Poll

In an all out war (WITHOUT the Flood), who do you think would win?  If you think two factions would join forces, feel free to select them.

UNSC
Covenant
GTVA
Shivans

Author Topic: HALO vs FreeSpace  (Read 68348 times)

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Offline Qent

  • 29
If you contradict with that, and refuse to believe that there's a larger Shivan force than the Juggernaut fleet, you'll have to believe that the Shivans were barbarians, running from galaxy to galaxy to find empires to destroy.
Um, no we don't. How did you reach that conclusion? :wtf: Counterexample: The Shivans' having only 80 Saths is also consistent with the Capellan Barbecue Theory.

 

Offline Marcov

  • Chicken Little
  • 29
  • My Sig Is Spam
If you contradict with that, and refuse to believe that there's a larger Shivan force than the Juggernaut fleet, you'll have to believe that the Shivans were barbarians, running from galaxy to galaxy to find empires to destroy.
Um, no we don't. How did you reach that conclusion? :wtf: Counterexample: The Shivans' having only 80 Saths is also consistent with the Capellan Barbecue Theory.

There are several theories and evidences that lead to it. As I said, Admiral Petrarch speculated that the Saths were supposed to return to their Home System, which, in theory, would be home to a much, much bigger group of Shivan ships and planets.

The Ancients were supposed to have also been destroyed by hundreds of Lucifer-class vessels, and each could be stopped in subspace. However, the Ancients failed to do this, leading to the destruction of their race.
With the rapid increase of FS fan-made campaigns, we're giving the GTVA a harder time with more violence and genocide.

~FreeSpace: The Battle of Endor (voice dub)~
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9K9-Y1JBTE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtQanXDRAXM
Part 3/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoBLKYt_oG0

Old (original) videos:
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1ygskaoUtE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0uoPTksBlI

 

Offline Qent

  • 29
If you contradict with that, and refuse to believe that there's a larger Shivan force than the Juggernaut fleet, you'll have to believe that the Shivans were barbarians, running from galaxy to galaxy to find empires to destroy.
Um, no we don't. How did you reach that conclusion? :wtf: Counterexample: The Shivans' having only 80 Saths is also consistent with the Capellan Barbecue Theory.

There are several theories and evidences that lead to it. As I said, Admiral Petrarch speculated that the Saths were supposed to return to their Home System...
Admiral Petrarch's speculation is not evidence. At most it's evidence that :v: had a few ideas for a maybe-sequel, but that's all in the meta, not canon.

... which, in theory, would be home to a much, much bigger group of Shivan ships and planets.
It's also possible that their home system is currently abandoned because their whole civilization went into space.

The Ancients were supposed to have also been destroyed by hundreds of Lucifer-class vessels, and each could be stopped in subspace. However, the Ancients failed to do this, leading to the destruction of their race.
The Ancients never said that there were hundreds of Lucifers. They didn't even mention one! They only said that Shivans have shields. Besides, how does that make Shivans barbarians? From the Ancients' description of themselves, the Shivans probably did the other species in the universe a great service.

Your theories are nice and all, but saying that "we know" things like the Sathanas's being a transport and that "we have to believe," there's "evidence" for so-and-so, etc. is a bit of a stretch, don't you think?

Maybe I'm taking this WAAAAY too seriously. :nervous:

 

Offline Jeff Vader

  • The Back of the Hero!
  • 212
  • Bwahaha
Interesting speculation and discussion can be interesting. But if there is no concrete canon information, one cannot simply make statements like "we all know..." and "this is how things are...", but should rather use phrases like "in my humble opinion..." or "it might be possible...". Examples:

We all know that the Shivans have an extremely large Empire, and that the Sathanas fleet was just a small group of armed transports.
No, we don't know that. We can speculate that this is how it could be, but it is equally possible that, for example, the ~80 Saths and all the other Shivan ships present during the events of FS2 were the very last of the Shivans.
And how do we know that they're an "empire"?
Also, the Saths might be transports, if the supernova thing did indeed create some supernode. But it is equally possible, that they are tools for creating supernovas and that creating supernovas serves some completely unrelated purpose.

