[wardog300k]

So, I went ahead and tested ships to see how powerful they are.
In FRED I placed 2x Leviathans, facing each other at 3 km distance, they're beam-freed and have the Attack order.
After committing the mission, instead of being where I placed them, ships are way closer to each other (around 500 m), and both are differently damaged (Lev 1 = 14% Lev 2 = 49%). Their subsystems have random damage as well. The battle goes on as it should, they start circling and firing on each other as they should. After this I tried some other missions I've made, all are bugged in some way (Ships not where they should be, turrets not firing, Subach HL-12s instead of beam cannons, etc...). Is this problem known, and is there any thing I could do to fix it?

FreeSpace 2 Retail, latest GOG version.

[Cyborg17]

Odd.  Well, first things first, please provide a Debug Log.  Second, since it seems to be a simple mission, could you post it as an attachment.  I'm wondering if the problem is introduced with the mission or with the Engine.

[The E]

When in doubt, blame retail. There is unfortunately not a lot we can do to help there.

[Cyborg17]

He may mean retail as in no mods rather than the retail .exe.  I figured either existence of a log or the mission file would confirm.

[FrikgFeek]

No, he means retail retail. Completely vanilla. The retail FRED2 exe that comes with the game.

[wardog300k]

I have Final Destination activated right now. Using retail .exe files. I never had such a bug before, neither in original game nor in mods. FD's tables and all are right, worked till now, I only had one problem (sound) before but it was fixed. I cannot post any of the missions as, well, I'd rather keep my WIP project as it is for now.

EDIT: It seems like I've found the problem. The mission starts at 2:XX, instead of starting at 0:00. While loading it does everything till that point ( its possible for me to even die during this process) and starts out at some random time.

EDIT2: It appears that I'm just a bit stupid. For unknown reason, Player entry delay was sat to 138, even tho I didn't touch the Team Loadout.
Turrets not firing and wrong weapons bugs are still present.

[Goober5000]

EDIT2: It appears that I'm just a bit stupid. For unknown reason, Player entry delay was sat to 138, even tho I didn't touch the Team Loadout.

You're not stupid.  This is a bug in retail.  If you don't set a player entry delay explicitly, FS2 will occasionally pick a random delay to use.

[Black Wolf]

The solution to a small but significant number of bugs is going to be "Upgrade to FSOpen". You don't need to use any of the MediaVPs, high poly mods or other hardware intensive stuff if you don't want to - without anything like that, FSOpen should run on any hardware capable of playing retail. However, it opens up vast possibilities for FREDding (dozens if not hundreds of new sexps, new AI, new options like the fiction viewer and even really basic things like texture replacement and multidocking) and solves a bunch of bugs.

There's no reason to use retail in 2015, especially if you're making a mod.

[wardog300k]

Well if my hunk of junk could've run FSO without crashing the system every few minutes, I would use it. And FSO doesn't like my tables, even tho they're good and not broken. Right now, I can use FSO to play some campagins, but I need to restart the game after every mission or two.

[Cyborg17]

Well, maybe we can help you get it more stable.  Run the 3.7.2 debug build until FSO crashes and post the log.

[wardog300k]

Code: (Here it is) [Select]

