[swashmebuckle]

Hmm, of those two I think I like the bubble canopy more, but I think I would have liked the three-panel version best if its lines were a bit further spread out like on the lambda:

You'll have to pretend that my version doesn't look like a cross between the lambda and a turd

[CountBuggula]

Hmm, of those two I think I like the bubble canopy more, but I think I would have liked the three-panel version best if its lines were a bit further spread out like on the lambda:

You'll have to pretend that my version doesn't look like a cross between the lambda and a turd

I could get behind this.  I like it just as much as the single-paneled one that I proposed.

[Thaeris]

Six panel, of course.

If you opt for the overly-wide canopy, or the bubble canopy in this instance, you run the risk of making the fighter not "suit its size." In other words, the model becomes toy-like in appearance because parts or components are not proportionate in relation to their function, especially when there is no sensible reason in assigning said components that function.

The Gunboat is best when it is slim and trim - the bulging of a bubble canopy, or a "stepped" canopy as later seen in XWA would really cut down on that design aspect.

[CountBuggula]

Six panel, of course.

If you opt for the overly-wide canopy, or the bubble canopy in this instance, you run the risk of making the fighter not "suit its size." In other words, the model becomes toy-like in appearance because parts or components are not proportionate in relation to their function, especially when there is no sensible reason in assigning said components that function.

The Gunboat is best when it is slim and trim - the bulging of a bubble canopy, or a "stepped" canopy as later seen in XWA would really cut down on that design aspect.

Or it could have a side-by-side pilot/gunner configuration that would work for the wide version.

[Thaeris]

The Gunboat has a missile launcher system, two heavy laser cannons, and an ion cannon turret. You don't need two crew members to operate those weapon systems.

[newman]

You usually want two pilots in an assault craft, though. One to pilot, the other to handle weapons and targeting. It just works better that way. Since it's sci fi though go with what looks cooler to you..

[TomShak]

For me the AG is the ultimate multi-role craft. The Imperials only had one hyperdrive capable craft (until the Tie Avenger) and so it had to do everything. As such I see it being pitched between the Y-Wing and the X-Wing.

Missions for the AG:
- Recon, since it's hyperdrive capable it's perfect for recon.

- Long range escort, escorting VIP shuttles and such like.

- Rapid interdiction, it can get there faster than the ISD and the rest of the fleet. This might be interdicting starships or fighters.

- Capture operations, it's Ion equipped so perfect for capturing enemy vessels.

- Surprise attacks, for when the large hyperspace signature of a capital ship would tip off the enemy.

As I say, the ultimate multi-role craft.

[Thaeris]

Pretty much.

Again, about the two seat ordeal...

Keep in mind that the Y-Wing is rarely seen with two crew members, and in film/games (as far as I know) is strictly single seat. The B-Wing in normal variants only has one pilot. As far as Cygnus fighters go, the only one with two seats is the Missile boat, which of the two (itself and the AG), is truly in need of a re-design. I'd suggest keeping the AG a single seat strike fighter. Its size and capabilities do not warrant a second crew member.

[TomShak]

Scale does appear to be an issue ... I've scaled the gunboat to agree with these measurements:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Alpha-class_Xg-1_Star_Wing

Whether these are accurate or not is open to debate, but they are comparable to the X-Wing measurements.

I've included an appropriately sized pilot (1.8m tall).



It's pretty roomy in there ... But like Thaeris I see the AG as a single man fighter ...

Of course you can scale the ship down to be a more reasonable fit ...



Which comes out at 13.6m wide, 9m long, 6.5m high. Even then you could still fairly easily fit two in it ...

[Thaeris]

10 meters is still quite small. What you might consider is possibly increasing the slope of the lower fuselage panels, or in general reducing the width of the hull by a small margin to make the sizing a bit more reasonable. Simultaneously, increasing the width of the missile launchers might also help to better proportion the fighter.

By the way, I do kind of miss the blending of the lower panels with the curvature of the nose, as seen on some of the earlier models.

