[ShadowGorrath]

So, assuming the Shivans never arrive ( or arrive way later ), and the GTA and PVE war keeps on going. Who would you expect to win in the long run? GTA or PVE?

PVE develops its tech slower than GTA, yet they're more advanced. And individually, Vasudans are "tougher" than Terrans. That's why I'd expect the PVE to win in the long run.

That's assuming it doesn't stay at a stalemate.

[-Norbert-]

The GTA just got the new Valkyries and already had working prototypes of the Avenger. That would have given them quite an edge over the Vasudans in fighter combat. And since I doubt the Medusa and Cylops were developed in a matter of weeks the GTA would very soon have gotting good bombers too.
I think the GTA would have had the better chances to break the stalemate.

[MatthTheGeek]

And since I doubt the Medusa and Tsunami were developed in a matter of weeks the GTA would very soon have gotting good bombers too.

Fix'd

[Dilmah G]

You can't 'win' this war, I don't think. Perhaps they would've come to an agreement over a cup of tea.

[Fury]

Norbert, you're oblivious to the fact that PVE never had any unique weapons beyond Vasudan Light Laser. Yes, they used same primaries and secondaries as GTA before, on and after the Great War. And so did Shivans use same secondaries and their weakened versions. Your point about Avenger, Tsunami and whatever is thus completely moot. Volition simply did not give them any unique weapons besides Vasudan Light Laser.

As for which one was going to get upper hand. I would say neither. The war had already progressed to a point where both sides had more to lose than win by continuing full scale war. Both had sustained major losses throughout the years and financing the war was becoming a problem. If Shivans had not appeared when they did, I would assume the war would have turned into smaller skirmishes and eventually cease-fire would've been signed.

[ShadowGorrath]

Like the one with the Koreas?

[Bob-san]

The PVE/PVN would DECIMATE Grand Theft Auto!!

[MatthTheGeek]

The PVE/PVN would DECIMATE Grand Theft Auto!!

I must admit that I didn't see that one coming

Anyway, I agree with Fury's point. The war has raged for FOURTEEN YEARS. Let me remind you that the World Wars were only 4 and 6 years long, and it was already terrible for both the military and the civilians, in term of resource drain and morale. I can't imagine the T-V war to continue at that rate for so long. Either one of the faction would have dealt the killing blow soon after the time of the GW, or it would have end as a cease-fire in months or at most a couple of years.

[Dilmah G]

Were they really committed? I mean, how can a war last for 14 years if it isn't just a few pushes here and there? I would envisage it to be a bit like a WWI kind of scenario, where the frontline moves about 10 yards every so often.

[-Norbert-]

The two world wars weren't called world wars because of their length, but because of the number of participating countries and the ferocity with which they were fought.
There were numberous wars that went on much longer, like the 30 year war or a lot of ethnic conflicts that have been and still are going on since the colonization period.

Just because they were in an open state of war doesn't mean they fought every single day of those years.
And I think it would have been more likely that the war would have turned into a cold war, with the possibility of re-erupting at a moments notice, rather than a cease fire being signed.
After all the GTA took their time is taking up the PVEs offer of negociations even when the Shivans were already advancing. Fourteen years of bloodshed and countless lost lives aren't easily forgotten.
Especially if the only thing your side did to provoke this conflics is a mistake in the translation....

[Snail]

Were they really committed? I mean, how can a war last for 14 years if it isn't just a few pushes here and there? I would envisage it to be a bit like a WWI kind of scenario, where the frontline moves about 10 yards every so often.

I kind of don't think we should be equating the war to ground warfare. It's IN SPAAAACE. It's clearly different.

I think the war was pretty fluid; territories changed hands regularly but didn't amount to anything much. The Terrans secured Antares without too much difficulty at the beginning of FS1 - It's not too much of a stretch to see that sort of advance happening throughout the whole war, but being pushed back by a counterattack or left unexploited due to severe losses in the process.

[Dilmah G]

I was making a comparison, you n00b, and it wasn't even to the warfare side, it was to the pointlessness of the whole thing.

But to be pushed by a counterattack or something out of the bag that many times is just sloppy. Someone up high wasn't doing their job right.

[Colonol Dekker]

GTA every time!
 
Check my sig for **** sake.
 
 
When Freespace started we were on the offensive. If the Shivans hadn't have turned up we would have wiped the floor with every last stinking one of them.
 
 
 
 
Scum.

[Snail]

But to be pushed by a counterattack or something out of the bag that many times is just sloppy. Someone up high wasn't doing their job right.

What I mean to say is, they got pretty close but could never manage to go the full way.

Also, I do think the GTA would have been in a better position for most of the war - At least, canonically that's how it was in 2335. They were merely one jump away from the Vasudan homeworld.

[Dilmah G]

Mmm, fair enough. But fourteen years? Nothing should take that long. Terran arms companies probably pulled strings to make more moneyz.

[Colonol Dekker]

Ignore me why don't you
 
 
According to the various briefs we were hitting Zod convoys left right and centre. In mission two or three we take out the only Zod ace in the galaxy (Alpha 1's counterpart maybe?) Oh yeah on that note. . . . The GTA have ALPHA ONE!
 
 

[Timerlane]

I agree that it doesn't look good for the Vasudans, but since incoming tech was mentioned, don't forget the Thoth was about to come online on their side(and no Ulysses for the GTA). Assuming no shields for anyone for quite a while, the Thoth would be quite a threat to the GTA's early fighters and bombers.

[Dilmah G]

Ignore me why don't you
 
 
According to the various briefs we were hitting Zod convoys left right and centre. In mission two or three we take out the only Zod ace in the galaxy (Alpha 1's counterpart maybe?) Oh yeah on that note. . . . The GTA have ALPHA ONE!
 
 

Oh, sorry Dek, I was playing COD at the time and didn't read a whole lot.

[Dragon]

There's a campaign, Twist of Fate, which would deal with this question.

[Colonol Dekker]

Wasn't the Thoth a joint project?
 
Saying that, I remember HOL saying the Sekhmet was derived from a shivan design.
 
Might have been in the multi templar campaign. Can't remember.
 
No shields. . . . Hmmm, I managed ok without them for a while. So long as we got em first I can dig it.