Hard Light Productions Forums
Community Projects => The FreeSpace Upgrade Project => Topic started by: Nix on November 01, 2006, 03:47:34 am
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EDIT - If you're interested in what I've posted so far.. just go to http://nix1999.shackspace.com/audio and click on what you'd like. I'll try to post more later on as people request.
Okay, maybe it's not new but... have a listen. (http://nix1999.shackspace.com/audio/fs1titlerefreshed.ogg) Those with garden-variety external speakers might not be able to hear what the big deal is about, therefore, headphones might be the best to hear this with... Before you say anything though, listen to it in it's entirety. ;)
A project I've started a while back has come true in a way I'd never thought possible. A while back, some of you might remember a really bad attempt I made to clean up the audio from Freespace 1. Well, after just hitting my head against the wall, I thought I'd just try asking Dan Wentz over at Volition for the original uncompressed music masters. Well, to my amazement he replied, and after a summers worth of searching, he's found most of the music for Freespace 1 and 2 in high-resolution uncompressed WAV files.
Additional interesting happenings are in the works, but have yet to be finalized. Till then, here's something to look forward to.
In my spare time, I'm going to try to create a VP for the FSPort, and FS2 containing newer, higher resolution audio for as much of the in-game music as possible. This includes interface/briefing/debriefing/ingame music. Since so many people have shown such great improvements to things like graphics and models, I've always felt that the music could be better. Now it can be. I aim to provide another piece to making Freespace 1/2 as best as it can be, while preserving what I feel to be some of the best music composed in the gaming world.
Questions/comments/discuss at will!
[EDIT by CP5670] - All of the high quality music is now available here:
Freespace 2 Music Media VP (http://cp.nukelol.com/mv_music.zip)
Freespace 1 Music (http://cp.nukelol.com/fs1music.zip)
FS2 Cutscene and Unused Music (http://cp.nukelol.com/extramusic.zip)
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How does one go about contacting Volition staff :o , Not sice the old days of V guys showing their heads in here, have i been so happy to be a HaRRRdy light Boy.
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Awesome. The music has always been one of my favourite parts about Freespace (my music is influenced by it way too much) and this sounds brilliant.
Requesting high quality FS2 endpart1 please. ;) *hopes*
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Can't wait!!!!!!!
*Runs home to upgrade his sound card and speaker system*
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Awesome. The music has always been one of my favourite parts about Freespace (my music is influenced by it way too much) and this sounds brilliant.
Requesting high quality FS2 endpart1 please. ;) *hopes*
Screw endpart1 (that's available elsewhere) I want the FS2 intro music :)
Well actually I wouldn't mind endpart 1 too. It's just not as high a priority to me :)
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Awesome. The music has always been one of my favourite parts about Freespace (my music is influenced by it way too much) and this sounds brilliant.
Requesting high quality FS2 endpart1 please. ;) *hopes*
Screw endpart1 (that's available elsewhere) I want the FS2 intro music :)
Well actually I wouldn't mind endpart 1 too. It's just not as high a priority to me :)
It's personally my very favourite piece of music in the whole game. endpart1 is the ultimate gift for completing the game in my opinion.
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I make you right there, Second only to the Hidden folder in the Silent Threat CD.......
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Oh, so that's how it's supposed to sound like! :eek2:
The difference to the music files shipped with the game is really really huge, I dare say. Clearly audible quality difference. Great thanks to you for the job and equal thanks to Dan Wentz and :v: for being so great towards the community... :)
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Very good music !
:yes:
I'd like to hear the FS2 end music too. IMO, some of the FS2 music really enhances the desperate feeling you are supposed to have when fighting against the advancing Shivans, particulary in the final missions..
Like when playing the game at the first time, and you never knew what the Shivans threw against you.
:nervous:
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:jaw: *jaw drops several feet*
That's absolutely amazing. I can't believe you were able to get in touch with Dan and get a hold of this stuff. I can't wait to get my grubby little paws on more of it. :)
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Holy crap. :eek: I didn't think we would ever get the original music pieces. Did he actually send you all of them?
That FS1 mainhall music sounds absolutely fantastic. Can't wait to hear the ohers.
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Most of the other tracks are included. I have missions 1-6 for FS1, and some others like mission 9-10 that need some hack'n'slashing done out of other tracks. There are a couple of missing tracks though and I will ask about those. Also, for FS2, I have Acts and Genesis only available in 22K, so I need to ask for 44K files from Dan, because each other mission track plus mainhall track are in high-quality. I also have some cutscene material that he found, like an uncompressed high-def version of the FS1 intro, Ancients 1, 3,4,5, (No 2, I will ask about this..) but the music done for those parts, I think are different than what was included with the game.
The official word from Dan, concerning the tracks was: Stephen von Kampen who worked for Noiz studio was hired to work on cutscene audio only. That's why the cutscenes may have a different sound to them compared to the rest of the game. I think those may have been lost forever, but I will try asking. All the rest of the music is Dan's work. These have been pretty much unofficially leaked to the public, so don't go bangin on :v:'s door for support on this.
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:eek2: Wow! This is awesome! Sounds like mv_music will soon become even more essential! Hooray for your success, and waiting on the edge of my seat for the rest...
Heh, I'm mostly just replying so that this thread shows up on my 'show new replies' list :p
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Well, your comments are appreciated, nontheless!
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This sounds truly stunning. FS1 had the best atmosphere.
I'll seriously replay the entire campaigns (both games worth) if you can give us this music.
Hell, I wanna hear FS2_brief4 in Hi res, thats always been my favourite track!
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This sounds so great :yes2::yes:... and the FS1 briefing music is (will be) the best IMO.
The FS2 intro gave me goosebumps.
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Awesome. :) The FS1 title music is one of my favorite pieces in FreeSpace. The excellent atmosphere just got even better. :)
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God damn yes.
Now get your arse in gear son and deploy the remaining files! :p
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FS2 briefing 4 is soooo damn good! :D
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FS2 Briefing 4?
(EEEEEVIIIIILLLL GRIIIIIINNNNNNN :mad2:)
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How big is the entire package of these music files? Is it small enough that you could upload it somewhere?
This has to be one of the best (and most unexpected) developments in the community since the source code release. I think the only thing the game could use more, content-wise, is the FS2 high resolution textures.
Hell, I wanna hear FS2_brief4 in Hi res, thats always been my favourite track!
Same here, I love that one.
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I want cinema2 in hi-quality. That is my single favorite track in the game (thought the Derelict people were very very smart in tuning their credits sequence to it, fit the atmosphere perfectly).
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A preliminary size estimate for both campaigns in 90% Quality OGG, is about 500 mb. Pretty good for the near 4 gigabytes I got. So yeah, I'm gonna need a lot of space, but these sizes will most likely decrease when the VP's are finished.
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High-quality FS1_M5, M9 (Monolith), Brief1, M6_Nrml2, and Cinema are what I'm looking forward to (or remixes thereof, if anyone is so inclined).
Brief1 and Cinema in particular set their respective moods perfectly.
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That one FS1 track... the one that was in the first mission of the demo, and the Taranis capture mission... that's the one I'm looking forward to the most.
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omg... the high-quality FS2 Brief 04 rocks. Really makes listening to the song over and over again worth it. :yes: :yes: :yes:
If only 100% quality OGG's were possible, but then it's going to eat up HDD space that I don't have... and I have waaay waaay less than 4GB. (http://209.85.12.236/5024/118/emo/bangwall.gif) (http://209.85.12.236/5024/118/emo/bangwall.gif) (http://209.85.12.236/5024/118/emo/bangwall.gif) (http://209.85.12.236/5024/118/emo/bangwall.gif) (http://209.85.12.236/5024/118/emo/bangwall.gif)
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The lossless version of OGG (developed by the same team I believe) are called FLACs
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So that's what FLAC is... was having trouble with my WMPlayer ripper codec and ran across that...
Aw heck, if I had the hard-disk space, I'd be real content with the original high-quality WAVE samples, and then make a VP out of them. That's as long as they're not in bitrates so high that even "civilian-issue" hardware can't read... :shaking:
Speaking of file formats, if the filenames are the same, would the OGG take predecence, or the WAVE?
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Then don't use WMplayer :wtf:
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It was my MP3 ripper codec. I fixed it already. :)
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FS2 briefing 4 is soooo damn good! :D
Ew.
I want cinema2 in hi-quality. That is my single favorite track in the game...
Seconded. :D
Here's what I'd like:
March, Monolith, cinema2, m4_nrml3 and aquitane. :D
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FS2 briefing 4 is soooo damn good! :D
Ew.
*smack*
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I have a favor to ask someone here.... I was wondering how hard it would be to make some missions up, very simple missions that would allow for easy testing of this VP. I could just plug it in to the existing campaign, but what I want to test is timing, to make sure the tracks start and end where they're supposed to. I don't know if someone's already done this before, but it'd be a big help if someone could point me to where I can either learn real fast how to make some missions, cause I have absolutely zero experience with FRED. (I'm a voice actor, what can I say?) That, or if someone had some free time and would be willing to help make some, that'd be even better, cause then I wouldnt' have to waste time on trying to FRED.
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It's personally my very favourite piece of music in the whole game. endpart1 is the ultimate gift for completing the game in my opinion.
I wouldn't disagree with you. It's certainly in my top 5 from either game at least. The thing is I already have a (low-res) copy of it though. Where as the only way I could hear the FS2 intro is to hear it with the sound effects still in it.
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I have a favor to ask someone here.... I was wondering how hard it would be to make some missions up, very simple missions that would allow for easy testing of this VP. I could just plug it in to the existing campaign, but what I want to test is timing, to make sure the tracks start and end where they're supposed to. I don't know if someone's already done this before, but it'd be a big help if someone could point me to where I can either learn real fast how to make some missions, cause I have absolutely zero experience with FRED. (I'm a voice actor, what can I say?) That, or if someone had some free time and would be willing to help make some, that'd be even better, cause then I wouldnt' have to waste time on trying to FRED.
I think all you'd have to do is replace the music files (in the data folder), then open FRED, look under Mission Specs Editor, and select the music track you want. Simple as that.
To learn how to FRED, do the walkthrough included with FRED. It is very handy and will touch upon all different aspects of the program, simple or complex. It'll take you about a day to get through, I think. The stuff it doesn't touch on is pretty intuitive (asteroid fields, etc.).
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Ah, so its not rocket science then, thats good. I think if I make one mission with the right timings then copy it 8 times or so, changing the music track for each one, then load them up via the mission simulator, it should work. Right?
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Why do you need a mission? If you could open the high res, and the old res versions into a sound editor and compare parts at certain times, maing sure that they match, it could be a direct replacement, no?
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The new Brief4 has somewhat exaggerated highs and seems to have the fading going the wrong way (it gets louder instead of softer at the beginning and end), but sounds excellent otherwise. Thanks for uploading these.
Another one that would be great to hear is the FS1 track 10 ambient music. I particularly like that one, but it sounds especially low quality and would benefit a lot from the 44khz version.
Why do you need a mission? If you could open the high res, and the old res versions into a sound editor and compare parts at certain times, maing sure that they match, it could be a direct replacement, no?
Well, you need to change all the parameters in music.tbl. IIRC the samples per measure thing depends on the bitrate.
A test mission for this should be very easy to make. Just add in an objective that becomes true when you press a key and make an enemy fighter arrive when you press another key, which should allow you to try out all of the ingame music "states."
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AH. Ive never modded the music part. Mea culpa.
