[Boundless]

After a lil research and investigating i've done concerning my artwork, ive come to a small hurdle of sorts that i'd like public opinion to answer for me. Personally I am leaning heavily to one side in this, but this is for everyone who is a fan of Mech Commander and not simply myself. So with this poll, the majority will influence the style that i'll take the images in.

If you take a look through some of the old MC 2 mech designs you'll see some mechs with appendages that resemble closed fists. The same applies for some MW4 designs and also include some mechs that could be mistaken for having facial features. Some of you might also avoid such mechs like I do, some might not care or some might like the link between human and machine.

Please note im not refering to the iconic Atlas skull head as its meant to look that way and it wont be touched. Its more other mechs such as my MW4 style Dasher/FireMoth.



This fills both the fists as well as a face and personally it makes my skin crawl. Sadly I havent had time to produce my own take of the FireMoth yet for comparrison. I spose this does have somewhat of a canon arguement for mech designs but I leave that up to you guys to decide.

Im on the last few minutes of internet I have left so it'll be perhaps a month before I can see the results which hopefully will have attracted enough voters in that time to give a definative answer. I'd encourage everyone to coax any friends of theirs who have any interest in the battletech universe to vote as well. It may not be a huge issue to the game as a whole, but this is a large issue for my part.

[Karl]

Difficult issue, while I have no real problem "faces" if they look obviously cheesy or stupid then a redesign would not hurt. Also fists I have no problem with
My 2c

[cowboy]

Well, philosophically I don't think more than one or two Clan mechs had human-like features, due to their avoidance of physical combat. Many more inner sphere mechs have fists, etc.

I think face wise, try to stick to Mechwarrior 2-era as close as possible, drawing from Technical Readouts as available. You can find them all available as free downloads online.

[captainslide]

Personally I like mechs that are more or less symetrical, which happens to coincide with humanoid mechs a lot.  mechs like the archer, warhammer, madcat appeal.  Thanatos, summoner, argus not so much.

Remember mechs with hands in TT could punch when up close, as well as pick up weapons, clubs, axes etc so they had a purpose.

Faces are somewhat redundant on a war machine, but if it scares the other guy so be it (ATLAS)

[Starman01]

I voted for Option two While I sometimes like the human appearance (best example for me are hunchback and centurion), I highly adore the birdlike variants like direwolf and timber wolf. The atlas, while being hiped everywhere, is the most ugly mech in my opinion (yes, it's powerful and strong, but looks like crap, especially the head. IMO, it's a product of poor imagination from it's original creator, whoever it was).

[Raven IIC]

I just love the bird-like mechs (especially the Raven and Firefly, and other lights), but imo, it doesn't matter that much to me about appearance, but rather the equipment that can be used and how fast the mech can move

[SpardaSon21]

The older designs where everything is extremely human-inspired are pretty bad, so I have issues with those.  I don't particularly have an issue with humanoid mechs as long as they still look like mighty war machines and not toy robots.

[TheOldMan]

Tough choice. 
Older IS Mechs were either designed with those features, or painted by Mech Warriors to look extremely fierce on the battle field (Like a 30 meter tall mech isn't awe inspiring enough). 

Clan Mechs were of a more functional design, but inspired fear by mere presence alone.

But then again, a lot of the drawings provided were based on Japanese designs for other things.

I'd go for basic design without all the face paint. (Except the Atlas).

I'd have to agree with Cowboy, check Tech Readouts, if original design had hands, then make them look like hands.

[Timerlane]

I'd have to agree with Cowboy, check Tech Readouts, if original design had hands, then make them look like hands.

This for the most part.

With all due respect for their work, I didn't care much for the 'face' on the MekTek-added MW4 Fire Moth/Dasher, either. OTOH, the 'not-really-a-face' on the MW4 Executioner/Gladiator ended up looking goofy, IMO(and the painfully stretched/low-res textures on the torso didn't help).

On yet another hand: Technically, the Gargoyle/Man O' War should be considered to have hands 'by default', but its Primary configuration uses arm-mounted light autocannons, and the construction rules don't allow hands on OmniMech arms that have ACs, Gauss or PPCs equipped(which is why the Executioner is also only shown with one hand). All but two of the canon alternate configs have a hand on one arm or the other(or both, in the case of the D).

...

Actually on further review, about as many of the 3050 Clan Omnis have hands as don't; for the most part, it's really only the iconic heavies(Mad Dog, Hellbringer, Summoner, Timber Wolf), and the Dire Wolf and Warhawk that exclude them almost entirely.

Still, for the most part, 'check the TRO art' is probably good precedent if there's any question.

[cowboy]

Part of the reason that the Gargoyle/Executioner have hands is their "Irregular" designation- they were most often used in non-traditional units, some of which actually participated in HTH combat.

Just out of curiosity, how many people here are on MegaMek as well?

[SpardaSon21]

I've attempted to play MegaMek a couple times, but that's my extent of experience with it.

[Spoon]

I like some, I dislike others.
Though I will admit that I've never been a fan of the idea of close combat punching or putting an axe into someone's mech in the mechwarrior universe.

