Author Topic: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi  (Read 103367 times)

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Offline The E

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi

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The point is, until you have worked under a weak director, you don't see through the signs of him mishandling stuff. With Johnson here, I'm seeing enough inconsistency that could indicate he isn't a particularly visionary guy and is instead a yes-man, so I'm saying it out. You are right to criticize that, since I can't provide direct evidence. But it's risk I'm willing to accept.

There's some truth to this, namely that he couldn't manage all the little things that went into the movie in a more coherent, satisfying whole. This is no argument to whether if the guy has a "vision" or not. Those are absolutely separate things!

There was an interview with Ridley Scott recently that touched on this a bit. Johnson went from directing 20 and 30 million dollar films to making the 200 million dollar TLJ. Any director, no matter how easy they are to work with, will have difficulty adjusting to such a bump in scale; I think that the weaknesses in TLJ can be partially attributed to this.
Scott's thesis was that studios like Disney do this because it makes it easier for the studio to get the directors to follow a studio mandated line; this, in essence, was responsible for the MCUs track record of making films that rarely go above or below their average quality.
Star Wars was built around a similar idea of strong studio influence. To start things off, they used JJ Abrams, who for all his faults in terms of following through with a franchise, has a strong track record of building very good casts and giving them food starting points. Then they used Johnson to do the follow through, and if The Book of Henry hadn't killed Colin Trevorrows career, he would have been the one to finish things off.
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Offline MP-Ryan

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
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Episode XI Attack of the Orphans

The funny thing is, I could actually see myself paying money to see that :lol: Particularly the Ghost busters and Force Ghosts.  :lol:

I figured out the author's thought process:

"Disney ruined my childhood because they cast WOMEN and MINORITIES and they've turned Star Wars into SECRET FEMINIST PROPAGANDA OH NOES!!!! I need my support-frog!  Let me write what my groupthink cluster will think is clever but is little more than tired, worst-stereotype-oriented drivel that simply reveals what a terrible writer I am.  Lulz, I'll make a pun about Millennials which will be totally ironic because I can't actually even spell Millennium Falcon, despite being the ULTIMATE STAR WARS FAN."

For ****'s sake.  The only thing matching the total awfulness of the lack of humour in that excerpt are the atrocious spelling and typos.  If this is what passes for satirical criticism of both film and modern progressive thought, the corners of the internet writing it are more moronic and hopeless than I thought.
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Offline Mongoose

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
When do we get to forcibly remove troglodytes like that to the middle of Bumble****, Nowhere, hundreds of miles from a wireless signal?

 

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
I could drive a death star - heck, Starkiller Base - trough the gaping holes in the plot and character behavior and writing the last two movies have.

Then again, SW in general was never the height of storytelling and concistency to begin with.
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Offline Mika

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
And yet you've posted answer upon answer on this page trying to blame Rian Johnson for JJ Abrams faults? Perhaps thinking about who Snoke and Rey were would have been a better use of your time.

My bank account disagrees with that, but it's true that I don't get paid for writing here. The reason I'm still talking about this here is not only because the movie was abysmal, but also due to the reasons it ended up so. It seems like a classic case of management errors stacked on top of each other, which could provide a bit more discussion about this. Additionally, the whole thing started from people asking why others found the movie bad, and I've given my answers to that. I hoped to close the discussion from my part with the last response, but some relevant discussion popped up.

Abrams wasn't necessarily tasked with writing the whole backstory. These things are written in the commission contracts, and Abrams provided what was asked from him. Mark Hamill himself has stated that there was no story arc available for the movies, including the first one. That's Disney. Then we know Kennedy has fired a director or two from their positions. Wasn't Trevorrow already asked to direct the TFA, that's what I'm getting from Hamill's interviews? Kennedy sacked him due to "creative differences". Regardless, he was dropped, and the ball was given to Abrams. Abrams wouldn't have time to write the story arc if he had to write the plot for the movie in a short notice, in addition for taking care of other production things. Abrams provided the hooks with purpose and gave a rather interesting starting point for Episode 8.

