Hard Light Productions Forums
Site Management => Site Support / Feedback => Topic started by: Axem on September 03, 2016, 02:16:14 pm
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I'd like to ask the people of HLP two things.
One, how many of you use the front page? I'm guessing not a lot of you. There isn't much there except the newsletter and some now quite outdated highlights, so I don't really blame you.
So let's skip one then. What would you like to see on the front page? In "the olden times" HLP's front page had a bunch of content. Mods news, interviews, reference material, links to downloads, pictures, latest forum posts. A lot of that content has migrated elsewhere now, either to the forum or the wiki or sites like freespacemods or Sectorgame's FSfiles.
After a brief internal discussion we thought the front page should be an overview of what HLP is and what it has to offer. A prime advertisement to our works. Fancy inviting pictures of things like the MediaVPs, Diaspora, Wings of Dawn, TBP and a big giant "how to play" button to get new comers jump started (links to the gog store page, the fso installer and other things). And of course there would be things like news and highlights of recent activity still.
So what's your opinion? What would your idea of an HLP home page look like? Post links to other sites or crappy MS paint mockups if you like!
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After a brief internal discussion we thought the front page should be an overview of what HLP is and what it has to offer. A prime advertisement to our works. Fancy inviting pictures of things like the MediaVPs, Diaspora, Wings of Dawn, TBP and a big giant "how to play" button to get new comers jump started (links to the gog store page, the fso installer and other things). And of course there would be things like news and highlights of recent activity still.
This sounds cool. :yes:
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P3D previews of currently WIP models perhaps?
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A brief history lesson:
HLP 1.0 (https://web.archive.org/web/20010813040435/http://www.3dap.com/hlp/)
HLP 2.0 (https://web.archive.org/web/20060601224226/http://www.hard-light.net/)
HLP 3.0 (https://web.archive.org/web/20090520074404/http://www.hard-light.net/)
The current main page is HLP 4.0.
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After a brief internal discussion we thought the front page should be an overview of what HLP is and what it has to offer. A prime advertisement to our works. Fancy inviting pictures of things like the MediaVPs, Diaspora, Wings of Dawn, TBP and a big giant "how to play" button to get new comers jump started (links to the gog store page, the fso installer and other things). And of course there would be things like news and highlights of recent activity still.
This sounds cool. :yes:
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I could quadruple quote... but instead I'll just say that I agree, with one additional point, I'd really like the highlights to be done in one place only, the expression engine / main page ones look good, but it's a pain to have to duplicate the forums highlights, as can be seen by my recent woeful update schedule...
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Here's (a slightly edited version of) what I posted on the internal.
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Well I'm not a web designer so I'm going to be hard pressed to describe what the website should look like. But I can point out what is very wrong with the current one. I'm going to make the assumption that the main users of HLP's main page are people new to the community. I might be wrong there but even if I am, I think we can agree that it is the entry point for anyone new.
So put yourself in their place and actually take a look at the main page. What do you see? Does the page look like a website with cool games for you to download?
The main page isn't bad if you know what HLP is. If you don't, it's going to take you a while to even figure out what the website is about! Want to hear something shocking? The word Freespace appears NOWHERE on the front page of HLP. There are no pictures of Freespace, Diaspora or anything else we have made. Cause Betrayal's project is currently the main highlight, the only image on the front page is a rather mysterious badge with some alien writing on it. I have to flick through two of the highlights to even find a picture of a ship, and no disrespect to Betrayal but a static image of a Shivan ship really doesn't look that impressive. Hell, even clicking on the newsletter doesn't help much when it comes to explaining what this site is about.
Then we have the big HLP badge. Now I love the HLP tagline and I'd never want to replace it, but it is so prominent on the front page that it makes it seem like HLP is a site for modders, not the place for fans of the Freespace games. We already have a name and a website address with no connection to Freespace or even Volition. Even if someone has been referred to HLP by a friend who has tried out the SCP, they're going to be a little confused and alienated by the main page. If they've just googled Freespace and ended up there, they might even suspect they've gone to the wrong place.
Picking at random look at the Team Fortress 2 (http://www.teamfortress.com/) page. The first thing that page does is slap you in the face with the fact that there is a free game you can download and play RIGHT NOW! Yeah, they still have the news and all the sorts of things we currently have but you're left in no doubt what that page is.
I would suggest we split the main page in two. The first part should be more like the Team Fortress page. It should have a section with great pics of Freespace 2 with pictures from Blue Planet and other great looking mods and a big button that points to the game on GOG (and Steam if we must. :p) and also a bit that says "Already got it! Here's how you upgrade it! We should also be doing the same with Diaspora, TBP and Wings of Dawn. Hell, maybe we should even have them first since they are absolutely free to play. Hook them in with the TCs and then get them playing Freespace.