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:nervous:
I never ever before realized that the choir sings Agnus Dei in endpart1. This is the first time I even noticed they actually have anywords in the music at all.
For this recognition only I would be obliged to give a thousand thanks... in form of Thanks.java:
public class Thanks {
public static void main(String args[]) {
for (int n = 0; n < 1000; n++) {
System.out.println("Thank You!");
}
}
}
Should a conclusive VP package "mv_music.vp" appear, I'll change the code with
n < 1000000
:D
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Wow, very nice, though I agree that it was unexpected. Thanks for going ahead and getting the cinema music; I know people have wanted that for ages.
As for brief4 cutting off abruptly, I seem to remember that track always having trouble with the transition. While FS has a good method of blending tracks for its own purposes, it's sort of backwards to most players so don't expect it to sound perfect in WinAmp. Putting in a crossfade may actually hurt it in-game, so until you get it modded in don't play with the transition effects.
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I have the Winamp fade thing turned off. The old version sounds fine in it; this only occurs with the new one (you can tell the volume increases a lot at the end before it abruptly stops). I think FS just loops the briefing/debreifing tracks normally and doesn't do any additional blending with them.
As for the endpart1 music, is this one better (in terms of quality) than the one we already have? That used to be one of the music files available in 44khz from Volition's website. It's been in my music directory for years, anyway.
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I'm not sure, I thought the files were encoded in 128K MP3, although the source file was a 44Khz wave. And, strangely, there's a few different files of Brief4, but they're all the same. I think the files were a bit over-normalized, as when you look at it in sound forge, the waveform's constantly hitting the ceiling. I used a bit of click and crackle removal on it because the highs were so bright and loud they made my headphones crackle pretty bad. It's too bad that there's not a softer, well rounded version of this track. As for adding fades in and out, that's going to be left up to the listener, because I'm posting these as naturally as they can be.
For timing.. well that's gonna be easy, then again it might be harder than I think because all I have to do if the tracks are the same exact length in seconds, I just need to double the number of samples in the table, cause I'm leaving all the tracks at 44K.
It's gonna be a big download, but it's worth it in my opinion, to have hi fidelity music with awesome graphics... this will be interesting to behold once it's all done!
BTW, since I'm super familiar with MP3 but honestly getting my feet wet with OGG in this project, what do you think about the file format itself, bitrate, and such. I'm getting between 6-7 MB from a song that's about 15-20 MB large in WAV format. My current settings is VBR quality 9, usually around 160K/s. Anyone have any reccomended settings they could suggest would be greatly appreciated!
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I would love to get the originals >..>; But I have no use for them, so thats kinda dumb :p
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The level of compression I'm doing retains an awful lot more fidelity than the original ADPCM compression. There's hardly any difference between the source files I have and what will be available in the VP.
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:nervous:
I never ever before realized that the choir sings Agnus Dei in endpart1. This is the first time I even noticed they actually have anywords in the music at all.
All of the gregorian choir stuff is from Spectrasonic's Symphony of Voices, it's a 4 CD set of brilliant choir samples.
It's quite funny because not only do I use them, but I hear them aaaaall the time in tons of TV programs and films, and I can't help but giggle when I hear yet something else going "Aaaalelujaaa.... Luuuluuulaaaluuu...."
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Audio directory updated again, will post a few more next week then get down to the nitty-gritty.
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All of the gregorian choir stuff is from Spectrasonic's Symphony of Voices, it's a 4 CD set of brilliant choir samples.
To be exact, the chanting in endgame part 1 is not Gregorian, unless they found some eunuchs to sing it. At least it sounds to me it's women singing it, and women don't actually sing Gregorian chant. It becomes something else... perhas neo-gregorian would be better term. :)
It's quite funny because not only do I use them, but I hear them aaaaall the time in tons of TV programs and films, and I can't help but giggle when I hear yet something else going "Aaaalelujaaa.... Luuuluuulaaaluuu...."
I can imagine.
I have to start listening for them so I can laugh at them too... :lol:
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You posted M2!!!! I love you now.
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Nix : I usually find VBR 5 to be near CD quality and good for general use, and 4 to be a bit below that. artifacts are more noticeable in 4 when turning up the preamp too much in the EQ...
I don't think I've ever formally compared file sizes, though. Most of my music is OGG quality 4, with newer stuff in 5 (About the time I got a new HD...), and it sounds well enough. IIRC, file size wise that equates to approximately 1 meg a minute, where the source WAV or AIFF is about ten times that. And it sounds mucho better than an MP3 of equivalent size.
My conjecture from there is that VBR 9 will be preeety damn close to the original... Though perhaps not so bad if you're trying to preserve as much info as possible. :P
Now... mor mux plz.
... :P
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Another request:
FS1 M10 music.
Those of you who don't recognize it: it was played only in the final mission of Silent Threat, when the Hades was fought. Crappy mission, but spectacular music! :cool:
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To be exact, the chanting in endgame part 1 is not Gregorian, unless they found some eunuchs to sing it. At least it sounds to me it's women singing it, and women don't actually sing Gregorian chant. It becomes something else... perhas neo-gregorian would be better term. :)
Most of the ones used in FS2 are from an all male Gregorian choir of which there are lots of young boys sampled in there. Gregorian doesn't nessesarily mean deep brooding voices you know. ;)
There's a couple of women bits used in FS2 from the London choir stuff but they're usually nothing more than mmms and aaaahs.
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Wel, not all latin chanting is Gregorian either, however, I'd say it's probably not Gregorian more for the melody it follows than the people singing it.
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You'ld be surprised what classes for Gregorian, I also have two full audio CDs of the stuff (my mum had them for some reason...) It's lovely but can have some really unusual melodies, it's sometimes rather lush.
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At least it sounds to me it's women singing it
Most of the ones used in FS2 are from an all male Gregorian choir of which there are lots of young boys sampled in there.
M'kay. I stand corrected. :)
That's the reason I mentioned that it sounds to me very much like women - I wanted to leave myself a backport in case it wasn't women after all. It's just that I've seen horrid examples of some... things... being dubbed "gregorian" with no real connection to actual traditional gregorian chanting at all, or at least the connection was very feeble.
Gregorian doesn't nessesarily mean deep brooding voices you know. ;)
Yeah, I know that... I've studied the history of western music a bit. Not on university level, but...well, here in Finland we have a very capable istitutional system for teaching music. And while the main thing is to learn to play some instrument, the higher levels also include studying the theory of music as well as history of music and stuff like that. Been playing cello for about 11 years and also went through all the theory/music knowledge courses that system had to offer... If I wanted to study more music I would have had to go to a conservatoire to actually study music, or possibly Sibelius Academy, but I really wasn't that interested in it. But it gave me some kind of a knowledge basis about music nevertheless. ;)
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WOOT! He posted the Monolith battle track and March! YES!
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Any further updates with this? I've been constantly listening to the ones you have released so far during the last few days. :) I think M10 and M3 in FS1 would be especially good to have, as those not only sound good but would benefit a lot from the high quality versions.
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Unfortunately, I don't have M10, and I will get in touch with Dan about it to see if it's lost or if he may have it somewhere. Oddly enough, I have a completely different (Better, IMO) version of M1 than what was included with the game, which has been posted. I'll be updating here and there, but I'm going to get down to VP construction. I will try to fufill requests as best as I can. I'm sure Dan will be happy to hear the community is very quite pleased over the release of these materials. There's actually a few things that I'm missing that I need to list up and see if Dan can find them in the next short while. He's been awfully busy lately, I might not get these for a while.
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What is the exact filesizes of the original masters anyway? I want to get my hands on these things and burn some soundtrack CDs ;7 --- We need FLACs!!!
P.S. Didn't Dan Wentz also do the Red Faction soundtrack (which was ALSO incredibly awesome)? >.>
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I just found out that I've been.. well.. overdoing what I've posted. I've been using VBR Qual 9 and it does compress the hell outta the originals, but it's a bit overkill. I'll be compressing them further, hopefully to keep as much fidelity as possible. If people want FLAC, after this is all done, I could possibly do that. I honestly cannot hear a difference between VBR Q9 and a medium-high bitrate FLAC of the same file. Keep in mind that some of these masters might be meant to not sound crystal clear perfect. I'm just trying to keep everything in its purest form.
And yes, Dan did the soundtrack for RF, which was pretty darn good too.
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I don't know much about those formats, but you could just post a short clip of the same thing in both formats and see if anyone can notice the difference.
Hopefully we can still get M10. That was probably overall my favorite track in FS1. Do you have M3?
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I do have M3, will post as soon as I have time. I've got everything for missions 1-6, arrival cues and all. I just got to get around to making my list of stuff that I'm missing.
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Have you got Aquitaine.wav out already. Tis the best after all :nod:
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Old or new? ;7
Uploading now - check out the fs2betamainhall track, according to IceFire, it was used in the Multiplayer Beta version of FS2, a completely different mainhall track. If they're not there, check again in a few minutes. CP5670, I'll get to M3, I've gotta make a mix for it, like I did for M1.
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Ummm, both :p
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check out the fs2betamainhall track, according to IceFire, it was used in the Multiplayer Beta version of FS2, a completely different mainhall track.
:eek2: Why wasn't that used in the main game? It's awesome!
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Wow, that sounds completely different. Although I can see why they changed it; it doesn't really fit in with the style of the other tracks. It actually sounds like a mix of the Doom 3 intro and some of the SS2 tracks, or maybe more like the Unreal music. I know I've heard stuff quite similar to it somewhere else.
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WOW That's is bloody gorgeous!
I wish that had at least been put in the VP.
Amazing how even after all this time my favourite game never ceases to amaze me...
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The Beta main hall track is seemingly (to my ears anyway) a medley of tracks from FS1. I'm recognizing some of the FS1 briefing musics in it, along with the original FS1 title theme. It sounds like what the FS2 mainhall and all other tracks *would* have sounded like, had Dan Wentz elected to keep the exact same musical "feel" of FS1's music in FS2.
I assume that neither soundtrack (FS1 or FS2) were done with a real orchestra, and that they are both computer synthesized using sound samples:
Dan Wentz seems to have had a DRASTIC change in the sound samples he used to compose these things between FS1 and FS2. It's a shame we may never hear the FS1 tracks with the instruments that were used in the FS2 tracks. That would be awesome, to hear the FS1 mainhall using the same "sounds" (drums, etc) as the FS2 Aquitaine one. :D
Somehow, the FS2 Beta mainhall reminds me of the Deus Ex theme...do we have a definitive "name"/"title" (eg, Aquitaine, Monolith) for the Beta main hall?
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The title name was "main1.wav" so I think it might have been the first track ever created for FS2. The filename for the Aquitaine track was "title_new.wav".
So.. speculate at will, but I think that it just wouldn't fit. It'll be in there as an easter egg, but it won't be a new mainhall track.
It's a shame we may never hear the FS1 tracks with the instruments that were used in the FS2 tracks.
Hmm...
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Somehow, the FS2 Beta mainhall reminds me of the Deus Ex theme...
That's it! They're very different of course, but I knew that, stylistically, it reminded me of something. That's most certainly it.
And yes, you can definately hear parts of the FS1 mainhall in it.
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It's creepier, though. It clearly has the feel of ..."THE SHIVANS...ARE BACK. AND THEY ARE BIGGER. AND BADDER." The Doom 3 feeling is definitely caused by the first instruments used in the piece. It is absolutely beautiful. It gave me goosebumps to listen to it.
I get goosebumps every time I watch the FS1 intro movie, actually.
