Author Topic: Simple question...  (Read 6023 times)

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Offline starlord

  • 210
Simple question...
Hello to all, :)

I've recently observed the work of the FSCRP and I must say that it's addition to the various FS project has been more than a success: Allowing old campaigns to be preserved appear to be extremely appreciated by the fans.
As such, I wonder if the functionnalities of the FSCRP might also be extended to the babylon project (as it's the only TC I know of for which older campaigns were made. A very select few of which today (like tales of janus) are incompatible with the recent builds).
Of course, this remains nothing more than a question, and I hope that no harm will be made from asking, but since aside from the tales of janus, no campaigns need restoring, I thought it might be interesting to consider...

What are your points on this?

 

Offline Admiral Nelson

  • Resurrecter of Campaigns
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There is never any harm in asking. :)

I suppose that it is mostly a question of interest.  I have seen the Babylon 5 TV show maybe two or three times and no more.  Thus I haven't really thought about it.  I do believe that there is some controversy around updating TBC at present for some other reasons.
If a man consults whether he is to fight, when he has the power in his own hands, it is certain that his opinion is against fighting.

 

Offline Rhymes

  • Galactic Mediator
  • 29
  • Fatum Iustum Stultorum
Yeah, the idea of graphical updates to TBP caused a huge stir in the community, which resulted in the project leader alienating the rest of the team, who thought that supporting a mod for graphical updates, like FS2's mediavps, was a good idea.  The project leader didn't, and wound up angering the admins, his team, and the devoted fans.

He's made maybe two posts since, and that was a while ago.  Actually retooling the campaigns would probably be a bad idea with TBP. The fact is, we could start what happened in, like, February all over again.  Don't get me wrong; it's a good idea, but TBP isn't ready for it.  Besides, TBP isn't THAT old.
If you don't have Knossos, you need it.

“There was a button," Holden said. "I pushed it."
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Offline starlord

  • 210
Actually, far from creating a graphic update for janus, the goal would rather be for it to run under recent builds of TPB. It would be a shame to lose that campaign (especially since it's one of the only one covering the earth minbari war)... ;)

 

Offline starlord

  • 210
So basically, what we would need would be a volunteer fredder to redesign the missions (since miburo is here, he might provide insight).

Although, I suppose that should you encounter said fredder, you will first plan on finishing the promising titan rebellion...

However, should someone feel fit for the job, miburo might be interested...

 

Offline captain-custard

  • previously known as andicirk
  • 210
  • one sandwich short of a picnic
This may seem a little strange by why oh why wasnt this in the TBP forum , and why oh why dont you have a look in the TBP forum.....


http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,62508.0.html

this was first posted 2 weeks before the first post in this forum......

and

So basically, what we would need would be a volunteer fredder to redesign the missions (since miburo is here, he might provide insight).

Although, I suppose that should you encounter said fredder, you will first plan on finishing the promising titan rebellion...

However, should someone feel fit for the job, miburo might be interested...


is already working on it and has asked for volunteers to help

most of what happened earlier in the year has calmed down now and some advancements have happened , namely Zathras (thanks to fubar) so please if you have questions and suggestions for TBP post them in that forum and they can be answered by the ppl who are involved in that project .....


please can this be moved to TBP  forum
"Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together."

 

Offline Rhymes

  • Galactic Mediator
  • 29
  • Fatum Iustum Stultorum
Dude, look at the first post.  He's talking about extending the FSCRP into TBP as WELL as FS. 

Please, READ what the original post says before you ask someone to move this, kthxbai.
If you don't have Knossos, you need it.

“There was a button," Holden said. "I pushed it."
"Jesus Christ. That really is how you go through life, isn't it?”

 

Offline captain-custard

  • previously known as andicirk
  • 210
  • one sandwich short of a picnic
ok , maybe i missed that a little but at the same time no one steered him towards tbp to have a look at a process that had already started ,

but i agree with my initial misreading i will remove my request for it to be moved

but still think that part of the first reply could have been "have you asked TBP if it has any plans"
"Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together."