Johnson not only managed to squash it down, but instead of ignoring the stupid parts of the hooks, he ignored parts of the original trilogy instead, with rather predictable results. Now what will likely happen is that Johnson gets all the blame, and will likely be the fall guy if things didn't go according to Disney's plan. And I have to say rightly so, if anything told in the former movies is drastically revised, there better be a damn good reason for it. Otherwise, why would I want to invest any time in the series if the stuff just keeps on changing?

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Unsolvable in that there is no satisfying answer to them. I challenge you to come up with an answer for who Snoke is that would have added anything to film number 8. As for your continued claims of lack of character development, chanting it like a mantra does not make it true. The problem that people are complaining about in the film is that Luke's character developed in a direction they didn't like. If you're going to keep claiming that Luke's character didn't develop at all, then you're only proving that you have no idea what the words character development mean.

Snoke's history was not essential for Episode 8, a short part of it could have worked in 9. However, the First Order was essential for the Eight Installment. So is it a remnant of the Empire or not? How on Earth does it have such a vast fleet that rivals the Empire? How was Snoke able to convince anyone to join his cause, and more so, what does Snoke even represent? If he isn't a Sith, what does he want to do with the galaxy? Where do the First Order's resources come from? What is the balance of power between the Republic and the First Order? None of that is available anywhere. Because of it, there's no telling what was at stake in the battles of Episode 8. La Resistance started running, and they are still running with less people around at the end of the movie. All that changed is apparently "now there's hope", while galaxy gave them a massive middle finger.

Regarding character development, The E asked more about it.

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Let's see, what was the character development for the main cast.

Rey: learns that being a Jedi doesn't mean being a Jedi fangirl. That she has to make her own decisions and her own name and that she can't rely on Luke or her parents to make her important in the grand scheme of things.
Finn: has to come to terms with being a part of the resistance and that looking out for yourself and your loved ones exclusively is not enough, not in the face of something like the Empire.
Poe: learns that heroics have their place, but not when they lead to pyrrhic victories.
That's just the heroes, of course. Kylo Ren also has his own arc, and in every case, these characters make decisions over the course of the film that they wouldn't have been able to make at the film's start.

I am curious now, though. What do you think character development is, Mika?

The issue with Rey having the character development of your interpretation is that it doesn't make sense to me. She was already a strong willed urchin in Episode 7, and having been basically a slave until her adulthood makes this development quite disconnected from the backstory shown in TFA. She would have already known the difference in the sense that she decides for herself. The interesting thing about her would have been the moral backbone; having lived under extreme poverty, she still has a very strong moral backbone whereas many people around her didn't. She certainly would have been tempted with quick cash-ins and other illegality to improve her position, but she has refused to do that. How does she see the world in this way even after such a rough childhood?

Finn's development on him coming to terms with La Resistance works somewhat, but still, he is a deserter, and no army employs a deserter in their ranks by default. Very few people in La Resistance knew who he was even if he was injured at the end of Ep 7, and was in coma for the beginning of Eight. More could have been done by handling the deserter part to flesh out the character in his new surroundings better. Why would he attempt to sacrifice himself after knowing the people from La Resistance for a couple of days??? The rest about stopping the First Order doesn't work, as thinking about that would be pretty much essential already as a storm trooper on the First Order side. Unless you mean storm troopers cannot think due to some chip installed in them, but even then Finn deserted.

The point about Poe's heroics is problematic in two fronts: it gets mudded by the rest of the film, and secondly, person with his temperament would never have been any general, possibly not even a pilot. The problem with the wanton heroics point is that Holdo sacrifices herself and manages to create a massive disruption in the First Order. Then we get Finn about to wreck the cannon which could have taken out the ground forces of the First Order in Krayt. Finally, Luke gets himself killed to save the few remnants of Le Resistance. Furthermore, his character's actions do not lead to, let's just say, feedback from the mechanics and friends of the bomber squad he managed to wipe out. Making the point this way would have been way more effective. What do we have now? A decisive battle where the Resistance soliders MUST remain at their stations given the information they had; it's do or die situation for them and the Resistance.

Only at the moment when Luke arrives becomes the retreat justified as the opposition is distracted. However, Poe makes the decision before that, but to accomplish what exactly? Retreat option for the fleet was certainly there in the beginning of the episode, but in Krayt, it's really not an option. That's not learning to assess the situation, it's just again a bad decision from his part. Of course, had he wanted to save the people from his perspective certain death with AT-ATs to fight in better positions, then it somewhat works. Unfortunately, the speeders were still likely the best bet they had, nothing in the base could otherwise touch the AT-ATs so they would have been overrun anyways.

