[-Norbert-]

Eh? I thought the balance was several Nordera kills per LSF loss.

I think he meant the five species (Cordi, Fura'ngle, Hertak, Nordera and Zy) against one and all the losses this caused the LSF.
And the 5-to-1 kill-death ratio (or whatever it was) was at the beginning of the war, when it was only the Nordera and Cordi invading. With the Zy and Fura'ngle and that balance must have shifted in favour of the invaders.... and the Hertak themselfs are worse still.

[Jellyfish]

I think he meant the five species (Cordi, Fura'ngle, Hertak, Nordera and Zy) against one and all the losses this caused the LSF.
And the 5-to-1 kill-death ratio (or whatever it was) was at the beginning of the war, when it was only the Nordera and Cordi invading. With the Zy and Fura'ngle and that balance must have shifted in favour of the invaders.... and the Hertak themselfs are worse still.

Even then, the invaders apparently got the worst part of it. Specially after the Cordi turned over.

I doubt the LSF wants to go into Nordera space given the five-on-one beating it recently received.

The Nordera took prisoners from Human colonies and shipped them off for slave labor. The LSF is conducting several small operations in order to liberate these people.

Namely, the Guardian Angels?

[SpardaSon21]

Eh? I thought the balance was several Nordera kills per LSF loss.

I think he meant the five species (Cordi, Fura'ngle, Hertak, Nordera and Zy) against one and all the losses this caused the LSF.
And the 5-to-1 kill-death ratio (or whatever it was) was at the beginning of the war, when it was only the Nordera and Cordi invading. With the Zy and Fura'ngle and that balance must have shifted in favour of the invaders.... and the Hertak themselfs are worse still.

I meant the five species attacking the Terrans, yes.  Even with the excellent kill ratios against the Norderans and Cordi the Terrans were still taking painful losses that would take time to replace, and when the Fura'ngle, Zy, and eventually the Hertak showed up it went from bad to worse with three more races beating up one that was already reeling from the first two attackers.  The Terran star fleets are in shambles, and the Cordi, Zy, and Fura'ngle have re-building issues of their own, the Zy especially what with an exploding star in their home system. Waging open war against the wounded animal that is the Norderans would be a bad move.  The Cyrvans are probably mostly untouched by the recent events due to their more advanced technology and distance from the main thrust at the Terrans, so best to let them handle things on the Norderan end.

[Dark Hunter]

The Hertak were hammering the Cyrva just as hard as the Terrans. The Space Elves weren't untouched by the war. Their fleets most likely aren't in much better shape than the LSF.

[SpardaSon21]

I thought that was a relatively (compared to the ass-beating the Terrans were getting) minor diversion to pull Cyrvan reinforcements away from LSF space.

[NGTM-1R]

Yeah, we know the Cryvans were hit, but on what scale we don't. It's even implied they hadn't really mobilized or deployed yet by the end of the war.

[-Norbert-]

To let the Cyrvans handle an invasion isn't really a good idea I think.
After all any offensive action undertaken by them is carried out on a stric volunteer only basis. That way it could easily happen that they won't be able to get enough ships for a serious  attack together. And even if they do, they could be called back on a moment notice if even a small group of enemies shows up at their doorstep again.

No, they might be a good defensive force (in their own terretory anyway) but I feel the Cyrvans can't be trusted to undertake a large scale invasion.

Come to think of it, the invasion showed that it was a good thing the LSF rejected and resistet the Cyrvans takeover of protection. Imagine the Cyrvans had won the war. Then there would be no human military and the moment their own systems are attacked, they pull back to their own systems, leaving humanity completely undefended.
Or are "protected" species included into the Cyrvans defensive laws, even though it doesn't sound like that from the Techroom and briefing/ingame messages?

[Jellyfish]

Apparently, they do undertake large invasions if they feel insulted. Terran rejection of their 'offer' of protection is one such insult, and if that sparked a war, I don't want to see what they would do against whoever invaded their home systems

[-Norbert-]

But the war against he Terrans wasn't a "large" invasion. The Terrans outnumbered them many times over, but due to their technology being so inferiour still took massive losses before they could fight that small force to a standstill.

When the Cyrvans invaded the Terrans they thought the Humans had two, maybe three systems only few ships and their technology was barely able to overcome Cyrvan shields.
It's one thing to go to war with such a seemingly chanceless enemy and quite another to go to war with the Nordera, who are still in leage with the Hertak! And there might be other battlethralls that simply weren't part of the invasion, because the Hertak leader though he wouldn't need them (if not for Infis sacrifice that assumption would most likely have been correct).