Then we have have the HLP logo and a blurb about how this is also a site for modding the games above. Put the newsletter etc there. People who read it are already fans of the games we have.
Anyway, those are my suggestions, right now I'm just spitballing ideas but I think we really should shake things up a little.
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One, how many of you use the front page? I'm guessing not a lot of you. There isn't much there except the newsletter and some now quite outdated highlights, so I don't really blame you.
So let's skip one then. What would you like to see on the front page? In "the olden times" HLP's front page had a bunch of content. Mods news, interviews, reference material, links to downloads, pictures, latest forum posts. A lot of that content has migrated elsewhere now, either to the forum or the wiki or sites like freespacemods or Sectorgame's FSfiles.
I don't look at the front page, I look at the unread post list on the forums. The front page is an entry point for new users, not a place for regulars to keep checking in at. It should be designed with that function in mind: a big glossy pitch to sell people on FSO and its mods and get them playing and posting.
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The current front page is a pretty slick news feed for the audience that checks in every few weeks to months to see what's going on but it's absolutely terrible if you come at it from the perspective of a newbie who has only a vague idea that there's this thing called Freespace with a lot of cool mods.
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I would suggest we split the main page in two. The first part should be more like the Team Fortress page. It should have a section with great pics of Freespace 2 with pictures from Blue Planet and other great looking mods and a big button that points to the game on GOG (and Steam if we must. :p) and also a bit that says "Already got it! Here's how you upgrade it! We should also be doing the same with Diaspora, TBP and Wings of Dawn. Hell, maybe we should even have them first since they are absolutely free to play. Hook them in with the TCs and then get them playing Freespace.
Then we have have the HLP logo and a blurb about how this is also a site for modding the games above. Put the newsletter etc there. People who read it are already fans of the games we have.
Anyway, those are my suggestions, right now I'm just spitballing ideas but I think we really should shake things up a little.
Hmm, I made a fast example image of Karajorma's idea. (Attachment.jpg Below)
I spent less then 5-ish minuets on it in paint, so take It with some sodium chloride. It's just a rough layout idea. I can make better art then that I swear
The only thing worth noting in my example is the "parallelogram" design with the TCs and Freespace. all other stuff is just placeholder to a placeholder.
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That is actually a really good starting point. I love how don't and center it is to play RIGHT NOW.
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I haven't used the frontpage in years, and I wholeheartedly agree with kara and PH. I also vividly recall my own introduction to the SCP and HLP years ago, and how confusing it was. What the frontpage needs, bolded and centered, is something like this:
Hard-Light Productions (HLP) is the home of the FreeSpace 2 Source Code Project (SCP). FreeSpace 2 was originally released in 1999; its developers later released its source code. In the years since, a substantial community has formed at HLP dedicated to the continual update and enhancement of the code into a modern space-flight engine, the development of FreeSpace mods (which require the original game), and Total Conversion projects (which are free standalone games that function entirely using the SCP engine). The new engine is now referred to as FreeSpace Open (FSOpen). All of the materials hosted on or by HLP are provided free of charge.
Getting Started
- If you are interested in FreeSpace 2 and its mods, you will need the original game. It can be purchased at the following online retailers: <links to Steam and GOG pages>
- The upgrades to the base game are the FSOpen engine, found here <link> and the MediaVPs (updated graphic enhancements), found here <link>. Both are required to play FreeSpace 2 under the improved engine with the improved modern graphics.
- HLP hosts a substantial FreeSpace modding community. Please check the forums under Missions and Campaigns <link>, Community Projects, and Hosted Projects <link> for FreeSpace 2-related mods.
- HLP also hosts mods for other games, and standalone Total Conversions (TCs). Please consult the appropriate forum sections <links>
- The primary community, help, and resources are based in the forums. Please consult them regularly for updated information. You can get started with support or help by posting your question in the Support forum <link>
Recent Community News and Highlights
- Insert here
Incidentally - this goes to show long long its been since I downloaded anything FS-related - I can find no mention of the installer. Is it now defunct?
Regardless, a concise, clear introduction to what the community is and where to go for the main parts of it that bring people to HLP is really needed.
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@MP-Ryan, So perhaps a link to a "Getting started" page with all the information on It could be placed on the top part of the page.
I think that the Intro sentence you made could be made to sit there as well, (but much smaller) and/or something else? I'll make a better example version later.