 

Offline captain-custard

  • previously known as andicirk
  • 210
  • one sandwich short of a picnic
Hello to all, :)

I've recently observed the work of the FSCRP and I must say that it's addition to the various FS project has been more than a success: Allowing old campaigns to be preserved appear to be extremely appreciated by the fans.
As such, I wonder if the functionnalities of the FSCRP might also be extended to the babylon project (as it's the only TC I know of for which older campaigns were made. A very select few of which today (like tales of janus) are incompatible with the recent builds).
Of course, this remains nothing more than a question, and I hope that no harm will be made from asking, but since aside from the tales of janus, no campaigns need restoring, I thought it might be interesting to consider...

What are your points on this?



just try this , go to link in my first post , redownload the janus vp and follow the instructions, it is no not perfect but playable ..... good luck

andi
« Last Edit: May 19, 2009, 04:04:29 am by andicirk »
"Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together."

 

Offline captain-custard

  • previously known as andicirk
  • 210
  • one sandwich short of a picnic
"Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together."

 

Offline Ziame

  • 28
  • ED ftw
I won't start another topic cos that'd be pointless. This is another Simple Question:

 Are you guys here is FSCRP going to upgrade the retail campaign? I mean only correcting some errors (like hauler 1 and 2 that'd fetch cargo from colossus/ changing Regulas to Regulus (IIRC that's still there), and others I forgot about?


I hope you won't flame me
Rabbinic Judaism had a good start with the Old Testament but kinda missed the point about 2000 years ago

ALL HAIL HERRA
/fan of BlackHole

 

Offline Macfie

  • Moderator
  • 210
  • If somebody made a campaign I've probably got it
We will probably not do anything with the retail campaign.  Changes to that are usually made by the media VP upgrades.  There are a lot of problems with upgrading the retail campaign that we would not want to venture into.  Other than upgrading the graphics no one has done much of anything with the retail campaigns of either FS1 or FS2.
Normal people believe that if it isn't broke, don't fix it. Engineers believe that if it isn't broke, it doesn't have enough features yet.
The difference between Mechanical Engineers and Civil Engineers is:
Mechanical Engineers build weapons.  Civil Engineers build targets
An optimist sees the glass half full; the pessimist sees it half empty. An engineer sees that the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

Offline Ziame

  • 28
  • ED ftw
We will probably not do anything with the retail campaign.  Changes to that are usually made by the media VP upgrades.  There are a lot of problems with upgrading the retail campaign that we would not want to venture into.  Other than upgrading the graphics no one has done much of anything with the retail campaigns of either FS1 or FS2.

That's kinda... weird. I don't mean some uber changes just the bugfixes and this crappy haulers xD
OK, ok I think that you probably know better, you've been here for far longer than I dudes.
Rabbinic Judaism had a good start with the Old Testament but kinda missed the point about 2000 years ago

ALL HAIL HERRA
/fan of BlackHole

 

Offline Macfie

  • Moderator
  • 210
  • If somebody made a campaign I've probably got it
We only deal with user made campaigns.  The original campaigns of the game have been left alone.  FSPort did Silent threat reborn but they pretty much created a new campaign.  Working on the original campaigns would be like trying to repaint the Mona Lisa.  Even if you could do a better job you'd probably be publicly executed.  It's really a firestorm we prefer to avoid.
Normal people believe that if it isn't broke, don't fix it. Engineers believe that if it isn't broke, it doesn't have enough features yet.
The difference between Mechanical Engineers and Civil Engineers is:
Mechanical Engineers build weapons.  Civil Engineers build targets
An optimist sees the glass half full; the pessimist sees it half empty. An engineer sees that the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 
We only deal with user made campaigns.  The original campaigns of the game have been left alone.  FSPort did Silent threat reborn but they pretty much created a new campaign.  Working on the original campaigns would be like trying to repaint the Mona Lisa.  Even if you could do a better job you'd probably be publicly executed.  It's really a firestorm we prefer to avoid.

