto registered. A report published by the Bureau of Justice Statistics states that less than 2% of criminals who committed firearms related offenses obtained their firearms at a gun show. Source: http://bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/fuo.pdf

   In conclusion, it is clear that gun control is not going to lower violent crime rates in the United States, or anywhere else for that matter. Rather than harming law abiding citizens and discarding the fundamental rights we hold dear, I propose we work towards fixing the underlying problems that lead to violent crime. The underlying cause of violent crime is not firearms, it is social and economic factors; and the underlying cause of mass shootings is poor mental healthcare. Rather than focusing on the symptoms, we should work on improving our education system, healthcare system (including mental health) and eliminating the poor economic conditions that cause people to resort to violence.

 

Offline Black Wolf

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Yep. We had one "mass" shooting since the assault weapon ban. Look at the rate of them drop off at the same time. Gun control worked in Australia, there's very little legitimate doubt about that.
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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
so yeah can we not indulge this guy, i don't think this is really within the scope of what can be considered reasonable discussion on HLP
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Offline Nakura

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Yep. We had one "mass" shooting since the assault weapon ban. Look at the rate of them drop off at the same time. Gun control worked in Australia, there's very little legitimate doubt about that.

Actually, Australian scholars and statisticians have deemed the Australian gun ban an utter failure, as mentioned in the original post. The ban didn't lower crime rates and you still experienced another mass shooting. Australia had widespread gun ownership, a strong gun culture and lenient gun laws up until 1987, yet they never experienced any mass shootings and had traditionally had low crime rates. It wasn't until the mid-1980s that you experienced any sort of "mass shootings," which were sparked from motorcycle gang wars. Seeing as you had virtually no strict gun control laws until 1987 and no mass shootings or violent crime until that time, it would be ridiculous to blame guns and law abiding gun owners for Port Arthur and the like.

 

Offline Black Wolf

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
so yeah can we not indulge this guy, i don't think this is really within the scope of what can be considered reasonable discussion on HLP

You're right, we can ignore him until he goes away.
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Offline Mongoose

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Sooo...why are we ignoring someone who stated an opinion and proceeded to back it up with references and discussion, exactly?  Isn't that the sort of thing we want more of around here?

 

Offline Black Wolf

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
It's not the sort of thing I want more of. Don't want to speak for anyone else though.
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Offline Mongoose

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Well when the alternative is one-line drive-by ****posts, I should think that anyone would go with this option.

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Sooo...why are we ignoring someone who stated an opinion and proceeded to back it up with references and discussion, exactly?  Isn't that the sort of thing we want more of around here?

Because the people who would engage on this sort of an opener are either on (self-imposed?) hiatus from the forum or just don't feel like having this discussion. You can't make people post if they don't want to post.
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Offline MP-Ryan

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
I sincerely hope this "essay" isn't for submission for a grade or use in a formal setting, because your tone and language use throughout is quite informal and poorly assembled.  That's all I'll say on stylistic commentary.

As to the meat of your argument, cherry-picking wins you no points.  You appear to discuss bans in the same breath as other countries with significant gun cultures - countries which don't use bans, but instead have strict (compared to the US) firearms regulations in place.  You've set up a strawman argument.  While I'll give you points for a single CDC citation, I'd deduct points for citing interest-group sites like justfacts.org and open-encyclopedias like Wikipedia (as I frequently say regarding wikipedia - good for background info; not acceptable sourcing for an argumentative piece).

You get kudos for giving it a try, but your writing style requires improvement generally, and your critical analysis is flawed from the outset.  This isn't so much an essay as a somewhat poorly-constructed opinion piece without a great deal of credibility in terms of overall content because of how your argument has been constructed. (I gave you a "bad essay" vote - sorry, but this wouldn't get a passing grade as a piece of serious critical commentary in any formal venue).