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*shudder* Me too. That pilot... he really looks scared out of his mind... I haven't seen too many other character models able to do that so well.
Reading the FSreferenceBible, and looking at the initial plans for the cutscenes... I feel like we missed out, to tell the truth. For instance, there was going to be a cutscene depicting the Lucifer annihilating Tombaugh, complete with a red subspace vortex and Shivan shock troops flying through space to attack the station... Really too bad they didn't put that in after all... :blah:
Wonder what it's music would have been like?
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Wonder what it's music would have been like?
Something hair-raising, that's for sure.
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It'll be in there as an easter egg, but it won't be a new mainhall track.
What the hell... Give it to Woomeister, I think it would be rather good mainhall music for Inferno. ;7
That, of course, is up to Inferno staff to decide, but IMHO the general feeling I get from that beta mainhall track would fit Inferno extremely well. Perhaps that is because the atmosphere of Inferno was always closer to FS1 in my opinion than FS2.
What do you think?
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Now that I listen to it again, it does have that "Inferno" feeling (reinforced further by the part that sounds like Doom 3; the beginning of the track) Either that, or BlackWater Operations, but that's just a wild guess as I have no idea about whether it'd fit BWO's content or not. Inferno, however, is a definitive yes (at least, when you consider what Inferno R1's mainhall track was). The problem is, the mainhall track ought to fit the rest of the musical score, so if any campaign uses the FS2 Beta track for its mainhall, they better have at least SOMEWHAT similar music for ingame, or the mainhall will sound out of place. =b
This track is so good, it could actually be a command briefing music for a mission, too --- not just a main hall...Hmmm...FS2 Beta Mainhall track is to FS1 what Cinema is to FS2?
I'm applauding this project overall; I'm looking forward to the FS1 tracks more than the FS2 tracks, as the FS1 tracks were in such bad quality originally, and I loved their feel a lot more. =)
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Blimey!
I've never thought this was possible.. to recover the old-new lossless musics of FS & FS2. Congratulations! Don't know if you have the resources to convert the musics in FLAC and upload them somewhere... I'd very happy if you could manage it, but that would be an extra gift, the proposal you did it's more than enough, so if you don't have time for it, never mind. If it's being discussed recently, excuse me, I'm a newb here.
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Welcome to the HLP and stuff, Zoli.
Nix, do you have FS2's Numbers and Joshua battle tracks in that magical high-quality music box of yours?
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Yeah. I'd love to hear Numbers but Joshua is the best of the FS2 battle tracks :)
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Doubt he's been beamed yet...
(http://www.hard-light.net/forums/Smileys/HLP/welcome2hlpbb.gif)
My first beam.. hmm.. As for the welcome speech I'll leave that to someone else.
Uploaded Joshua (which was named Exodus too.. odd..) and Numbers. Currently uploading M3 FS1 mix as I type. It will be available shortly!
Also, I'm uploading in FLAC's now, which seems to be a little bigger on the size, but the quality is better.
As far as the beta mainhall track, IceFire already asked me for it, I don't know if he's using it for BWO, or a project of his own, or just really wanted it to listen to. So, I'll ask him to make sure both projects wont use the same mainhall track.
Here's another suggestion for another mainhall track that I've never heard before, a track called "Waiting" which I dont know ever made it into either FS1 or 2. It was in both the Freespace 1 and 2 source collections, so I bet it's one of those lonely tracks that never saw the light of day... untill now!
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Thanks for posting M3. I always particularly liked the battle 2 piece in that. This sounds way better than the original.
The waiting track also seems to have a different style than anything in the FS games, even more so than the beta mainhall one. I think I might actually be able to use that beta mainhall track as a briefing in one place.
There is a noticeable background hiss in M3 though. Some of the others you posted earlier also have a similar hiss, but it's not nearly as prominent. Maybe it's showing up more in this one due to the lossless compression. Goldwave's noise removal function with the "light hiss removal" preset gets rid of it, but I can't tell whether it's affecting the quality otherwise.
We actually already have the HQ versions of the battle parts of FS2 D and G (Numbers and Joshua), although they're mp3s and the quality is probably a little worse. I compiled them into single files some years ago.
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'Waiting' seems like it would be great for briefing/debriefing when you've reached a "The end of the world is coming and there ain't a damn thing we can do about it" sort of spot in a campaign. Conveys a great sense of hopelessness imo.
[Edit] Many, many thanks for putting up the m2 battle mix. Those tracks were (well, are) my favourite battle music in FS1 :)
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I thought cinema2 always worked well in that situation. Like it did at the end of Derelict. Course, for it to really take effect, the briefing needs to be uber-long...
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My humble thanks for your work Nix. FS1 mainhall sound heaps better now.
As for little requests:
Cinema and Cinema2
Briefing1 (FS1)
M5 (FS1), especially the 'dead' part
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There is a noticeable background hiss in M3 though. Some of the others you posted earlier also have a similar hiss, but it's not nearly as prominent. Maybe it's showing up more in this one due to the lossless compression. Goldwave's noise removal function with the "light hiss removal" preset gets rid of it, but I can't tell whether it's affecting the quality otherwise.
I've noticed this, and Dan said something about a hum too that probably only he could notice. I don't notice a hum, but I notice a bad hiss around 8000Khz. I tried Goldwave briefly, and about the only thing I'd use Goldwave for after my experience with that is to make vasudan voices with the mechanize function. Running it through the light hiss removal actually destroyed a lot of the audio. After futzing around with various functions and stuff, Sound Forge has a paragraphic EQ function, which allows me to cut out certain frequencies. I've been messing around with presets, presets from other sources and my own tinkering with the filters I can use, and each one allows me to remove the hiss, but it removes way more than what I want to remove, highs end up sounding muffled. If I restore the highs, hiss comes back. I doubt I'll be able to remove all the hiss and keep as much fidelity as possible. What I'll probably do is a light hiss removal to keep as much of the high frequency elements, and keep as much of the music content in as possible.
Any musicians here who have other software besides Goldwave and Sound Forge (Using Sound Forge 8, full bodied version) that would come in handy here? :confused:
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Yeah, I have been trying fiddling with some things in Goldwave but haven't been able to remove the hiss either without screwing up the highs too much.
I don't notice any hum, but the M3 hiss is fairly loud. See what happens if you put it into ogg format. That may have nothing to do with it, but it wasn't quite as bad in the oggs you posted earlier. The slight loss of quality with oggs may actually be having a good side effect here. :p
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Well, CP5670, we can't exactly help the fact that FS1's sound samples are also, as I pointed out earlier, drastically inferior to FS2's. They have a bit of a weird hissing to every single sound they have and tend to sound "flat". Mission 2 and 1 have it as well, but not as loudly. *shrugs* If FS2 had hiss, that'd be a problem because FS2 sounds too rich to have any hiss. But FS1 can get away with it, as the sound quality isn't exactly supreme top notch anyway.
What the hell was the sound format in vanilla FS1 anyway? Microsoft ADPCM WAV files running at like 14K or something? I can't check at the moment. All i know is that it was extremely low. Same with FS2..
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Perhaps Dan knew that the final tracks would be in mono format anyway to save space, and recorded the tracks down the center channel. With the exception of a few parts in M2, the entire M1 track, and other bits and pieces, the source files were mainly in in stereo with little stereo effects.
The format of the audio in FS1 was ADPCM WAV, 11,025k, 8 bit. I have 16 bit 44,100K uncompressed rendered WAV's running at 14K/sec, most of it is like that anyway. Some FS2 material is only in 22,050K.
As far as the hiss goes on the tracks, I will perform a light cleanup, and post a comparison track to see if everyone approves. If the hiss cutting takes out too much of the highs, then I just might leave them in thier original form, and it'll be up to others to modify it as they see fit. I just hate to lose a lot of fidelity.
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What happened to these files !?! They're gone ! :(
Does anyone have a link or a mirror or some kind of explanation ! :eek:
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Yeah, I was about to ask the same thing. :p
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Oh well i guess i'll just have to wait until someone with the files wakes up from hibernation, which could be a long time :D
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Just wondering if anyone has bothered trying to write a score for the music?
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Here you go. I uploaded the files to QuickSharing.com. It's a single file 7zip archive containing all the music that used to be in the Nix's folder. Here you can find the file:
Download page (http://s28.quicksharing.com/v/6148579/FS1_2_music.7z.html). Even the Download button is clearly visible... Filesize is 125 MB, will be deleted after 30 days of not being accessed. That should do for the time being, I suppose.
:)
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So was the whole project completed or just thrown to the side?
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Well, Nix's last active time is December 1st, so perhaps he just has some RL things to do. It's definitely not completed yet, but I don't think it has been "thrown aside"...
There could be many reasons to why the files aren't in his audio folder any more. Like, perhaps he had to free some quota for other files so he temporarily took the "appetizers" away. I know I've had to do that on my public html quota (which, on the other hand, is pathetically small at 60 MB soft limit).
I think that if the project was halted, he would've also updated his frontpage and announced that the project was no more, but that hasn't happened. I think it's best to enjoy what we've got, and wait patiently for news from Nix. While the waiting is going on, anyone who hasn't got the files can download them from here (link is also on my previous message, along with a better description):
http://s28.quicksharing.com/v/6148579/FS1_2_music.7z.html (http://s28.quicksharing.com/v/6148579/FS1_2_music.7z.html)
Be strong in yer faith, brothers (and sisters). :)
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Nix got a one week temp-ban for ignoring Karajorma's request to not reply to Kazan. December 1st should be during or after that time, but I havent seen him post since. Im hoping he didnt drop this as a protest of some sort. :(
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:( I hope he comes back soon!
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He's updated his frontpage...
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Would you mind getting rid of that scrolling **** in your sig? You might not realise it, but it's extroadinarily annoying. The same goes for the highlighting.
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Fixed. :)
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Thankyou very much. :)
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Right now I have a sudden urge to listen to the composition used for FS1's ending, the one where the Luci goes byebye and splits in half.
Dang, when I first saw that, I was so freaked out, I had trouble sleeping (playing at night). I freaked myself out again yesterday by watching the video for nostalgia's sake... :shaking:
Hope all goes well for Nix... :)
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I'm back. Taristin was right, and I'm real busy as well, but I'm hoping I can find a little bit of time to put some more back up as FLAC's. I goofed up when I was re arranging stuff for my website and accidentally nixed the derelict and audio files. I'll have some up soon though.
And even gooder news, Dan has contacted me again, and the other things I mentioned, but cant talk about, well they're pretty much done. I still have to wait a little bit before I reveal what's up though. And all the missing tracks, Dan is going to take a look again and see what he can find. If he can find the Silent Threat tracks, we'll be in business completeness wise. If not, there's probably going to be a few here and there that won't be updated. As for the FS2 tracks that are in 22K only as well, they might only be available in 22K, as the whole project had to be compressed down. It all depends on if he's got em or not.
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Sounds good Nix. Look forwards to hearing them.
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Everything sounds very good!! I especially like the intro music. :)
EDIT: I really like the betamainhall too.
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Yeah, it's bad, the main hall beta sounds better than the one used.
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Yeah, it's bad, the main hall beta sounds better than the one used.
Remembering the discussion about this earlier, did anyone give Woo a shout about using betamainhall as the Inferno mainhall theme?
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I did. He didn't respond.
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Well, I for one am going to toss that file into my Inferno folder and rename it if necessary so that it will be played instead of the original Inferno mainhall track. :)
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Well, I for one am going to toss that file into my Inferno folder and rename it if necessary so that it will be played instead of the original Inferno mainhall track. :)
Hmm, good idea...
