Author Topic: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)  (Read 6991 times)

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Offline General Battuta

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
Not a problem?

I just don't see why disciplined GTI pilots would ever break comms discipline or jeopardize brevity.

 

Offline Mobius

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
Well, there are no messages coming from the player's side. The player and his squadron were pretty much facing who could be easily dubbed as their old colleagues, and there's no mention of that. That's FS-ish, no doubt about that, but concepts use to evolve.
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Offline Snail

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
Can I just ask what you're actually trying to achieve with this discussion?

 

Offline Mobius

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
What do you mean? Well, I'm trying to say that although ST:R is great under most points of view, it deluded me a bit because I did not "feel" the power of the opposing GTI wings seen in the campaign. I would have appreciated more in-mission messages related to hostile wings. I'm not imposing anything.
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Offline Angelus

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
What do you mean? Well, I'm trying to say that although ST:R is great under most points of view, it deluded me a bit because I did not "feel" the power of the opposing GTI wings seen in the campaign. I would have appreciated more in-mission messages related to hostile wings. I'm not imposing anything.

You mean your wingman ( the players wingman ) are supposed to talk about enemy wings?

Hm, to make one enemy ace wing "scare the ****" out of the player ( <-- extreme case- or something similar to that ), you have to build up their reputation during the campaign, but this could in case of ST:R "distract" from the threat that the Hades or the GTI itself poses, if done improperly ( and by no means i'm implying that the team couldn't get this done if they wanted ).

I'm not saying that it wouldn't work, but that it's difficult to achieve, 'cause you have to, either put a lot of chatter about those aces into most missions/ briefings or give this enemy wing more "screentime".

I doubt it's worth the effort to tear apart the already finished campaign to add some messages about enemy aces. I never had the feeling the GTI deployes wimps, but i also never had the feeling they are sending "Starbucks" into battle.
The threat came from the strategical/ tactical advantage they had, and this feeling was transported.

I'd like to see something like that in other campaigns, though.


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Offline Mobius

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
I see.

Well, doing things a la FreeSpace really helped ST:R getting closer to the main campaigns, but since ST:R is not a pure upgrade things might have been managed in a different way. Many well praised fan-made campaigns became famous and popular thanks to their different and particular styles.

It's also true that concepts evolve... the good old FS feeling may be out of date nowadays, as FRED allows campaign designers to come out with more interesting stuff. :)
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Offline Goober5000

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
So what exactly is your point?

 

Offline Kolgena

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
He seems to have 2:

1. GTI pilots aren't good enough.

As has been mentioned, he should play on insane. However, if he wants a plot explanation, how's this: Since GTA pilots are defecting to GTI, we can assume that many GTI pilots would defect back to GTA. This means that we'd have a bit more scattering of good and bad pilots, so that the GTI wouldn't exactly be as elite as they are during the Capella era.


2. GTI pilots don't talk enough.

Last I checked, pilots aren't allowed to talk to opponents, even when they're fighting old friends or are trying to convert enemies. You get court-martialed for that regardless of what you manage to accomplish.

 

Offline Nuclear1

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
No, the GTI didn't talk a lot, but when they did, it did its job.

If you're looking for the general character of GTI pilot you were going up against, I'd look no further than the Ransom-voiced pilots in Mission 3 and the EMP mission. If you didn't get the idea that you're going up against obedient, well-trained pilots in possession of technology more advanced than yours, then I think you missed the whole point.

Additionally, the GTI doesn't talk a lot ingame for a good reason. An easy way to build intelligence on an enemy force and gain an enormous advantage is by simply knowing which channels enemy forces communicate on. The easiest way to give this information out is to simply speak to your opponent. Once your opponent knows you can operate on that channel, it doesn't take long for them to figure out what others you operate on. Once that's all understood, everything from fighter launches, strategic maneuvers, and deployments are all available for your enemy to listen to.

Now, maybe on Hercs and other fighters used by both GTI and GTA, this is less of an issue...GTA already knows what those craft are capable of. But having Lokis and Zeus bombers give away their comms strips away the GTI's advantage.
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Offline Kolgena

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
That sounds like a good point, but I'm tending to imagine that by this far into the future, messages can be encrypted so well that it doesn't matter at all whether you know the enemy's communication frequencies.

(Note: in all SOC arcs, you always use an encoder/decoder device to talk to your contact/Snipes)

 

Offline StarSlayer

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
Its probably worth pointing out that these guys are Intelligence.  It's a slightly different situation then say splitting up the Air Wing on an aircraft carrier where everybody knows each other.  These chaps  were probably segregated from the rest of the regular Navy conducting black ops that remain classified for 100 years freedom of information act be damned.  Regular Navy might know they are Bad Mother Frakers but its not like the GTI has been writing up their pilots' names and kill scores in the GTA Navy Gazette.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
Once that's all understood, everything from fighter launches, strategic maneuvers, and deployments are all available for your enemy to listen to.

Misconception. By the timeframe FS occurs in, traffic analysis will probably survive but cryptanalysis is going to be a dead art. All communications will be encoded using effectively random systems and therefore be unbreakable.

Honestly, this is a situation that will probably develop within our lifetimes as digital encryption advances.

(ETAK being the great exception, since the Shivans either don't encrypt or do it poorly; they have no spoken speech after all.)
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Offline Nuclear1

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Re: Mobius re-reviews ST:R (split)
True...I guess I'm spoiled dealing with less-capable militaries' comms that I didn't take the encryption into account.

At least it sounded cool and somewhat authentic.:p
Spoon - I stand in awe by your flawless fredding. Truely, never before have I witnessed such magnificant display of beamz.
Axem -  I don't know what I'll do with my life now. Maybe I'll become a Nun, or take up Macrame. But where ever I go... I will remember you!
Axem - Sorry to post again when I said I was leaving for good, but something was nagging me. I don't want to say it in a way that shames the campaign but I think we can all agree it is actually.. incomplete. It is missing... Voice Acting.
Quanto - I for one would love to lend my beautiful singing voice into this wholesome project.
Nuclear1 - I want a duet.
AndrewofDoom - Make it a trio!