Kylo Ren, [sigh]. He is one of the movie "baddies" you'd really like to smack down and tell him to grow a pair of balls. He's probably going to cry like a baby in Episode 9 because Rey makes him see the error of his ways. Luckily, I don't need to see it.

Protip: Don't do this if you as a CEO don't want to get labelled for pushing agendas. Makes one wonder about the target group analysis of the marketing department...
« Last Edit: January 22, 2018, 06:03:14 pm by Mika »
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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Kylo Ren, [sigh]. He is one of the movie "baddies" you'd really like to smack down and tell him to grow a pair of balls. He's probably going to cry like a baby in Episode 9 because Rey makes him see the error of his ways.

man you could not make it more clear that you did not understand the film at all if you tried
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Offline karajorma

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Johnson not only managed to squash it down, but instead of ignoring the stupid parts of the hooks, he ignored parts of the original trilogy instead, with rather predictable results.

Where did he ignore anything from the original trilogy? Just because you assert he did, doesn't make it true.


Quote
However, the First Order was essential for the Eight Installment. So is it a remnant of the Empire or not? How on Earth does it have such a vast fleet that rivals the Empire? How was Snoke able to convince anyone to join his cause, and more so, what does Snoke even represent? If he isn't a Sith, what does he want to do with the galaxy? Where do the First Order's resources come from? What is the balance of power between the Republic and the First Order?

Bull****. Those were vital questions for seventh instalment, the instalment that introduced them and claimed they had vast fleets, planetkiller weapons, etc. If you don't lay the blame for ignoring that on the episode that introduced them out of thin air then it is massively unfair to blame the next film for not doing so. Especially as the Republic is basically gone at this point.

Like I said before, you want to blame Rian for JJ Abrams mistakes.
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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Protip: Don't do this if you as a CEO don't want to get labelled for pushing agendas. Makes one wonder about the target group analysis of the marketing department...


Translation: Mika doesn't think people should have fun because god knows women playing bigger roles both behind and in front of the camera shouldn't be celebrated right?  If you celebrate it, and try to be a role model for young girls, hell that **** might spread!

Also hey anyone else remember when some guy had fun with a t-shirt?


Maybe Star Wars producers just like to trigger nerds


 
Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Speaking of pushing agendas...

Quote from: Chris Taylor, How Star Wars Conquered the Universe
Anyone sitting down to write a screenplay on November 1, 1994, as Lucas apparently did, would have been interrupted eight days into the writing process by one of the most seismic midterm in postwar American history. Republicans took the House and the Senate for the first time in 40 years. A resurgent GOP under House Speaker Newt Gingrich started pushing its tax-cutting, regulation-slashing 'Contract with America.' Democrats, whose messaging had improved since Ted Kennedy's "Star Wars" flub, started calling it a 'Contract On America.'
It was perhaps no co-incidence, then, that Lucas started writing about a "Trade Federation," aided and emboldened by corrupt politicians, embroiled in some sort of dispute over the taxing of trade to the outlying star systems. We never learn what the dispute is about -- whether the Trade Federation was pro- or anti-tax. But what we know is that the name of the leader of the Trade Federation -- never actually spoken in the movie, but noted in the script from the start -- was Nute Gunray. By 1997, when the GOP Senate leader was Trent Lott, Lucas named the Trade Federation's representative in the Galactic Senate: Lott Dodd. We're a long way from the subtlety of his [George Lucas's] [North] Vietnam metaphor here.

... I mean, if we're going to talk about pushing agendas, we really ought to consider the Prequel's not-so-subtle critique of Bush-era politics (esp. in Revenge of the Sith) or, well, literally naming the bad guys after the most prominent Republican politicians at the time. There's far more going on in there then, errr, a film having women in it.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2018, 01:26:47 am by -Joshua- »

 

Offline The E

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Mika, do you know what character development is?
If I'm just aching this can't go on
I came from chasing dreams to feel alone
There must be changes, miss to feel strong
I really need lifе to touch me
--Evergrey, Where August Mourns

 

Online Colonol Dekker

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
I haven't read the whole thread I'm just posting to say I saw this last night and I'm very much unimpressed with it all.