EDIT: INF:A uses the betamainhall as its mainhall track! Whoo-hoo!
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Nix, how about releasing a few more of these? :) Pretty much anything would be good to have.
Do you happen to have the music from the Ancient monologues? That might be interesting to hear.
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Sure thing, I'll have some of these up soon, probably tomorrow sometime, if I can wake up early enough to do it before work.
I'm still working on reducing hiss on original FS1 material. I'm going to post a couple of FLAC samples, and I'd like to know what you think about them. Since all tracks have this hiss at this frequency range, I'm pretty sure I could just apply it globally across all files, though that could be risky. Unfortunately they sound... "flat" to me with the hiss cut applied. Who knows, maybe I might have burned myself out that day, I've been too busy since then to get any work on this done, with finals at school. They're done now but I'm starting the process of moving home and settling in. Once I've done that, I'll have more time. In the meantime, I'll get tracks posted again.
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They sounded slightly flatter to me too with the hiss removal. However, I think I prefer that to the hiss on most of them. The hiss is really distracting IMO. I need to try saving the flacs as oggs and see if that changes anything; as I remarked earlier, it's not quite so bad in the oggs you posted for some reason.
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I've noticed that too upon a second listen. Being as they will be directly encoded from WAV to OGG in the VP, that's what you'll have. The web archive, I might edit all of the tracks, given time.
Anyways, as of tonight I've re-upped the tracks along with a few others in FLAC format. If downloading any track requires you to log in to fileshack, I'll trim it down a bit to get it under that filesize limit.
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Wow. Tons of great stuff there. :yes: I love the trailer tracks. The FS2 ambient C music is interesting, as it sounds very different than the normal one, but I can think of several possible uses for it.
The drum beats in FS1 Brief 2 have a slight "crackle" in them in some places, but I can't tell whether that was intentional or not. Other than that, I actually like this version a bit better than the normal one (leaving aside the quality improvement).
I didn't notice the hiss in any of these, although I wasn't really looking for it. Did you do something to remove it?
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Not this time around, these were direct FLAC encodes, set at quality 2, which is darn close to the WAV's quality. I'll post a comparison track later tonight after I process it.
I've noticed that the FS1 brief tracks do have a bit of crackle, either that or my cans are blown already (I hope not, I'm going to have to test...)
EDIT: I've uploaded a few tracks in a mix <a href="http://nix1999.shackspace.com/audio/hisscuttest.flac> here[/url]. Let me know what you think, if it's less noticeable, same settings here, in FLAC Quality 2.
Ambient C, is that the Fs_Menace track? I think it was his base track used to record the final mix. Really interesting, hearing individual elements like this. The FS_Drums2 track is used in FS2BtlG03, and also used in the track "Spectre" in Red Faction.
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After listening to the Brief 2 one several times, I think it just wasn't recorded at the same sampling rate as most of the others. The bassy drum beats clearly wash out the background tune around the beginning of the soundtrack. The quality is still miles ahead of the original anyway. :)
Ambient C, is that the Fs_Menace track? I think it was his base track used to record the final mix. Really interesting, hearing individual elements like this.
Yeah, I think it would make a very nice "spooky" ambient track, more so than the finished version. I might use it in one place in my campaign.
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I will say this, to be perfectly honest. A few of these tracks just sound.. odd. The quality is good, but a few of them sound like they were overdriven. Theres not too much I can do for those tracks.
BTW, do you use the Beyerdynamic DT770's as well? I've had mine for about nine months and I think both drivers are blown. This is odd, because even my old MDR-V700DJ headphones worked longer than that before the right driver blew. I had those for a year and a half. I have a pair of MDR-CD780's, for three years and they haven't blown, but don't offer the isolation and response like the DT770's do. Luckily I think the seller I bought them from actually honors the warranty, as he's still selling brand new in box DT770's with warranties. I've used them directly with my Sound Blaster X-Fi card, nothing else, and they're the 80 Ohm version. I wonder if they're just distorting from being underpowered perhaps? I know if I were to use the 250 Ohm cans, I'd need to use an amp, most likely... What do you think, CP?
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I will say this, to be perfectly honest. A few of these tracks just sound.. odd. The quality is good, but a few of them sound like they were overdriven. Theres not too much I can do for those tracks.
I know what you mean. FS1 Brief 2 and FS2 Brief 4 are probably the best examples of that.
BTW, do you use the Beyerdynamic DT770's as well? I've had mine for about nine months and I think both drivers are blown. This is odd, because even my old MDR-V700DJ headphones worked longer than that before the right driver blew. I had those for a year and a half. I have a pair of MDR-CD780's, for three years and they haven't blown, but don't offer the isolation and response like the DT770's do. Luckily I think the seller I bought them from actually honors the warranty, as he's still selling brand new in box DT770's with warranties. I've used them directly with my Sound Blaster X-Fi card, nothing else, and they're the 80 Ohm version. I wonder if they're just distorting from being underpowered perhaps? I know if I were to use the 250 Ohm cans, I'd need to use an amp, most likely... What do you think, CP?
I actually have the DT250, which are from their studio monitor line. I've had them for about 18 months with no issues. You could try getting yours replaced, as the DT770 is becoming increasingly highly recommended these days as a general purpose gaming/music headphone. I was planning to get one myself at some point.
The x-fi should be fine with 80 ohm models. The one I have is also rated at 80 ohms and I find that the volume is comfortably loud at one notch over the half point in the Windows volume control. There are some good amps available on ebay for cheap though, around $40 or so (there is one guy selling amps built around boxes of breathmints that many say are exceptional for the price, but I can't remember the name now :p).
By the way, do you have the 2006 version of the DT770 or the older 2003 version? (they look quite different so it's easy to tell) Headroom claims that the 2006 version sounds a lot better, although the comments I've seen on forums indicate that they are fairly similar.
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EDIT: I've uploaded a few tracks in a mix here. Let me know what you think, if it's less noticeable, same settings here, in FLAC Quality 2.
Just noticed this. It's a definite improvement over the original one. The hiss is still quite noticeable, but it seems to be a good compromise between having the hiss and cutting out details.
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I actually have the DT770 Pro, which is from the "broadcast, studio, video & production" line, the ones people have called "DT 1980's" due to the dated look. I'm going to email the guy I got em from as he's probably an authorized Beyerdynamic warranty guy. It's odd, cause the cheaper, muddier sony headphones have lasted longer than these, and these were genuinely new when I got them. They might not look like much, but they're comfortable, and do the job right, when they don't sound blown that is...
I can still pick out the hiss myself in the tracks, but if I increase the cut any more from this point, it cuts out a lot of the high-frequency sounds, resulting in a really flattened high end, and in my mind, a severe loss of fidelity. Increasing the cut makes it sound like it's playing from inside another room, for example. Maybe I should encode this in OGG, because the hiss is fairly reduced under OGG encoding, as evidenced before.
Edit - Again: I've uploaded an OGG-version of the hiss cut test, under the same name with the .ogg extension. Filesize is cut down quite a bit, but there's a minor difference in quality. This was encoded VBR, Quality 7. I think I'll be using this in the VP, Q7 that is. ;)
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Yeah, I think that's the older model. You're actually the first person I've seen having problems with those; the Beyer cans in general are well known for their long term durability. Where did you get yours? Mine came off ebay (for $135 instead of the normal $200 price :D), although it was new and the seller was an online store that has their own website elsewhere.
I tried out the ogg and there was no perceptible difference in the hiss this time. So much for that theory. :p I think that particular piece (FS2 ambient 3 part A) is just somewhat quieter than the other tracks, which may be making the hiss more noticeable. You may want to apply the full hiss removal to that one only, which sounds very low quality anyway.
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Why does the stuff that wasn't used in the game sound so much better......
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This stuff is great! Good luck finding the rest!
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Why does the stuff that wasn't used in the game sound so much better......
Because you're hearing it for the first time, and therefore it's more impressive to you.
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I have started to put some of the stuff you uploaded into the game (the FS2 ones, mainly). The briefing tracks are very easy to do (only some volume adjustments needed), but the ingame ones take some more work. As long as the new tracks are the same length as the old ones, we can use the existing data in music.tbl to get the new values for the parameters.
What compression level are you using for the oggs that are going into the game? I have been using the 256kb/sec setting in Goldwave and they're generally coming out indistinguishable from the flacs. The samples per measure values in music.tbl depend on the bitrate.
How much space does that Shackspace service give you? Can you upload some more? I'm just itching to get more of these things. :D
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Sorry for the delay, I've been caught up in a lot of real-life stuff lately, mainly moving all the stuff I own into my girlfriend's house, and getting my old job back. This weekend I'll probably have the time to get the office assembled, and later on I'll be able to actually make progress on this again. I'm actually waiting on Dan for some more material before I get way too far ahead of myself. In fact, I'll PM you with more, CP.
Anyways, to awnser your questions directly, I'm using Quality 7 on the OGGs. I'm sure for the 44K tracks, all we need to do is double the timing numbers to get the correct timing + "lean in" that Dan had originally intended. Getting the raw values will play the track from start to finish, then start again. With the lead-in, I think it sorta mixes them into each other for a more seamless feel. I don't have access to Freespace at the moment to check though. Shackspace gives you a gig, and if I just compress and upload, I'm sure everything would fit, but there's a lot of redundant stuff on the DVD I have. It's just a matter of weeding everything out, in that respect.
Yes, I know I've been slow, but I know I'll have time in the future to get back to this. Sorry to keep everyone waiting.
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There's still no sign of cinema2 :(
Oh well, they're all kickass. :D
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Sorry for the delay, I've been caught up in a lot of real-life stuff lately, mainly moving all the stuff I own into my girlfriend's house, and getting my old job back. This weekend I'll probably have the time to get the office assembled, and later on I'll be able to actually make progress on this again. I'm actually waiting on Dan for some more material before I get way too far ahead of myself. In fact, I'll PM you with more, CP.
Anyways, to awnser your questions directly, I'm using Quality 7 on the OGGs. I'm sure for the 44K tracks, all we need to do is double the timing numbers to get the correct timing + "lean in" that Dan had originally intended. Getting the raw values will play the track from start to finish, then start again. With the lead-in, I think it sorta mixes them into each other for a more seamless feel. I don't have access to Freespace at the moment to check though. Shackspace gives you a gig, and if I just compress and upload, I'm sure everything would fit, but there's a lot of redundant stuff on the DVD I have. It's just a matter of weeding everything out, in that respect.
Yes, I know I've been slow, but I know I'll have time in the future to get back to this. Sorry to keep everyone waiting.
No problem, I replied to your PM. It looks like I have been using quality 8, so I might cut that down a bit. One of the numbers should be easy to compute, although I think they depend on the bitrate so they may come out a little different depending on the type of ogg compression used. I need to double check that though. The thing with the timing numbers is that they aren't based on the length of the file, but on some other component of the music. In most cases this shouldn't matter though.
There's still no sign of cinema2 :(
Oh well, they're all kickass. :D
He posted it already. It's called introextendedmix or something.
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Either that, or BlackWater Operations, but that's just a wild guess as I have no idea about whether it'd fit BWO's content or not.
BWO has some custom music that's a bit more of a Tom Clancy-esque feel. But at the same time some tracks have FS1 themes like the beta music.
This stuff is awesome, and some of it will be definately used in BWO for at the very least briefing tracks. "Menace" definately fits with the mood of one of the secret missions...
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I know one of those files is an OGG Vorbis audio file, but what about the rest? What format are they? What program would I use to listen to them?