==========================================================================
DEBUG SPEW: No debug_filter.cfg found, so only general, error, and warning
categories can be shown and no debug_filter.cfg info will be saved.
==========================================================================
FreeSpace 2 Open version: 3.7.2.11227
Passed cmdline options:
  -missile_lighting
  -noenv
  -noglow
  -nospec
  -nonormal
  -noheight
  -3dshockwave
  -nolightshafts
  -dualscanlines
  -orbradar
  -rearm_timer
  -targetinfo
  -mod dem1_5,mediavps
  -no_glsl
  -old_collision
Building file index...
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\dem1_5\DeusExMachinaInterlude.vp' with a checksum of 0xe97efdbc
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\incision.vp' with a checksum of 0xd80d48ca
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\Root_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xce10d76c
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\smarty_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xddeb3b1e
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\sparky_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0x164fe65a
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\sparky_hi_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xa11d56f1
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\stu_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xd77da83a
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango1_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0x4c25221e
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango2_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0x86920b82
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango3_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0x705e8d71
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\warble_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xd85c305d
Searching root 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\dem1_5\' ... 31 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\dem1_5\DeusExMachinaInterlude.vp' ... 125 files
Searching root 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\mediavps\' ... 0 files
Searching root 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\' ... 1785 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\incision.vp' ... 68 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\Root_fs2.vp' ... 157 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\smarty_fs2.vp' ... 10 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\sparky_fs2.vp' ... 3027 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\sparky_hi_fs2.vp' ... 1337 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\stu_fs2.vp' ... 2355 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango1_fs2.vp' ... 32 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango2_fs2.vp' ... 15 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango3_fs2.vp' ... 10 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\warble_fs2.vp' ... 52 files
Found 14 roots and 9004 files.
ERROR: Unknown Language Checksum: 589986744
Using default language settings...
Setting language to English
Game Settings Table: Using Standard Loops For SEXP Arguments
Game Settings Table: Using standard event chaining behavior
Game Settings Table: External shaders are DISABLED
Initializing OpenAL...
  OpenAL Vendor     : Creative Labs Inc.
  OpenAL Renderer   : Software
  OpenAL Version    : 1.1

  Found extension "ALC_EXT_EFX".

  Sample rate: 44100 (44100)
  EFX enabled: NO
  Playback device: Generic Hardware on Realtek HD Audio output
  Capture device: Realtek HD Audio Input
... OpenAL successfully initialized!
Initializing OpenGL graphics device at 640x480 with 16-bit color...
  Initializing WGL...
  Requested WGL Video values = R: 5, G: 6, B: 5, depth: 16, stencil: 1, double-buffer: 1
  Actual WGL Video values    = R: 8, G: 8, B: 8, depth: 24, stencil: 8, double-buffer: 1
  OpenGL Vendor    : Intel
  OpenGL Renderer  : Intel 945G
  OpenGL Version   : 1.4.0 - Build 7.14.10.4926

  Using extension "GL_EXT_fog_coord".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_multitexture".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_env_add".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_compression".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_compression_s3tc".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_filter_anisotropic".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_env_combine".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_compiled_vertex_array".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_draw_range_elements".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_texture_mirrored_repeat".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_texture_non_power_of_two".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_vertex_buffer_object".
  Unable to find extension "GL_EXT_pixel_buffer_object".
  Using extension "GL_SGIS_generate_mipmap".
  Unable to find extension "GL_EXT_framebuffer_object".
  Unable to find extension "GL_NV_texture_rectangle".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_bgra".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_cube_map".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_lod_bias".
  Unable to find extension "NV_point_sprite".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_shading_language_100".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_shader_objects".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_vertex_shader".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_fragment_shader".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ATI_shader_texture_lod".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_texture_float".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_draw_elements_base_vertex".
  Found special extension function "wglSwapIntervalEXT".

  Max texture units: 8 (2)
  Max elements vertices: 1024
  Max elements indices: 1024
  Max texture size: 2048x2048
  Can use compressed textures: YES
  Texture compression available: YES
  Post-processing enabled: NO
  Using trilinear texture filter.
... OpenGL init is complete!
Size of bitmap info = 742 KB
Size of bitmap extra info = 48 bytes
ANI cursorweb with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
GRAPHICS: Initializing default colors...
SCRIPTING: Beginning initialization sequence...
SCRIPTING: Beginning Lua initialization...
LUA: Opening LUA state...
LUA: Initializing base Lua libraries...
LUA: Beginning ADE initialization
ADE: Initializing enumeration constants...
ADE: Assigning Lua session...
SCRIPTING: Beginning main hook parse sequence....
Wokka!  Error opening file (scripting.tbl)!
TABLES: Unable to parse 'scripting.tbl'!  Error code = 5.
SCRIPTING: Inititialization complete.
SCRIPTING: Splash screen overrides checked
SCRIPTING: Splash hook has been run
SCRIPTING: Splash screen conditional hook has been run
Using high memory settings...
Wokka!  Error opening file (interface.tbl)!
WMCGUI: Unable to parse 'interface.tbl'!  Error code = 5.
Dutifully ignoring the extra sound values for retail sound 36, 'l_hit.wav'...
Dutifully ignoring the extra sound values for retail sound 37, 'm_hit.wav'...
Windows reported 16 joysticks, we found 0
Current soundtrack set to -1 in event_music_reset_choices
TBM  =>  Starting parse of 'dem-mus.tbm' ...
Wokka!  Error opening file (armor.tbl)!
TABLES: Unable to parse 'armor.tbl'!  Error code = 5.
WARNING: "For 'Kayser_Impact', 2 of 3 LODs are missing!" at weapons.cpp:208
weapons.tbl(line 565): Error: Required token = [#End] or [$Name:], found [@Laser Glow: 2_laserglow03].