PS:
I literally used the Installer yesterday. It's not defunct. :)
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The fact that it took your post to make me notice there is a menu bar with a link to the installer at the top of the site now is probably indicative that the menu bar should be made a little more obvious. I'd also say a link to FSOpen and the Installer should both be front-and-center on the main page.
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I said it once and I'll say it again... I really really like that layout. To be very specific, I really really like how DOWNLOAD RIGHT THE FRICK NOW is front and center... literally unmissable.
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I made this mockup, mostly based off of the current main page, but trying to bring in what we've talked about.
(https://ibin.co/2v6ETKj0TZmk.png)
I did really like MP-Ryan's text, but I feel it belongs on its own About Us page. It's too wordy to immediately draw people in. Front page needs to be IN YO' FACE!! On my mock up I tell people "This site is about FreeSpace 2! Buy it at these places, then upgrade with this! And take a look at the stuff we do!"
The showcase would be like permanent highlights for high quality released campaigns/standalone games. It would be a continuously scrolling arrangement of images, and the order would be randomized. More often than not we would just add on to it, stuff doesn't come down off the showcase unless its become terribly broken or abandoned.
On the side we have links to About Us (where MP-Ryan's text could go, along with our history), links to the wiki, hosted projects, the forum and other ways to interact. Below those links would be Forum Highlights, automatically taken from the highlights board (also I think we should boost the highlight image size, 160x50?? What is this, 1996???). Then the main panel would be HLP news, automatically taken from the news forum with a link to the thread.
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No, I think MP-Ryan's blurb should be right there front and centre. If someone wants to see the news then they already know what FSO is and are interested in it! Your design makes it easy to find where to get FSO, but not what it is or why you would want it.
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Legit vote for coding up Axem's mock-up pretty much verbatim.
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This is the Elite: Dangerous website. (https://www.elitedangerous.com/) It's a big, glossy pitch aimed at telling you what Elite: Dangerous is, what you do in it and why you want to get it, with some clearly-marked navigation to the bits actual players are interested in. I think we need a similar page somewhere, that just sells FSO to people, and I think it needs to be at the main entry point for the site. Axem's prototype is mostly focused on navigation and news, which is a mistake because people arriving to the site from the first time don't care about those things.
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Okay what if we do this? About Us shows by default, and user can switch to a news tab? Or we just get rid of the news? Or get rid of the show case? How do we sell FSO to someone? I was trying to do it with screenshots. Do we need to sell FreeSpace itself to people?
Also should we list what FSO exactly adds? How in depth do we get?
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Wow, well. . .
Here's this anyway. SEE ATTACHMENT
Hey Axem, do you think something like this is good? or a combo of mine and yours could be made?
Yours Is better though.
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I think these layouts are a big step forward but I'm a bit bemused at how they put TCs right at the top before FSO itself, which honestly seems like it'd confuse a new user as to what exactly we're offering.
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Battuta's camapign guide (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=80688.0) (which is obnoxiously hard to find) is very engagingly written and I think is the kind of style a front-page intro should aim for; Ryan's blurb is a bit too dry IMO.
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OK, I like something like DefCynodont119's better and here's why. They GET IT NOW stuff is the content. It's front, center, right in the middle. That's what the front page should be. The news/about/screenshots should be on a second page. With the exception of some really pretty screenshots used something like the Elite Dangerous page. They are there.. but only secondary to the BUY IT NOW and LEARN MORE buttons. That's really good entry design.
Want the game? Click here. Not sure yet? Click here.
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A sticky thread is obnoxiously hard to find? :p
Battuta's masterpost is a masterwork, but I fear something of that length and depth would be intimidating to someone who just found the site.
(Also I'd totally put the FSO installer stuff above TCs)
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I had to check three or four different boards before I found which one it was stickied in.
I just tried to find it again, having done so less than 15 minutes ago, and had to check three.
To be clear I'm not saying that it should be put on the front page, it's not appropriate as a general introduction to FSO, I'm saying that its style is enthusiastic and fun to read and we should have the same sort of writing on our front-page intro.
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EDIT:
(Also I'd totally put the FSO installer stuff above TCs)
Yes, It's nagging me now that I see It
Battuta's camapign guide (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=80688.0) (which is obnoxiously hard to find) is very engagingly written and I think is the kind of style a front-page intro should aim for; Ryan's blurb is a bit too dry IMO.
yes.
SO MANY NINJA'S! :lol:
So what are the best aspects of the two designs shown?
If you were to mix mine and Axem's, how would you take the best from both? and beyond that, what's still missing?
I like Axem's more now that I look at It, but hole "separation of TCs and Mods" from the showcase that mine has is still nice. how about a version of my "parallelogram" thing that scrolls like Axem's? (and has the "buy now" and " get the installer" links there? or not?