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flac
There are several free plugins for Winamp that let you open these files; a google search should turn up a bunch of them.
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I have a codec pack for Windows Media Player that allows it to handle both OGG and FLAC. There's also a free media program called Quintessential that can play oggs with no additional support, though I don't think it's equipped to handle FLACs.
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http://www.foobar2000.org/
Can play FLAC
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When this is done, will it be included in the FSO downloads? Or will we have to pick it out separately? I'd nominate this for a sticky just to keep track of it.
Still downloading the first audio file. Which file do I have to dig into to find the old game music? I'll go digging through right now, but please respond anyways. :)
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They're in freespace.vp (FS1) and warble_fs2.vp (FS2).
They will be added to the mv_music media VP eventually, although there is some work needed to get them into the game.
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Is the game able to play them as-is? Or do they need to be converted to .wavs if we want to use them now (I'm refering here to those several songs posted that weren't in the game, and therefore don't have a .wav alternative already in the VP)?
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It depends on where you want to use them. For briefing and mainhall tracks, all you need to do is make them into oggs (if they aren't already) and drop the filenames into music.tbl. It's the ingame tracks that are a bit more complicated.
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...make them into oggs (if they aren't already) and drop the filenames into music.tbl...
Which reminds me, the updated 3.6.9 build, and all future builds, will ignore the file extension on music.tbl entries. It will instead try for both .ogg and .wav, searching for .ogg first and then .wav, for each directory. The first one it finds it will try and use. It's the first use of the new searching function outside of the movie player code. This allows it to search for both formats at the exact same time, so there are no real priority issues, it will just load the first filename of either format that it finds. The normal sound code (sound.tbl) will be the next to get this change, but not until 3.6.10.
Hopefully this change will make life a little bit easier on everyone. :)
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That sounds convenient but might actually cause a few problems. One of the music.tbl parameters is based on the bitrate and would vary depending on whether the file is an ogg or one of the old, low quality wavs.
Would this also work for voice files later on? That would save a little work for something in my campaign in the future.
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That sounds convenient but might actually cause a few problems. One of the music.tbl parameters is based on the bitrate and would vary depending on whether the file is an ogg or one of the old, low quality wavs.
I would really, really like that to be automatic. I don't actually know what that parameter actually measures though (I did know at one point, I just didn't care, and have since forgotten ;)). If it's something that we can actually figure out when loading the file then we can code it in rather than having it in the tbl. I have a feeling that it would be more preference rather than a code definable setting though.
Would this also work for voice files later on? That would save a little work for something in my campaign in the future.
Yep, the plan is to convert everything to do it. Though, the current code will actually do this for anything which is streamed, including all music and most voices (de/briefing, etc). The main reason that audiostr (the music/voice code) got this first is to prevent a crash if it happened to try and load a Theora movie by mistake.
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The values in the TBL are defined as "Number of measures" and "Samples per measure", going by that, neither one should be preference-based or dependant on bitrate.
In fact, given that fs2_open plays VBR OGG (Vorbis :p) files, having it based on bitrate would make it virtually impossible to have any kind of consistent marking.
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According to Goober's comments on the wiki (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/Music.tbl), the samples per measure value is obtained from the number of measures and the average bitrate. I guess the game could automatically determine that from the file size though.
The number of measures is actually more of a problem. I don't know of any simple way to find that value apart from trial and error (I can't make any sense of what Goober is talking about there), although that doesn't have anything to do with the music file quality.
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Well, first of all, I'd take all that information with a grain of salt. The last time I tried to figure out Goober's music.tbl instructions, they didn't make any sense given how it should work, and when I checked the code, I only saw a partial relation in how it actually did work. That was awhile back though, and to be fair, Goober's instructions may have worked at some point in time.
Second of all, I think you're confusing bitrate with the bits per sample, because I did a text search on that page and don't see 'rate' anywhere.
Here goes...
Description of terms
Sample - A 'sample' is a measure of sound, a snapshot of it, if you will. Think of it as a frame in an animation
Sample Rate - The number of samples per second. The higher this is, the more samples you have, and thus the better sounding your sound file is. Music may be specified in hertz or kilohertz. A good-quality sounding file will generally be about 44100hz, or 44.1khz, which means that in one second, approximately 44 thousand samples are played.
Bits per sample - How much data each sample contains. Sizes are usually 8 bits or 16 bits, and in professional audio circles, up to 24 bits or more. The larger this is, the more range each sample has. This is not to be confused with bitrate; they are completely different.
Bitrate - Bitrate is used for compression algorithms. Basically what the bitrate means is that X bytes of data will be used to store information in a second. This is akin to varying the compression numbers on a JPEG image. 128-192kbps is generally regarded as CD-quality compression for OGG and MP3. However, with variable bitrate files, the encoder will actually remove sound data that would be inaudible or barely noticeable to the human ear.
Measure - A measure is not really a technical term, but a music term, and for Freespace purposes, it means a section of music. If you had a one-minute piece of music, the beats per minute could be identical as the number of measures in the wave. For a 2 minute file, it could be 2 x BPM. However, it really depends on the piece of the music. The reason Freespace2 wants this, is that it'll assume that the end of a measure is a graceful point to transition to the next song. (At least, that's my understanding of it)
How to use them
I've attached two images to this post, both are the output from a foobar2000 properties window. The first is for an OGG, the second is for a wave. Note that the OGG file does not list the bits per sample. All OGG files are decoded at 16 bits per sample in fs2_open, regardless of their bitrate; this is something that you specify within the program itself that's playing the OGG, rather than the file.
All that follows is based in an ideal world, where the TBL functions do exactly what they're supposed to.
Num measures
This is really up to your ear, because it's completely dependant on the music. For "Don't Panic", I'm going to throw out an arbitrary value that every measure should last 5 seconds. So, I use the formula
Total Length / Sample Length = Number of measures
Doing a bit of rounding, for "Don't Panic", I get:
135 / 5 = 27 measures
Samples per measure
If you already know the measure length, you can just do:
Sample Rate x Measure Length = Number of Samples
So for the OGG:
44100 * 5 = 220500 samples
Final Note
If for whatever reason, you know exactly how many measures you have in a file, but not how many samples, you can use the number of samples (just under the grey header for the second section)
Num Samples / Num Measures = Num Samples per Measure
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Well, first of all, I'd take all that information with a grain of salt. The last time I tried to figure out Goober's music.tbl instructions, they didn't make any sense given how it should work, and when I checked the code, I only saw a partial relation in how it actually did work. That was awhile back though, and to be fair, Goober's instructions may have worked at some point in time.
Second of all, I think you're confusing bitrate with the bits per sample, because I did a text search on that page and don't see 'rate' anywhere.
The bitrate is the same thing as the kb/sec value, which is what Goober refers to there. The oggs have a variable bitrate as you said, but from what Goober is saying I think it's just looking for the average bitrate over the entire file.
You may be right about the rest though. :p It's been a while since I last did anything with music.tbl, but I don't remember ever having to take any bitrate changes into account (when switching to a higher quality file). The bits per sample is the only thing that seemed to matter. Now that I look at it again, I think Goober's instructions may be making this more complicated than it really is.
Measure - A measure is not really a technical term, but a music term, and for Freespace purposes, it means a section of music. If you had a one-minute piece of music, the beats per minute could be identical as the number of measures in the wave. For a 2 minute file, it could be 2 x BPM. However, it really depends on the piece of the music. The reason Freespace2 wants this, is that it'll assume that the end of a measure is a graceful point to transition to the next song. (At least, that's my understanding of it)
I see, this is the main thing I was having trouble with. But what exactly counts as a beat? Take something like battle part 2 of track F for example. It seems to have "big" beats every two seconds along with a bunch of smaller beats interspersed in between.
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If there's a technical definition for a beat beyond 'an interval in music at which a sound is regularly heard', I'm not aware of it. :p That is entirely up to the musician. If your song had lyrics, you might want each measure to be at the end of a line. Or you might want it to be at the end of each stanza.
I read through the wiki again, and I think I see what you're talking about.
A stereo track at 44,100 Hz will be 172 kilobytes per second
And this should be completely irrelevant for filling out the music.tbl (in the aforementioned ideal world). Although it is, technically, correct. OGG files are decoded to PCM before being sent off to OpenAL anyways, so it should be possible to do all the math consistently for WAV and OGG files, and ignore the bitrate of OGG files altogether.
I could see Goober's odd instructions being correct is if :V: made a mistake in coding the music.tbl in the first place. It's entirely possible, but I have yet to see any proof of it...
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All I want is Anciants, and all the FS2 Battle Musics
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I'd like to request M3 and M10 for the next round! :)
We really should try and get these all up in one place.
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Measure - A measure is not really a technical term, but a music term, and for Freespace purposes, it means a section of music. If you had a one-minute piece of music, the beats per minute could be identical as the number of measures in the wave. For a 2 minute file, it could be 2 x BPM. However, it really depends on the piece of the music. The reason Freespace2 wants this, is that it'll assume that the end of a measure is a graceful point to transition to the next song. (At least, that's my understanding of it)
Actually, tracks *should* always end so that an even number of measures in that track have been played. That's because almost every piece of music has an even number of measures... so having a track to switch at the end of an odd (uneven) measure would not be much better than having the tracks switch mid-measure.
I dunno how it's coded, though, but musically it should be like that.
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So it's been a while since any updates were made... Is there anything to report, or is it essentially abandoned / put on hold?
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Not abandoned. CP5670 and I are trying to get this done. I haven't heard back from Dan on the files we're missing. I've pretty much given him (CP5670) everything that I have, and he's working up the tables and such. I'm trying to find free time to sit down and do processing and such, but I'm sure we got a big chunk of this down. I do want to assure you that it's not abandoned. I've been way out of the loop for a while due to me quitting my old job and getting a new job with the BLM out here. It's been pretty busy on my end filling out endless paperwork just to be hired. (Welcome to the US Government!) I'll try to get back on track as soon as I can, but I'm pretty much tied down with some of the missing stuff. That's all up to Dan, and I'm sure he's quite busy with composing for current V projects. I'll drop him a line this weekend to check in on status.
Sorry for the delay everyone
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I have most of the available FS2 tracks working correctly now. The table data for the ingame music hasn't been set up yet, but there are some changes being made to how the game handles that, so I'm holding off on it.
I have uploaded the briefing and menu tracks that we have here (http://procyon.freespacemods.net/fs2brief.rar), if anyone is interested. I had to make subtle changes to a few of them to make them match the lengths of the originals. They're not perfect, but they sound pretty good to me. You can dump these into the data\music and data\tables folders (it would be a good idea to create a mod folder and put them in there) and the game will play them fine.
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By the way, for future reference, I found out how the music.tbl parameters work. The samples per measure is computed using the formula SPM = (2*SF*L)/NM, where SF is the sampling frequency in hz , L is length of the music piece in seconds (only up to the point where the game is supposed to truncate it, not necessarily the length of the entire file), and NM is the number of measures. It turns out that the NM value is actually irrelevant. You can put in anything for it as long as the SPM is calculated correctly, since the game just multiplies them together.
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you know, Dan had mentioned that if the source files are in 22K, all we'd need to do is double the SPM value. Somehow... I didn't think it was going to be that easy, especially for the slightly longer tracks here and there. I spent quite a few nights with what Dan told me, and what Goober posted in the wiki and I couldn't ever get the tracks to line up right. I couldn't even get the correct sample values to show up when I did my calculations on paper. They wouldn't match Sound Forge's Samples measurements, I'd be millions of samples off.