If you contradict with that, and refuse to believe that there's a larger Shivan force than the Juggernaut fleet, you'll have to believe that the Shivans were barbarians, running from galaxy to galaxy to find empires to destroy.
There's more speculation in the games about the theory that the Shivans specifically target advanced and potentially dangerous civilizations that have mastered the use of subspace to at least some extent. I'd hardly call that barbaric. Then again, in both cases there is strong lack of hard canon facts. Nothing states how things are straight in your face.

The Ancients were supposed to have also been destroyed by hundreds of Lucifer-class vessels, and each could be stopped in subspace. However, the Ancients failed to do this, leading to the destruction of their race.
As it was already said, no one in the games ever stated that there were hundreds of Lucifers beating up the Ancients. The Ancients encountered an advanced species flying ships that the Ancients could not harm. Based on the events of the games, it is rather safe to assume that that species was the Shivans.

The Shivans beat up the Ancients, but that doesn't necessarily demand an overly large assault force. If you can't harm them, there need not be too many of them. Possibly there was a Lucifer and a large amount of fighters and bombers, based on the fact that the Ancient monologues stated that the Shivans could not be harmed and as far as we currently know, the Lucifer is the only shielded Shivan capital ship. That might imply that there were no other Shivan capital ships fighting the Shivans. Or it might also be that there were, but the Ancients never got close enough to discover that those capital ships would be vulnerable.

Also, the Ancients did indeed discover that the Shivans were vulnerable in subspace. Unfortunately they made this discovery at a point where most of their empire was gone and the few survivors merely tried to avoid the inevitable end of their race.
23:40 < achillion > EveningTea: ass
23:40 < achillion > wait no
23:40 < achillion > evilbagel: ass
23:40 < EveningTea > ?
23:40 < achillion > 2-letter tab complete failure

14:08 < achillion > there's too much talk of butts and dongs in here
14:08 < achillion > the level of discourse has really plummeted
14:08 < achillion > Let's talk about politics instead
14:08 <@The_E > butts and dongs are part of #hard-light's brand now
14:08 <@The_E > well
14:08 <@The_E > EvilBagel's brand, at least

01:06 < T-Rog > welp
01:07 < T-Rog > I've got to take some very strong antibiotics
01:07 < achillion > penis infection?
01:08 < T-Rog > Chlamydia
01:08 < achillion > O.o
01:09 < achillion > well
01:09 < achillion > I guess that happens
01:09 < T-Rog > at least it's curable
01:09 < achillion > yeah
01:10 < T-Rog > I take it you weren't actually expecting it to be a penis infection
01:10 < achillion > I was not

14:04 < achillion > Sometimes the way to simplify is to just have a habit and not think about it too much
14:05 < achillion > until stuff explodes
14:05 < achillion > then you start thinking about it

22:16 < T-Rog > I don't know how my gf would feel about Jewish conspiracy porn

15:41 <-INFO > EveningTea [[email protected]] has joined #hard-light
15:47 < EvilBagel> butt
15:51 < Achillion> yes
15:53 <-INFO > EveningTea [[email protected]] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client]

18:53 < Achillion> Dicks are fun

21:41 < MatthTheGeek> you can't spell assassin without two asses

20:05 < sigtau> i'm mining titcoins from now on

00:31 < oldlaptop> Drunken antisocial educated freezing hicks with good Internet == Finland stereotype

11:46 <-INFO > Kobrar [[email protected]] has joined #hard-light
11:50 < achtung> Surely you've heard of DVDA
11:50 < achtung> Double Vaginal Double ANal
11:51 < Kobrar> ...
11:51 <-INFO > Kobrar [[email protected]] has left #hard-light []

 

Offline Marcov

  • Chicken Little
  • 29
  • My Sig Is Spam
Interesting speculation and discussion can be interesting. But if there is no concrete canon information, one cannot simply make statements like "we all know..." and "this is how things are...", but should rather use phrases like "in my humble opinion..." or "it might be possible...". Examples:

No, we don't know that. We can speculate that this is how it could be, but it is equally possible that, for example, the ~80 Saths and all the other Shivan ships present during the events of FS2 were the very last of the Shivans.
And how do we know that they're an "empire"?