That's a likely outcome. Just recall the death of the Colossus thread a few months ago. I imagine some go-getter would want to recreate or tweak the mission to make it like "[V] would have done if they had time or so my retrospective telepathy tells me".

You can imagine what side of the fence I would be on.

 

Offline Mongoose

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To be fair, that particular mission has FRED events/waypoints that flat-out aren't even being used due to that seemingly last-second Colossus disabling (not to mention the glitch with the beam-free events on the cruisers), which results in the in-mission dialogue not even matching the situation as it's presented.  That's just about the sole case where I'd be firmly in favor of tweaking the mission, since we have a fairly clear picture of what it was "supposed" to be and could make it that way without affecting the underlying purpose of the mission.

 

Offline Sushi

  • Art Critic
  • 211
What about remaking the retail campaign(s) without even pretending to be compatible? In other words, a whole new campaign with the same story and missions as retail, but sort of in a "reboot" style... kind of in the vein of High Noon 2.0 and similar projects.

 

Offline Macfie

  • Moderator
  • 210
  • If somebody made a campaign I've probably got it
What about remaking the retail campaign(s) without even pretending to be compatible? In other words, a whole new campaign with the same story and missions as retail, but sort of in a "reboot" style... kind of in the vein of High Noon 2.0 and similar projects.

Have at it if you want, but that is way beyond the scope of the FSCRP.  Look how long it took the FreeSpace conversion group to do Silent threat Reborn.  We (FSCRP) don't have the resources to do something of that scale.    
Normal people believe that if it isn't broke, don't fix it. Engineers believe that if it isn't broke, it doesn't have enough features yet.
The difference between Mechanical Engineers and Civil Engineers is:
Mechanical Engineers build weapons.  Civil Engineers build targets
An optimist sees the glass half full; the pessimist sees it half empty. An engineer sees that the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

 

Offline Dragon

  • Citation needed
  • 212
  • The sky is the limit.
Alos, don't forget for what FSCRP stands for.
It's a FreeSpace Campaign Restoration Project, the only case in which they would get interested in something like ST:R would be when it will be outdated and needed to be restored.  :)
You will need to start your own project (FS2 Reborn for example) and find a team for it.

 
To be fair, that particular mission has FRED events/waypoints that flat-out aren't even being used due to that seemingly last-second Colossus disabling (not to mention the glitch with the beam-free events on the cruisers), which results in the in-mission dialogue not even matching the situation as it's presented.  That's just about the sole case where I'd be firmly in favor of tweaking the mission, since we have a fairly clear picture of what it was "supposed" to be and could make it that way without affecting the underlying purpose of the mission.

See that's exactly the thing I'm talking about. Some people think the mission should be tweak. Others, like myself, don't. My sentiment is that regardless of what the mission was going to be, the end product is what is in the campaign. If someone shoots a movie and in editing they cut out a bunch of scenes, should someone unrelated to the original production and revisiting that movie re-introduce those scenes into the final cut???

More than that, their very presence suggests that they were meant to be not used. See if there were no waypoints, a person could argue "well they didn't have time to set that up and test it, so I should add them in". But instead people are saying "well there are waypoints so they obviously had the time to do the mission that way, but they chose not to, but I believe that if they had the time they would've used those waypoints even though that makes no sense at all". It's like the Sathanas. Some of the missions call it the Apocalypse or Armageddon. Think it's Apocalypse. So should we re-name it the Apocalypse because they were thinking about it but then changed their minds?


But anyway.
A thought just struck me. Remember the Yamato? Imperial Japanese Battleship? I blieve original plan for its final hours was to scuttle it in shallow waters and use it as basically an unsinkable island of firepower (but then the americans bombed it to the bottom of the sea enroute).  What if it was similar with the Colossus. What if they thought, let's just park it there, and smash anything that comes our way. The captain seemed pretty intent to draw them there until it's done.