Poll

In an all out war (WITHOUT the Flood), who do you think would win?  If you think two factions would join forces, feel free to select them.

UNSC
Covenant
GTVA
Shivans

Author Topic: HALO vs FreeSpace  (Read 68357 times)

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Offline Mongoose

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Why do we allow threads like this to exist? :p

 

Offline Scotty

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Turning 180 degrees means nothing.  Changing the direction of velocity is what does.  Do you remember when that happens?  I'm fairly certain it rotates a damaged shield quadrant out of the way and rolls to bring another to bear.

 
Turning 180 degrees means nothing.  Changing the direction of velocity is what does.  Do you remember when that happens?  I'm fairly certain it rotates a damaged shield quadrant out of the way and rolls to bring another to bear.
Well I'm sorry. I'm not paying attention in physics class anymore...

I think it was in the Fall of Reach book. Captain whats-his-face with the beard observed one of the first covenant cruisers fleeing from him at what was described at incredible speed and then did an extremely sharp turn that the author described would completely shred any human ship at that speed.
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 
I can't find my Halo books under my piles of Star Wars and 40K novels, but I am fairly certain that it is mentioned a few times in TFoR that UNSC vessels have serious accuracy problems when transiting Slipspace.  I know for certain they have difficulty transiting Slipspace in fleet formations because Keyes is surprised when the Covenant ships en-route to Sigma Octanus arrive in perfect formation, and Covenant vessels can travel so closely together in Slipspace that sensors have trouble differentiating the various ships and get them mixed up as one giant blob.
17:37:02   Quanto: I want to have sexual intercourse with every space elf in existence
17:37:11   SpardaSon21: even the males?
17:37:22   Quanto: its not gay if its an elf

[21:51] <@Droid803> I now realize
[21:51] <@Droid803> this will be SLIIIIIGHTLY awkward
[21:51] <@Droid803> as this rich psychic girl will now be tsundere for a loli.
[21:51] <@Droid803> OH WELLL.

See what you're missing in #WoD and #Fsquest?

[07:57:32] <Caiaphas> inspired by HerraTohtori i built a supermaneuverable plane in ksp
[07:57:43] <Caiaphas> i just killed my pilots with a high-g maneuver
[07:58:19] <Caiaphas> apparently people can't take 20 gees for 5 continuous seconds
[08:00:11] <Caiaphas> the plane however performed admirably, and only crashed because it no longer had any guidance systems

 
Covenant vessels also travel significantly faster than UNSC ships in Slipspace (as well as in general), taking mere hours instead of a day, for example.
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 

Offline starlord

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I sincerely hope that this scenario could be verified under freespace one day... With causality currently AWOL, hope dwindles away... :sigh:

Although HALO being quite successful, there's no shortage of ship model pics and info. It's just that it would be so cool to have at last a space sim in that universe...

 
Although HALO being quite successful, there's no shortage of ship model pics and info.
Actually, yes there is. There is only one UNSC starfighter documented: The Longsword. and there is negligible data available about it, other than the fact that it's a long-range fighter-bomber with the capacity of nuclear warheads, missiles, and 120-150 millimeter cannons. The Covenant Seraph fighter has even less data available, though it seems to be a light interceptor or possibly a recon craft.
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Bleh. Halo wars is all we've got to work with. That and that nexus mod.
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
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-Uncharted Territory
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(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

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Offline Rodo

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Shivans are the ultimate answer of an angry cosmos, so... vote for Shivans... or else.
el hombre vicio...

 
Or Carl will munch your lunch.
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 
If you're lucky... :drevil:
17:37:02   Quanto: I want to have sexual intercourse with every space elf in existence
17:37:11   SpardaSon21: even the males?
17:37:22   Quanto: its not gay if its an elf

[21:51] <@Droid803> I now realize
[21:51] <@Droid803> this will be SLIIIIIGHTLY awkward
[21:51] <@Droid803> as this rich psychic girl will now be tsundere for a loli.
[21:51] <@Droid803> OH WELLL.

See what you're missing in #WoD and #Fsquest?