[newman]

The length figure with the gunboat is a bit misleading; the thing is massive for a fighter but it was never too long - it's proportions always favored width and height, with the gunboat having a much higher width/length ratio than any other fighter. I wouldn't say the 10m figure is wrong right off the bat, especially for a single seat ship like that. Seems most sci fi fighters are about ww2 fighter sized, because compared to modern fighter jets they're tiny..
Anyway I wouldn't scale it up too high, they'd still want to be able to keep a reasonable amount of them on ships and stations.

[CountBuggula]

If you're going by WWII standards, while dogfighters were exclusively single-seaters, attack aircraft were almost always crewed by 2 or more:

A-17
A-20
SBD Dauntless
TBF Avenger
B-25

And that's just american aircraft.  German, british, and Japanese aviation followed a similar pattern.

And based on the pictures we have above, it's certainly not out of the question size-wise to have this be a 2-seater.

[Thaeris]

Oh good grief. Most of those aircraft were multi-crew as they had a tail gunner, which most SW craft do not have. The Gunboat has a turret, true, but you don't need a gunner to operate a gun turret beyond the pilot, especially when it's not the principal weapon system.

Moreover, using WWII standards as a strict standard is pretty dull. Most of the fighter craft as seen in the original series were single seat, and could be classified as fighter-bombers. Even more dedicated attack craft, such as the TIE Bomber, are single seat.

[CountBuggula]

Oh good grief. Most of those aircraft were multi-crew as they had a tail gunner, which most SW craft do not have. The Gunboat has a turret, true, but you don't need a gunner to operate a gun turret beyond the pilot, especially when it's not the principal weapon system.

Moreover, using WWII standards as a strict standard is pretty dull. Most of the fighter craft as seen in the original series were single seat, and could be classified as fighter-bombers. Even more dedicated attack craft, such as the TIE Bomber, are single seat.

I only say it because the WWII standard has been brought up several times as where Lucas pulled his inspiration.  But the trend continued long after the need for gunners:

A-6
F-111

[Thaeris]

I think the parallel you're making, especially with relation to a small attack craft can work, but is still not in-line with the weapons systems and capabilities with the AG, which often acts as a tactical interceptor and interdiction craft. Given that the AG is often performing in a role somewhere in between the Y-Wing and the X-Wing, a second crewman is not a necessity.

[StarSlayer]

I think the parallel you're making, especially with relation to a small attack craft can work, but is still not in-line with the weapons systems and capabilities with the AG, which often acts as a tactical interceptor and interdiction craft. Given that the AG is often performing in a role somewhere in between the Y-Wing and the X-Wing, a second crewman is not a necessity.

Phantom II, Tomcat,  Strike Eagle, Super Hornet

[Thaeris]

Ultimately...

Fighter bombers today will not fall in line with any specific single- or multi-crew arrangement, as the software/hardware capabilities currently allow any given attack craft to perform just about any role with a single crewman or an additional crewman for greater operational fluency. In fact, multi-crew fighters are assumably going to become more common, so long as there is a market for crewed fighters.

I'm arguing for a single seat in the case of the AG for reasons I've already noted - its role and the weapons it employs, either of which do not require a WSO. I'll also add in that for those of us who are already a fan of the AG, it has ALWAYS been presented as a single-seat fighter. Which I like, and I think a good many of others here like as well. If you want multi-crew, the Missile Boat is for you.

[newman]

Yea, it's Star Wars. You got people waving laser swords, surviving 500 meter drops, and caveman level teddy bears defeating elite imperial troops. And let's not get into the least believable thing of all, that *ack* love story from the prequels.  Whatever call is made on the number of pilots is going to be well in the scope of believable considering the amount of crap Lucas and EU writers put in that universe

[bobbtmann]

Just give it a black canopy and we'll pretend it's whatever we want.

Personally I'd just like to see more personality in the your gunboat. For instance, is this ship a fast and efficient strike-craft? Then make it longer and focus on the linear-ness of it. Make it look aggressive with more diagonals and more dynamic form. If you want an armoured craft then break up the canopy and make it look blockier with extrusions and layers.

Be creative and make it your own. I'd like to be able to come across a picture of your ship on Google and say: that's a TomShak.

[General Battuta]

Honestly I always thought this ship didn't belong with Imperial forces anyway.