Hard Light Productions Forums
Hosted Projects - FS2 Required => FreeSpace Conversion => Topic started by: Tarvis on December 07, 2009, 06:47:38 pm
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To be honest, some things (such as the lead indicator, for example) came out badly when scaled up for sparky_hi_fs1.vp.
So, I'm re-doing most HUD elements to look better.
So far I've got:
-Lead Indicator
-Crosshair
Here's a before and after comparison.
Before:
(http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/8996/beforecrosshair.png)(http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/8157/beforelead.png)
After:
(http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/5748/aftercrosshair.png)(http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/9884/afterlead.png)
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Oh nice.
Now we just need the widescreen issues fixed.
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Oh nice.
Now we just need the widescreen issues fixed.
I don't think that's something that can be fixed with graphic replacements, but perhaps a hud_guages.tbl can be made for widescreen resolutions.
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Probably not, but it's an old enough problem especially with reticles being off to the side.
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As long as you religiously keep to the originals (as it appears you have) I'd love to play with these.
I play the FSPort in 1280x720 resolution, and while it looks great for the most part, some of the HUD elements are obviously pixelated. Some of that is just the resolution, but a bit is because it's original FS1 art.
I'm far from complaining, excellent job of them for getting that HUD in the game. The new Port version is so great I don't even run it as a MOD anymore, I just have a Descent Freespace folder in c:/games/
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I like.
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Sweet Jesus, that's great.
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Before:
(http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/8996/beforecrosshair.png)(http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/8157/beforelead.png)
After:
(http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/5748/aftercrosshair.png)(http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/9884/afterlead.png)
Nicely done. :):yes:
Although you should know that widescreen coordinate issues are not something the Port has any control over. Those are FSO's department.
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Wonderful, we truly appreciate this. Post the source files and we'll put them in FSPort 3.2 SVN.
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Nice work.
Heh, I actually liked the pixellated look. It seemed more... how to say, immersive? Like you were flying a more primitive ship.
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I know I'm flying a more primitive ship in a more primitive time when I can fly up to a warship and not worry about getting slaughtered by various "new fangled" weapons. :D
Of course even the lasers on the Cain can be quite a nuisance on higher difficulty levels.
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Wonderful, we truly appreciate this. Post the source files and we'll put them in FSPort 3.2 SVN.
I'm going to wait before I do some more so I have a more complete package to give.
I could also do graphics for the low-resolution menus (So far they seem to be FS2's default) and fix some of the offsets for the mainhall screens. (Notably the Bastion's main hall in high-res mode displays animations a pixel or so down and right of where they should go. A modified mainhall.tbl should be all that is needed to fix this though.)
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I don't think we support low-res menus anymore, considering that any computer within the last 5 years can handle 1024x768 or higher on FSO.
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We still support low-res menus.
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Oh. Uh... :nervous:
*cough* I stand corrected then.
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I think that you don't update them anymore though.
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They work just fine. But we haven't bothered to do the whole FSPort interface job on them, or render weapon and ship selections. So it's really a mishmash of FS1 and FS2 style, and nothing is animated.
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Weren't they outlines (and triangles and such for the briefing icon) in the original game?
Was it deemed they didn't really fit? I'm curious to why they aren't in.
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I think they wanted to use the FS2 style briefing icons (more detailed). If you want the FS1 style, you can use the briefing icons from Shrouding the Light.
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RE: Briefing Icons. FS1 had only one icon for each ship class; they didn't separate them out by species, so an Orion and a Demon would be using the same icon. Therefore, they had to be more generic.
We figured we'd use the FS2 style icons since we have the upgraded technology, and applied that to the ship and weapon icons too.
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Right, sorry for seemingly abandoning this, but I've recently started over in terms of hard drive (wiped HDD and switched to Windows 7)
Because of this I don't have everything setup yet to continue working on this.
(Note I didn't delete the files however, silly :P)
Just hang in there.
(Also that Bastion animation offset seems to be gone, but there is still the problem of miscolored pixels in the sparky_hi version, also the order of animations displayed isn't correct. I feel this warrants it's own topic though.)