[07:57:32] <Caiaphas> inspired by HerraTohtori i built a supermaneuverable plane in ksp
[07:57:43] <Caiaphas> i just killed my pilots with a high-g maneuver
[07:58:19] <Caiaphas> apparently people can't take 20 gees for 5 continuous seconds
[08:00:11] <Caiaphas> the plane however performed admirably, and only crashed because it no longer had any guidance systems

 

Offline Wolfy

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UNSC/Covenant would most certainly have the advantage in a hugely long range fight (the distances described in the halo books), where as the GTVA and Shivans would have a huge advantage at a very close range (such as in Freespace). I dont think it's really possible to compare these 2 franchises as it is others. They just domnt mix together (apart from this mod, if it's ever done :P). freespace vs Star Wars or Battlestar would be easier and match together, while Halo vs <Insert Space Opera novel series here> (The Lost Fleet, etc) would also be easyer to comapre.

BUT, even the small UNSC ships often carry nuclear weapons. UNSC Frigates and Destroyers carry between 1-3 nukes, capable of destroying  a huge amount of covvie ships at a time, what would those do to GTVA and Shivan ships which have minimal weapons and are clustered close together. Even the tiny prowlers carried (14?) nuclear mines. Ghost of Onyx even had a prototype of a new nuke which essentially blew the atmosphere off and destroyed half a planet(!!!) MAC rounds (piece 600 ton slug fired at 120,000KM/s + ships current speed) would probably smash most GTVA ships, and thats then the UNSC Defence platforms fire 3000 ton slugs at about half the speed of light, those destroyed Covvie ships AND any ship behind the target. Archer Missiles on most ships, Pillar of Autumn had 7800 missiles it could of fired at pretty much the same time. (although, the PoA was heavilly upgraded).

Covvie ships i dont think would serve so well against GTVA and Shivan ships though, i just dont see Plasma and Laser being as effective as huge and massive kinetic rounds, i feel thats what these ships where designed to have a better defence against.
Wolfy - Ship Modeler for SBP07

 
BUT, even the small UNSC ships often carry nuclear weapons. UNSC Frigates and Destroyers carry between 1-3 nukes, capable of destroying  a huge amount of covvie ships at a time, what would those do to GTVA and Shivan ships which have minimal weapons and are clustered close together. Even the tiny prowlers carried (14?) nuclear mines. Ghost of Onyx even had a prototype of a new nuke which essentially blew the atmosphere off and destroyed half a planet(!!!) MAC rounds (piece 600 ton slug fired at 120,000KM/s + ships current speed) would probably smash most GTVA ships, and thats then the UNSC Defence platforms fire 3000 ton slugs at about half the speed of light, those destroyed Covvie ships AND any ship behind the target. Archer Missiles on most ships, Pillar of Autumn had 7800 missiles it could of fired at pretty much the same time. (although, the PoA was heavilly upgraded).
The effectiveness of nukes against covenant ships is negligible. One of the generals in the halo novels was said to have fired a nuke at a covenant cruiser with almost no affect against it's shields, at the sacrifice of an entire squadron of longsword fighters who were distracting it.
I'd like to know where you heard that a nuke could destroy multiple covenant ships, as if that were the case, the UNSC could win any space battle by simply using nuclear weapons properly. (I.E. mines, the method described above, etc...)

Also, as I recall, Harbinger and Helios torpedoes are the equivalent to a nuclear weapon in power, making the UNSCs nuclear weapons no more powerful than the GTVAs bombers. The harbinger according to the tech database has 5000 megatons of yield, substantially larger than the bomb dropped on hiroshima and probably larger than Shiva or FENRIS warheads.

EDIT: After doing some research, it seems that an average sized nuclear explosion would be enough to destroy a covenant cruiser if it was a direct hit, though seeing the massive size of the Covenant, it's unlikely that the UNSC has enough nukes for every Covenant ship to make them a viable weapon.

UNSC MAC weapons do seem like they would be rather effective against GTVA vessels, seeing as how they can be fired at extremely long ranges with very powerful yield. Though I'm sure the GTVA could invent a refurbished beam cannon design to hit at those ranges (or perhaps beam cannons can already reach that range, as evidenced by the Lucifer's ability to destroy entire cities on Vasuda Prime from orbit).
« Last Edit: March 20, 2010, 05:42:11 pm by haloboy100 »
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 

Offline Wolfy

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nukes
Battle of Onyx:
http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Battle_of_Onyx
towards the end of Battlegroup Starlingrad section: "As the Covenant closed to engage and entered the field the HORNETs were detonated, destroying all but four of the remaining Covenant warships"

Battle of Sigma Octanus IV (not QUITE as effective as i thought it was):
http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Battle_of_Sigma_Octanus_IV
Opening Actions section: "the nuclear warhead deployed earlier, was detonated, completely draining the shields on the two frigates"

I think the only time Nukes where not so effective was the Second Battle of Harvest where all the remaining UNSC Ships had to fire ALL there nukes and MACs at the same time to just bring down one covvie ships.