It isn't possible that the Sathanas fleet represented the entire Shivan race. The Ancients encountered much, much more Lucifer-class warships (OK, possibly not exactly "Lucifers", but similar, shielded warships) that could also be another part of their armada.

All right, maybe I used the wrong term ("empire"), well, I was referring to their "race".

Also, the Saths might be transports, if the supernova thing did indeed create some supernode. But it is equally possible, that they are tools for creating supernovas and that creating supernovas serves some completely unrelated purpose.

Fine, you've made your point. Seems that I'd been having some grammar problems.

There's more speculation in the games about the theory that the Shivans specifically target advanced and potentially dangerous civilizations that have mastered the use of subspace to at least some extent. I'd hardly call that barbaric. Then again, in both cases there is strong lack of hard canon facts. Nothing states how things are straight in your face.

It is a canonical theory that the Shivans were "cosmic destroyers", so I'm calling that barbaric. Destroying a race for no reason would be called retarded and thus, my term "barbaric".


As it was already said, no one in the games ever stated that there were hundreds of Lucifers beating up the Ancients. The Ancients encountered an advanced species flying ships that the Ancients could not harm. Based on the events of the games, it is rather safe to assume that that species was the Shivans.

Use your common sense. If they weren't Lucifers, they were similar, shielded warships that the Ancients couldn't harm, except for subspace battles. Remeber, the Ancients were, by a small amount, more advanced than the Terrans and Vasudans.

The Shivans beat up the Ancients, but that doesn't necessarily demand an overly large assault force. If you can't harm them, there need not be too many of them. Possibly there was a Lucifer and a large amount of fighters and bombers, based on the fact that the Ancient monologues stated that the Shivans could not be harmed and as far as we currently know, the Lucifer is the only shielded Shivan capital ship. That might imply that there were no other Shivan capital ships fighting the Shivans. Or it might also be that there were, but the Ancients never got close enough to discover that those capital ships would be vulnerable.

The Ancients described the Shivans as a "plague that can be harmed". So we could imply that the Shivans had a "plague" of Lucifers that could be harmed in subspace. Your statement about the Ancients never getting close to discover the Shivans' vulnerability is quite confusing. Wasn't it said in the cutscenes, "the destroyers darkened are skies like a plague that can be HARMED"?

Also, the Ancients did indeed discover that the Shivans were vulnerable in subspace. Unfortunately they made this discovery at a point where most of their empire was gone and the few survivors merely tried to avoid the inevitable end of their race.

This is exactly my point.

Look, I apologize for mistaking my theory as a fact. However, there's a gap between theory and common sense. You are obviously debating hard canon facts, but there are times when you'll need to assume the unmentioned. For example, isn't it perfectly logical that the Shivans probably used ships similar to Lucy's (with shields, etc.)? This isn't canon, but as I said, use your common sense.
With the rapid increase of FS fan-made campaigns, we're giving the GTVA a harder time with more violence and genocide.

~FreeSpace: The Battle of Endor (voice dub)~
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9K9-Y1JBTE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtQanXDRAXM
Part 3/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoBLKYt_oG0

Old (original) videos:
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1ygskaoUtE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0uoPTksBlI

 

Offline Jeff Vader

  • The Back of the Hero!
  • 212
  • Bwahaha
I can do this again. It's the choice of words I'm after here.

It isn't possible that the Sathanas fleet represented the entire Shivan race.
It is as possible as it is that they returned to their home through the Capella supernova. Possible, not an absolute truth.

