Author Topic: cool stuff and ideas that may not work.  (Read 5961 times)

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Offline Turnsky

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cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
okay, this is just a little fun to shoot a few ideas involving the SCP, who knows, some of them might actually work, either way, it's just a little harmless fun, and discussion.. as well as fanciful requests, could give the guys in the ferrium project some thoughts as well. :nod:
i'll start

large-destructable parts of warships.. (like blowing the "wings" off a hecate)
engine flicker-multiple explosions- then burnt out derelect hulls, instead of having big lumps of debris floating hither and yon..
the "bloom" effect.. if you've played bridge commander, and halo2, etc.. you'll know what i'm talking about..

transforming vessels..as well as swing-wing desgined..

more advanced beam charge-up animation, like the endgame movie when capella goes boom, the energy crackling along the "spires" of the ship..  or something like points of energy moving up to meet in a point where the beam fires, like with phaser strips in star-trek, etc.

in-engine, character-based cutscenes! (yes, like freelancer)

higher-poly debris, this might seem like a minor gripe, but the currant debris only look like asteroids with a bit of hull texture applied, not actual chunks of obliterated spacecraft...

with debris, dead people to float about said debris.. like in starlancer.

"turreted" and auto-locking/tracking primaries, like in S:AAB, as well as starlancer, primary fire will track your target within your target reticule, should be toggled..

different huds, for different ships..  i know this may seem a little silly considering how well our current one works, but given how diverse the species' ship designs are, you'd think that it would influence the design of the HUD, too.. like you have your classic hud for terran ships, something with a vasudan influence for well, vasudan ships.. and when you fly shivan vessels.. you get the idea.

a more diverse, and richer "universe" as far as freespace is concerned

the option to be able to upgrade/redesign your own fighter...? :nervous:
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Offline Nuclear1

  • 211
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
I especially like the large-destructible part. That's what I like to see when I watch (or play) sci-fi. The in-game cutscenes would definitely be useful for FREDers and story-telling, hopefully by pausing the action and letting the cutscene take over. It'd make Derelict a lot more easier to enjoy (hint: watch Gorgon Cannon fire without being distracted or watch the Argentus do its thing at the end).

Good ideas all around. :nod: :yes:
Spoon - I stand in awe by your flawless fredding. Truely, never before have I witnessed such magnificant display of beamz.
Axem -  I don't know what I'll do with my life now. Maybe I'll become a Nun, or take up Macrame. But where ever I go... I will remember you!
Axem - Sorry to post again when I said I was leaving for good, but something was nagging me. I don't want to say it in a way that shames the campaign but I think we can all agree it is actually.. incomplete. It is missing... Voice Acting.
Quanto - I for one would love to lend my beautiful singing voice into this wholesome project.
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Offline Falcon

  • 29
Re: cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Quote
Originally posted by Turnsky
.......transforming vessels..as well as swing-wing desgined.....


*imagines a Sathani transforming into a huge battle mech* :p




:drevil:

 

Offline Turnsky

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cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
i do have another couple of ideas..

Since the SCP have so kindly implimented Skybox, i want to see somebody model an entire cityscape with it, say, the size of manhattan,  vasudan, and make it the fall of vasuda prime...

more advanced beam impact effects.. like, a dusting of particles around the impact point, as well as the current impact animation, also, when a beam cuts through a ship, a small explosion to signify that it's just gone straight through the ship..
a long beam scar would look kinda nifty too.

Smoke.. like, real smoke.. or at least a better looking particle effect, when a ship is heavily damaged, or scripted to do so..

with skybox... another idea or two... Rain.. like, a shower, or a thunderstorm..
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Offline FireCrack

  • 210
  • meh...
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
1 major thing that would looks soo good.


Burning debris!
actualy, mabye not.
"When ink and pen in hands of men Inscribe your form, bipedal P They draw an altar on which God has slaughtered all stability, no eyes could ever soak in all the places you anoint, and yet to see you all at once we only need the point. Flirting with infinity, your geometric progeny that fit inside you oh so tight with triangles that feel so right."
3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105820974944 59230781640628620899862803482534211706...
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Offline pyro-manic

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  • 210
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Screw that - I think ships themselves should burn. ;) You know when a ship gets down to critical hull strength (~30% IIRC) and they get that lightning arcing over the hull? Well, I think that there should be an option for ships to catch fire and burn. It'd basically be a new particle effect, I suppose, but it'd have to be bigger than the current one, and look really good. I have a mental image of a shot-up Orion limping away from an engagement whilst on fire from torpedo strikes...

