Hard Light Productions Forums
Hosted Projects - FS2 Required => FreeSpace Conversion => Topic started by: Trivial Psychic on September 01, 2010, 08:25:22 pm
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I personally have never done this, but I came close once. I do know that some players have reported being able to successfully defend the Plato during Mission 5, which in effect breaks the mission. I haven't played the latest Port version, so I don't know if anything has been done with this or not. I recall some debate about how to solve this dilemma though. One was to simply have the Plato a self-destruct order if all the Shivans are destroyed. The second, would be to introduce a new threat into the mission which cannot be defended against, such as having a number of Basilisks jump in at medium range and with a good-secondary-time event and launch a volley of Phoenix against it, which cannot be intercepted. The third, would be to allow the Plato to escape in that event, but there is of course the issue of the event not corresponding to recorded messages. There is an option of recording new messages, but the voice wouldn't jive existing ones. In any case, if the mission were altered to allow the Plato escape if it is successfully defended, and giving a bonus objective, led to another thought of mine, that could give the player an advantage in a later mission.
Since the Plato was carrying the Avenger prototypes, it could be argued that if the Plato had survived, it might have expedited the Avenger's development, which could mean getting the Avenger one mission early. My thought was, if the player succeeds in the afore-mentioned bonus objective, allow only one avenger cannon for "Pandora's Box". I'm sure many of us wouldn't have minded having even one cannon for that mission. On top of that, add a bonus objective if the player can successfully destroy all Shivan fighters... and of course add a withdrawal order for the Taranis if its in danger of getting disabled/destroyed.
I doubt that the team would support such changes to the originals, but it's a cool thought.
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I think its a great idea, I would totally be down with that. If people are worried about changing canon, can't this be introduced as a small patch?
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The thing is, I'd count the Plato surviving in the FSPort as a bug, not a possible achievable goal. That thing went down like it was made of tissue paper in FS1. :p
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Am I the only one who thinks that the early Shivan missions are some of the most fun in the entire FS series, simply because you ARE woefully ill-equipped against a clearly more advanced foe?
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Am I the only one who thinks that the early Shivan missions are some of the most fun in the entire FS series, simply because you ARE woefully ill-equipped against a clearly more advanced foe?
And it also makes completing "impossible" objectives regardless all the more badass, and thus should be rewarded? Yes :P
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Yes, those were always so much fun. Just blowing one Scorpion out of the sky was the achievement of the century while using an ML-16 :lol:
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Problem is that, technically, you CAN'T defend the Plato. IIRC there is a self-destruct sexp triggered when it enters the node.
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Problem is that, technically, you CAN'T defend the Plato. IIRC there is a self-destruct sexp triggered when it enters the node.
Then it was added by the Port, because I have FS1 installed and I can get the Plato to the node alive. :P
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I'd go with the Basilisk + Phoenix solution. If you had a chance to defend the Plato, the Shivans' introduction wouldn't be as menacing as it would be with the Plato as a sure goner.
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I vote for optional patch that can be downloaded and applied where by the Plato can survive and warp out of the mission but you just get an added well done in the debrief explaing how having the reserch materials and manufacturing prototypes on board will help with the maufacturing of the weapon with no other effect.
this solves the issue of the plato not warping if it survives (which if it was done by some one in this community it would get picked up on as bad testing and or not allowing for the fact that some/many players will do things not in your script) and acknowlages this sucsess without a notable violation of canon. Also if memmory serves the player is not in a position to get special access to equipment.
I suggest this as a patch because
1. it does move slightly away from canon
2. it will be close to impossable to add the voice acting to the extra debrief stage and match it to the voice acting in place
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The thing is, I'd count the Plato surviving in the FSPort as a bug, not a possible achievable goal. That thing went down like it was made of tissue paper in FS1. :p
In the original FS1 I was able to defend the Plato. The trick is to hound the bombers and let your wingmen tangle with the scorpions.
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Yeah, and the fact you managed to do it doesn't mean you should be able to do it - just another example of a breakable retail mission.
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The thing is, I'd count the Plato surviving in the FSPort as a bug, not a possible achievable goal. That thing went down like it was made of tissue paper in FS1. :p
In the original FS1 I was able to defend the Plato. The trick is to hound the bombers and let your wingmen tangle with the scorpions.
I guess I do remember screwing it up once or twice by attacking the bombers, but I eventually learned to leave them well enough alone and let the mission proceed as planned. Like Matt said, it's fairly clear that :v: intended the thing to blow up as a display of Shivan power, so saving the thing winds up breaking the mission.
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Problem is that, technically, you CAN'T defend the Plato. IIRC there is a self-destruct sexp triggered when it enters the node.
Then it was added by the Port, because I have FS1 installed and I can get the Plato to the node alive. :P
Then you have to blow it up yourself ¬.¬
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Then you have to blow it up yourself ¬.¬
Nah, I still had Shivan bombers running around after 15 minutes, had to rearm, Plato got blown up. You have to be extremely sparing in the use of your secondaries to keep the Plato alive since the AI doesn't really react to ML-16 or disruptor fire, so you have to herd the bombers around with Furies.
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Oh..from your comments..
heh.. nevermind.
Normally if I'm going all out I've killed all the shivans by the time the Plato gets to the jump node :\
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I vote for optional patch that can be downloaded and applied where by the Plato can survive and warp out of the mission but you just get an added well done in the debrief explaing how having the reserch materials and manufacturing prototypes on board will help with the maufacturing of the weapon with no other effect.
this solves the issue of the plato not warping if it survives (which if it was done by some one in this community it would get picked up on as bad testing and or not allowing for the fact that some/many players will do things not in your script) and acknowlages this sucsess without a notable violation of canon. Also if memmory serves the player is not in a position to get special access to equipment.
I suggest this as a patch because
1. it does move slightly away from canon
2. it will be close to impossable to add the voice acting to the extra debrief stage and match it to the voice acting in place
Yeah... no. this is definitely not going to happen. If we were to do anything to that mission it would probably be giving the Shivans A-1 SOOPAR weapons. and even that's a zero to half-slim chance.
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I think that "thou shalt not tamper with canon missions" sums up my view. A self-destruct sexp would be my choice... but that's tempering with canon missions! GAH! In either case, the Plato must die! I remember that mission being one of the most iconic when I first played FS, the whole "first contact with a new enemy that ****S YOU UP!" Besides, if we get the avenger early... I dunno, I don't like the idea. Takes a way from that feeling of desperation in the first few shivan fighting missions.
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I remember when I was about 10, I tried the Plato mission apox. 50 times not knowing that the survival of the Plato was Impossible. Congratulations Volition, you wasted 4 hours of my childhood. :(
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I also managed once to guard the damn thing and all it did was waiting for its doom at the node and I was like "jump the **** out you dumb mother****er!!!! :mad: :hopping:"
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The highest goal is not to let the Plato jump at node,the escape pods have to jump...
....with the scientists and the avenger prototypes. :nod:
I use a Valkyrie interceptor with Fury missiles and as primary ML-16 and disruptorguns to kill hostile Vasudans....
.....inclusive 1 Scorpion(not listed as a kill) as bonus.
Peter
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Looking at the poll again, I can't help but wonder what the point of options #3 and #5 was.
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It was mainly for comic effect. Note, you could chose 2 options out of the list.
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The Shivans are the Great Destroyers! All Will Tremble!
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The Shivans are the Great Destroyers! All Will Tremble!
Also the Great Preservers, we owe them our lives!
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#4 got as many votes as all other options put together (which is understandable, BTW)...