Hard Light Productions Forums
Community Projects => The FreeSpace Upgrade Project => Topic started by: fightermedic on September 27, 2016, 06:27:41 am
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Hades' and Oddgrim's Leviathan is now ready to go
PBR textured, so use a recent nightly if you want to swim along this one
(http://i1293.photobucket.com/albums/b590/lolaldanee/screen0013_zpskgyarpry.png~original)
download:
https://www.mediafire.com/?cwz9kmv1yc12cyo
also includes .png textures, and also Oddgrim's original textures
let me know of all the overlooked stupid little details
Thomas Hobbes would be proud, I am sure of it!
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What are those flammy things coming out of the model?
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What are those flammy things coming out of the model?
A triple dose of realism IN MAH FREESPACE.
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What are those flammy things coming out of the model?
A triple dose of realism IN MAH FREESPACE.
So does this mean we are going to have RCS on every ship one day? not that I'm complaining of course.
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I would personally prefer not that...
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What are those flammy things coming out of the model?
A triple dose of realism IN MAH FREESPACE.
So does this mean we are going to have RCS on every ship one day? not that I'm complaining of course.
What does "RCS" mean?
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Stands for "Reaction Control System", aka fancy NASA speak for an array of thrusters to do attitude adjustments with.
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Thanks for the info that it means those thrusters.
Just my opinion, but my vote would be the same as mjn's; I'd prefer not to have those. Is there a way to turn them off?
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Just had a test of this Leviathan on the latest nightly build and instead of as depicted, it gets shown in a really dark jet black in-game. Not sure what's going on; any ideas? Other than that, it is stunningly beautiful to behold. Much kudos in getting her done ;)
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Totally gorgeous levi!!!! :D Btw medic, what is the status of some other projects? I remember the perseus was getting a revamp, as well as the herc 2
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Just had a test of this Leviathan on the latest nightly build and instead of as depicted, it gets shown in a really dark jet black in-game. Not sure what's going on; any ideas? Other than that, it is stunningly beautiful to behold. Much kudos in getting her done ;)
As did I. I hooked it up correctly too
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Looks great, good job!
Also, I'm seeing the Hedetet. Good to see it be recognized by others as well, interesting design.
As always I hope we'll see more upgraded models in the near future!
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Just had a test of this Leviathan on the latest nightly build and instead of as depicted, it gets shown in a really dark jet black in-game. Not sure what's going on; any ideas? Other than that, it is stunningly beautiful to behold. Much kudos in getting her done ;)
As did I. I hooked it up correctly too
That is interesting, i will have a look if i can find any reason for that
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Just had a test of this Leviathan on the latest nightly build and instead of as depicted, it gets shown in a really dark jet black in-game. Not sure what's going on; any ideas? Other than that, it is stunningly beautiful to behold. Much kudos in getting her done ;)
Same here. It's extremely dark on both nightly and 3.7.4 builds.
Thanks for including original textures :). These .psd files will be very helpful to learn, especially for weathering the metal surfaces (which I always adored in Oddgrim's work)
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all this sounds a hell of a lot like the refelctance map ist not loaded, but if you are using a recent nightly, i have no idea why hat should be the case
it's obvious why it would happen in 3.7.4 however
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i just downloaded the very latest nightly, the one i used was a few weeks old, and now it is black for me too
seems like the current nightlies have a bug, or something changed with the reflectance maps
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I'm not sure if this fits better here or somewhere else, but it'd be nice if there was a launcher checkbox to toggle the showing of RCS. Or maybe two seperate ones for fighters and cap-ship.
Personally I like the idea and would switch them on, but I can see why some people might not like them.
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i just downloaded the very latest nightly, the one i used was a few weeks old, and now it is black for me too
seems like the current nightlies have a bug, or something changed with the reflectance maps
The Leviathan is the only ship affected by this.
Also, you might want to remove the .psd for the Leviathan textures to make it much more bandwidth-friendly.
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Also, you might want to remove the .psd for the Leviathan textures to make it much more bandwidth-friendly.
I'm going to vote "please don't remove the .psd's", sure it's more bandwidth but much more friendly to anyone who wants to modify the textures :) (it can be a real pain to track down the 'source' textures for many ships)
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i just downloaded the very latest nightly, the one i used was a few weeks old, and now it is black for me too
seems like the current nightlies have a bug, or something changed with the reflectance maps
The Leviathan is the only ship affected by this.
i just checked again, negative, all pbr ships are affected
with the nightly from 4 weeks ago they all work, with more recent ones, all pbr ships are messed up with their -misc and reflection textures
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And yet the Apollo I have is unaffected, and in fact the non-PBR textures for the Leviathan also result in a black ship. :wtf:
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fightermedic, you do know -misc is specifically for team colors right? You've got -misc used as the base texture for all the greebling on the Leviathan. As for the build, can you tell me the exact date for it? Not all PBR ships are affected, seems to vary dependent upon a number of unidentified factors.