+ what MJn.mixael typed
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PH: Gotcha, I too think something more breezy and more laid back would be good.
Something maybe like...?
Hard Light Productions is home to one of the most enthusiastic modding communities on the internet. We strive to keep FreeSpace 2, a space sim released all the way back in 1999, alive and active with an upgraded game engine, new beautiful assets, and countless stories that take place both in and out the FreeSpace universe. Whether you are new to FreeSpace or not, HLP is sure to have something that will catch your eye.
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PH: Gotcha, I too think something more breezy and more laid back would be good.
Something maybe like...?
Hard Light Productions is home to one of the most enthusiastic modding communities on the internet. We strive to keep FreeSpace 2, a space sim released all the way back in 1999, alive and active with an upgraded game engine, new beautiful assets, and countless stories that take place both in and out the FreeSpace universe. Whether you are new to FreeSpace or not, HLP is sure to have something that will catch your eye.
I like this a lot!
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OK, my biggest thing with Axem's is too much text. No one cares what we say... they want to SEE what our game is about!
EDIT: To clarify.. we already have the forums, newsletters, wiki and all these things to TALK about why Freespace is cool. The front should be not that. It should be pretty pictures and download links!
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Hey, in my defense I just copy pasted MP-Ryan's text. :p I think if we could just distill what HLP is, what we do and what we have to offer to 2 short paragraphs and let screenshots do the rest, we might be on our way to something real nice.
Do we want something where everything is just like right there as someone opens up the page, or would making it long and scrolly like the Elite site be okay?
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If you insist on text... not long and scrolly :)
EDIT: Unless it can make sure it keeps the first view mostly (some text) pictures and links... and then if you scroll down is the text.
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Hmm?
Hmm?
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Top one is a good starting point, but the showcases for TCs and for FS mods should be separate, and download links to them as well.
It's the whole "Here's what you can get for free now, vs Here's what you can get once you have FS2" thing that I was trying to convey.
Everything else on the top one is great.
+1 on the MediaVP fade thing.
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Like the new layout, don't care about tweaking the wording, but one other suggestion:. Three tabs.
About Us can be the default, with a fun snappy description. News should be furthest to the right. In the middle you need a Getting Started section.
The most obnoxious part about HLP and FreeSpace modding for someone totally new to the game is how nothing is concisely explained on how to get started with simple step-by-step instructions. I don't care if you use mine, but for the love of all that's holy out a list of steps on the front page to get someone who has never bought or played FS2 up and running with FSOpen and the MediaVPs.
I can re-write something tomorrow if necessary.
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OK, I like something like DefCynodont119's better and here's why. They GET IT NOW stuff is the content. It's front, center, right in the middle. That's what the front page should be. The news/about/screenshots should be on a second page. With the exception of some really pretty screenshots used something like the Elite Dangerous page. They are there.. but only secondary to the BUY IT NOW and LEARN MORE buttons. That's really good entry design.
Want the game? Click here. Not sure yet? Click here.
I couldn't agree with this more. We really need to push the fact that there are games available for free, right now on the front page. For those who didn't click on my link, I'm posting a picture of the Team Fortress 2 page. Axem's mock-ups are good but lack the in-your-face simplicity of that image.
Here's what I suggest we do. Make an image similar to the Team Fortress one. An image with a recognisable battlestar, B5 and stuff from our other TCs. Include text that shouts they are free to play. That image links to all the TCs and let's new people see all the completely free games we have. That's something that will become more important when TCs like FotG come out. Most people who are interested in that, will never have played FS2. Same as we got BSG fans for Diaspora.
Below that but visible when you first open the page without scrolling is a big image showcasing the difference SCP makes. So get an ugly screenshot of Freespace 2 retail and then a big graphic saying "Already got Freespace 2? We take this (ugly) to this (SCP beauty)." Make that image link to the installer / getting started page or tab.
Below that, have "Loved Freespace 2 and want more?" With a campaign showcase below it. Have that also link to the installer.
Only after that should we start doing any explanation of what HLP is. But that should be punctuated with gorgeous pictures of all the mods and TCs we have in the same way as the Elite dangerous page is.
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I agree that it's important that FS2 itself (and therefore the MediaVPs) need to be front-and-center, because FS2 is ultimately the reason all (or at the very least most) of us are here in the first place. However, it's also important that the free standalones also be given prominent placement because, unlike the MediaVPs, they don't require someone who's never heard of FreeSpace to spend any money to try it out for themselves.
In that vein, how hard would it be to make an FSO package out of the FS2 demo and put that front-and-center? That's what the guy who ported the FS2 engine to the OpenPandora did (https://repo.openpandora.org/?page=detail&app=freespace2_demo_ptitseb).
