[Aesaar]

But... death doesn't actually mean anything in Dark Souls.  That's the whole point of the game.  There are no costs to death in the game itself (save humanity, but you can recover it and it's easy to find).  The only consequence to death is its effect on the player's patience.

Same here. Losing credits / reputation can all be easily grinded for "again" after all. The thought is that it "hurts" because you "lost" something.

Dark Souls is still on my "to play list" so I'm not sure how the mechanic really works, but I remember CR stating specifically that "losing things/souls/whatever" in Dark Souls was a good thing because it made the player feel that death meant something.

Personally mechanics that punish the player are kind of a red flag for me back from the Everquest days. Being conditioned to be risk averse and instead "work hard while staying as save as possible" in gaming is not really the best use of my free time imho. I was gonna make an exception and give Star Citizen at least a chance because of all the pent up Wing Commander / Freespace / Space Sim nostalgy ... but that was a few years ago before the project became this "neverending story".

If you go back to where you died in Dark Souls, you can reclaim your souls (which are the game's currency/level up points).  All of them.  Even if you die again before you get them back, every single enemy gives you souls when they die, and since they respawn, it really doesn't matter.  There are no other consequences whatsoever to death.  None.  You lose absolutely nothing you can't get back in a few minutes.

All that happens if you die is you respawn at the last bonfire you rested at and all the enemies respawn.  ****, it's more forgiving than reverting to checkpoint is in other games.  You lose nothing but time, which plays into the game's story.  Death is utterly meaningless.  You can't lose unless you give up.

It's save scumming turned into a central aspect of gameplay.

That's in complete opposition to how SC has presented itself.  It would mean that death in SC would return you and all your equipment and ship right back to your last save point as though nothing happened.  If death is supposed to mean something, then Dark Souls is one of the worst possible examples to use.  If CR is using it as an example, his community has either fundamentally misunderstood his intentions, or he hasn't played the game and knows nothing about it except that it's known to be hard.

I encourage you to play it.  It's an excellent game.

[Mikes]

But... death doesn't actually mean anything in Dark Souls.  That's the whole point of the game.  There are no costs to death in the game itself (save humanity, but you can recover it and it's easy to find).  The only consequence to death is its effect on the player's patience.

Same here. Losing credits / reputation can all be easily grinded for "again" after all. The thought is that it "hurts" because you "lost" something.

Dark Souls is still on my "to play list" so I'm not sure how the mechanic really works, but I remember CR stating specifically that "losing things/souls/whatever" in Dark Souls was a good thing because it made the player feel that death meant something.

Personally mechanics that punish the player are kind of a red flag for me back from the Everquest days. Being conditioned to be risk averse and instead "work hard while staying as save as possible" in gaming is not really the best use of my free time imho. I was gonna make an exception and give Star Citizen at least a chance because of all the pent up Wing Commander / Freespace / Space Sim nostalgy ... but that was a few years ago before the project became this "neverending story".

If you go back to where you died in Dark Souls, you can reclaim your souls (which are the game's currency/level up points).  All of them.  Even if you die again before you get them back, every single enemy gives you souls when they die, and since they respawn, it really doesn't matter.  There are no other consequences whatsoever to death.  None.  You lose absolutely nothing you can't get back in a few minutes.

All that happens if you die is you respawn at the last bonfire you rested at and all the enemies respawn.  ****, it's more forgiving than reverting to checkpoint is in other games.  You lose nothing but time, which plays into the game's story.  Death is utterly meaningless.  You can't lose unless you give up.

It's save scumming turned into a central aspect of gameplay.

That's in complete opposition to how SC has presented itself.  It would mean that death in SC would return you and all your equipment and ship right back to your last save point as though nothing happened.  If death is supposed to mean something, then Dark Souls is one of the worst possible examples to use.  If CR is using it as an example, his community has either fundamentally misunderstood his intentions, or he hasn't played the game and knows nothing about it except that it's known to be hard.

I encourage you to play it.  It's an excellent game.

I checked again and what was referenced was actually Demon Souls and not Dark Souls, my bad - although I haven't played either game and wouldn't know what the difference would be, personally. ;-)
Also should be said that he thought Demon Souls was on the "punishing" side of things, so SC will probably not THAT punishing.
But the gist I got is that "punishing" it will be. /shrugs.