Also, posting to prove NGTM-1R wrong, though I don't know if this actually counts as engaging since I'm not bothering to try to counterpoint.  :P

Nakura, being a registered and licensed Canadian firearms enthusiast, I can tell you that a number of your citations don't paint a full picture of the regulatory facts, and I'd encourage you to do some further (unbiased) reading of the statistics from other Western democracies without relying on advocacy websites to summarize for you.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2013, 11:40:00 pm by MP-Ryan »
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Offline Veers

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
(From Australia)

I own a Mosin Nagant 7.62x54R rifle, 1942 construction.

That's a decently large round compared to what most people in my area shoot, except for those few guys who sound like they are using cannons. :/ I don't use it for hunting, only bench-rest shooting.

I summed up a discussion like this recently, based on my views of course.

But a lot of people living in the suburbs and city areas are scared of firearms, why?. They have not grown up with them and the media is full of gun-crime in Sydney (for example) from the gangs (always in the media as the Bikie gangs). So naturally they would be scared and want them banned/severely limited.

Were as a lot of people out in the country, have grown up with firearms. We use them rather regularly for our lively-hood (farms for example) and have little gun-crime when compared to the cities. We are comfortable with them and have practical uses for them.

Then again.. the guy I was talking to went off on a huge rant about asylum seekers and such sooo.. yea.
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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Sooo...why are we ignoring someone who stated an opinion and proceeded to back it up with references and discussion, exactly?  Isn't that the sort of thing we want more of around here?

Because this is not an honest attempt to engender discussion. This is him trying to bait anyone who disagrees with his opinions into a 'debate', which he will probably 'win' because he has a vast pool of prepared waffle and dubious or misrepresented sources, and there's only so much time worth spending on a forum idiot. It's a very common tactic (creationists, for instance, are adept at it) and we're all better off if nobody engages with him, unless you find the idea of an endless game of musical bull**** to be entertaining.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2013, 06:05:40 am by Phantom Hoover »
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Offline BloodEagle

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Sooo...why are we ignoring someone who stated an opinion and proceeded to back it up with references and discussion, exactly?  Isn't that the sort of thing we want more of around here?

Because this is not an honest attempt to engender discussion. [...]

As opposed to say, the following, which is totally an honest attempt to engender discussion and is completely inoffensive to the thread-starter whose primary (stated) goal was to receive feedback on an essay?

so yeah can we not indulge this guy, i don't think this is really within the scope of what can be considered reasonable discussion on HLP

 :no:

 

Offline deathfun

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Not to be a bother, but where is Snuffleupagus?
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Offline The E

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
There he is.
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Offline deathfun

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Excellent. Smithers, jot down a tally for me


Quote
we have further constitutional protections of the right to bear arms.

This is generally where I stop in gun related topics

http://scholarship.law.wm.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=3295&context=wmlr
http://www.english.illinois.edu/-people-/faculty/debaron/essays/guns.pdf
"No"

 
Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Quote
we have further constitutional protections of the right to bear arms.

Why do you Americans think you have a right to a bear's arms? :P

Quote
homocides reported to the police in UK

Have you even considered that the most obvious explenation of the rise of reported crime is simply because people have started reporting more and more?

Quote
Rather than focusing on the symptoms, we should work on improving our education system, healthcare system (including mental health) and eliminating the poor economic conditions that cause people to resort to violence.

DUe to the weird political divide in the US, the party that supports gun rights is also the party which happens to NOT do these things you mention as solution, and in fact have worked very hard the past few years to abolish the laws that take care of these issues.

What about New York and Hawaii, where these laws do seem to work very effictively?

Quote
They show a mixed result in firearms-related offences since the mid-1990s. There has been a fall in firearms murders (from 32 to 13 per cent) but a rise (19 to 23 per cent) in attempted murders involving guns.

How is this a mixed result? I see a rather large fall in firearm murders but only a small rise in attempted murders.