It'd be cool if that was implemented with the destroyable chunks and smoke effects, and the hulk-death option, rather than always having a huge explosion followed by a few lumps of stuff shooting off at high speed. Would make for some amazing scenery and eye-candy, if nothing else.
Any fool can pull a trigger...

 

Offline Kosh

  • A year behind what's funny
  • 210
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Quote
the "bloom" effect


I played Deus Ex 2 with that option turned on for about 10 minutes and hated it. I couldn't see a damn thing.


Quote
I think ships themselves should burn.  You know when a ship gets down to critical hull strength (~30% IIRC) and they get that lightning arcing over the hull? Well, I think that there should be an option for ships to catch fire and burn.


Basicly like that Apollo in the FS1 intro?
"The reason for this is that the original Fortran got so convoluted and extensive (10's of millions of lines of code) that no-one can actually figure out how it works, there's a massive project going on to decode the original Fortran and write a more modern system, but until then, the UK communication network is actually relying heavily on 35 year old Fortran that nobody understands." - Flipside

Brain I/O error
Replace and press any key

 

Offline Turnsky

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cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Quote
Originally posted by Kosh


I played Deus Ex 2 with that option turned on for about 10 minutes and hated it. I couldn't see a damn thing.




Basicly like that Apollo in the FS1 intro?


DX2's bloom effect was overdone, something with a bit of subtlety to it would suffice, like the nacelle/deflector glows from ST, that sorta thing..

and i'm guessing yeah, traling a long plume of smoke from an engine instead of a thruster glow, i'm guessing.

okay, how's this one.. a more accessable active camoflage/cloaking system, i haven't heard anything about this for quite some time.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2004, 01:37:57 am by 86 »
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do not torment the sleep deprived artist, he may be vicious when cornered,
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Offline aldo_14

  • Gunnery Control
  • 213
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Quote
Originally posted by Turnsky
i do have another couple of ideas..

Since the SCP have so kindly implimented Skybox, i want to see somebody model an entire cityscape with it, say, the size of manhattan,  vasudan, and make it the fall of vasuda prime...


http://www.sectorgame.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1119

(why am I advertising other peoples campaigns?  Oh well, c'est la vie)

 
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Has anyone played "Space Interceptor:Project Freedom"? It´s a small but nifty little game. I heard one guy alone made it or something. Anyway, they have a great way how ships blow up. After the big boom, all that remains is a twisted, scorched heep of metal. Looks realy good. The hull doesn´t go flying off in little debris, it stays there, full of holes, smoking and *burning*. Maybe i should take a screeny of it...
And destroyable ship parts is what it should have been all along. Blowin´ up an engine, a nacelle, a wing, or whatever, would look and feel more realistic. Like blowing off a Sathanas arm, instead of just the tip. Or the Colossus breaking in half by the neck.
No Freespace 3 ?!? Oh, bugger...

 

Offline aldo_14

  • Gunnery Control
  • 213
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Quote
Originally posted by Swamp_Thing
Has anyone played "Space Interceptor:Project Freedom"? It´s a small but nifty little game. I heard one guy alone made it or something. Anyway, they have a great way how ships blow up. After the big boom, all that remains is a twisted, scorched heep of metal. Looks realy good. The hull doesn´t go flying off in little debris, it stays there, full of holes, smoking and *burning*. Maybe i should take a screeny of it...
And destroyable ship parts is what it should have been all along. Blowin´ up an engine, a nacelle, a wing, or whatever, would look and feel more realistic. Like blowing off a Sathanas arm, instead of just the tip. Or the Colossus breaking in half by the neck.


Both of those can be pretty much done already, though.

 

Offline Singh

  • Hasn't Accomplished Anything Special Or Notable
  • 211
  • Degrees of guilt.
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
A neat thing that may never happen: for cutscenes, how about simply removing the 'game' elements almost totally, and instead just using the Rendering engine to it's max.