Except this bit.


https://youtu.be/nIkKOlsYWKc
« Last Edit: January 23, 2018, 04:33:22 am by Colonol Dekker »
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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Johnson not only managed to squash it down, but instead of ignoring the stupid parts of the hooks, he ignored parts of the original trilogy instead, with rather predictable results.

What parts of the "original trilogy" did he "ignore", with what "predictable results"?

This is 100% bull****.

Quote
Snoke's history was not essential for Episode 8, a short part of it could have worked in 9. However, the First Order was essential for the Eight Installment. So is it a remnant of the Empire or not? How on Earth does it have such a vast fleet that rivals the Empire? How was Snoke able to convince anyone to join his cause, and more so, what does Snoke even represent? If he isn't a Sith, what does he want to do with the galaxy?

Why on earth are you confused whether if Snoke is a Sith Lord or not? And given episode 7 just gave us StarKiller Base out of nowhere, I just assumed this was just a premise they built on top of, that the First Order was rich as **** and would bring its heat on the galaxy. Why is this still a question?

Quote
Where do the First Order's resources come from? What is the balance of power between the Republic and the First Order? None of that is available anywhere. Because of it, there's no telling what was at stake in the battles of Episode 8. La Resistance started running, and they are still running with less people around at the end of the movie. All that changed is apparently "now there's hope", while galaxy gave them a massive middle finger.

This is utterly bull****, from start to finish. You know First Order is crazy rich, they built a goddamned StarKiller base. You know the Republic has just been nuked entirely to shreds, fleets included. You know the Resistance was just found out and is trying to escape Snoke's grip. That's all the setup you need for the movie to work. Everything else is commentary.

Regarding the "middle finger", this is obviously a hook to episode 9. Why didn't the galaxy come to help them? There's a good story in there, not that I have much hopes that JJ will answer them, but hey. Some hypothesis: they were also being cornered by the First Order. They were hopeless and trying to hide themselves. They couldn't listen.

Quote
The issue with Rey having the character development of your interpretation is that it doesn't make sense to me. She was already a strong willed urchin in Episode 7, and having been basically a slave until her adulthood makes this development quite disconnected from the backstory shown in TFA. She would have already known the difference in the sense that she decides for herself. The interesting thing about her would have been the moral backbone; having lived under extreme poverty, she still has a very strong moral backbone whereas many people around her didn't. She certainly would have been tempted with quick cash-ins and other illegality to improve her position, but she has refused to do that. How does she see the world in this way even after such a rough childhood?

That's not character development for the Rey that we had from episode 7, that's a completely different character that you just wrote yourself. If your point was to blame JJ, "fine", I guess, but we're talking about episode 8. Keep up. Her arc here is about self-sufficiency in a spiritual way. She's always been self-sufficient materially, but she always craved for a father / brother figure. Well, no more. If you are all into anti-feminist claptrap, you should applaud this development. Basically she's saying "**** #HeforShe" bull****, I'm on my own".

Quote
Finn's development on him coming to terms with La Resistance works somewhat, but still, he is a deserter, and no army employs a deserter in their ranks by default. Very few people in La Resistance knew who he was even if he was injured at the end of Ep 7, and was in coma for the beginning of Eight. More could have been done by handling the deserter part to flesh out the character in his new surroundings better. Why would he attempt to sacrifice himself after knowing the people from La Resistance for a couple of days??? The rest about stopping the First Order doesn't work, as thinking about that would be pretty much essential already as a storm trooper on the First Order side. Unless you mean storm troopers cannot think due to some chip installed in them, but even then Finn deserted.

Finn's character development is muddied by a very uneven arc that he and Rosie go through, but still it seems very obvious to me. From a deserter in the beggining of 7 (and 8, btw), he goes through the cynical trope of war "everyone's the same", until he slowly realises what he's fighting for. Then, he gets a lesson from Rosie that he is not here to just "fight", which is just a suicidal move, but to save, that this is the main difference between the First Order and the Resistance.

This is character development. Sorry if you didn't see it.