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RE: Briefing Icons. FS1 had only one icon for each ship class; they didn't separate them out by species, so an Orion and a Demon would be using the same icon. Therefore, they had to be more generic.
We figured we'd use the FS2 style icons since we have the upgraded technology, and applied that to the ship and weapon icons too.
however, now we have icons in briefings for ships that don't exist. perseus, seraphis, mentu, etc. appear for their granddaddy ships.
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It would be a simple matter to replace the fighter icon (Perseus) by using a modified Ship Selection icon for, say, the Apollo (or the Valkyrie, since it is the FS1 equivalent of the Perseus)
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It's in progress. :)
(http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/2439/screen0021.png)
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Well anyway, I completed 2_leftarc.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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RE: Briefing Icons. FS1 had only one icon for each ship class; they didn't separate them out by species, so an Orion and a Demon would be using the same icon. Therefore, they had to be more generic.
We figured we'd use the FS2 style icons since we have the upgraded technology, and applied that to the ship and weapon icons too.
however, now we have icons in briefings for ships that don't exist. perseus, seraphis, mentu, etc. appear for their granddaddy ships.
It's not just that. The mission with the shield convoys feature a carefully placed cargo icon on a freighter icon in the briefing. The Port version is distorted to say the least.
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It's in progress. :)
(http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/2439/screen0021.png)
I'm gonna ****ing strangle the Bast when I finally get to it.
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I signed up here with the intention of overhauling all the HUD graphics myself, but you seem to be already working on it.
Let me know if you need any help!
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Which ship is above the Elysium, below the Centaur and the Aten wing?
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Typhon.
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Question about 2_leftarc: The engine only seems to use the first frame in the ani, whats the point of the other 3?
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Question about 2_leftarc: The engine only seems to use the first frame in the ani, whats the point of the other 3?
No it doesn't. In fact, I believe it's just the opposite (the first is never used)
The second is the background of the throttle meter, which is on the left arc. This is displayed when throttle is 0. The third frame is drawn from the bottom up to a point marked by where the throttle is. That's why the throttle meter gets brighter showing your throttle, because the third frame is overlayed. I am not entirely sure about the fourth one, though I believe it is used when training missions highlight it for demonstration purposes.
I do not recall a case where the first frame is displayed.
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You are correct! :)
I've been working on a set of HUD graphics for the Vasudan ships (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=67875.0), but I'm not having much luck getting my graphics to show up instead of the original ones. The only graphics of mine that show up are the left and right arcs, the radar and a few of the targeting icons...
Any idea why that is?
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You are correct! :)
I've been working on a set of HUD graphics for the Vasudan ships (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=67875.0), but I'm not having much luck getting my graphics to show up instead of the original ones. The only graphics of mine that show up are the left and right arcs, the radar and a few of the targeting icons...
Any idea why that is?
From my experience with this, they need to have a specific palette. Just having them all the same does not seem to be enough.
If you're using a fancy image editing program, set Index Color palette to this:
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Yeah it's very picky about the colour index!
I at least figured out what my problem is - Turns out on my pc at least, the engine is using almost entirely the low res hud graphics (which I didnt change, so no difference in game) and just a few of the high res ones...
I'm thinking this is some kind of bug or my install is broken or something? Could you confirm that on your copy, the engine is displaying all the 2_ versions from the mediavps?
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What resolution are you playing at?
At any rate, you may have corrupted game files. Please post an fs2_open.log (Instructions how to generate one can be found in the Support FAQ). This will let us determine what is going wrong (hopefully....).
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He doesn't have corrupted files - FS2's been doing this since retail, using low res graphics on the high res HUD.
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Thanks Black Wolf - I guess if that's just the way it is, I'll work with it :)
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.......... If it does, then it's a bug that should be fixed. Checking to see if the behaviour is not caused by the user's setup is the first step towards that process.
Sooner or later, someone will want to create hi-res HUD art (ISTR a thread about that, must have lost the link though). If it doesn't work because of this (undocumented) behaviour, then it needs to be either explained properly, or fixed in a way that allows the correct usage.
It comes back to me asking you, WormSlayer, for a debug log.