Anywho, I will definitely check this out tonight, downloading it now. Thanks for your help on this project!
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No problem. :) Yeah, Dan is correct there. I think you can just disregard Goober's instructions. They make even less sense to me now that I know how it works. :p The L values are really the only thing that the game actually uses; they tell the game where to place the transitions between music pieces.
Do the Brief3 and Brief5 tracks sound okay to you? You'll notice that they were both taken from the FS2_Brief_03 file, but certain parts of the music that are repeated twice in the original versions are only played once in the file, so I had to cut and paste/mix pieces of them to make them sound right. This may actually be the background track for the Colossus movie, which has them merged together like this. The DVD archive also contains separated copies of these tracks, but they're among the files that are only in 22khz.
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05 sounds pretty good as is. I will have to break out the fine-toothed comb for 03 and re-up back to ya. I'll see what I can do for that one. Otherwise, it all sounds pretty darn good. I have yet to test in-game tonight, probably do this on monday in the afternoon. I love paid holidays!
I can also hear that 04 had been downsampled, then re-upsampled back up to 44K, either that or the "magnitude" of the volume is way too high. It sounds distorted, and that's the way it's always been from source. It does sound good enough though to do better than what's already ingame, but I have told dan awhile back of what we're missing.
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I noticed the same thing with 04. We have a couple of different versions of that one, but they all sound either the same as this or worse.
See if you can do better with 03. I'm not entirely happy with that one either. The thing with it is that the part at the beginning (which is what needs to be repeated) is merged into the end of the 05 music. This makes duplicating it somewhat harder than it would normally be, since you can hear bits of 05 right at the merging point.
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Yeah, Dan is correct there. I think you can just disregard Goober's instructions. They make even less sense to me now that I know how it works. :p
Oops. :nervous:
Would you mind updating the wiki? :)
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Okay, done. Hope you don't mind that I removed your instructions, to prevent any further confusion with this.
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K. :)
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CP, check here (http://nix1999.shackspace.com/audio/test) for my fix for 03. It's still got a noticeable bump, but I think I have it trimmed down a little bit more. let me know if it sounds ok.
eek. just noticed that the phrase doesn't fit that I copied/pasted.... hmm... not much we can do on this one. What about leaving it as it is with the two merged together? it'd probably be overused if we did that.. hmm..
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The timing in your version seems off. See if you can get the parts aligned.
As for keeping them as they are, it wouldn't really sound right given what we're used to. I would rather leave the bump in there. Actually, if you listen to the original 03, it has a similar bump (or a pause, rather) at that point too, so we wouldn't be losing much.
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You're right, well, there might be a hiccup in the middle of it (final version of the hi-res track). I will try to minimize the effect as much as possible with what I have to work with. I'll have results soon. I took a crack at it tonight, but I'm not happy with the results just yet.
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By the way, I find that it's helpful to have the original (22khz) music open along with the one I'm editing. You can repeatedly play them side by side until they have exactly the same timing/beat.
It looks like Taylor has fixed the music switching issues, so the new ingame music should now work properly. I'll try them out when I get home.
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Any idea when the Silent Threat music track will be available?
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Still waiting on Dan for most everything concerning Silent Threat tracks. I'll be writing him in a few minutes to check on things, I have a feeling he didn't get my last message, my outgoing mail server has been acting up lately.
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Do you want to use Gmail? Just go to http://mail.google.com and sign up.
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CP, Check the test area again, this one has a hiccup in it but at least the phrasing is right. I'm still trying to figure out how Dan did that in the original file. Quite puzzling.
There's my problem, the way my ISP's set up, sometimes it works, sometimes it wants my mail client to use it's own mail server. Anyway, I've fixed that problem, and my email went through last night. Depending on how busy he is, will determine how quick I'll get a response.
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This sounds a lot better, but the transition is still somewhat abrupt. I see what you're trying to do here though. Try adding a small fade out / fade in effect on each of the two pieces at the joining point (or maybe only on the second piece) and make them slightly overlap. That may get rid of the sudden change in the pitch of the background tune.
The other option is to use the beat (or whatever it's called) at the merging point to mask the transition, the way I did, but that also sounds a little funny.
I guess if Dan can send us the high quality sample of the final version of this music, messing around with this won't be necessary.
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... If you use the music.tbl correctly, IIRC the transitions should be flawless. Me & my bro figured out what the values were for once, but I'd have to check again...
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What we're trying to do is make this track the same length as the original track. In order to do this, the first phrase needs to be repeated before moving into the second half of the music. Unfortunately, the start beat for this track is mixed into the last note of the previous phrase. Our source file has shortened versions of two retail released tracks, which are mixed in together. It's about editing and such, nothing we can do with tables here.
I listened to the original shipped version of the track and that's exactly what Dan did, a fade-in from the start, then it sounds like he went and extended the middle phrase, either by taking a section of track and reversing it or just lengthening that one particular note at the abrupt change. I have no idea... but it's proving to be pretty difficult to line up without that dangling note from the previous phrase.
Anyways, news from Dan!
Good news - He's found some missing Silent Threat material, and has found some other goodies.
Bad news - We may not see it until after April, as he's busy working on their current unannounced project. As far as things like that go, we're still working on tracks here and there, so we'll probaby not get this done till around then anyway.
Keep in mind that he's doing this in his spare time, and fully willing to pitch in and do this. I am all for giving him as much time as he needs to get it done right, because when it's all done, it'll be worth the wait. Very much worth the wait.
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I wish I could get MIDI versions of a couple of them...
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Status Update - long overdue
I've pretty much put this on hold again, because of a LOT of real-life events that have happened recently. Lots has happened, preventing me from even hopping on my personal computer to do anything at all. I have an email backlog about a month long that I'm still filtering out. In that, Dan had wrote me last week, or rather forwarded me a message, concerning the original tracks. Other people are interested in this, as I can see, which is a good thing.
I'm now settled in, settled down, and I should have more time in the coming weeks to work on this, to hopefully put out some kind of release soon. Dan is still busy, hard at work on Volition's next project, still unannounced. (To my knowledge, I've been away from the "civilian" internet for months now). So I still haven't heard any word on new material, but I know that he's still working on it, in as little spare time that he has. In the meantime.. I'm going to try to get something out there that's usable, as a taste of what's to come.
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I have actually been using the high quality FS2 tracks we currently have for a while now. The only reason I haven't released them yet is that they need an especially recent FS2 build to fully work at the moment, and this build has a few other bugs of its own. The next available build should correct these things though.
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:yes:
Sounds good. Has the table structure changed at all? I'm so behind on all of this. :sigh:
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It's the same; the only change is to how the game searches for the actual music files. There are some strange bugs with 3.6.9 in that respect and it's only one of the newer builds, Taylor's 3/23 one, that fixes them entirely. It still has the fade bug and a few other things though, so I'll wait for the next build before releasing what I have.
By the way, if you're finding that you're too busy with real life to keep up with this regularly, feel free to give Dan my email and contact information.
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Also, while we're waiting on the things mentioned above, I'm going to go ahead and release this gem:
http://cp.nukelol.com/BiteMeJason2.MP3
For everyone else: this was among the files in the masters package. :D
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That is so beautiful!!
"I've got a visual on somethin' BIIIG"
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Also, while we're waiting on the things mentioned above, I'm going to go ahead and release this gem:
http://cp.nukelol.com/BiteMeJason2.MP3
For everyone else: this was among the files in the masters package. :D
:lol:
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Master's Package?
"Damn it it's unknowun and it's incoming. Can it be that too?"
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I meant the original music archive that we got from Dan Wentz.
I guess this is what the Volition guys do in their free time. :D
"When I make Admiral, heads will roll!"
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Everything I see just keeps proving more and more that Volition had fun making FS 2.
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I want the soundtracks. Where I can find them? :blah:
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Also, while we're waiting on the things mentioned above, I'm going to go ahead and release this gem:
(file)
For everyone else: this was among the files in the masters package. :D
LOL....
(though in a way, I was surprised at the... umm... coarse language... O_O)
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I want the soundtracks. Where I can find them? :blah:
I'm working on mixdowns to be posted on the web, in FLAC format. That, and taking an honest attempt at getting tables/FSO to see the music for FS1 material using the FSPort. My life has been straightened out now and I have time to actually *WORK* on this again.
BTW, Still waiting to hear from Dan concerning missing material from the masters package. No news there yet.
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Everything I see just keeps proving more and more that Volition had fun making FS 2.
Yeah making projects is fun... 'specially MT, we just goof around in internal, that's all we do. Srsly.
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I can't listen to .flac files. Can't you make'em as .ogg files? That I can play.
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like an uncompressed high-def version of the FS1 intro,
I MUST get my grubby little hands on this, do you know if he still has access to it and can share?
Thanks ;)
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That particular one was available on the Volition site, so we have had it for many years. I can upload it if you want.
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high def FS1 intro?!
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I can't listen to .flac files. Can't you make'em as .ogg files? That I can play.
Winamp can play them.... and many others, as well. (IIRC, Media Player Classic does as well)
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That particular one was available on the Volition site, so we have had it for many years. I can upload it if you want.
The high def one? Yes please!
Thanks much, what resolution is it in? (1080i?)
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eh? It's only the audio I was referring to, not the movie itself.
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what about fs2btlc1-3? i know they may have been said before, but i can't be arsed to read through 10 pages...
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We have 3, but not the other two parts.
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i didn't see 3 anywhere here? (http://nix1999.shackspace.com/audio)
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Only a small portion of the stuff has been uploaded there.
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then where did it all go?
Like i said i can't be bothered to search 10 pages....
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It was never uploaded. :p It's on a DVD that Dan Wentz sent to Nix, who in turn sent me a copy. If you want a particular file, I can upload it if we have it, although I can't put everything up.
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well the fs2btlc1-3 is all i want, if you can put it up.
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It was never uploaded. :p It's on a DVD that Dan Wentz sent to Nix, who in turn sent me a copy. If you want a particular file, I can upload it if we have it, although I can't put everything up.
So where can we get more?
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If you can send me that, I think I can upload it all... Hades Combine? Well, if you want me to, that is...
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There is a lot of redundant or useless stuff on there. I don't think there is much point in uploading everything. I will instead put up the FS2 music vp I've been using. This contains all the FS2 tracks we have so far. I was planning to release this when the 3.6.9/3.6.10 VPs came out, but those have been delayed quite a bit so there's no point waiting further.
http://cp.nukelol.com/mv_music.zip
You'll need a build from February 27 or later (which is after 3.6.9) to have this work perfectly. It should mostly work on 3.6.9, but with some minor glitches.
The DVD also has about 20 new pieces that weren't in either game. Some are only a few seconds long while others are full fledged pieces. Nix uploaded most of them already on the link on the first page, but there are a few more. I'll get around to them later.
[edit] crap, it looks I uploaded an older version of the tbm that doesn't quite work right. I'll put the proper one up in a little bit.
[edit2] The fixed version is up.
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Anyone found that HD FS1 intro yet?
Thanks ;)
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There is a lot of redundant or useless stuff on there. I don't think there is much point in uploading everything. I will instead put up the FS2 music vp I've been using. This contains all the FS2 tracks we have so far. I was planning to release this when the 3.6.9/3.6.10 VPs came out, but those have been delayed quite a bit so there's no point waiting further.
http://cp.nukelol.com/mvmusicv2.zip
You'll need a build from February 27 or later (which is after 3.6.9) to have this work perfectly. It should mostly work on 3.6.9, but with some minor glitches.