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ah, yea, when i was talking about -misc right now i was only talking about teamcolors being messed up too in rescent nightlies,
the -misc textures in the leviathan are working as intented (in the old builds, in the rescent nightly they are having the same problem as all the other pbr textures), but the suffix -misc really isn't quite ideal for textures other than teamcolors, now that you mention it
so far i have only checked the problem with two PBR build numbers
the new fs2_open_3_7_5_20160927_d0600a6 is having all the problems
in the older fs2_open_3_7_5_SSE2_20160714_d28be15 everything is still working
no idea which build inbetween those broke it
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Well, given that I know where to start now, I can figure it out via git bisect.
In the future, I'd say give the greeble textures a more apt name like levi-greebles or leviathan_2.
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indeed, i just copied oddgrims name for the textures, without any brain activity involved that -misc might be not exactly the perfect name
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Commit that caused the botched rendering has been found. There is an issue (https://github.com/scp-fs2open/fs2open.github.com/issues/995) on Github.
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I'd like to give this a try someday, but it sounds like with what you guys are talking about that there are some minor bugs to work out.
When they get fixed, what files do I put where in order to use this new model?
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So RCS just means side thrusters? Acronyms ugh, I can just call them 'side thrusters', can I? :nervous: :P
Have to admit I miss the blockiness of the older HTL and the original model though, it looked more 'tough' by being more blocky. And there's something about the texturing at the middle segment, especially near the mortar launcher that really, really bothers me somehow, but I probably wouldn't care too much if this model goes into a new MediaVPs anyway. Guess that makes it my feedback i suppose, even though I won't be using the model anytime soon anyway...
Graphics these days is so lifelike I probably couldn't spot a new-gen error even if I was staring right at it.
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Bug with PBR rendering has been fixed as of this morning. Should be up in the next nightly.
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Yep, is working again, very well
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Sorry for the necro, but I tried this recently and got a dark black Leviathan.
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Sorry for the necro, but I tried this recently and got a dark black Leviathan.
Are you trying to use it with FSO 3.7.4? It has PBR textures, which won't work right without a PBR renderer (so you need either 3.8 or a recent nightly build).
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Sorry for the necro, but I tried this recently and got a dark black Leviathan.
Are you trying to use it with FSO 3.7.4? It has PBR textures, which won't work right without a PBR renderer (so you need either 3.8 or a recent nightly build).
That could be the problem.
BTW, is there a way to remove the RCS (side thrusters)? Visually I'm not crazy about them.
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You'd only need to remove the thruster entries from the modular table file included with the model.
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What are those flammy things coming out of the model?
A triple dose of realism IN MAH FREESPACE.
Less so than you'd think. Real spacecraft use reaction wheels to change orientation, for the simple reason that that doesn't require reaction mass and is easier to control.
...that said, this is a game where a ship stops moving if you turn off the engine, so whatever.
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I think it's pretty clear the universe is supposed to have maneuvering thrusters. The black dots on the retail leviathan/fenris (for some reason they're glows on the texture here, not sure why) are pretty clearly meant for that purpose. Plus you see a Poseidon using them in a CBANI in FreeSpace 1.
Still, the ones on Leviathan here are a bit overdone and not very well placed I feel.
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What are those flammy things coming out of the model?
A triple dose of realism IN MAH FREESPACE.
Less so than you'd think. Real spacecraft use reaction wheels to change orientation, for the simple reason that that doesn't require reaction mass and is easier to control.
...that said, this is a game where a ship stops moving if you turn off the engine, so whatever.
It's never a bad time to learn something new: ;)
A cluster of CMGs can become saturated, in the sense that it is holding a maximum amount of angular momentum in a particular direction and can hold no more.
As an example, suppose a spacecraft equipped with two or more dual-gimbal CMGs experiences a transient unwanted torque, perhaps caused by reaction from venting waste gas, tending to make it roll clockwise about its forward axis and thus increase its angular momentum along that axis. Then the CMG control program will command the gimbal motors of the CMGs to slant the rotors' spin axes gradually more and more forward, so that the angular momentum vectors of the rotors point more nearly along the forward axis. While this gradual change in rotor spin direction is in progress, the rotors will be creating gyroscopic torques whose resultant is anticlockwise about the forward axis, holding the spacecraft steady against the unwanted waste gas torque.