Quote
   Meanwhile almost no other first-world country (including Albania, Andorra, Austria, Belgium, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Canada, Finland, France, Greenland, Ireland, Italy, Republic of Korea, Montenegro, Netherlands, New Zealand, Northern Ireland, Norway, San Marino, Singapore, Sweden, Switzerland, etc.) has banned semi-automatic rifles or handguns, yet they don’t have mass shootings or high crime rates. Source:

Dude.
Seriously?
You don't have any idea about how strong the gun control in those countries are. I can personally attest for the Netherlands, which has very strict gun control laws, and many other countries mentoined do actually have strict gun control laws as well. THe nations you mentoined mostly are an argument for, and not against, stricter gun control. Heck, the very site you linked as a source nullifies your claims.

tl;dr: Your essay is full of factual inaccuracies and misinterpretation of sources, it's very bad, and you should feel bad. You should also not own a handgun, as you are clearly delusional. Moving on...
« Last Edit: June 28, 2013, 08:47:41 am by -Joshua- »

 

Offline Nakura

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
I sincerely hope this "essay" isn't for submission for a grade or use in a formal setting, because your tone and language use throughout is quite informal and poorly assembled.  That's all I'll say on stylistic commentary.

As to the meat of your argument, cherry-picking wins you no points.  You appear to discuss bans in the same breath as other countries with significant gun cultures - countries which don't use bans, but instead have strict (compared to the US) firearms regulations in place.  You've set up a strawman argument.  While I'll give you points for a single CDC citation, I'd deduct points for citing interest-group sites like justfacts.org and open-encyclopedias like Wikipedia (as I frequently say regarding wikipedia - good for background info; not acceptable sourcing for an argumentative piece).

You get kudos for giving it a try, but your writing style requires improvement generally, and your critical analysis is flawed from the outset.  This isn't so much an essay as a somewhat poorly-constructed opinion piece without a great deal of credibility in terms of overall content because of how your argument has been constructed. (I gave you a "bad essay" vote - sorry, but this wouldn't get a passing grade as a piece of serious critical commentary in any formal venue).

Also, posting to prove NGTM-1R wrong, though I don't know if this actually counts as engaging since I'm not bothering to try to counterpoint.  :P

Nakura, being a registered and licensed Canadian firearms enthusiast, I can tell you that a number of your citations don't paint a full picture of the regulatory facts, and I'd encourage you to do some further (unbiased) reading of the statistics from other Western democracies without relying on advocacy websites to summarize for you.

Thank you for taking the time to reply to my post. This is not for a grade at all, but rather a quick essay I wrote up in about 45 minutes to send to a friend of mine. I never intended it to be formal to begin with, I should have stated that to begin with, sorry.

I really don't see how I'm cherrypicking or comparing unrelated data. I merely looked at the laws and statistics of various countries, analyzed the data for over a year (firearms law is a bit of a hobby of mine) and merely shared (in the essay) the results of the particular law in that country. I did this, because the number one argument against gun ownership that the gun control lobby puts forth is that "Europe banned guns and they have no crime," when both statements are clearly not true. So I deliberately analyzed that claim and proved it to be bunk, as it's a claim that my anti-gun friend often uses. You yourself said that you're a Canadian and you are a legal gun owner, thus disproving his theory that people in other countries don't have guns. If you would like, could you please elaborate on where exactly I am cherrypicking data that supports gun ownership, while ignoring data against it?

As for sourcing, you raise some valid points. I've been using justfacts.org as a source for quite a while and from my experience, they aren't an interest group out to push an agenda; they seem to do a good job presenting the data in an unbiased manner, letting the reader draw their own conclusions, and they always cite their sources. You're absolutely correct though, Wikipedia isn't a valid source for any sort of scholarly material. I wasn't using Wikipedia to acquire any statistics or specific firearms laws, but rather to simply prove that these mass shootings did occur. For instance, the only paragraph in which I sourced Wikipedia was this one:
Quote
So what about mass shootings? Will mass shootings stop if we ban semi-automatic rifles and/or so-called “assault weapons?” Both Australia and the United Kingdom experienced mass shootings after their gun bans. In Australia there was the Monash University massacre in 2004 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monash_University_shooting) and in the United Kingdom there was the Dunblane massacre in 1996 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_massacre) and Cumbria (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumbria_shootings) massacre in 2010. Prior to the 1997 Hungerford massacre in the United Kingdom, which led to the 1988 ban on semi-automatic firearms, there were zero mass shootings in Great Britain. In the United States we experienced arguably the worst school shooting in American history, the Columbine High School massacre, which was committed during a time in which both “assault weapons” and so-called “high capacity magazines” were banned.