The DVD also has about 20 new pieces that weren't in either game. Some are only a few seconds long while others are full fledged pieces. Nix uploaded most of them already on the link on the first page, but there are a few more. I'll get around to them later.
[edit] crap, it looks I uploaded an older version of the tbm that doesn't quite work right. I'll put the proper one up in a little bit.
[edit2] The fixed version is up.
Link down...
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Sorry, I changed the filename around at one point. The link has been updated.
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I can't listen to .flac files. Can't you make'em as .ogg files? That I can play.
Winamp can play them.... and many others, as well. (IIRC, Media Player Classic does as well)
I installed a few audio converters to convert them to .wav (to put on my iPod)............. but they either don't work, or they crash....
lol nevermind
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Sorry, I changed the filename around at one point. The link has been updated.
Still down..... :(
mv_music version 1 is still up though.......... looks like the file got deleted somehow.
BTW is the FS1 m3_nrml music on the DVD?
lol nevermind, I didn't see the "m3mix.flac".
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The link works for me. Check my original post.
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So its mv_music? Not mv_musicv2?
BTW, can you upload an un-mixed version (if its not too much of a hassle) of the m3_nrml 1-3?
The mixed-up version isn't exactly my cup of tea...
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mv_music and mv_musicv2 doesn't work; I just get a 404.
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Try this:
http://cp.nukelol.com/mv_music.zip
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Yay! Thanks, Harbinger.
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No problem. :)
Woah, how did I get 400 posts?!
I don't remember posting that much! :confused: :eek2: :eek: :shaking: :nervous: :wtf:
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Me neither, but look at mine.
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eehehe... yeah.
Same old story, I've been busy, but.. PROGRESS!
First off, Thanks to Goober's sharp eyes, I simply had wrong filename refrences in my table, to the files in the VP, which was my main hangup in the first place, on the FS1 music package. In-game music does work now. At first, I was using a slightly older build, and the music would be cut off in the middle of the track. After Goober directed me to a particular bug in Mantis, I simply used a new build. Music plays properly now...
But... only on the first mission. Second mission, no music at all, in fact, M1's sountrack is the only one working in-game at the moment. Mainhall plays back, briefings play, but only the first mission actually has working music. I am currently using Goober's recent "Stable Branch"build. I tried what Goober suggested, taking the table from the FSPort and plugging it in with the new music VP. I have the results above. I'm using a bare-bones installation of FS2, with only the FSPort files in it's own directory. I've tried putting everything into root as well, and this doesn't change anything.
I should have some time this weekend to start uploading/creating the FLAC tracks. I'm hoping to have everything done soon. It's taken me more time than I thought since I've upgraded my computer again, running some sweet hardware, but has been pretty touchy out of the box.
And no news from Dan either on the missing Silent Threat material.. that though IS coming soon. I have faith in Dan to get these to us.
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Umm, FSPort music doesn't work correctly with barebones (retail) FS2... you are using barebones FS_Open, right?
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Yes, I'm using Goober's "stable branch" build of FSO right now.
Worked better than the older 3.6.9dot7x or whatever it was I WAS using.
The whole odd thing though, is that when I use Goober's supplied music, everything works right. When I use mine, first mission works... I need to sit down and go over my tables. Perhaps the Stable Branch build might have a problem with FSPort music? I don't want to use a build that's going to corrupt my pilot files, even if I have a backup, because I'm testing things.
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Forgive me if I've missed something due to a lack of reading comprehension, but would it be possible for you to release the remastered FS1 music, even if it's not ready for inclusion in FSPort yet? I really, really like the FS1 music, and i actually prefer it to the FS2 music.
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I'm actually considering it, in mixdown format, meaning a single download for each mission, with the parts spread out in it. I've been having a devil of a time getting everything to work in-game. I'll continue to work on it though because I really REALLY want to see this work in-game. I need to start from scratch again just to make sure I don't have any conflicts table-wise. I know I've said this in August, but I will make good on this.
That, and real-life events have prevented me from working on this. Hell, I hardly have time to play games in general anymore, I bought Bioshock the day it came out and it took me a month to finish it.
So when I can get the tracks uploaded, hopefully keeping them under that silly 20 meg limit, the first post on this thread will be updated with the news.
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What 20 meg limit? If you're trying to go lossless, use FLAC?
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Is that 20MB limit web hosting or a limitation of the game engine?
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if its web related there is always 7zip. Thats a pretty good compression.
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I wonder if this project is really dead...according to the FS Wiki, it is...do we have a chance of getting those uncompressed soundtracks? If not, is there someone able to modify existing soundtracks and make them better?
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Nix did say he would post them, He's just busy.
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Can someone help him? _MaX_? Whoever made WC_Saga_Idea? Black Hole?
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Use Savefile? (http://www.savefile.com) Which is *Bleep* in most days, but has an 60 MB limit per file?
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I can upload the FS1 stuff that we have without any tables or anything, but I would still need a place to put all of it. I think they're a little under 150MB in total.
I can put them on Swantz's nukelol site, but you'll have to persuade him to give me more space there. :p
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O.o MediaFire, RapidShare... put them up on FileFront, and I'll put them up on the previous 2 for safe keeping. I'll just use multi-part archives. Although, 7-zip compression may make that unnecessary, we'll see.
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Why don't you use Hades Combine? It's Krackers87's Birthday today! :D
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FLAC doesn't compress, the only advantage of using an archive is to reduce the number of files to download.
As JR2 says, throw them up on FileFront and people can distribute them to other mirrors.
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:wtf: I've used FLAC... it does compress. Quite well for a lossless algorithm, actually.
Free Lossless Audio Codec (FLAC) is a file format for audio data compression. Being a lossless compression format, FLAC does not remove information from the audio stream, as lossy compression formats such as MP3, AAC, and Vorbis do.
Like other methods of compression, FLAC's main advantage is the reduction of bandwidth or storage requirements, but without sacrificing the integrity of the audio source. For example, a digital recording (such as a CD) encoded to FLAC can be decompressed into an identical copy of the audio data. Audio sources encoded to FLAC are typically reduced in size 40 to 50 percent. (53% according to their own comparison)
FLAC is suitable for everyday playback and audio archival, with support for tagging, cover art and fast seeking. FLAC's free and open source royalty-free nature makes it well-supported by many software applications. FLAC playback support in portable audio devices and dedicated audio systems is limited but growing.[2] Josh Coalson is the primary author of FLAC.
On January 29, 2003, Xiphophorus (now called the Xiph.Org Foundation) announced the incorporation of FLAC under their banner, alongside Vorbis, Theora, Speex, and others.
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Ok, great news.
Could you compress the waiting.flac file this project has previously posted, and tell me how much space you saved? If you can trim a notable amount off the total I might be able to host the downloads.
If on the other hand you get the same thing as myself where the file is actually marginally larger after even ultra LZMA compression then I won't be able to. A few terrabytes of data transfer doesn't really get you far when working with 150MB files.
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I'll do it when I get a chance in about 6 hours from this post.
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I really don't know if I'll be downloading new music. FS2 music is kick-ass as it is already :D
If there's not much difference I see no point. Then again, if there is much difference I see n point in getting it either. LOL
Will have to wait and hear I guess.
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Original size for waiting.flac : 8,057 KB, ~ 8 MB
Decompress wav file: 12.8 MB
Re-compressed flac file with level 8 (max) compression: 7,583 KB, ~ 7.5 MB
Apparently these were encoded with the default level compression, which is 6. But, as it is all lossless, you might as well use level 8.
Now... Why not decompress to wav, and save has VBR-0 (actually, quality: 10.00) .ogg? Shall I try that, and upload it for you to test?
EDIT: Here ya go, non-normalized (http://www.mediafire.com/?dqmuvdgnmip) | normalized with Audiograbber (http://www.mediafire.com/?201xnygcwac) Size for both is ~4,200 KB
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I really don't know if I'll be downloading new music. FS2 music is kick-ass as it is already :D
If there's not much difference I see no point. Then again, if there is much difference I see n point in getting it either. LOL
Will have to wait and hear I guess.
/me face-palms
22KHz sampling is not what I'd call great.
It's not new, more like restored.
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So we're basically just waiting for a place to host this?
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How big is the full package? OGG compressed for release?
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150MB was quoted before JR2 demonstrated he could chop the file sizes in half. I would guess somewhere from 80-100 MB from that, but it is just a guess.
And, erm technically we are waiting for the files. I don't mind hosting a mirror, but the files are a definite requirement to do that.
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I'm always ready to mirror! :p
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Sorry, I forgot all about this earlier. I was pretty busy with real life stuff over the last month.
I'm always ready to mirror! :p
If you increase the space on my account, I'll put it up there. I think it would be about 60MB over my limit right now, since the FS2 music media VP is also on there.
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Hey, that's an interesting new! I'm waiting for that package! :D
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Sorry, I forgot all about this earlier. I was pretty busy with real life stuff over the last month.
I'm always ready to mirror! :p
If you increase the space on my account, I'll put it up there. I think it would be about 60MB over my limit right now, since the FS2 music media VP is also on there.
You have 500 MB, and it says you're only using 125. :)
Did I tell you 200 MB before or something?
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Yes, you did. :p
Well, here it is at last: http://cp.nukelol.com/fs1music.zip
As someone said early in this thread, some of these files won't sound as good as you would expect, simply due to the quality of the instruments used in composing them. Others are in excellent quality, however.
Nix originally wanted to hold off releasing these until a music.tbl for FSPort was ready, but he was running into various problems with it and I have not heard from him for quite some time, so I think it makes sense to just release them as they are. If you get them working in the game, post your music.tbl here. I haven't had much time to look into it myself.
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As someone said early in this thread, some of these files won't sound as good as you would expect, simply due to the quality of the instruments used in composing them. Others are in excellent quality, however.
They all make a distinct difference to the original ones, even if some of them didn't sound as good as others. But aw man. M10 is missing. My favourite track... :(
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http://www.freespacemods.net/download.php?view.58
Got the pack uploaded on FSMods.net too.
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Thank you for ULing them on FSMods.net! :D
Question...does WMP read .flac files(I can't check it right now, I have no audio)?
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I don't think so
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Geez...most files are in .flac format...
Can someone please convert them to .ogg?
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Well, that was the point, Mobius: these are the original high-quality tracks.
Thank you for ULing them on FSMods.net! :D
Question...does WMP read .flac files(I can't check it right now, I have no audio)?
It can, but you need to download the .flac codec.
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Well they should've been converted...
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Well they should've been converted...
No, they shouldn't have.
FLAC is easy to play. I think Media Player Classic can play them out of the box.
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I'll use Winamp(with another computer, of course)...
Does FS Open read .flac files?
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i doubt it.
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Flac? No. Ogg Vorbis? Yes.
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Many M8 tracks are missing!
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I think Media Player Classic can play them out of the box.
Or just simply use Foobar 2000 - good and easy in use :)
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Hey guys. My God, has it really been four months? I guess that's what Real Life does to you...
So yeah, I see that CP5670 has put out the FS1 files, that's cool. I never had the chance to make the mixdowns for the FS1 files ovbiously, nor update my own webpage. I'm glad that these have been released. I've just about given up on the music project myself. I've had a real rough time just keeping a computer running, and finding time to sit down to use it. I've purchased a brand new laptop though and I'm still getting everything set up on it. Therefore, I have no audio software at the moment. I'll get it eventually.