Also there was little danger of the Terrans trying to invade the Cyrvans, but the Hertak and thralls might go back on the offensive once they chose a new leader. Not the best prerequisits for an invasion by a mostly peacefull race like the Cyrvans....

[Jellyfish]

And the Hertak and Nordera might deploy new toys we haven't seen yet...
But now the Terrans and the Cyrvans most likely have the Fur'angle, the Zy and the Cordi as allies, and, now that they are free from the Hertak, they can develop new stuff as well. And the Hertak are most likely too busy fighting against these former thralls.

Why not trying to reason with them? They release the prisoners, break free from the Hertak, and are given the chance to be protected from them by the LSA and to develop past their barbarism.
Something tells me they are the race that is impressed by shows of force, and killing their master might be the ultimate form of that. Perhaps now they consider the Terrans/Cyrvans as more powerful than the Hertak.

[SpardaSon21]

But the war against he Terrans wasn't a "large" invasion. The Terrans outnumbered them many times over, but due to their technology being so inferiour still took massive losses before they could fight that small force to a standstill.

When the Cyrvans invaded the Terrans they thought the Humans had two, maybe three systems only few ships and their technology was barely able to overcome Cyrvan shields.
It's one thing to go to war with such a seemingly chanceless enemy and quite another to go to war with the Nordera, who are still in leage with the Hertak! And there might be other battlethralls that simply weren't part of the invasion, because the Hertak leader though he wouldn't need them (if not for Infis sacrifice that assumption would most likely have been correct).

Also there was little danger of the Terrans trying to invade the Cyrvans, but the Hertak and thralls might go back on the offensive once they chose a new leader. Not the best prerequisits for an invasion by a mostly peacefull race like the Cyrvans....

Norbert, the Hertak lost their entire ruling class when the flagship was taken out by Crystal, and due to how Hertak gain and pass on knowledge, they won't be getting one any time soon.  They're completely headless, and while a leader will eventually emerge, right now they have no idea what to do, and who knows if they'll support their Norderan battle thralls given the whole "You have failed us" situation thanks to the death of all their royalty.  Right now the LSF, Cordi, Fura'ngle, and Zy need to work on rebuilding what was lost due to the Hertak (i.e. pretty much everything), and leave the Norderans to the Cyrvans.  Even if only a relatively few Cyrvans volunteer for the reprisal strikes, that's still more than enough to take out Industrial-era primitives with combustion-powered spacecraft given what they did to the fusion-powered and shielded Terran vessels armed with fission torpedoes.

Of course, the Terrans fighting the Cyrvans to a standstill despite the technology gap is pretty much the definition of "Humans are Warriors", which is surprising why it isn't on the WoD TVTropes page.

[Dark Hunter]

Why not trying to reason with them? They release the prisoners, break free from the Hertak, and are given the chance to be protected from them by the LSA and to develop past their barbarism.
Something tells me they are the race that is impressed by shows of force, and killing their master might be the ultimate form of that. Perhaps now they consider the Terrans/Cyrvans as more powerful than the Hertak.

But the Nordera probably don't want to be freed. The impression I got of them is that they love fighting, and the Hertak gave them the opportunity to fight a whole bunch of other people. And the Hertak gave them spacefaring technology. They have every reason to like the Hertak, and no reason to desire protection from them. Technically, they are slaves, true, but they want to fight, and the Hertak want them to fight, so it's a win-win situation for both species.

It is possible that they see humanity/Cyrva as more powerful, but something tells me that they wouldn't like the idea of being peaceful all that much, which is what the Terrans and Cyrvans would require of them if they did ally.

Of course, the Terrans fighting the Cyrvans to a standstill despite the technology gap is pretty much the definition of "Humans are Warriors", which is surprising why it isn't on the WoD TVTropes page.

Well, then go put it there, why don't you?

[SpardaSon21]

Why not trying to reason with them? They release the prisoners, break free from the Hertak, and are given the chance to be protected from them by the LSA and to develop past their barbarism.
Something tells me they are the race that is impressed by shows of force, and killing their master might be the ultimate form of that. Perhaps now they consider the Terrans/Cyrvans as more powerful than the Hertak.