I fully recognize that my writing style needs serious improvement. When writing academic essays, I try to write formally and use the Chicago style of citation, but even my formal writing needs serious improvement. I suppose this is largely because I practically taught myself formal writing, rather than ever actually taking a class and learning the proper way of doing things, instead I developed my own quirks and own manner of writing.

I thought that's what I was trying to do, as a large portion of my original post covered gun control laws and crime statistics from Australia, the United Kingdom and mainland Europe. Sorry I didn't touch on Canada, I wrote this rather quickly and it's by no means all-inclusive. I am somewhat aware of Canada's firearm laws, but please correct me if I'm wrong on anything:
-Handguns are legal but need to be registered and licensed, but long guns do not require registration.
-Handguns can be carried in public if you have a permit to do so, but permits are rather difficult to obtain.
-Semi-automatic rifles are legal, provided their magazine holds five rounds or less.
-Fully automatic machineguns are banned, but owners prior to the ban can keep their weapons, which have been grandfathered in.


Thanks again for reading my post and taking the time to constructively reply.  :)

 

Offline The E

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
Quote
I really don't see how I'm cherrypicking or comparing unrelated data. I merely looked at the laws and statistics of various countries, analyzed the data for over a year (firearms law is a bit of a hobby of mine) and merely shared (in the essay) the results of the particular law in that country. I did this, because the number one argument against gun ownership that the gun control lobby puts forth is that "Europe banned guns and they have no crime," when both statements are clearly not true. So I deliberately analyzed that claim and proved it to be bunk, as it's a claim that my anti-gun friend often uses. You yourself said that you're a Canadian and you are a legal gun owner, thus disproving his theory that people in other countries don't have guns. If you would like, could you please elaborate on where exactly I am cherrypicking data that supports gun ownership, while ignoring data against it?

So you're trying to disprove a massively hyperbolic statement? Not any real facts?

I mean, of course there's gun crime in other countries. Even the strictest of laws won't prevent that (because criminals, as a rule, don't obey the law). That you took the assertion that other countries do not have gun crimes at face value speaks more to your gullibity than anything else.

But all statistics I have been able to find point towards guns being used way more often in the US, whether in crimes, suicides, or lethal accidents, than in any other first-world country.
I am a strong proponent of gun control, given that I believe that guns do not have a place in daily life for the vast majority of people in my country (Germany, btw). I concede that it's a different issue for more frontiery countries like the US or Canada or Oz, where guns (subtype: Hunting rifles) still have legitimate uses. But the bottom line for me is that the vast majority of people cannot be trusted with the kind of power guns represent. That isn't meant to be a slur against anyone's character, it's just the simple matter that handling a gun responsibly and safely at all times requires discipline and training, and that is something that takes time to acquire. There are far too many incidents of kids playing with guns and killing themselves or others for me to ever be comfortable with the idea of keeping firearms inside a home.
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Offline MP-Ryan

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Re: I wrote an essay on gun control, thoughts?
I really don't see how I'm cherrypicking or comparing unrelated data. I merely looked at the laws and statistics of various countries, analyzed the data for over a year (firearms law is a bit of a hobby of mine) and merely shared (in the essay) the results of the particular law in that country. I did this, because the number one argument against gun ownership that the gun control lobby puts forth is that "Europe banned guns and they have no crime," when both statements are clearly not true. So I deliberately analyzed that claim and proved it to be bunk, as it's a claim that my anti-gun friend often uses. You yourself said that you're a Canadian and you are a legal gun owner, thus disproving his theory that people in other countries don't have guns. If you would like, could you please elaborate on where exactly I am cherrypicking data that supports gun ownership, while ignoring data against it?