The Ancients encountered much, much more Lucifer-class warships (OK, possibly not exactly "Lucifers", but similar, shielded warships)
Again, possible but not a fact, not a truth. Can be used in speculation ("I do think that the Ancients encountered several shielded capital ships") but can't be claimed as a fact ("The Ancients did encounter several shielded capital ships").

It is a canonical theory that the Shivans were "cosmic destroyers", so I'm calling that barbaric. Destroying a race for no reason would be called retarded and thus, my term "barbaric".
It is also canonical that the Shivans attacked the Ancients, who were a rather advanced race that had been conquering the galaxy mercilessly. A "barbaric" approach would have been to attack anything they came across, not just the Ancients.
It is also canonical that the Shivans attacked the Terrans and the Vasudans, who were rather advanced races that had been waging war with each other for 14 years. It is entirely possible that, without the Shivans, that war might have eventually destroyed or at least ruined both races.
It is entirely possible that "The Shivans are the great destroyers but they are also the great preservers". They destroy races that are too advanced for their own good, thus preserving lesser races.

Use your common sense. If they weren't Lucifers, they were similar, shielded warships that the Ancients couldn't harm
Again, very possible but not a fact. If the Lucifer paved way with smaller craft, the Ancients might have been running low on morale, eventually abandoning all ideas regarding fighting them and then they could have been hunted by other, unshielded capital ships.

The Ancients described the Shivans as a "plague that can be harmed". So we could imply that the Shivans had a "plague" of Lucifers that could be harmed in subspace. Your statement about the Ancients never getting close to discover the Shivans' vulnerability is quite confusing. Wasn't it said in the cutscenes, "the destroyers darkened are skies like a plague that can be HARMED"?
Quoting is good only when it's accurate: "They are like the others. Strange, hideous, resisting, fighting. Only these were not like the others. They did not die."
"The destroyers that darkened our skies like a plague can be harmed. But we have no way to deliver the hurt."
What I was stating was this:
- the Shivans attack the Ancients
- possibly only the Lucifer (and fine, yes, possibly several Lucifer-class ships) with fighters and bombers engage the Ancients in direct battle
- the Ancients take note that the attacking ships are shielded
- possibly there are Shivan cruisers or even destroyers somewhere, but the Ancients cannot engage them, because the shielded fighters, bombers and Lucifer(s) are already beating the crap out of them
- thus, the Ancients fail to notice that some Shivan ships could be harmed in direct combat

And it is also possible that the Ancient monologues neglected to mention that some Shivan ships were unshielded and could be harmed. And why not? Many ships still remained shielded and even if the Ancients could have taken some ships out, they couldn't stop a Lucifer. Or fighters/bombers.

On my part, this speculation was supposed to be completely irrelevant to the fact that at some point, the Ancients discovered that shields did not work in subspace.

You are obviously debating hard canon facts, but there are times when you'll need to assume the unmentioned. For example, isn't it perfectly logical that the Shivans probably used ships similar to Lucy's (with shields, etc.)? This isn't canon, but as I said, use your common sense.
As I said, speculation can be interesting indeed. But the choice of words. Saying "This is how things are..." gives the impression that you (think you) know better, even without canon information and facts. And that can be perceived as arrogant. If you say "This is how things could be in my theory..." immediately should raise thoughts in other people. Thoughts like "Hmm. Your theory indeed sounds interesting, and I'm going to present some counter-arguments based on my own thoughts about the matter.", followed by some very lively discussion.