[Timerlane]

Supposedly, the hands can be used for other, non-direct-combat activities, like carrying/loading/unloading cargo(something raiding pirates/mercenaries probably have more use for).

IIRC, the rules say you can carry something like 10% of the Mech's weight(using both arms), and that doubles if you have active(9pts(again, IIRC) overheat or more) triple-strength myomers.

[NGTM-1R]

Check the TROs.

[ThorC]

I have always been a fan of physical attacks(charging,kicking,punching,axe's,swords,clubs,death from above). I remember playing the board game, and that was one of the things that made it intresting. Especially if you were playing an opponent who knew when to use physical attacks or when playing in a cramped urban enviroment. As far as faces go some mechs were designed to resemble certain things(Kodiak, Balck Knight, Grizzly,etc).

[headdie]

I have always been a fan of physical attacks(charging,kicking,punching,axe's,swords,clubs,death from above). I remember playing the board game, and that was one of the things that made it intresting. Especially if you were playing an opponent who knew when to use physical attacks or when playing in a cramped urban enviroment. As far as faces go some mechs were designed to resemble certain things(Kodiak, Balck Knight, Grizzly,etc).

I like the face on the Atlas because it is part of the mythos of the mech, not so sure about them on other chassis

[Starman01]

I always disliked the passages in the novel where the mechs made physical attacks (like giant ninja mechs with even more giants katana's), only exceptions are desperate acts in close combat when someone rams his ppc into the enemies cockpit.

Despite, the only need for hands (like hunchback) are these few tasks where a giant robot hand can come in handy. I guess, if they would build or invent such things, of course there will be human shapes since for some tasks it might be usefull. It's pretty pointless on mechs for med or long range distance.

Certainly a matter of taste

[Boundless]

Nice to see some responses added with a lil insight into your minds instead of simply voting.

Poll pretty much ended up how I thought it was going to (aside from getting almost double the votes it would). I still don't approve on hands on mechs for a few reasons,
• Mechs in general (humanoid or not) don't have anywhere near the flexibility or mobility our bodies or hands do which makes use extremely limited (proportions dont help them much either).
• When it comes to melee (hand to hand) I have a mental image stuck in my mind of a mech trying to do a karate chop which makes me think of the concept as absurd. They again lack the shoulder movements humans are capable of so a punch aint gunna happen. A battering ram style pendulum motion I could understand and cope with however it still raises a lot of issues and concerns (i'll spare you those for the time being).

As it stands though mechs with fists will keep them since its pretty much mojority rules. I'll still change 1 or 2 arms if there isnt enough lore on a mech to enforce it needing hands and it wasnt just a case of the artist being lazy (mw4 atlas arms with a bull bar [fist looking thingy] where the end of the arm is).

Now I come to subject of tech readouts of which i'll go out on a limb and say some of you are using those for your model designs. While im sure I could find these online please remember im very short on time that I can spend online so quick links to a direct download or something similar would be very much appreciated.
Also to our Mech model makers it'd be great if you could direct me to the image/design your basing you mechs off of so I can knock up a 2D image that will bear close resemblence to your 3D model.

Closing point i'd like to bring up is some mechs really dont cope well to being a front on 2D image, Annilhilator is the one I first came across with this problem mostly due to the cannons on its arms (they just look like 2 holesin a boxwhen they are 2D). So any insight or opinions on that matter would be nice.

[cowboy]

After playing MW4 mektek mekpak, I am appalled at the butchering of classic designs that they committed. Butchering things like the Firemoth or Orion were just really really bad.

I'm rather surprised, Boundless. I have played the tabletop game on and off for about a decade now, and melee combat is the #1 most powerful weapon in the game. Period. Nothing else even comes CLOSE. That said, mechs with full arm actuators were referenced in many novels as having a high degree of dexterity due to sophisticated servo-actuators and that myomar stuff. Punching would likely happen in a piston sort of manner with the shoulder serving as the crankshaft in this analogy.

I'll put the TRO's up here and edit the post when I'm done.

edit: the .rar is 220 MB. Anyone have a good way to send something that size? Most of the individual ones are ~12MB with two being ~4x that size.

[attachment deleted by a ninja]

[Boundless]

Perhaps the concept of melee makes me uncomfortable since its outside my sphere of experience within the battle tech universe. For refrence sake all i've had access to is the original MW2, MW4 Veng/BK/mektek, MC 1 & 2 and a little exploring of sarna. So yeah I really havent been able to immerse myself within it as much as i'd like to. So currently melee makes my mind jump to images of eastern style mecha like Z.O.E or Gundam.

I have to agree with you on the mektek release of MW4. In my opinion they clearly went for quantity over quality with many of their designs. However their 'box like' style does make 2D art easier to replicate. Maybe one day I can get my hands on a tablet and shave off a few hours off the time it takes to produce an image.

Thanks for looking into the TROs for me also, looking forward to browsing through them first chance I get.

Edit:
Seem to be having problems trying to download the rar. Not sure it thats a problem on my end or perhaps a webpage issue.