The principle with most rendering engine is the same: have a camera, mod special effects into the hull as this light source travels here (which appears like a beam) to here.

However, in FS2 the game pretty much does that all for you. The rendering engine is there, the capabilities are there. All that is required is to further enhance FRED to incorporate the facilities, as well as FS2. For example: if a different version of FRED was created to make .fs2 (or maybe a different format alltogether) files with a 'cutscene' check in them, it would hold all the tools necessary to place and move around objects as you visualize it in a scene. Want a diemos to take a special path? Fly it around with the keyboard and have waypoints auto-generated as it moves. The camera would have it's own course. Lighting and effects could all be generated in-game, with only the placement of the main sun source and background nebula being an issue. Beam effects, weapons, engine glows everything is already generated in-game! SexPs could be used to trigger and time events, and the flexibility here for large-scale battles would be massive.

Once FS2 loads this file, rather than go into the game, it would go to a 'render' mode, where the output would be put frame-by-frame at the specified FPS or into an .avi movie format in a selected folder. The output would be viewable, and with all the ub3r features that FS2 is known for. It'd work quite a bit faster than most renders as well I wager, and it would also be ever-improving as the SCP guys add more and more stuff to it over the years, unlike most renderers now, which are pretty static.....
"Blessed be the FREDder that knows his sexps."
"Cursed be the FREDder that trusts FRED2_Open."
Dreamed of much, accomplished little. :(

 

Offline Lynx

  • 211
Re: cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Quote
Originally posted by Turnsky
large-destructable parts of warships.. (like blowing the "wings" off a hecate)


Already doable with Bobbau's non targetable subsystems.

Quote
engine flicker-multiple explosions- then burnt out derelect hulls, instead of having big lumps of debris floating hither and yon..
the "bloom" effect.. if you've played bridge commander, and halo2, etc.. you'll know what i'm talking about..


Dunno about the bloom, but the other stuff sounds good. Variable debris would be very cool, too, so that the ships don't always have the same debris...one capship explodes more or less totally, leaving only a few chunks behind, the other one leaves a burnt out hull behind.

Quote
transforming vessels..as well as swing-wing desgined.


Yeah moving parts would be cool for vector based engines(that means that the engine mounts are moveable to further increase the ships maneuveability)


Quote
in-engine, character-based cutscenes! (yes, like freelancer)


I could imagine that being incredibly hard to implement, but yeah it'd be cool, especially WCS could need something like that, otherwise the download size would be larger with prerendered cuscenes an all that.
Ther are free or abandoned  shooter engines out there that could be adapted and implementedfor that...Quake1 with source mods could do the job .


Quote
with debris, dead people to float about said debris.. like in starlancer.


That's one odd request. :wtf: And AFAIK the people in SL weren't dead but ejected pilots in their spacesuits



Quote
different huds, for different ships


Should be doable with WMC's HUD_gauges.tbl. What I'd like besides are HUD gauges that aren't restricted to the HUD color palette(I want a multicolored gun energy counter FFS!)

Quote
..  i know this may seem a little silly considering how well our current one works,


That's boubtful, IMO the FS HUD is one of the worst  HUDs I've seen in any space shooter/flight simulator. It's cluttered with useless stuff, is incredibly ineffective, and on the technical side it could use some work too:

The HUD transparency: I like to play with a deep blue HUD but due to the transparency I can't see **** most of the time because the background always shines through. The gun energy counter doesn't need to to be transparent because usually there isn't *anything of interest* behind it.

FS HUD uses multiple guages that could be combined into one without loosing information: A targeting VDU might be nice and fancy, but it serves no real purpose. All the information in it like ship type, name and health could be put over the shield indicator, the ship graphic in the shield indicator serves already the purpose of identifying the ship type(at least I know shipsfrom their silouettes), and it could change color according to damage status(green -nominal/ yellow-moderate damage/ red- heavy damage) and simply put the damage counter from the VDU in the middle of it if you want to know it exactly.
The same with that mini shield/HP icon. You already have a gauge that indicates all that info. Why do you need another one saying exactly the same?