ERROR: weapons.tbl(line 565):
Error: Required token = [#End] or [$Name:], found [@Laser Glow: 2_laserglow03].

File: parselo.cpp
Line: 333
Int3(): From c:\code\fs2_open_3_7_2_rc5\code\globalincs\windebug.cpp at line 1260


[General Battuta]

Code: [Select]

Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\incision.vp' with a checksum of 0xd80d48ca

That shouldn't be in your root directory and could mess things up. Move it into a subfolder!

Also, it's probably best to run with no mods while trying to sort out the crashes. You've got Deus Ex Machina: Interlude selected here. (The error at the end of that log is, I think, caused by a messed up table.)

[The E]

And FSO doesn't like my tables, even tho they're good and not broken.

If FSO complains about your tables, they're very definitely not good and very definitely broken. Retail (and, to a degree, FSO release executables) will try their best to ignore wrong data, but that has limits and will definitely cause unintended behaviour somewhere.

[wardog300k]

I've removed DEMI from the launcher (as I forgot to do it before).
Incision is just a single mission that shouldn't make any problems, but I've put it into a subfolder.
Tables should be alright, I have no idea what's wrong with them, only 5 or 6 weapons are by me, all other are from INFR1 or their entries copied from a working source.

Code: [Select]

==========================================================================
DEBUG SPEW: No debug_filter.cfg found, so only general, error, and warning
categories can be shown and no debug_filter.cfg info will be saved.
==========================================================================
FreeSpace 2 Open version: 3.7.2.11227
Passed cmdline options:
  -missile_lighting
  -noenv
  -noglow
  -nospec
  -nonormal
  -noheight
  -3dshockwave
  -nolightshafts
  -dualscanlines
  -orbradar
  -rearm_timer
  -targetinfo
  -no_glsl
  -old_collision
Building file index...
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\Root_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xce10d76c
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\smarty_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xddeb3b1e
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\sparky_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0x164fe65a
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\sparky_hi_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xa11d56f1
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\stu_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xd77da83a
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango1_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0x4c25221e
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango2_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0x86920b82
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango3_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0x705e8d71
Found root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\warble_fs2.vp' with a checksum of 0xd85c305d
Searching root 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\' ... 1785 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\Root_fs2.vp' ... 157 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\smarty_fs2.vp' ... 10 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\sparky_fs2.vp' ... 3027 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\sparky_hi_fs2.vp' ... 1337 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\stu_fs2.vp' ... 2355 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango1_fs2.vp' ... 32 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango2_fs2.vp' ... 15 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\tango3_fs2.vp' ... 10 files
Searching root pack 'D:\Program Files\GOG.com\Freespace 2\warble_fs2.vp' ... 52 files
Found 10 roots and 8780 files.
ERROR: Unknown Language Checksum: 589986744
Using default language settings...
Setting language to English
Game Settings Table: Using Standard Loops For SEXP Arguments
Game Settings Table: Using standard event chaining behavior
Game Settings Table: External shaders are DISABLED
Initializing OpenAL...
  OpenAL Vendor     : Creative Labs Inc.
  OpenAL Renderer   : Software
  OpenAL Version    : 1.1

  Found extension "ALC_EXT_EFX".