Quote
The point about Poe's heroics is problematic in two fronts: it gets mudded by the rest of the film, and secondly, person with his temperament would never have been any general, possibly not even a pilot. The problem with the wanton heroics point is that Holdo sacrifices herself and manages to create a massive disruption in the First Order. Then we get Finn about to wreck the cannon which could have taken out the ground forces of the First Order in Krayt. Finally, Luke gets himself killed to save the few remnants of Le Resistance. Furthermore, his character's actions do not lead to, let's just say, feedback from the mechanics and friends of the bomber squad he managed to wipe out. Making the point this way would have been way more effective. What do we have now? A decisive battle where the Resistance soliders MUST remain at their stations given the information they had; it's do or die situation for them and the Resistance.

Only at the moment when Luke arrives becomes the retreat justified as the opposition is distracted. However, Poe makes the decision before that, but to accomplish what exactly? Retreat option for the fleet was certainly there in the beginning of the episode, but in Krayt, it's really not an option. That's not learning to assess the situation, it's just again a bad decision from his part. Of course, had he wanted to save the people from his perspective certain death with AT-ATs to fight in better positions, then it somewhat works. Unfortunately, the speeders were still likely the best bet they had, nothing in the base could otherwise touch the AT-ATs so they would have been overrun anyways.

You're headcannoning reasons why Poe's arc was bad. This is really awful analysis. Yes, he's "over the top" high on his heroics, but this is Star Wars for ****s sake, this isn't JAG. And we learn that he gets demoted not from "general". The main difference between what he did and Holdo and Luke did was, these two sacrificed themselves to save the rest. Really, you are this incapable of recognizing this basic difference? Luke's sacrifice is also about his own arc. Jesus, how ****ing wrong can you get? So Sad.

Regarding Krayt, it's ****ing obvious that Poe reckoned that there was no point in driving everyone to their graves, especially considering they wouldn't achieve anything. Retreat and reconsider is the only logical move. It also points to his arc, where he realises that you shouldn't always go gung ho.

Quote
Kylo Ren, [sigh]. He is one of the movie "baddies" you'd really like to smack down and tell him to grow a pair of balls. He's probably going to cry like a baby in Episode 9 because Rey makes him see the error of his ways. Luckily, I don't need to see it.

I think that at this point you don't need to see *any* Star Wars, because you would hate this character called "Anakin Skywalker" in both the trilogies...

Jesus ****ing Christ. This is like a treatise on being wrong. Oh we're not finished!

Quote
Protip: Don't do this if you as a CEO don't want to get labelled for pushing agendas. Makes one wonder about the target group analysis of the marketing department...


What the ****ing **** is wrong with pushing the agenda that women should celebrate and think of Star Wars as their own??!? Jesus, tell me what the **** is wrong with you.

 

Offline zookeeper

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
One aspect of what I find off-putting about TLJ was the weird and out-of-place... pathos, I guess? There were a whole bunch of supposedly-inspirational one-liners with the word "rebellion" in it, and it always felt like fanservice or name-dropping. "The Rebellion is reborn today", yay fistpump wait what? "We have everything we need to build a Rebellion" yay fistpump wait wtf does that even mean? "Rebel scum!" woo yeah awesome moment, or wait that's just the most obvious callback. And hope this, hope that, spark that will light the fire, bla bla bla. Then an emotional moment is made out of a freed animal getting released to join its herd, rich people are shown to be awful, arms trade is shown to be bad, "this is how we win", and so on.

Obviously the problem is not that a movie has slavery and it's bad, heroes freeing an animal and that's good or jedi masters inspiring hope, but I find it hopelessly clumsy and out of place how the cinematography focuses on spelling out those things and how characters join in on the commentary. It's like if in RotJ Han, Luke and Leia were poignantly lamenting how this is the Ewoks' habitat that the Empire is destroying, with sad music and a shot of a clearcut area. Or if in ANH Leia was constantly going on about how there is still hope, despite that that's what the plot of the movie was already expressly about.

In the OT, no one ever (?) makes inspirational speeches, no one is dismayed by the depravity in Jabba's palace (C-3PO perhaps excluded), and heck, no one (?) even talks about how the Empire is bad because there's simply no need. It's space opera with spaceships and lasers and wizards, and while it has emotion, it's based on the characters, not on abstract concepts or morals.