But the Nordera probably don't want to be freed. The impression I got of them is that they love fighting, and the Hertak gave them the opportunity to fight a whole bunch of other people. And the Hertak gave them spacefaring technology. They have every reason to like the Hertak, and no reason to desire protection from them. Technically, they are slaves, true, but they want to fight, and the Hertak want them to fight, so it's a win-win situation for both species.

It is possible that they see humanity/Cyrva as more powerful, but something tells me that they wouldn't like the idea of being peaceful all that much, which is what the Terrans and Cyrvans would require of them if they did ally.

Of course, the Terrans fighting the Cyrvans to a standstill despite the technology gap is pretty much the definition of "Humans are Warriors", which is surprising why it isn't on the WoD TVTropes page.

Well, then go put it there, why don't you?

First quote:  Well, "Be peaceful or we will kill you" tends to stick pretty high for everyone that isn't an Ork, and since Norderans aren't saying they're never beaten in battle, and don't use firearms around cities due to the risk of blowing themselves up, I would say that even though they're Blood Knights, they aren't Ax Crazy.  You can't fight if you're dead.

[Deadly in a Shadow]

From which anime/film/game are the soundtracks? the ABriefing4 sounds a bit like Avatar

[-Norbert-]

Norbert, the Hertak lost their entire ruling class when the flagship was taken out by Crystal, and due to how Hertak gain and pass on knowledge, they won't be getting one any time soon.  They're completely headless, and while a leader will eventually emerge, right now they have no idea what to do, and who knows if they'll support their Norderan battle thralls given the whole "You have failed us" situation thanks to the death of all their royalty.

They lost the royal family. But they got to have some kind of governers throughout their empire and ambassadors on the homeworlds of their thralls. I highly doubt that such a big empire, including several enslaved races, was all controlled from the flagship alone.
Also there's got to be some Generals in the military.

So even if the whole Royal family was really wiped out, I wouldn't count the Hertak out just yet.

It's also be possible that a few of the royal family escaped in pods before the flagship went down. In the confusion of the battle they might have slipped through the LSF troops unnoticed. If that's the case, they probably need a bit of time to consolidate their rule, but the knowledge of the Hertak leaders would be at least partially intact (depends on how closely related they were with the Emperor I guess).

[Dark Hunter]

From which anime/film/game are the soundtracks? the ABriefing4 sounds a bit like Avatar

I do know that there's quite a bit of Gundam music in there. And a few tracks from Star Control 2.

And there's a few that I recognize but annoyingly cannot remember where they came from!

[NGTM-1R]

I recognized When the Dragon Submerges and Mobile Doll's Eyes from Wing. I might have to dig out the backups that have nearly the whole soundtrack for Wing and see if there's anything else...

[Dark Hunter]

There's also an unnamed-as-far-as-I-know song from Wing that only plays during the Big Climactic Battle^TM of the series.

*After taking stock and wracking brains*

I hear songs from Gundam Wing, Gundam 00, Diebuster, and Star Control II. Any others I'm either not remembering or not recognizing.

[NGTM-1R]

Well I know he didn't use any of the stuff with lyrics. Gimmie a bit to go through my files...

AAmbient5 is The Labyrinth Called Yourself (Not Mobile Doll's Eyes!)
I think I recognize AAmbient3 as being the Christmas Eve track from Endless Waltz (I even sent it to my sister to ask her, and she agrees), but I can't find a copy to compare with.
DogBattle1 is When The Dragon Submerges
I recognize DogBattle3 from somewhere too, but I don't think it's Wing. Maybe the original MS Gundam?
TBattle3 is...well I have it marked as "Invitation From The Hell" but I don't know if the song title is really that engrish.

I think that's it.

(Sidenote: surprised some of this stuff I could turn up, like the second half of Signs of Consciousness, didn't get into the mod. Even if was only used once in the show.)

[-Norbert-]

ABattle2 is Possibility though it seems to start only 30 seconds into the OST track.
ABriefing3 is Controll
OldBattle1 is Counterattack
OldBattle2 is Innovation
OldBattle3 is Union
EBattle2 is 00 Gundam.
EBattle3 is 0-Raiser

All of those are from "Gundam 00". And I have to say I'm quite surprised that Trans-Am Raiser didn't make it in, but then there is only so much room for music in a mod
Would have been nice for the Nordera slaughter mission in the final push though.