Also, someone mentoned earlier that the UNSC only has the Longsword for a fighter. I just read the Halo Encyclopedia, APPARENTLY UNSC cruisers also carry a lightning fighter, no idea what it could look like though. However, could Hornets and Vultures and Hawks be useable in space? maybe not? :P
Wolfy - Ship Modeler for SBP07

 
nukes
Battle of Onyx:
http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Battle_of_Onyx
towards the end of Battlegroup Starlingrad section: "As the Covenant closed to engage and entered the field the HORNETs were detonated, destroying all but four of the remaining Covenant warships"
Those were because the Covenant ships still had their shields down due to the fact they just exited slipspace and also due to the fact that they weren't engaged in battle, so they wouldn't have their shields raised. Also remember that it took over a dozen nuclear devices to achieve that much destruction, as well as the fact that all the covenant ships were probably close enough to be under the mercy of multiple nuclear explosions going off at once.
nukes
Battle of Sigma Octanus IV (not QUITE as effective as i thought it was):
http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Battle_of_Sigma_Octanus_IV
Opening Actions section: "the nuclear warhead deployed earlier, was detonated, completely draining the shields on the two frigates"
Frigates are even smaller than Cruisers in the Halo universe, meaning that they probably can't handle a nuke like Cruisers can.
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 

Offline NFSRacer

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I keep reading that HALO craft fly at clicks per hour.  My question is, Is there any sort of proof behind that?  I mean, look at the BSG: Re-Imagined series.  Out of all the episodes that I've seen (...which, to be honest, isn't a whole lot...), I've only seen one episode where you could see through the cockpit of a Viper and it look VERY similar to FS combat.  For all we know, dogfighting in HALO may be the same in some sense.
"Said 'It was up to us.  Up to us, to decide.  You've become a virus that eating up it host.  We've been watching you with all our eye, and what you seem to value most.  'So much potential'.  Or so we used to say.  Your greed, self-importance, and your arrogance, you p*** it all away.'" - NIN from Year Zero

 
Well, this time it's based on actual proof, as the approximate speed of space craft is mentioned at least once in all the halo novels.
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 

Offline NFSRacer

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Huh.  What was the class?  Did it mention?
"Said 'It was up to us.  Up to us, to decide.  You've become a virus that eating up it host.  We've been watching you with all our eye, and what you seem to value most.  'So much potential'.  Or so we used to say.  Your greed, self-importance, and your arrogance, you p*** it all away.'" - NIN from Year Zero

 
I remember a transport moving at speeds of thousands of kilometers per hour during ghosts of onyx; the one carrying Dr. Hasley about to go into reentry.
But that's just one example. Everything from Longswords to cruisers are stated to go at that scale of speed.
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 

Offline NFSRacer

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Well, then that changes it a bit, but not by much.  You mentioned the transport going into re-entry.  Perhaps (I'm not counting on it, though) the transport reached that speed with the help of the planet's gravity.  But, even if that were true, I'm fairly sure that the slowest ship within the UNSC Fleet can still travel faster than a GTF Pegasus on afterburners, or even a GVF Hoth on full burners as well.  I guess it all comes down to fire power, right?

Speaking of which, does anyone know how much of its mass a Helios torpedo uses?  I know it's an anti-matter warhead, but I also know that the Covie's have their own that uses 100% of ITS mass upon detonation.  Wither that makes them more or less powerful than a Helios you guys are going to have to answer.
"Said 'It was up to us.  Up to us, to decide.  You've become a virus that eating up it host.  We've been watching you with all our eye, and what you seem to value most.  'So much potential'.  Or so we used to say.  Your greed, self-importance, and your arrogance, you p*** it all away.'" - NIN from Year Zero