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And what about making full use of HTML5 and CSS3 features? I wanted to see it more dynamic than ever.
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And what about making full use of HTML5 and CSS3 features? I wanted to see it more dynamic than ever.
To do what ? Do you have something in mind with those features that would enhance the page ?
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Bryan, consider this a preemptive warning: do not derail this thread with questions about technical minutiae that have little to nothing to do with the general topic.
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I agree that it's important that FS2 itself (and therefore the MediaVPs) need to be front-and-center, because FS2 is ultimately the reason all (or at the very least most) of us are here in the first place. However, it's also important that the free standalones also be given prominent placement because, unlike the MediaVPs, they don't require someone who's never heard of FreeSpace to spend any money to try it out for themselves.
In that vein, how hard would it be to make an FSO package out of the FS2 demo and put that front-and-center? That's what the guy who ported the FS2 engine to the OpenPandora did (https://repo.openpandora.org/?page=detail&app=freespace2_demo_ptitseb).
That is a really good idea. Any got the demo? Can't be that hard to make into an FSO package. I'll give it a go if no one else can.
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I was able to download a copy from here (http://games.softpedia.com/Freespace-2/download/)
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Wasn't the demo missions already ported to FS2? Might have gotten lost though. Ah, here we go, 5MB, I uploaded it to Google Drive: link (https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0W8iwdwhDpOLVpVNTVPR2NWWXM/view?usp=sharing). File creation date is November 2005.
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Score.. let's see what we can do with this.
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Hmm, my idea would revolve around the global mods on offer and using the things we already have: We already have the HLP network tab, which sits above the page being rather invisible and also being very neat. Instead of having a small HLP network tab, have a bigger, image-assissted tab that has the following options:
Freespace 2 - The Babylon Project - Diaspora - Wing Commander Saga - Wings of Dawn
clicking on any of these produces a dropdown explenatory page. The very first thing an user should see when they visit a page should be a "Play now" button which instantly brings the user to the download page. The page should then further eleborate on what that thing they clicked on actually is.
Why only the total mods and "Freespace 2"? Because those options represent the shortest time-to-complete: Once the user knows how to use the FSOpenInstaller, for instance, they know how to get the good mods for that, too. And, obviously, having a Battlestar Galactica, a Babylon 5, a Wing Commander and ANIMÉ front and center is a huge thing to have.
Below the HLP network tab and the explenatory page (have it drop down with the dropdown page!) should be the regular news thing - However, I think the current highlights and news seperation is a bit silly. The monthly news articles are great, but a lot of the highlights that are currently on the frontpage are not really relavent. My advice would be to:
Drop *either* the highlight system or the news system entirely, in favour of a composite system that only highlights the newsletter itself and releases of trailers and stuff that is playable. RTS scripts and new modeels and the like are usefull for modders, but not for people looking to play the site's stuff, and as such can be reported in, say, the newsletter but not on the frontpage.
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Adapt as neccesary, but the shorter and clearer you can make the path to downloading and playing the better. The frontpage should, ideally, directly link to forum threads such as the one that Battuta created for Blue Planet. (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=90802.0)
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I like a number of the ideas here, and I put together a refined layout that tries to capture them all. It's not terribly pretty (because I was stuck using Powerpoint to quickly do this during a break) but it gives you the idea of where everything can go. Features:
-HLP Logo and Short About Us blurb
- 3 large in-your-face tikes: one to buy FS2, one to get FSOpen (and MediaVPs), and one to point to all the Total Conversions. Tiles can use screenshots or other visuals and backgrounds, overlayed with text to explain what you get when you click, the cost (Free emphasized), and the quick benefits. The tiles should each point to a dedicated page WITH DOWNLOAD LINKS for whichever item they've clicked on.
-Tab-based content window below, defaulting to the Getting Started explanation, with a right tab for combined news and highlights, and a middle tab to memorialize Battuta's epic wall-o-text in a front-and-center explanation where it belongs.
Thoughts?
Someone make it pretty.
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I like that one hell of a lot
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I'm going to advocate till I'm blue in the face that we move the WALL OF WORDS out of the way... The wall of words is fine.. but let the download links have some space to breathe, man! They want to be seen! They want to be pretty! They want to stand out!
Here's my version of that mock up. I fully realize that my image choices make some of the text unreadable. Just ignore that.. I wouldn't do that in the final version.
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk264/mjnmixael/Private/mockup_zpsikwfkx16.jpg~original)
Let me back this up. Text is busy. It's distracting. It's not generally pretty. Let the download links and pretty pictures (bonus points for background silent video) be front and center without competition at all.
Just take a look at all these sites. None of them hit you with any sort of text in terms of what the game is about, who is selling it, or even what it really is. It's pictures, videos, and PLAY IT RIGHT NOW.
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/ (http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/)
http://www.zelda.com/ (http://www.zelda.com/) - A sort of exception to the rule.. but not really. Look how little text is visible!
http://www.rollercoastertycoon.com/ (http://www.rollercoastertycoon.com/)
https://www.elitedangerous.com/ (https://www.elitedangerous.com/)
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/ (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/)
http://www.oddworld.com/ (http://www.oddworld.com/)
https://www.callofduty.com/ (https://www.callofduty.com/)
I could go on and on and on. People want to play games, they don't want to read about them.
EDIT: A few other things. I would change "Install" to "Play". I would remove any language about "standalone games" and "total conversions" because new people don't know what we mean by that. I would change those to buttons specifically for Diaspora, BSG, FOTG. Yeah yeah.. the list could get long, but it's not right now... so that can be a (good) problem for future-HLP.
The "Play/Install FSO" thing is tough. It should probably start with "Got FS2 Already?" and then say "Upgrade Now Free".
Then we have Buy FS2, Upgrade FS2, Play Diaspora, Play BSG, Play FOTG... etc.
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I actually like spacing out the title bar, main buttons, and wall-o-texts. I can also agree with switching "Install" to Play
Quibbles:
1. I think some text on the tiles IS important. The Frontpage should sell people on the benefits of the FSO upgrade, and what the games are.
2. Individual buttons for all the TCs favours them above some of the stunning mods and campaigns that deserve equal billing.
3. Re: 2, a better layout would be 4 tiles arranged in a square: Buy FreeSpace 2, Upgrade to FreeSpace Open (Free!), Play FreeSpace 2 Mods/Campaigns (Free!), Play Standalone Games (Free!)
4. "Standalone" is an important distinction that should probably be in the title, or some other word. "Play Games" is too generic, and I don't support the idea of giving every TC its own button for reasons in 2. All the other products on HLP require FS2, so the distinction of "standalone" is, I think, needed if the consensus is consolidation.
5. If moving to the 4-tile format in a square, each tile could be larger and composed of a screenshot or multiple screenshots.
I also really happen to like the About Blurb you stuck in the banner. That's very HLP.
EDIT: Alternative if we want a button for each TC....
Divide the Tiles into two rows.
First row heading (small text): FreeSpace 2 Source Code Project and Mods
First row tiles: Buy FreeSpace 2 (Required for FS Upgrades and Mods), Upgrade to FreeSpace Open, Play FreeSpace Mods/Campaigns
Second Row heading (small text): Free Games (Standalone Games / Total Conversion Mods)
Second Row tiles: FOTG, WC, B5, Diaspora, WoD, etc.
That would give a top row of three large tiles for all things FreeSpace, and a bottom row of ~6? slightly smaller ones for each TC project. A small heading is unobstrusive, yet divides the two categories up so its clear what tile is for what kind of thing.
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I'm not saying get rid of all text.. just the bits where we are trying to force all the tabs and explanatory stuff to be just as "FIRST" as the playnow stuff on the front page when it shouldn't be.
Remember that this page is designed (as per how this discussion began) for someone who's new to HLP and probably even to Freespace. We can show that there are mods/campaigns to add-on.. but they need an FS2 purchase. Not only that, but to anyone who's new.. while they COULD start with BP2. They should probably start with FS2.. and thus all they need is a place to buy it and a place to upgrade it. After that, they are here.. in the community and we can point them in the right direction from there.
I'm still afraid that "standalone" is too technical. It leads to questions.. "why standalone?" "standalone from what?" "how is that different from FS2?" We want to either remove or not even allow those questions. Removing requires moar text to explain them. Just offering free games without stating a header/category doesn't even trigger the questions.
Are you here for free games? Great, here's five.
vs
Are you here for free games? Great, here's a list of standalones.
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OK, sold on the elimination of standlone, but then you still need headings between the FreeSpace tiles and the Free Games Tiles.
Think of it this way: The FreeSpace section has dependencies. They need to be visually clustered and distinct from the TC section, where those dependencies don't exist.
On your note about text.... thinking more about the frontpage, maybe it makes sense to feature the banner, blurb, sectioned-tiles, and then a big giant link below the tiles that simply says
"Want More? Have Questions? Visit the Forums" with an active link.
Thus, the main page fulfills its three primary functions:
- Gets people to the FreeSpace stuff
- gets people to the TC stuff
- Redirects everyone to the forums, where the actual content is.
This does, however, mean we need to update the forum entry points with a Getting Started post, Batts' Missions/Campaigns post, and a highlights post. I know these things already basically exist, but they need to land in a more discrete entry area.
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Yes
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For the showcase, this Is what I made: [SEE ATTACHMENT]
This works right? It matches what MP-Ryan and Mjn.mixael have been saying as far as the showcase goes; TCs and FS-mods separate but compact.
Also, I think this looks nice.
colors and fonts are WIP. Anyone want to modify/work off this example? Start adding text around it maybe?
EDIT: Of course this would not be the entire webpage, just the "Showcase" part.
Tell me what you think!
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Possibly make the word Java a link to https://java.com/download
It's pretty easy and obvious, however, some people (the toolbar people) will not have an official Java download come up on their first search (although, they did make it to HLP alright, so maybe..)
Just a thought.
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Possibly make the word Java a link to https://java.com/download
It's pretty easy and obvious, however, some people (the toolbar people) will not have an official Java download come up on their first search (although, they did make it to HLP alright, so maybe..)
Just a thought.
That was the intention, but I forgot to underline It. :p
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I like a lot of the ideas here, good job. It's 7am here and I need to get to sleep, so I'll keep this short and to the point.
1. No trapezoids, sorry! Can't be done easily with current browser support. :-/
2. Big, beautiful imagery is where it's at, but focus more on wireframe page designing during this brainstorming process. Also, as was mentioned, a silent background video could be superb to "sell" HLP to visitors.
3. Let's not be afraid to move content out of the forums and/or wiki - IF we create a better place for it.
P.S. HTML 5 and CSS 3 are definites. ;)
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I'd be very willing to create some sort of background video when we get there.
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Soundless background video, please. There is nothing so irritating as auto-play videos with sound.
In fact, I wonder if a slideshow of compelling (and regularly updated) screenshots wouldn't be a better plan than a static video.
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We have said "silent" since the idea came up....
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I really hope this silent background video won't have any sound!
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Perhaps we can have it autoplay an empty audio track?
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will this background video have a sign language interpreter
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Umm. A lot of autoplaying videos (the less atrocious ads) default to volume off, with an inconspicuous mute button if you should choose to listen in. Thoughts?
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I honestly prefer it if the background images would simply rotate between the winners of the screenshot contest. No videos.
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Umm. A lot of autoplaying videos (the less atrocious ads) default to volume off, with an inconspicuous mute button if you should choose to listen in. Thoughts?
Sound would be a pointless distraction for a background video.
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Not if its silent sound!
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Vote against autoplay. That **** is annoying on 3G and limited data.
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Seriously guys.. how about worry about the -design- and not the technicalities? Most well designed sites with video BGs don't play them for mobile configurations automatically. A great example is airbnb.com.
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Agreed. Design first. Then consider implementation.
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Tossed this together just before bed. The wording, menus, buttons, etc. will probably need much refining and whatnot, but it's a start. Concentrated more on the content's design than on the surrounding page's design.
(http://i.imgur.com/sIj5RLj.jpg)
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Layout looks great, and even most of the wording! Only thing that seems kinda silly is the HLP By the Numbers section, seeing how those aren't going to change much any time soon (and the last one is funny considering I'm sure a huge majority of those accounts are long dormant).
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Yeah, that's pretty close to what I imagined when I first posted. You see that and you know that there is stuff to play on that website. :)
I'd make the "Unleash your inner starfighter pilot" into a gif that switches between all our current games so that it shows off TBP, Diaspora, WoD, etc too.
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I'd make the "Unleash your inner starfighter pilot" into a gif that switches between all our current games so that it shows off TBP, Diaspora, WoD, etc too.
QFT
But, APNG instead?
EDIT: Oh, and something something you seem to be painting FS2 into a corner by calling it a 'failure'. Re-phrase to indicate FS2 was never given a chance or uneducated people will be wondering if FS2 is a zombie sent forth to rot their brains. :lol:
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I'd just cut it back to "Some think the space combat genre died last century. Some people think there hasn't been a good modern space sim in years. Not even close."
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But, APNG instead?
Nah, pretty sure only Firefox supports them at the moment (I guess I haven't checked Safari....)
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APNG#Support
Yeah, looks like Webkit has it, Edge doesn't have it, and Chrome needs a 3rd party plugin (support is in development). 5/9 browsers support it, not quite universal yet (probably within months?, but that's just my guessing).
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Only thing that seems kinda silly is the HLP By the Numbers section, seeing how those aren't going to change much any time soon (and the last one is funny considering I'm sure a huge majority of those accounts are long dormant).