Choice of words.
23:40 < achillion > EveningTea: ass
23:40 < achillion > wait no
23:40 < achillion > evilbagel: ass
23:40 < EveningTea > ?
23:40 < achillion > 2-letter tab complete failure

14:08 < achillion > there's too much talk of butts and dongs in here
14:08 < achillion > the level of discourse has really plummeted
14:08 < achillion > Let's talk about politics instead
14:08 <@The_E > butts and dongs are part of #hard-light's brand now
14:08 <@The_E > well
14:08 <@The_E > EvilBagel's brand, at least

01:06 < T-Rog > welp
01:07 < T-Rog > I've got to take some very strong antibiotics
01:07 < achillion > penis infection?
01:08 < T-Rog > Chlamydia
01:08 < achillion > O.o
01:09 < achillion > well
01:09 < achillion > I guess that happens
01:09 < T-Rog > at least it's curable
01:09 < achillion > yeah
01:10 < T-Rog > I take it you weren't actually expecting it to be a penis infection
01:10 < achillion > I was not

14:04 < achillion > Sometimes the way to simplify is to just have a habit and not think about it too much
14:05 < achillion > until stuff explodes
14:05 < achillion > then you start thinking about it

22:16 < T-Rog > I don't know how my gf would feel about Jewish conspiracy porn

15:41 <-INFO > EveningTea [[email protected]] has joined #hard-light
15:47 < EvilBagel> butt
15:51 < Achillion> yes
15:53 <-INFO > EveningTea [[email protected]] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client]

18:53 < Achillion> Dicks are fun

21:41 < MatthTheGeek> you can't spell assassin without two asses

20:05 < sigtau> i'm mining titcoins from now on

00:31 < oldlaptop> Drunken antisocial educated freezing hicks with good Internet == Finland stereotype

11:46 <-INFO > Kobrar [[email protected]] has joined #hard-light
11:50 < achtung> Surely you've heard of DVDA
11:50 < achtung> Double Vaginal Double ANal
11:51 < Kobrar> ...
11:51 <-INFO > Kobrar [[email protected]] has left #hard-light []

 

Offline General Battuta

  • Poe's Law In Action
  • 214
  • i wonder when my postcount will exceed my iq
JeffVader is right. Marcov, you're overreaching with your confidence levels here.

 

Offline Marcov

  • Chicken Little
  • 29
  • My Sig Is Spam
It is as possible as it is that they returned to their home through the Capella supernova. Possible, not an absolute truth.

Look, I'll say this a second time; I'm not necessarily arguing on whether what's fact or not, I'm arguing on this that are highly possible. I don't care whether you call it a fact or not, I'm not arguing fact-or-fiction here. I'm arguing about something that is logically correct, and thus can be true. I've shown some heavy evidence to prove it. Ultimately, yes, I'm arguing my theory. I'm trying to state that there are hard evidences that support my theory.


Again, possible but not a fact, not a truth. Can be used in speculation ("I do think that the Ancients encountered several shielded capital ships") but can't be claimed as a fact ("The Ancients did encounter several shielded capital ships").

I never said anything about my statements being a fact. If so, I already explained that it was misuse of grammar. But heavy, sensible evidence supports my theory.


It is also canonical that the Shivans attacked the Ancients, who were a rather advanced race that had been conquering the galaxy mercilessly. A "barbaric" approach would have been to attack anything they came across, not just the Ancients.
It is also canonical that the Shivans attacked the Terrans and the Vasudans, who were rather advanced races that had been waging war with each other for 14 years. It is entirely possible that, without the Shivans, that war might have eventually destroyed or at least ruined both races.
It is entirely possible that "The Shivans are the great destroyers but they are also the great preservers". They destroy races that are too advanced for their own good, thus preserving lesser races.

Yes, I know that. I didn't exactly mean that the Shivans were "entirely evil", but that they were DESTROYERS. They wiped out empires for unknown reasons. Barbarians don't attack anyone that passes by. For example, Attila the Hun focused on destroying his enemies, not noecessarily everyone he knows.



Again, very possible but not a fact. If the Lucifer paved way with smaller craft, the Ancients might have been running low on morale, eventually abandoning all ideas regarding fighting them and then they could have been hunted by other, unshielded capital ships.

Again, I'm not proving things whether they are fact or not, rather I'm trying to give evidence that supports my theory.

Quoting is good only when it's accurate: "They are like the others. Strange, hideous, resisting, fighting. Only these were not like the others. They did not die."
"The destroyers that darkened our skies like a plague can be harmed. But we have no way to deliver the hurt."
What I was stating was this:
- the Shivans attack the Ancients
- possibly only the Lucifer (and fine, yes, possibly several Lucifer-class ships) with fighters and bombers engage the Ancients in direct battle
- the Ancients take note that the attacking ships are shielded
- possibly there are Shivan cruisers or even destroyers somewhere, but the Ancients cannot engage them, because the shielded fighters, bombers and Lucifer(s) are already beating the crap out of them
- thus, the Ancients fail to notice that some Shivan ships could be harmed in direct combat

And it is also possible that the Ancient monologues neglected to mention that some Shivan ships were unshielded and could be harmed. And why not? Many ships still remained shielded and even if the Ancients could have taken some ships out, they couldn't stop a Lucifer. Or fighters/bombers.

Again, use your common sense. Why would the Ancients dramatize something they already expect? Why include something you're already used to into an epic poem that explains how hideous and potent your opponent is? They're most probably trying to state that there was a WAY, one desperate way, in which they could damage their greatest fear (as I said, this fear is probably the impenetrable Lucifers).


As I said, speculation can be interesting indeed. But the choice of words. Saying "This is how things are..." gives the impression that you (think you) know better, even without canon information and facts. And that can be perceived as arrogant. If you say "This is how things could be in my theory..." immediately should raise thoughts in other people. Thoughts like "Hmm. Your theory indeed sounds interesting, and I'm going to present some counter-arguments based on my own thoughts about the matter.", followed by some very lively discussion.

Choice of words.

Fine. Call me an impolite person. I already said that I used the wrong grammar in supporting my theory. All I'm saying is that there are numerous, credible evidences that prove that my theory is (OK, so you won't call me "arrogant" again) quite sensible.
With the rapid increase of FS fan-made campaigns, we're giving the GTVA a harder time with more violence and genocide.

~FreeSpace: The Battle of Endor (voice dub)~
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9K9-Y1JBTE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtQanXDRAXM
Part 3/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoBLKYt_oG0

Old (original) videos:
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1ygskaoUtE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0uoPTksBlI

 

Offline General Battuta

  • Poe's Law In Action
  • 214
  • i wonder when my postcount will exceed my iq
Your theory is as plausible as any number of others.

 

Offline Jeff Vader

  • The Back of the Hero!
  • 212
  • Bwahaha
Fine. Call me an impolite person. I already said that I used the wrong grammar in supporting my theory. All I'm saying is that there are numerous, credible evidences that prove that my theory is (OK, so you won't call me "arrogant" again) quite sensible.
Right, thank you. This is what I was after. If you remember that you only have a theory and express your thoughts like that, everybody's gonna be happy.

Again, use your common sense. Why would the Ancients dramatize something they already expect? Why include something you're already used to into an epic poem that explains how hideous and potent your opponent is? They're most probably trying to state that there was a WAY, one desperate way, in which they could damage their greatest fear (as I said, this fear is probably the impenetrable Lucifers).
Again, I was not exactly talking about the "shield no work in subspace" revelation, but rather about the Ancients fighting the Shivans. The Shivans didn't necessarily need many shielded capital ships. Take a Lucifer, or a few, then some fighters and bombers, then throw in some unshielded capital ships. Maybe the Ancients found out that some capital ships could be damaged. But if there is a decent amount of shielded ships, regardless of their numbers, what were they gonna do?

Yes, I know that. I didn't exactly mean that the Shivans were "entirely evil", but that they were DESTROYERS. They wiped out empires for unknown reasons. Barbarians don't attack anyone that passes by. For example, Attila the Hun focused on destroying his enemies, not noecessarily everyone he knows.
Indeed we do not know the reasons behind the Shivans' motives. But we can speculate.
a) Perhaps they did what the cutscenes implied: maintained the balance of power, prevented civilizations from getting too powerful. Much like the Inhibitors in Alastair Reynolds' Revelation Space universe.
b) Perhaps they had some completely mysterious motives.
c) PERHAPS they did it for no reason.
I still prefer to keep my own personal belief that it was a). Not saying you're wrong: just saying.