Also, in other news, Star Citizen just won the Vaporware award: https://www.wired.com/2016/12/vaporware-games/

[Aesaar]

Death in Demon Souls works the same way.

[Cobra]

The bloody point is that in an age of trolls, griefers and assholes, punishing players for death in a ****ing MMO is a terrible idea. Even if it's not something huge, it just gives them more reason to make the punishments build up for other players.

If Croberts thinks this **** won't happen in his half-assed dream of his he's so very wrong.

[Unknown Target]

Speaking of punishing players...

Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHtIjbBVuTE&feature=youtu.be

Embed:

(How do I embed Youtube videos? I keep getting "an error occurred" when I hit play.

[FrikgFeek]

Copy just the video code. In your case OHtIjbBVuTE

Like this:

[FrikgFeek]

The bloody point is that in an age of trolls, griefers and assholes, punishing players for death in a ****ing MMO is a terrible idea. Even if it's not something huge, it just gives them more reason to make the punishments build up for other players.

Actually economic punishment is a brilliant idea. If half your playerbase is fighting PvP and losing billions of in-game cash in ships and character upgrades it really helps control the standard MMO hyperinflation.

That's one of the ways EvE deals with inflation.

[Cobra]

Don't forget about the new players, though. I was literally never able to get off the ground in PvP in EVE. My destroyers got wrecked trying to travel through zero sec every time I tried. I literally could not afford to replace them, even with insurance. I eventually just gave up because after every step forward I was sent five back. This will be no different for anyone coming later into the game.

[StarSlayer]

Copy just the video code. In your case OHtIjbBVuTE

Like this:

I'm a little confused, are the map models so bad that the bullets pass through everything, or did they modify the client enough to ignore obstacles and the server is happy as a clam to register all the hits?

Also H&K must be pretty stoked that in the far far future the G36C is still the pinnacle of firearms technology.

[The E]

CIG's ability to **** up functionality that the engine should be really good at never ceases to amaze.

[Phantom Hoover]

groundbreaking lumberyard netcode in action, i suppose

[MikeRoz]

Maybe CIG are just fans of cs_assault?

[FrikgFeek]

Not even cs_assault is this bad. Look at that ****, he's banging through 3 different walls and doing reasonable damage.
You can't do that even in 1.6 with its wallbangtastic penetration modelling.

[Colonol Dekker]

It's called wall hax.  Maybe it hacks the walls? And God that song is annoying.

I appreciate I'm a bit late to the earlier torpedo article, but 70 dollar quids? ??!!   Please tell me there's a free equivalent, not that I ever want any part of SC.

[FrikgFeek]

If a hack can completely break your damage/hit registration model that's a very bad sign.

[Phantom Hoover]

It's called wall hax.  Maybe it hacks the walls? And God that song is annoying.

Wallhacks usually just allow you to see through walls; this is quite easy because, for technical reasons, the server has to tell each player's client where all the other players are. For a wallhack to also allow you to shoot through walls the server has to uncritically believe the client when it says "yeah I shot that guy, no walls in the way at all, honest". This is a really stupid way of building the netcode, and it can kill the game (for a recent example see The Division).

[Luis Dias]

Walls are merely an illusion in the Matrix anyways.

[Phantom Hoover]

It's pretty interesting how the Star Citizen forums are much, much more accommodating of open scepticism than the subreddit. Maybe it's the lack of a downvote button.

[MikeRoz]

It's pretty interesting how the Star Citizen forums are much, much more accommodating of open scepticism than the subreddit. Maybe it's the lack of a downvote button.

I've found quite skeptical threads on the subreddit, especially after Citizencon and the Holiday Livestream of this year.

Personally I avoid both. Very high signal to noise ratio, too many "Wouldn't it be cool if I could act out this movie/TV/novel scene?" posts.

Speaking of distressed projects, my No Man's Sky Explorer's Edition pre-order is finally arriving tomorrow.

[Sushi]

As soon as I saw this post, I was immediately, strongly reminded of this:

Which reminded me, in turn, of this: