Author Topic: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)  (Read 18259 times)

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Offline Dishwasher

  • Diplomat Extraordinaire
  • 24
Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
But what on earth did you guys do to piss the CIC off this much... I started this toic over there but it was closed within minutes :(.

http://www.crius.net/zone/showthread.php?t=20402

Saga is by far my fav. WC project and I really hope you will finish it someday.. until then I will just be poking you guys about a release date over here instead off at the CIC.. I hope others will find this place soon to.

Good luck on the project.

Dish.
Live is Unfair, Kill yourself or get over it.

 
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Insert plasma core... target "Dishwasher"... OPEN FIRE!

:welcome:



Welcome to the HLP! Exits are located to the right, left, up, down, and 4th-dimensionally. However all of them are blocked, except the 4-d one, and no one's yet figured how to reach it. You might try the ducts if you're desparate to leave, but beware Carl, our lunch-loving Shivan. Throw him your lunch and he'll leave you alone (usually). Flamethrowers are located underneath all seats; budgets have recently been reduced due to politics (don't ask) and the flamers have been filled with Holy Water. Other weapons are located in the secure lockers, but only and admin, :v:, or hyper-intelligent shade of blue may open them. Thank you and enjoy your stay! You are my fifth kill! :)


Seeya!  :yes:
"You need to believe in things that aren't true. How else can they become?" -DEATH, Discworld

"You can fight like a krogan, run like a leopard, but you'll never be better than Commander Shepard!"

 

Offline Goober5000

  • HLP Loremaster
  • 214
    • Goober5000 Productions
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
It's very simple:

1) Bandit LOAF blames FreeSpace for the collapse of the Wing Commander franchise.
2) Since WCSaga uses the FreeSpace engine, they incur guilt by association.
3) Much of the CIC forum takes Bandit LOAF's word for things without bothering to do research on them.
4) Thus the WCSaga team has acquired an unjust and inaccurate reputation among much of the WC fan base.

 

Offline Fury

  • The Curmudgeon
  • 213
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Indeed, it is such as shame that LOAF happens to be an administrator there. Without him relationships between our two communities would be much friendlier. But no, his personal crusade against anything FreeSpace has made him to spread half-truths and outright lies throughout WC community, and because he is an admin everyone believes him. There might be cases where WCS or HLP members might have acted offensively against LOAF and his lies, which is a shame because these cases have only benefitted LOAF and his personal crusade. But HLP and WCS members are far from being the jerks and assholes LOAF has made us and them to be.


In any case, welcome to HLP Dishwasher and enjoy your stay. :)

 

Offline gevatter Lars

  • Another wingnut
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    • http://gevatter_lars.tripod.com/
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Thanks Dishwasher for your try at CIC but as Goober and Fury mentioned Loaf has some personal problems with us.
I don't want to go into details because I am sick of Loaf turning everything around...even if we would say we found a cure for cancer he would make it look like we invented cancer in the first place to sell the cure...just as an example.

In this special case I don't have any idea what made Loaf belive that we where threatening the HW2 mod...especial since czacen posted openly that we wheren't the one who PMed him.
You can read it for yourself here czacen post

Well I hope you will enjoy your stay and we will try to continue our updates as we can and support anyone who asks us here...since we can no longer do that in the CIC what I personaly feel sad about. Just because of one or two persons we aren't able to support those who are interested.
"Yes! That is my plan, and I see nothing wrong with it. I figure that if I stick to a stupid strategy long enough it might start to work."
 - comment to "Robotech: The Masters"

 

Offline Tolwyn

  • The Admiral
  • Administrator
  • 214
  • Ridiculously Old Fraud
    • Wing Commander Saga
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
I think I do not have to mention, that this statement was deleted without comment by the CIC staff :)
Wing Commander Saga: A Legend Is Reborn | WingCenter
 
Tolwyn’s reputation for risk taking with other people’s lives was considered  to understate the facts. The admiral’s willingness to sacrifice anyone or anything to achieve his objectives had long been lauded in the popular press. He was “the man who got things done”.- Colonel Blair

No errors, no random CTDs, just pure fun and proof of why getting hit with missiles is a bad thing.
-WC Saga's beta tester


Report Wing Commander Saga bugs with Mantis

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

  • HLP is my mistress
  • 213
  • Aken Tigh Dekker- you've probably heard me
    • My old squad sub-domain
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Hiya Dishwasher, FS2 & WC Rocks the hizoose, Its a shame we all cant get along.... :( but welcome again

:welcome:
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
- Blue Planet: Battle Captains
-Battle of Neptune
-Between the Ashes 2
-Blue planet: Age of Aquarius
-FOTG?
-Inferno R1
-Ribos: The aftermath / -Retreat from Deneb
-Sol: A History
-TBP EACW teaser
-Earth Brakiri war
-TBP Fortune Hunters (I think?)
-TBP Relic
-Trancsend (Possibly?)
-Uncharted Territory
-Vassagos Dirge
-War Machine
(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

Your friendly Orestes tactical controller.