  Sample rate: 44100 (44100)
  EFX enabled: NO
  Playback device: Generic Hardware on Realtek HD Audio output
  Capture device: Realtek HD Audio Input
... OpenAL successfully initialized!
Initializing OpenGL graphics device at 640x480 with 16-bit color...
  Initializing WGL...
  Requested WGL Video values = R: 5, G: 6, B: 5, depth: 16, stencil: 1, double-buffer: 1
  Actual WGL Video values    = R: 8, G: 8, B: 8, depth: 24, stencil: 8, double-buffer: 1
  OpenGL Vendor    : Intel
  OpenGL Renderer  : Intel 945G
  OpenGL Version   : 1.4.0 - Build 7.14.10.4926

  Using extension "GL_EXT_fog_coord".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_multitexture".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_env_add".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_compression".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_compression_s3tc".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_filter_anisotropic".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_env_combine".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_compiled_vertex_array".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_draw_range_elements".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_texture_mirrored_repeat".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_texture_non_power_of_two".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_vertex_buffer_object".
  Unable to find extension "GL_EXT_pixel_buffer_object".
  Using extension "GL_SGIS_generate_mipmap".
  Unable to find extension "GL_EXT_framebuffer_object".
  Unable to find extension "GL_NV_texture_rectangle".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_bgra".
  Using extension "GL_ARB_texture_cube_map".
  Using extension "GL_EXT_texture_lod_bias".
  Unable to find extension "NV_point_sprite".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_shading_language_100".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_shader_objects".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_vertex_shader".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_fragment_shader".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ATI_shader_texture_lod".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_texture_float".
  Unable to find extension "GL_ARB_draw_elements_base_vertex".
  Found special extension function "wglSwapIntervalEXT".

  Max texture units: 8 (2)
  Max elements vertices: 1024
  Max elements indices: 1024
  Max texture size: 2048x2048
  Can use compressed textures: YES
  Texture compression available: YES
  Post-processing enabled: NO
  Using trilinear texture filter.
... OpenGL init is complete!
Size of bitmap info = 742 KB
Size of bitmap extra info = 48 bytes
ANI cursorweb with size 24x24 (25.0% wasted)
GRAPHICS: Initializing default colors...
SCRIPTING: Beginning initialization sequence...
SCRIPTING: Beginning Lua initialization...
LUA: Opening LUA state...
LUA: Initializing base Lua libraries...
LUA: Beginning ADE initialization
ADE: Initializing enumeration constants...
ADE: Assigning Lua session...
SCRIPTING: Beginning main hook parse sequence....
Wokka!  Error opening file (scripting.tbl)!
TABLES: Unable to parse 'scripting.tbl'!  Error code = 5.
SCRIPTING: Inititialization complete.
SCRIPTING: Splash screen overrides checked
SCRIPTING: Splash hook has been run
SCRIPTING: Splash screen conditional hook has been run
Using high memory settings...
Wokka!  Error opening file (interface.tbl)!
WMCGUI: Unable to parse 'interface.tbl'!  Error code = 5.
Dutifully ignoring the extra sound values for retail sound 36, 'l_hit.wav'...
Dutifully ignoring the extra sound values for retail sound 37, 'm_hit.wav'...
Windows reported 16 joysticks, we found 0
Current soundtrack set to -1 in event_music_reset_choices
Wokka!  Error opening file (armor.tbl)!
TABLES: Unable to parse 'armor.tbl'!  Error code = 5.
weapons.tbl(line 565): Error: Required token = [#End] or [$Name:], found [@Laser Glow: 2_laserglow03].

ERROR: weapons.tbl(line 565):
Error: Required token = [#End] or [$Name:], found [@Laser Glow: 2_laserglow03].

File: parselo.cpp
Line: 333
Freeing all existing models...


[MatthTheGeek]

Well something is obviously wrong with your weapon table and it gives you the line, so it should've be hard to find and fix the issue. If you're stuck you can always pastebin your table for us to take a look.

[wardog300k]

Well if you want to take a look at the table and find the problem, tell me and I can PM it to you. Even though it doesn't have any spoilers, I'd rather keep it as hidden as possible.

[General Battuta]

Nobody will steal your table, promise. Tables (especially retail-only tables!) are easy and fun to make.

[mjn.mixael]

I would also recommend using this for working with tables. It can really help to visual what's wrong when there are errors.

[wardog300k]

I know that nobody will steal it, I just don't want to show the table to everyone as there are some unique weapons that I want to not be seen before the mod's release.

[mjn.mixael]

That is indicative of a false believe that new weapons/ships are going to be the main draw for people to play your mod... a discussion which doesn't belong in this thread. I will simply say that we can't help if you don't let us.. and building a mod that only works on retail due to these sorts of bugs is not going to get many players, regardless of how many new weapons or ships you have.