This stuff is hard to explain, so no nitpicking, please!

 
Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
I honestly feel as if the Rebellion side of the film was more of an afterthought compared to the Jedi side of the film. The Empire Strikes Back does deal with moral ambiguity in the form of Lando Calrissian, but it's done in a far more subtle manner. A lot of the rebellion side of the film feels rather first draft and almost as if it was done by a different writer then the Jedi part.

 

Offline Luis Dias

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
No worries Zookeeper, I think that is a very fair criticism.

 

Online Colonol Dekker

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Anyone commented on how Rey got less jedi schooling than luke did?
« Last Edit: January 23, 2018, 11:09:22 am by Colonol Dekker »
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
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-TBP EACW teaser
-Earth Brakiri war
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-TBP Relic
-Trancsend (Possibly?)
-Uncharted Territory
-Vassagos Dirge
-War Machine
(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

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Offline The E

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Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
One aspect of what I find off-putting about TLJ was the weird and out-of-place... pathos, I guess? There were a whole bunch of supposedly-inspirational one-liners with the word "rebellion" in it, and it always felt like fanservice or name-dropping. "The Rebellion is reborn today", yay fistpump wait what? "We have everything we need to build a Rebellion" yay fistpump wait wtf does that even mean? "Rebel scum!" woo yeah awesome moment, or wait that's just the most obvious callback. And hope this, hope that, spark that will light the fire, bla bla bla. Then an emotional moment is made out of a freed animal getting released to join its herd, rich people are shown to be awful, arms trade is shown to be bad, "this is how we win", and so on.

Obviously the problem is not that a movie has slavery and it's bad, heroes freeing an animal and that's good or jedi masters inspiring hope, but I find it hopelessly clumsy and out of place how the cinematography focuses on spelling out those things and how characters join in on the commentary. It's like if in RotJ Han, Luke and Leia were poignantly lamenting how this is the Ewoks' habitat that the Empire is destroying, with sad music and a shot of a clearcut area. Or if in ANH Leia was constantly going on about how there is still hope, despite that that's what the plot of the movie was already expressly about.

In the OT, no one ever (?) makes inspirational speeches, no one is dismayed by the depravity in Jabba's palace (C-3PO perhaps excluded), and heck, no one (?) even talks about how the Empire is bad because there's simply no need. It's space opera with spaceships and lasers and wizards, and while it has emotion, it's based on the characters, not on abstract concepts or morals.

This stuff is hard to explain, so no nitpicking, please!

Yeah, I think that's a fair criticism.

Then again, we live in a time where a not insignificant percentage of the population isn't really on-board with that whole "fascism bad" thing....
If I'm just aching this can't go on
I came from chasing dreams to feel alone
There must be changes, miss to feel strong
I really need lifе to touch me
--Evergrey, Where August Mourns

 
Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
I honestly feel as if the Rebellion side of the film was more of an afterthought compared to the Jedi side of the film.
That's the impression I got as well. It feels as if they carefully planed out Luke, Rey & Kylo's story, then scrambled to find something to do for everybody else. Holdo doesn't bring a whole lot beyond being an expandable one-shot character, Rose is alright, but I feel like the Finn/Rose side arc should have been a Poe/Finn/Rose side-arc, with the rest of the Resistance being left out entirely until the final parts of the movie.


Anyone commented on how Rey got less jedi schooling than like did?
I'm not sure she got that much less actually. The timeline is kinda muddy in this regard in both TLJ & ESB, it depends on how long you think it took Han & co to go to Bespin vs how long the chase lasted in TLJ.

 
Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
Then again, we live in a time where a not insignificant percentage of the population isn't really on-board with that whole "fascism bad" thing....

It still ended up being less subtle then Revenge of the Sith, which is honestly not a high mark to clear.

  

Offline Luis Dias

  • 211
Re: *SPOILER THREAD* Star Wars: The Last Jedi
I always assumed Luke's training with Yoda actually took weeks slash months. The MF took forever to reach cloud city. You can see it by the way Han and Leia's relationship completely changes from the asteroid belt to cloud city. That isn't a couple days' worth of development.