Secret bomb God.
That one time I got permabanned and got to read who was being bitxhy about me :p....
GO GO DEKKER RANGERSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
President of the Scooby Doo Model Appreciation Society
The only good Zod is a dead Zod
NEWGROUNDS COMEDY GOLD, UPDATED DAILY
http://badges.steamprofile.com/profile/default/steam/76561198011784807.png

 

Offline Dishwasher

  • Diplomat Extraordinaire
  • 24
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
It's very simple:

1) Bandit LOAF blames FreeSpace for the collapse of the Wing Commander franchise.
2) Since WCSaga uses the FreeSpace engine, they incur guilt by association.
3) Much of the CIC forum takes Bandit LOAF's word for things without bothering to do research on them.
4) Thus the WCSaga team has acquired an unjust and inaccurate reputation among much of the WC fan base.

About point 1, I never got that one.. I was delighted with the freespace series... It was original had a good storyline amazing cap ships cool missions. I think freespace 1 and 2 where awesome games.
Live is Unfair, Kill yourself or get over it.

 

Offline gevatter Lars

  • Another wingnut
  • Moderator
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    • http://gevatter_lars.tripod.com/
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Well you could ask for the reason...but don't wonder if you get banned. ^_^
"Yes! That is my plan, and I see nothing wrong with it. I figure that if I stick to a stupid strategy long enough it might start to work."
 - comment to "Robotech: The Masters"

 

Offline Dishwasher

  • Diplomat Extraordinaire
  • 24
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Well everything I say about it get's closed.. apparantly it's not considered something that should be discussed in public... hell if I would act like that on the Queens of the Stone Age forum (I'm a mod there) I would be burned down by my own admin LOL.
Live is Unfair, Kill yourself or get over it.

 

Offline Sphynx

  • Moderator
  • 210
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
No offense taken, Dishwasher. We are open to honest questions around here.

About point number 1:

Someone awhile ago ran a wonderful regression statistic (I think it was Milo), but I don't have it now (my old computer crashed).

Anyways, Freespace 2 came at kind of the last gasp of the long reign of the space flight sim. It was a great game, although the publicity around it could have been done better (for instance, I loved FS1, but was totally unaware of the existence of FS2 until I saw it in a bargin bin at Media Play. That's my ancedotal proof, but there is more proof. Marketing was a little weak, that must be admitted.).

What we have going on here is that Loaf has come to believe that since FS2 was the last, the shortcomings that occurred regarding it's publicity and marketing (and what he considers to be poor gameplay, although I wonder if he has ever played it) were responsible for actually killing the space flight sim genre, thus making compaines like Origin think it would not be profitable to produce another Wing Commander.

In other words, the claim is "Freespace killed Wing Commander."

However, this is a case of spurious association, because there had been a steady decline in space sim sales already (due to market flooding by a rather large line of lack-luster or poorly executed titles [a la Battlecruiser pre-patch] eager to take a share in the profits and growing interest in other genres). FS 2 inherited a market that already had one foot in the grave, so to speak, and would have required a great deal of effort to revive. Could FS2 have been the magic bullet to spark new interest? Possibly, but somehow word and availablity were not up to the task. But that is another discussion altogether.

The point is, the regression analysis showed that there was no statistically significant change in the slope of space flight sim sales and profitablity at the data point occupied by FS2. What does that mean? It means that FS2 did not kill the space flight sim, nor did it actually do it any harm (whereas other titles had), it just merely failed to revive it.

That's a different story alltogether than "Freespace killed Wing Commder." It's more like "Freespace 3 and the next Wing Commander shared the same fate."

(To HLP hardcores, please forgive the mention of Freespace 3!  :))

There was a time when this info was posted at the CIC (it got me banned once for bringing it back up), but as you can guess, it has all been deleted by the admins.

It's much easier to appear right if one hides all the evidence of an opposing view. Just as it is easier to excuse the senseless banning of all Saga members by hiding the post by the person who exhonerated them of the charges being levied against them.

That being said, we do not wish any ill to the CIC community. I want to make that point very explicit.

And welcome aboard, Dishwasher.

Oh, and for the record, I actually like that HW2 mod a lot.

:welcome:
« Last Edit: July 18, 2006, 10:13:50 am by Sphynx »
What we perceive is more a reflection of ourselves than of our environment.

 

Offline Dishwasher

  • Diplomat Extraordinaire
  • 24
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
You got banned for posting the above information?
Live is Unfair, Kill yourself or get over it.

 

Offline gevatter Lars

  • Another wingnut
  • Moderator
  • 213
    • http://gevatter_lars.tripod.com/
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Dosn't wonder me.
"Yes! That is my plan, and I see nothing wrong with it. I figure that if I stick to a stupid strategy long enough it might start to work."
 - comment to "Robotech: The Masters"

 

Offline Dishwasher

  • Diplomat Extraordinaire
  • 24
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Gheheh.. FreeSpace 2 got a damn good review in a dutch gaming magazine, after it's release I was laying on the loca retailers doormat to get it.. finished the game in days... then finished it again directly afterwards.
Live is Unfair, Kill yourself or get over it.