You've made a disingenuous argument because you focus on the idea of weapons bans in the United States while pointing out that other countries don't have weapons bans either, but then completely fail to look at the stringent regulatory regimes in those countries (which do work - the problem with the statistics you're using is that they focus on homicide, instead of all firearms-related violent crime and death rates).  The US propensity toward greater rates of violent crime and firearms-related violence is due in part to a cultural difference between the US and other countries with gun-culture, and lax firearms laws in the United States.  This is particularly notable in the rates of firearms-related deaths, because accidental deaths in the United States due to firearms causes are leaps and bounds beyond any of its comparator nations.

Anyone who is arguing Europe has no firearms-related crime is being a moron anyway, but that doesn't excuse the glossing over or misrepresentation of statistics and the legal framework in those countries.  Looking at the experiences in most Western democracies, firearms bans don't work but firearms regulation sure as hell does.  One day the United States might catch onto that.

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I thought that's what I was trying to do, as a large portion of my original post covered gun control laws and crime statistics from Australia, the United Kingdom and mainland Europe. Sorry I didn't touch on Canada, I wrote this rather quickly and it's by no means all-inclusive. I am somewhat aware of Canada's firearm laws, but please correct me if I'm wrong on anything:
-Handguns are legal but need to be registered and licensed, but long guns do not require registration.
-Handguns can be carried in public if you have a permit to do so, but permits are rather difficult to obtain.
-Semi-automatic rifles are legal, provided their magazine holds five rounds or less.
-Fully automatic machineguns are banned, but owners prior to the ban can keep their weapons, which have been grandfathered in.

What you neglected to do is look at all firearms-related violence and death statistics, and that's where the flaws in your argument come from.

For Canada, our national firearms-related violence and death rates are considerably lower than the US.  Regionally, some American states fare better than some Canadian provinces, and vice versa.  Where this gets confounded is because you cannot compare provinces to states, you must compare legal jurisdiction to jursidiction (this is where your argument also falls down in talking about other countries).  In the United States, the regulatory system is partially federal but primarily at the state level.  In virtually all of the comparator countries, the regulatory system is national.  This is very important - States with lax regulatory regimes (Idaho) often have lower firearms-related crime than some of the States with greater regulation that are nearby.  Why?  Demographics and mobility.  It is really easy to cross a state border illegally with a firearm and not get caught - it's really hard to cross a national border.  Similarly, Idaho (which is oft-cited when debating Canada vs US) is not a socially-diverse state, and doesn't experience the same general crime rates as other states.  That has nothing to do with guns.  So, when other countries talk about their regulatory regimes, they get to impose them on an entire country which breeds consistently and makes the law much clearer and easier to enforce.  This is not true in the US.

In terms of actual Canadian laws, the short version:
- All owners and users of firearms require a license.  The licensing system has mandatory background and criminal record checks.  It is a national system.  In order to obtain a license, you must take a mandatory safety course.
- There are three license endorsements:  non-restricted, restricted, and prohibited.  They correspond to three classes of firearms.  Long guns fall into all three categories, depending on the weapon.  Handguns are all either restricted or prohibited.  Prohibited licenses are only available to people who owned prohibited-class weapons when the law came into effect and their direct inheritors.
- The regulatory system imposes several requirements on the handling, transport, and storage of all firearms.  These requirements differ by firearm class and get progressively more stringent.
- All restricted and prohibited class weapons are individually registered by owner.  Non-restricted weapons are not.
- Restricted class weapons require permits for transport, are subject to transport conditions, and generally may not be carried under any circumstances.  Use is legally confined to private property and gun ranges, typically (there are some exceptions).  These same basic requirements apply to prohibited-class as well.
- Fully automatic weapons are all in the prohibited class.
- Semi-automatic magazines above certain capacity are either restricted or prohibited.
- Semi-automatic weapons may be non-restricted, restricted, or prohibited depending on the weapon.

So you are correct in stating Canada does not have a ban on certain weapons, because we actually don't have a ban on any weapons.  What we have is a stringent classification and licensing system.  Some prohibited-class weapons are for all-intents-and-purposes banned because no one has a license for them any longer, but prohibited-class does not automatically mean a weapon is banned in Canada.  I carry prohibited weapons legally for work, as do many other types of law enforcement and some other occupations (most police and armed security organizations issue prohibited weapons to their employees).
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