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Debug log attached for your perusal...
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Thanks. Now, which UI elements are ignored?
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I think this is all the ones its not loading high res copies of:
ANI toggle1 with size 57x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI weapons1 with size 126x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI targhit1 with size 31x21 (34.4% wasted)
ANI energy1 with size 12x41 (35.9% wasted)
ANI targetview1 with size 137x156 (39.1% wasted)
ANI targetview2 with size 4x96 (25.0% wasted)
ANI targetview3 with size 7x20 (37.5% wasted)
ANI damage1 with size 148x25 (21.9% wasted)
ANI support1 with size 108x24 (25.0% wasted)
ANI objective1 with size 149x21 (34.4% wasted)
ANI wingman1 with size 71x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI wingman2 with size 35x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI wingman3 with size 14x53 (17.2% wasted)
ANI netlag1 with size 29x30 (6.3% wasted)
ANI head1 with size 164x132 (48.4% wasted)
ANI time1 with size 47x23 (28.1% wasted)
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In other words, anything that does not constitute the center circle, the throttle, threat alarms, reticule, etc. Everything outside the center of the screen.
I can see why it only uses head1 though, and that's because there aren't highres animations for every head animation. Unless they could be scaled up in-game?
Perhaps this whole thing is intentional? Maybe they decided the screen would be less cluttered if they didn't do this. Perhaps, if anything, a toggle could be made to utilize 2_**** anis for every HUD element?
At anyrate, one other good thing it does is allow space for more than 3 escorts.
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Except that head1 is the frame drawn around the comm ani, not the comm ani itself.
At any rate, I've gone through the code, and it looks like an oversight (there are quite a few of those in the codebase). I'll correct it, and test to see what breaks.
EDIT: Here's the first output. Of course, some optimisations are still needed (The different bits of interface art are still drawn at the same coordinates as their smaller counterparts, which makes it look just a bit silly. I also start to ask myself if this isn't intentional; the larger graphics take up quite a bit of screen space.
(http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu320/FabianW/screen0069.png)
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I also start to ask myself if this isn't intentional; the larger graphics take up quite a bit of screen space.
Just like the original, low-res graphics did. Correcting this bug would considerably improve the usability for those of us with visual impairments.
Needless to say, I'm not demanding anything. But it would be nice if you could fix it or make it a launcher option. ;7
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Well, I'll wait for the planned HUD rewrite before doing anymore stuff on this. It was more a test to see if those files actually worked correctly.
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Nice try anyway E :)
How actual and in progress is this HUD rewrite?
As far as the size on screen of the various HUD elements, if your using a screen res higher than 1024x768 then the engine scales (most of, but not all) the graphics up, so its actually wasting screen space already?
I was also experimenting with a set of pre-squashed graphics that look normal when stretched to widescreen aspect ratio, but its not a very elegant solution...
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It should hopefully be done for 3.6.12 final. If not, 3.7 is actually not that far away.
I hope that the rewrite will allow for more intelligent scaling, if not, I will see about adding that in.
Oh, and for the most part, the original art is not scaled in any way for 1024x768.
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It should hopefully be done for 3.6.12 final. If not, 3.7 is actually not that far away.
I hope that the rewrite will allow for more intelligent scaling, if not, I will see about adding that in.
Oh, and for the most part, the original art is not scaled in any way for 1024x768.
It could perhaps be an option to do this if there is no 1024x768 art is a good idea. Main reason is the mainhall. (In FSPort at least)
On 1280x1024, the mainhall would look much better if scaled in-engine from 640x480 instead of using custom graphics already scaled. This is because 1280x1024 is roughly a clean scale (2x) as compared to scaling from the already scaled to 1024x768 art.
However, in the case that 1024x768 art is present, it should indeed be used. This applies to FS2, since it has actual high-res mainhall animations that weren't scaled. FS1's isn't.
If this actually gets in, the 2_***** .anis for FSPort should be taken out, since it is highly unlikely someone will re-make those. Perhaps for the HUD as well, but it is much easier to replace them (as I am) then it is to do for the mainhall.
Basically, things could be done by this in intelligent scaling:
Allow high-res art to be used in specified resolutions. For example, using, say, 800x600 instead of 1024x768.
Also the option to scale or letterbox low-res graphics if there are no high-res graphics present (Useful for mainhalls such as FS1).
This should be settable differently for HUD and the mainhall. For example, using an unscaled hud from 640x480 may look better in 800x600 than a scaled one. The size difference would likely be negligible.
Also, I knew the hud head1 was just a border. What I meant was if it used 2_head1, then the actual head anis for comm would be too small and not fill the box (unless they are scaled in-game)
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Couple of example images attached showing the hud (well my hud anyway) as it appears in game, and how it would look if the graphics were being drawn at 1:1 scale.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Still looks great-in-game IMO.
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There's just too much going on in those 'Vasudan' ones...
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There's just too much going on in those 'Vasudan' ones...
It's PVN, not Vasudan-GTVA. They have very different aesthetics.
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Well ... bleh. The aesthetics are dominating the utilitarianism. And unlike the Typhon, this foolish display of non-utilitarian design is NOT going to miraculously take out an Orion-class destroyer any time soon :p
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Well ... bleh. The aesthetics are dominating the utilitarianism. And unlike the Typhon, this foolish display of non-utilitarian design is NOT going to miraculously take out an Orion-class destroyer any time soon :p
:(
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Well I, for one, LOVE IT.
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I LURVS TOO <3 <3 <3
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Well ... bleh. The aesthetics are dominating the utilitarianism. And unlike the Typhon, this foolish display of non-utilitarian design is NOT going to miraculously take out an Orion-class destroyer any time soon :p
Vasudan design is pretty much all about aesthetics dominating the design process, so :P
(also, that 1:1 layout would be fugly, it looks fine the way it is. Could you do a screenshot in a 4:3 resolution so I can see it in a non-stretched form?)
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You mean, make a screenshot running at 1024x768. Everything else will be scaled and stretched.
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it looks nice, but from what i can tell from the still images, it would be a pain in the ass to use.
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Beta test version here (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=67875.0) if anyone wants a go on it...
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You mean, make a screenshot running at 1024x768. Everything else will be scaled and stretched.
Not necessarily, the problem with 16:9/16:10 is that the HUD is stretched out of proportion.
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You pretty much restated what he just said. He means that the only resolution on which the HUD is displayed actual size is 1024x768 (or 640x480 at low res). In other resolutions, regardless of whether the aspect ratio is correct or not, it's still scaled.
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I'm saying that rescaling isn't that important as long as it's the same aspect ratio. If the aspect ratio is different, then it's stretched out of proportion and the shape is screwed up.
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:bump:
Wormslayer, do you have your files available? I would really like to put them in our repository but they aren't available for download anywhere.
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Yay, I has a backup :D
http://www.mediafire.com/?nzjjunmmzdy
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Actually I meant the redrawn FS1-style HUD elements.
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Uhm. Could have figured. "for sparky_hi_fs1.vp". Yeah. Hurrm.
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Sorry I've been gone. Let me get what I have together, though I have to admit it's just the crosshair, the lead indicator, and one side of the circle (Throttle meter)
I'll see if I can get anything more done before the final release also. I have the original .PSDs I did it with too, so if I can't, someone else can make one that matches.
I know, if anything, I'll be able to get the energy/afterburner guages done. Those look incredibly simple.
EDIT: Just got the right arc (weapon selection) done! All that's left is the top arc (target indicators) and the energy gauges (easy) and that'll be it.
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Bump! Got everything done except the side gauges. This HUD upgrade will be in the next FSPort release and has already been sent in.
Some pics attached.
[attachment deleted by ninja]
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Very nice. :yes:
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Does this fix the one-pixel-off problem you get when using widescreen resolutions?
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Does this fix the one-pixel-off problem you get when using widescreen resolutions?
It looks much better, but there are still a couple problem areas, and there's nothing I can do about that.
If I recall, FS2's HUD also has this problem.
The only real way to fix that would be to have widescreen resolutions not stretch the HUD, and that's not something I can do.
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There's scripting in the works to address that. :)
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Awesome! :)