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

  • HLP is my mistress
  • 213
  • Aken Tigh Dekker- you've probably heard me
    • My old squad sub-domain
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
I cant find the HW2 mod, i used to love the strategyplanet site, but it doesnt appear to work right now for some reason?
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
- Blue Planet: Battle Captains
-Battle of Neptune
-Between the Ashes 2
-Blue planet: Age of Aquarius
-FOTG?
-Inferno R1
-Ribos: The aftermath / -Retreat from Deneb
-Sol: A History
-TBP EACW teaser
-Earth Brakiri war
-TBP Fortune Hunters (I think?)
-TBP Relic
-Trancsend (Possibly?)
-Uncharted Territory
-Vassagos Dirge
-War Machine
(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

Your friendly Orestes tactical controller.

Secret bomb God.
That one time I got permabanned and got to read who was being bitxhy about me :p....
GO GO DEKKER RANGERSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
President of the Scooby Doo Model Appreciation Society
The only good Zod is a dead Zod
NEWGROUNDS COMEDY GOLD, UPDATED DAILY
http://badges.steamprofile.com/profile/default/steam/76561198011784807.png

 

Offline Sphynx

  • Moderator
  • 210
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
@ Dishwasher,

Yes, I actually was. :)

Let me count the bans:

1st: when things blew up, I tried to help both sides calm down and mentioned I thought Loaf was too hard on Saga and should perhaps apologize, since the Saga team was apologizing for how they had handled a certain situation (this was before I was a part of the team).

2nd: Banned for quoting regression statistics.

3rd: Banned for using a common phrase without knowing that Loaf would construe it as a personal attack on a specific personal challenge that he faces (I only found out after the fact that he had that challenge, and certainly wasn't trying to attack him. In fact, I was just using the phrase to let him know that I think I come off as sincere when people talk to me face to face). This resulted in a permanent ban, by the way (even after I found out about his challenge, flet bad about how he thought I was attacking him personally, and tried to clear things up with him).

My crime was in supporting Saga. Everything else just seemd to be a case of, "a man hears what he wants to hear and disregard the rest."

But I need to stop. I don't want to start a string of CIC bashing. We have nothing against the community, we have many friends there. I have nothing personal against Loaf, I'm just sorry that he seems to think I do.

@ Dekker. This new HW2 mod is currently under construction, but can be found in the "Fan Projects" section of crius.net. Check it out, it looks very good.
What we perceive is more a reflection of ourselves than of our environment.

 

Offline Starman01

  • 213
  • Mechwarrior
    • Wing Commander Saga
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Welcome to HLP Dishwasher :)

Regarding the CIC, the situation or personal feelings, I highly suggest that we just drop the entire thing (I mean all of you :) ), since it's already getting to ridiculous to even discuss about it. All posts were we (or czazen himself) said we didn't do anything to the HW 2 mod (or the nexus-mod  :wtf: now this is even new to me ) get deleted immediately so that no one sees them, so it's quite obvious what methods are being used to justify our leave/extermination.

But with this sort of behaviour and such actions used, I can't see any way I can participate in that community any longer myself, and obviously we are also no longer welcome over there. I just hope that people will get a little more suspicious about certain statements and build up their own meaning about the situation, instead of believing everything they are being told to believe (but this may be quite hard when the evidence vanish).

Since we are no longer allowed to post on CIC, we will not be able to reach a few of our fans, but everyone is welcome visiting us here for receiving information (or support later on), and our website is out there too. I'm sure everyone interested in this game will be able to find us (even google, though not on the very first link :) ) We will continue our way of regular updates so you people see what's going on.

Well, as I already said, thanks for all the sympathy (to the HLP admins too), but discussing these things in puplic will most certainly just lead into a stupid community war and I don't want this to happen ( we all got better things to do). Most important, I don't want to see the HLP-Boards getting poluted by such a big pile of BS. This here was always a very friendly place to visit and discuss, and I want it to stay this way.

I will now leave this topic open for a couple of few hours and will close it then (around 23.00 pm german time). Please keep it clean for the time being. Any further questions regarding this matter should be issued to PM's. If you want to discuss the relations between WC und FS2, it would be nice if a admin (or a mod who knows how to  ) can split the thread (but keep that one clean too  ). Thank you.

Starman
MECHCOMMANDER OMNITECH

9 out of 10 voices in my head always tell me that I'm not insane. The 10th is only humming the melody of TETRIS.

 

Offline Dishwasher

  • Diplomat Extraordinaire
  • 24
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Ok let's leave it at that...
Euhm
Any help still requierd for the mod?
Live is Unfair, Kill yourself or get over it.

 

Offline Goober5000

  • HLP Loremaster
  • 214
    • Goober5000 Productions
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
I will now leave this topic open for a couple of few hours and will close it then (around 23.00 pm german time).

Isn't that would CIC would do? ;) :p

I recommend leaving it open.  Encourage the fans not to beat a dead horse, but be willing to answer questions if they ask. :)

 

Offline Sphynx

  • Moderator
  • 210
Re: Hi newly registered and curious.. (Don't mean to offend)
Dishwasher,

If you are interested in helping, perhaps PM or e-mail Tolwyn, Starman, or Lars. Let them know what you have to offer and they can take it from there.
What we perceive is more a reflection of ourselves than of our environment.