Communication window/menue: You abviouly can't communicate while you receive a comm, so there's no need to spread those things over the HUD. I'd put them on th same place on the screen to save screen space.

That ring thing around the HUD: I don't know about the others, but I don't pay attention to any of the warning indicators there, I even only discovered them when working on the HUD. To me, they are useless andserve no other purpose than to block my view.

Speed gauge: Why do you need a large indcator going up and down when the speed changes? A single numerical counter in the edge of the screen does the same without blocking my frontal view.

weapon/afterburner energy counter: The same. Why fo they have to sit near the reticle? Visibility would be better if they were at he boreder of the screen left and right to the radar.

Kill counter: Useless. I can always check in the pilot room how many kills do I have.

See, the HUD is far from perfect.

Quote
a more diverse, and richer "universe" as far as freespace is concerned


Not sure if SCP can do that :p

Quote
the option to be able to upgrade/redesign your own fighter...? :nervous:


There should be borders..FS is a mission based space shooter and not Privateer. Too much freedom is not good for gameplay, the player needs certain leads/rextrictions.
If you give Joe Average the ability to do something stupid he does and complains afterwards.
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Offline vyper

  • 210
  • The Sexy Scotsman
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Plus the fact that last one would involve rewriting half the game.
"But you live, you learn.  Unless you die.  Then you're ****ed." - aldo14

 

Offline Roanoke

  • 210
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Usoing SEXPs and Model subsystems would allow  for v/g wings.

 

Offline FireCrack

  • 210
  • meh...
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
I love the Freespace hud, the VDU is essential for attacking cap ships, the warning indicators are esential in dogfights etc...

Mabye if you play at 800x600 it's cluttered but at 1024x786 the hud is fine.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2004, 01:50:26 pm by 2073 »
actualy, mabye not.
"When ink and pen in hands of men Inscribe your form, bipedal P They draw an altar on which God has slaughtered all stability, no eyes could ever soak in all the places you anoint, and yet to see you all at once we only need the point. Flirting with infinity, your geometric progeny that fit inside you oh so tight with triangles that feel so right."
3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105820974944 59230781640628620899862803482534211706...
"Your ever-constant homily says flaw is discipline, the patron saint of imperfection frees us from our sin. And if our transcendental lift shall find a final floor, then Man will know the death of God where wonder was before."

 

Offline NGTM-1R

  • I reject your reality and substitute my own
  • 213
  • Syndral Active. 0410.
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Frankly, I prefer the FS-styled HUD to that of any of the Wing Commander games or that of Starlancer. This is mainly because it's easier to keep track of your gun and afterburner energy states, because they're closer to the reticule, which is where you spend most of your time looking.
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Offline Turnsky

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cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
there's always streamlining the current HUD
y'know, use little icons instead of words for various things..  
have the power meters closer together.. or smaller/somewhere else.

you get the idea.
   //Warning\\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
do not torment the sleep deprived artist, he may be vicious when cornered,
in case of emergency, administer caffeine to the artist,
he will become docile after that,
and less likely to stab you in the eye with a mechanical pencil
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Offline Lynx

  • 211
cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
Yeah, liking the HUD is mainly a personal matter and you are all used to it....but think about it as if you see it for the first time. As said, there  areo two or even three gauges which tell you the same which is pointless, and some could be easily combined into one Gauge without loosing any information(likeshield counter+VDU data)
As for the stuff being close to the reticle, matter of taste, but I think all the elements should be on the screens borders, obstructing your view as less as possible.
To me, the ideal HUD would initially only have reticule, radar,  gun/afterburner energy, speed counter and weapon selection visible, the rest of the HUD gauges would be only activated by keypress, because you simply don't need them most of the time.

Quote
the VDU is essential for attacking cap ships


Not quite. The targeted subsystem has a bracket around it on the main screen, same as in the VDU(--->again, two gauges that tell you exactly the same). Only thing you'd need is a tiny readout which subsystem has been targeted, but you don't need a whole VDU just for that.
Give a man fire and he'll be warm for a day, but set fire to him and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

 

Offline aldo_14

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cool stuff and ideas that may not work.
VDU is useful if you can't see the ship you're attacking though; i.e. if you've just done a strafing run and want to set up to turn round.