Yeah, there are definitely other numbers we could show - lines of code changed, number of games played (do we have those kinds of stats, SCPeople?), whatever else is appropriate. Just seemed like something fun. :)
EDIT: Whoops, didn't see the rest of the replies! I had thought that top bit could be either a slideshow (let's save animated gifs for articles or emails or something), or be gone completely in favor of having the wording and button hovering over a background video like what was mentioned before - I really think that would be the most impressive.
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That design looks awesome! I think we should have the "news" things display at very the bottom of your example, Sandwi
tch. oh, then add the animated background, and It would be perfect!
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A few small adjustments. Definitely more to do, just don't have the time at the moment.
I kinda want to keep the feel of the line "The thing is, FS2 never died... not even close." If you can come up with a good way to introduce that line, give it context, without referring to FS2 as a failure (perhaps what I did was sufficient?), let me know. :)
(http://i.imgur.com/7oGOVSh.jpg)
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I dislike the entire "What is all this" section. I'd remove any focus on space sims dying or FS2 being a failure or anything, and just focus on the celebration of FS2 being kept alive for over 15 years. Opening a webpage with negativity (negativity that is not even warranted considering the state of the space game genre today) is never a good idea. That entire section has a bit of "We're not as bad as people say we are!" which is weird because nobody is saying that to begin with. If there's any game that can make a claim to be "Dead", it's Allegiance. And they aren't (https://www.freeallegiance.org/).
Instead I'd replace it with... **** it, just ask AuthorTuta, but if you want my geuss:
Before Saint's Row, Volition created Freespace.
In 2001, they released the source code to Freespace 2 to the public.
15 years, a hundred user created campaigns and 7 standalone games later, FS2 Open stands as a bold achievement of what a dedicated community can do.
I'd put the "Buy FS2" in the middle, put "Expand FS2 with FS2Open" on the right, and put the "Get free standalone games" on the left. In general, standalone games should never be considered a "Third Step".
EDITed extensively.
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One other thing: the images show a lot of warships duking it out from a distance, but maybe it'd be better to have an actual ingame screenshot with HUD and everything, at least for the introduction? Would mesh better with the "unleash your inner starfighter pilot" line to see someone actually being a pilot rather than an observer :)
I also think that Freespace needs to make a bigger appearance. The word itself - like in one of the images. If this site is all about Freespace and Freespace modding, that should be pretty overwhelmingly clear.
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One other thing: the images show a lot of warships duking it out from a distance, but maybe it'd be better to have an actual ingame screenshot with HUD and everything, at least for the introduction? Would mesh better with the "unleash your inner starfighter pilot" line to see someone actually being a pilot rather than an observer :)
No. FS HUD is ugly.
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FS1 maybe, but FS2 looks pretty decent if you take some time to colorize it. Not even the whole HUD, but just the center reticle stuff with someone firing on other fighters. I mean, if you can't even show off what the game looks like to an actual player, what's that say?
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But in Freespace, the HUD isn't what the game looks like. We don't generally use cockpit models or anything similar. The HUD is just textual information pasted to the screen in front of what the game looks like. The HUD helps you play the game, it does not help you see it. You can take any one of those screenshots and slap an FS HUD on it and it will be exactly the same except with an obstructed view.
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For site design images, no HUD. But if we have a little gallery of "Hey, this is what the game looks like these days!" (which we should have, but perhaps not necessary to launch with that), then sure, HUD would be acceptable.
That said, the images are basically placeholders - I just picked some from the Screenshot contest wiki page that I thought would work in the various situations. I really really want to have a nice background video - perhaps done at a somewhat low resolution but with that horizontal scanlines effect, to offset the low res? Not sure if that's clear... whatever, anyway, background video, which only gets initialized on... tablet? desktop? sizes and up.
I have an idea for the "steps" section, gimme a bit. ;)
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I'm working on something that could be that video. I'll be able to do more after my mod is out because I need to play lots of other mods to record footage.
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I'm working on something that could be that video. I'll be able to do more after my mod is out because I need to play lots of other mods to record footage.
Sounds like what I had in mind... a bunch of 5-10 second highlight clips?
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Yeah basically. However, do not feel like you're stepping on toes if you randomly have time and decide to do it yourself! Codehulu knows I've got a long list of projects to finish around here.
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I don't have anything like the resources or tools necessary to do it, sorry. :-/
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Just wanted to make note of this; I'll try to see if I can integrate most of this stuff into the frontpage design.
http://blog.hubspot.com/blog/tabid/6307/bid/31097/12-Critical-Elements-Every-Homepage-Must-Have-Infographic.aspx#sm.00000z6h3mw9gafnzv3946h6rh6k9