And this is how presenting theories works: you present your theory, maybe some evidence, then other people are quite free to participate and say "Nah, x could also be soandso and y could also be yaddayadda". The art of argumentation.
23:40 < achillion > EveningTea: ass
23:40 < achillion > wait no
23:40 < achillion > evilbagel: ass
23:40 < EveningTea > ?
23:40 < achillion > 2-letter tab complete failure

14:08 < achillion > there's too much talk of butts and dongs in here
14:08 < achillion > the level of discourse has really plummeted
14:08 < achillion > Let's talk about politics instead
14:08 <@The_E > butts and dongs are part of #hard-light's brand now
14:08 <@The_E > well
14:08 <@The_E > EvilBagel's brand, at least

01:06 < T-Rog > welp
01:07 < T-Rog > I've got to take some very strong antibiotics
01:07 < achillion > penis infection?
01:08 < T-Rog > Chlamydia
01:08 < achillion > O.o
01:09 < achillion > well
01:09 < achillion > I guess that happens
01:09 < T-Rog > at least it's curable
01:09 < achillion > yeah
01:10 < T-Rog > I take it you weren't actually expecting it to be a penis infection
01:10 < achillion > I was not

14:04 < achillion > Sometimes the way to simplify is to just have a habit and not think about it too much
14:05 < achillion > until stuff explodes
14:05 < achillion > then you start thinking about it

22:16 < T-Rog > I don't know how my gf would feel about Jewish conspiracy porn

15:41 <-INFO > EveningTea [[email protected]] has joined #hard-light
15:47 < EvilBagel> butt
15:51 < Achillion> yes
15:53 <-INFO > EveningTea [[email protected]] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client]

18:53 < Achillion> Dicks are fun

21:41 < MatthTheGeek> you can't spell assassin without two asses

20:05 < sigtau> i'm mining titcoins from now on

00:31 < oldlaptop> Drunken antisocial educated freezing hicks with good Internet == Finland stereotype

11:46 <-INFO > Kobrar [[email protected]] has joined #hard-light
11:50 < achtung> Surely you've heard of DVDA
11:50 < achtung> Double Vaginal Double ANal
11:51 < Kobrar> ...
11:51 <-INFO > Kobrar [[email protected]] has left #hard-light []

 

Offline Marcov

  • Chicken Little
  • 29
  • My Sig Is Spam
Back to MAC firepower.

Correct me if I'm wrong:

The Fusion Mortar deals 80 damage and, comparing it to the MX-50, it probably deals around 40 Kilotons.

So we're going to use this formula to determine how much kilotons the Harbinger yields.
The Harbinger deals 3,200 damage. So divide 3,200 by 80 = gives you 40. So 40 X 40 Kilotons = 1600 Kilotons, or 1.6 Megatons.

But the Harbinger was stated to be FIVE THOUSAND MEGATONS! So 5000 divided by 1.6 = 3,125.
Now we'll use this formula to find out how much yield it takes to destroy a Sathanas.

If we had a bomb that deals 1,000,000 damage, what would be its actual yield? If we do simple math, 1,000,000 divided by 3,200 is 312. 312 X 5,000 = 1.56 Gigatons. But, to make it more accurate, we'll multiple it by 3,125 (see above). That makes 4,875. It took 4,875 TERATONS or nearly FIVE PETATONS to destroy a Sathanas!!!

Mac Gun? 1.17 Teratons.

Again, correct me if I'm wrong.
With the rapid increase of FS fan-made campaigns, we're giving the GTVA a harder time with more violence and genocide.