When the transient torque ends, the control program will stop the gimbal movement, and the rotors will be left pointing more forward than before. The inflow of unwanted forward angular momentum has been routed through the CMGs and dumped into the rotors; the forward component of their total angular momentum vector is now greater than before.
If these events are repeated, the angular momentum vectors of the individual rotors will bunch more and more closely together round the forward direction. In the limiting case, they will all end up parallel, and the CMG cluster will now be saturated in that direction; it can hold no more angular momentum. If the CMGs were initially holding no angular momentum about any other axes, they will end up saturated exactly along the forward axis. If however (for example) they were already holding a little angular momentum in the "up" (yaw left) direction, they will saturate (end up parallel) along an axis pointing forward and slightly up, and so on. Saturation is possible about any axis.
In the saturated condition attitude control is impossible. Since the gyroscopic torques can now only be created at right angles to the saturation axis, roll control about that axis itself is now non-existent. There will also be major difficulties with control about other axes. For example, an unwanted left yaw can only be countered by storing some "up" angular momentum in the CMG rotors. This can only be done by tilting at least one of their axes up, which will slightly reduce the forward component of their total angular momentum. Since they can now store less "right roll" forward angular momentum, they will have to release some back into the spacecraft, which will be forced to start an unwanted roll to the right.[a]
The only remedy for this loss of control is to desaturate the CMGs by removing the excess angular momentum from the spacecraft. The simplest way of doing this is to use Reaction Control System (RCS) thrusters. In our example of saturation along the forward axis, the RCS will be fired to produce an anticlockwise torque about that axis. The CMG control program will then command the rotor spin axes to begin fanning out away from the forward direction, producing gyroscopic torques whose resultant is clockwise about the forward direction, opposing the RCS as long as it is still firing and holding the spacecraft steady. This is continued until a suitable amount of forward angular momentum has been drained out of the CMG rotors; it is transformed into the moment of momentum of the moving matter in the RCS thruster exhausts and carried away from the spacecraft.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Control_moment_gyroscope
http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/43265-do-manned-spacecraft-use-reaction-wheels/
https://www.quora.com/How-can-I-understand-the-saturation-of-reaction-wheels-used-in-attitude-control
TL;DR
Reaction wheels are mostly for minor attitude adjustments, RE: If you turn too much in one direction, Reaction wheel stops working. you still need RCS Thrusters to "Reset" the Gyroscope's start position.
Science! :cool:
EDIT: *Ahem, back on topic, control thruster effects in Freespace are done almost completely by the ship TMB, removing or altering their size/position is trivial. No need to panic.
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Instructions how to install this would be great on the original post, for people that are new to this ship upgrades, like me. I got answered here: http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=91262.msg1854120#msg1854120
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I think it's pretty clear the universe is supposed to have maneuvering thrusters. The black dots on the retail leviathan/fenris (for some reason they're glows on the texture here, not sure why) are pretty clearly meant for that purpose. Plus you see a Poseidon using them in a CBANI in FreeSpace 1.
Still, the ones on Leviathan here are a bit overdone and not very well placed I feel.
Couple that up with a few fighters in the FS1 cb_ani had those thrusters too when they're not visible in-game.
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I don't think the thrusters appeared on the Poseidon command briefing animation until they got re-done.
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Nah, they're in the originals. They just don't look like they're off of a main thruster unit.
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For reference, here's the original.
(https://i.imgur.com/FxIbzhK.gif)
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Observe how the mighty Space Friction(TM) slows the Poseidon down before the thrusters start firing!
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Observe how the mighty Space Friction(TM) slows the Poseidon down before the thrusters start firing!
:yes:
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Also notice how it starts turning before the thruster fires before it docks with the container, I'm thinking maybe there's something more than simply it being Space Friction at work. :P
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The thrusters are retrocausal. Vishnan interference confirmed???
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Debug builds have been complaining to me about subsystems on the model not being in the table. At first I thought it had to do with the armour submodels, or a rogue subsystem entry in a arm or destroyed submodel. When I looked a little deeper, I found that the lod1 turret submodels have subsystem, fov, and name data. Is that supposed to be like that or is it an oversight?
[Edit]
That solved it. I can speculate that Lod1 was previously lod0 of the original file and retained the submodel info from the turrets. This should probably be fixed before the next MVP release.