~FreeSpace: The Battle of Endor (voice dub)~
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9K9-Y1JBTE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtQanXDRAXM
Part 3/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoBLKYt_oG0

Old (original) videos:
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1ygskaoUtE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0uoPTksBlI

 

Offline Qent

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What is your argument for damage being directly proportional to tons of TNT?

 

Offline The E

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Quote
So we're going to use this formula to determine how much kilotons the Harbinger yields.
The Harbinger deals 3,200 damage. So divide 3,200 by 80 = gives you 40. So 40 X 40 Kilotons = 1600 Kilotons, or 1.6 Megatons.

But the Harbinger was stated to be FIVE THOUSAND MEGATONS! So 5000 divided by 1.6 = 3,125.
Now we'll use this formula to find out how much yield it takes to destroy a Sathanas.

What does this 3,125 value signify?

(Also: Ridiculous discussion is ridiculous)
If I'm just aching this can't go on
I came from chasing dreams to feel alone
There must be changes, miss to feel strong
I really need lifе to touch me
--Evergrey, Where August Mourns

 

Offline Marcov

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What does this 3,125 value signify?

(Also: Ridiculous discussion is ridiculous)

3,125 signifies the difference between the yield of a bomb proportional to its damage and the yield of a bomb proportional to the Harbinger and the Fusion Mortar's yields.

For example, the Harbinger bomb has a far bigger yield what you'd calculate based on the damage (which will only get you up to 1.6 Megatons), so we're doing the same thing with a bomb that does 1,000,000 damage (enough to destroy a Sathanas).
With the rapid increase of FS fan-made campaigns, we're giving the GTVA a harder time with more violence and genocide.

~FreeSpace: The Battle of Endor (voice dub)~
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9K9-Y1JBTE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtQanXDRAXM
Part 3/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoBLKYt_oG0

Old (original) videos:
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1ygskaoUtE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0uoPTksBlI

 

Offline Aardwolf

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What units are these in? Dimensional analysis ftw.

 

Offline Marcov

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What units are these in? Dimensional analysis ftw.

What? Megatons.

I was just stating a fact that based on my calcs, I figured out that it took about 5 Petatons (5,000 teratons) to destroy a Sathanas.

So how on Earth would a MAC gun be able to do significant damage on a Shivan juggernaut?

And, lol, the Flood themselves won't be able to affect the cybernetic Shivans.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2010, 11:25:15 pm by Marcov »
With the rapid increase of FS fan-made campaigns, we're giving the GTVA a harder time with more violence and genocide.

~FreeSpace: The Battle of Endor (voice dub)~
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9K9-Y1JBTE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtQanXDRAXM
Part 3/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoBLKYt_oG0

Old (original) videos:
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1ygskaoUtE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0uoPTksBlI

 

Offline General Battuta

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What units are these in? Dimensional analysis ftw.

What? Megatons.

I was just stating a fact that based on my calcs, I figured out that it took about 5 Petatons (5,000 teratons) to destroy a Sathanas.

So how on Earth would a MAC gun be able to do significant damage on a Shivan juggernaut?

And, lol, the Flood themselves won't be able to affect the cybernetic Shivans.

The Shivans are actually a fusion of biological and technological components.

 

Offline Marcov

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The Shivans are actually a fusion of biological and technological components.

So this means they can be infected by the Flood?

They seem immune to diseases, though. Would you imagine a Shivan having colds?
With the rapid increase of FS fan-made campaigns, we're giving the GTVA a harder time with more violence and genocide.

~FreeSpace: The Battle of Endor (voice dub)~
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9K9-Y1JBTE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtQanXDRAXM
Part 3/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoBLKYt_oG0

Old (original) videos:
Part 1/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1ygskaoUtE
Part 2/4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0uoPTksBlI

 

Offline Mongoose

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I know I wouldn't want to be in the vicinity if one had to blow its nose.

 

Offline Scotty

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They seem immune to diseases, though. Would you imagine a Shivan having colds?

[Citation Needed]

Find proof, and it might have a leg to stand on.  Until then, it's safer to assume they can be infected.