Also, I still have not heard from Dan Wentz on other material. Basically, what CP5670 has posted, that's all we have. That's all that Dan found and sent to me, at least. I assume that all of his energy and time is devoted to the current Volition project (still don't know what it is...) and family, and rightfully so. Yes, there's some tracks that are missing, notibly the M8 tracks.
Also, I kept hitting brick walls each and every time I tried to get the music to work in the FSPort, the one problem I always got was that the track would only play halfway, then immediately start over again. I had set my timings right in the tables, and I still got the same problems. No matter what I did, it would always do that. The other problem I had, was that if I did get the music to work right, it would only work for the first mission. Second mission, and each mission after that would be silent. I removed any/all other refrences to music. So..... with this quite hasty post, I am hereby turning this over to the community to work on, if they'd like. I really wanted to release the pack as a single pack, complete and working, but I, for the life of me, cannot make it work right. The original intention was to play the FSPort with this music, that you have before you right now. Hopefully, someone else can make it work. I'm not giving up on it though, I WILL be of as much assistance as anyone needs, now that I've got a computer at my side again. I could be available for testing as well, just don't know if FSO will run on a Geforce 8600M GT card. Should...
I guess that's why I excel in hardware/software deployement and management, not coding. I couldn't code for crap in college.... hehehe...
I'm back, in somewhat diminished capacity. If there's anything anyone needs, please let me know.
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But CP used a Darkside ambient in PI...it should be in the package mentioned above!
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Hey guys. My God, has it really been four months? I guess that's what Real Life does to you...
Good to see you again. :) I know the feeling.
I was going to try setting up the FS1 music but am pretty short on time myself these days. The Port's tbm file seems to use additional entries that were added by the SCP, which I'm not that familiar with. The FS2 tbm (used in the 3.6.10 music media VP) was fairly straightforward to make though, at least after I figured out how the parameters work.
Also, I still have not heard from Dan Wentz on other material. Basically, what CP5670 has posted, that's all we have. That's all that Dan found and sent to me, at least. I assume that all of his energy and time is devoted to the current Volition project (still don't know what it is...) and family, and rightfully so. Yes, there's some tracks that are missing, notibly the M8 tracks.
Do you want to try contacting him again? I believe it's been several months and he may have just forgotten about it. We're missing most of the files from tracks 7 to 10, and also some pieces in FS2 like tracks B and C (these would actually be more useful in my opinion, since most existing campaigns use the FS2 tracks).
But CP used a Darkside ambient in PI...it should be in the package mentioned above!
That one is just a pitch-shifted version of the original. I thought that made it blend in better with the other music pieces used in that mission, and it also had the side effect of increasing the sampling rate and resulting in better quality.
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Hey there. Glad to see you're still around too. It's been a heck of a time getting things done.
I agree with you on how simple and straightforward inserting music into FS2's TBM is. I've had no problems with editing that part of the music stuff. But there's something I cant get my head around when it comes to the FSPORT. perhaps I could give another crack at it with a later build.
I am going to write Dan tomorrow and see whats up for sure. He has always said to have faith. I just need to get back in the loop with this project.
It will give me something good to do when my girlfriend wants to watch Dancing with the stars or American Idol. =)
By the way, I'll get around to posting the rest of the extras in another pack, as that just includes the ingame mission music. The best extra is posted already, the outtake reel, but in the spirit of completeness, it might be of interest to someone.
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fsport is a bit different in that it has like ... 2 normal tracks. PM Goob and see if he can shed some light on this. Goob fixed up the FSPort music that is currently working, whereas before it wasn't at all. (Well, it was, but not right. ;) )
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:bump:
Where does the trailer music come from?
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The new FSPort trailer uses the segment of intro that was cut from the final version used in FS1 (nice touch!). The original render for the intro had a short, moody synth intro. When the intro ends, that's when the FS1 intro we all know and love starts.
I hope this is what you're asking about.
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Nix, is there any possible way to get a high quality M10_Nrml1 ?
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The new FSPort trailer uses the segment of intro that was cut from the final version used in FS1 (nice touch!). The original render for the intro had a short, moody synth intro. When the intro ends, that's when the FS1 intro we all know and love starts.
I hope this is what you're asking about.
Nope. I was looking at your Fileshack and wondering where you got Trailer2.flac, Trailer3.flac and Trailer4.flac.
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Nix, is there any possible way to get a high quality M10_Nrml1 ?
I'm not sure if we'll ever find a high-quality M10 - that's been one of the most sought-after tracks, and I've asked Dan a few times and he's not been able to come up with anything yet.
The new FSPort trailer uses the segment of intro that was cut from the final version used in FS1 (nice touch!). The original render for the intro had a short, moody synth intro. When the intro ends, that's when the FS1 intro we all know and love starts.
I hope this is what you're asking about.
Nope. I was looking at your Fileshack and wondering where you got Trailer2.flac, Trailer3.flac and Trailer4.flac.
Ah, I see. Those tracks were included with the package of tracks that Dan found when we were looking for the original master recordings of FS1 tracks. They were unused, I believe. I never heard them before either. I posted them up in hopes they would be appreciated by everyone who likes Dan's music.
Also might go to show you how far :v: wanted to go the promotion of the titles, whereas Interplay did very little promotion at all.
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I see. I've always liked all of Dan Wentz's works for FreeSpace 2.
What is fs2betamainhall.flac? It seems that a slightly different version was used in The Procyon Insurgency.
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fs2betamainhall was the track included in the FS2 beta for it's Mainhall screen. It was used in Inf:A for it's mainhall as well, which was pretty cool.
It's so neat to see and hear these tracks get utilized, rather than cast away.
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It's also used in The Procyon Insurgency. fs2betamainhall sounds a bit like Darkside (FS1 Mission 10 music).
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We're appropriating it as the official Silent Threat:Reborn theme. Which makes sense given that it has the FS1 leitmotif in it.
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We're appropriating it as the official Silent Threat:Reborn theme. Which makes sense given that it has the FS1 leitmotif in it.
:yes:
That's very appropriate. At any rate, it sounds better than FAIL1.
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Awesome news!
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On a side note, I uploaded all of the remaining files (http://cp.nukelol.com/extramusic.zip) (the ones not used directly by the game) a few months ago but forgot to post the link. Some of these are on Nix's Fileshack page, but others aren't. I think that should cover everything we have available.
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Hi guys :)
I knew you were experiencing problems with your attempts to make the upgraded soundtracks work(I think there was something wrong with the table file)...do you have any news? I would like to have the upgrades ingame... :)
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On a side note, I uploaded all of the remaining files (http://cp.nukelol.com/extramusic.zip) (the ones not used directly by the game) a few months ago but forgot to post the link. Some of these are on Nix's Fileshack page, but others aren't. I think that should cover everything we have available.
Agh, damn you for not posting it sooner :) ! I hit the jackpot with this ;)
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Do they all work ingame?
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They should. It's just a matter of tablefile modification, right? :nervous:
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Have you tried? :nervous:
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No? :nervous:
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Can you do it, please? :)
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No? :nervous:
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It's all in music.tbl and the file names are listed there, for crying out loud. Just change them.
:nervous:
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That's what I originally thought, but looks like there's another problem...
Also, I kept hitting brick walls each and every time I tried to get the music to work in the FSPort, the one problem I always got was that the track would only play halfway, then immediately start over again. I had set my timings right in the tables, and I still got the same problems. No matter what I did, it would always do that. The other problem I had, was that if I did get the music to work right, it would only work for the first mission. Second mission, and each mission after that would be silent. I removed any/all other refrences to music. So..... with this quite hasty post, I am hereby turning this over to the community to work on, if they'd like. I really wanted to release the pack as a single pack, complete and working, but I, for the life of me, cannot make it work right. The original intention was to play the FSPort with this music, that you have before you right now. Hopefully, someone else can make it work. I'm not giving up on it though, I WILL be of as much assistance as anyone needs, now that I've got a computer at my side again. I could be available for testing as well, just don't know if FSO will run on a Geforce 8600M GT card. Should...
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Well, that applies to anything. The music pieces I just posted are no different from the others.
You don't need to deal with the music.tbl parameters if you want to use them in briefings or the mainhall, or as single-use pieces in specific missions.
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What blowfish did find in The Procyon Insurgency, CP, is that you used the space for debriefing voice for debriefing music... :drevil: :D
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That trick gives you much better control over which music it uses. The standard debriefing music system is fairly primitive and is based only on objectives, frequently playing the wrong music for the situation. (like when it plays the victory music after the Colossus gets blown up in the main campaign :p)
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It always does. I also note that sometimes, the music in Surrender, Belisarius! is messed up. You hear ambient music when the Belisarius jumps in, but the battle music doesn't fade in until the Belisarius has been destroyed.
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I had problems with BP's Razorback in the last mission...
Are these kinds of problems connected to 3.6.10? I was using a 3.6.10 INF build...
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How about ~ + UP ARROW or ~ + DOWN ARROW?
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Should you update the first post and add all precious links, Nix? :)
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I added them to the first post myself.
Also, I just checked that extras file and it looks like I forgot to include the FS2 cutscene ones in it, so I uploaded it again with those added in. I had those in a separate folder and I think most of them have already been available, but it would be good to have everything in one place anyway.
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It always does. I also note that sometimes, the music in Surrender, Belisarius! is messed up. You hear ambient music when the Belisarius jumps in, but the battle music doesn't fade in until the Belisarius has been destroyed.
You actually forget that the Belisarius is a pretty weakened ship. It's not a full "threat". It's normal to hear ambient music when, for example, the only hostile ship on the battlefield is a disarmed/disabled one. It's normal... :)
I added them to the first post myself.
Also, I just checked that extras file and it looks like I forgot to include the FS2 cutscene ones in it, so I uploaded it again with those added in. I had those in a separate folder and I think most of them have already been available, but it would be good to have everything in one place anyway.
Nice... :yes:
EDIT: LOL, CP...you changed the file while my DL was in progress...the file is now corrupted...don't worry, I'm re-DLing it... ;)
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That's not the point - I think he means that there's both tracks playing simultaneously. (which can't be good)
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I thought he was refering to an updated file. When I DLed it for the first time it was supposed to be 64 mbs big. I ultimated the DL and found out that the file was corrupt. I DLed it again and this time the file was 111 mbs, this means that it must have been changed while I was DLing it.
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I was referring to the first quote about the Belisarius.
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I just wanted to post that the M8 battle tracks for FS1 are missing. It's the greatest battle music in the game, IMO.
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AAAAAAAAA!
:welcomered:
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AAAAAAAAA!
:wtf:
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Holy Mother of Consciousness, what the hell was that?
Back on topic, I've converted a few files into .ogg ones for INFA but I need advice on how to fix the table file. Do I need to change the second number showed in each line? How?
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Couldn't you just ask me that on MSN, Mobius?
Too tired and annoyed to explain that now here though...
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I want to know if whoever is going to pack the files is also going to use a fixed table file.
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This is the first time I've heard the extended version of the Freespace 1 title.
It just shivers down my spine when I finally heard the part became so familiar.
Speaking of which, where is the track for the Freespace 2 trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r08pQHjF1X0&fmt=18)? I always like that one...
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No idea. I like that piece too. :blah:
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That said, I think there are still seems to be some timing problems and mixing errors along with off-cued looping still to be had with this new Music_VP, (such as the ambient parts during "Love the Treason.../...But Hate the Traitor"). But the other parts that work fine are very nice.
Give Dan Wentz our regards for his contributions to this project. Giving us the entire high-quality soundtrack was an amazing feat in itself. I'd still be surprised if Volition hads't given lossless versions of their cutscenes. It's kind of how the people who worked in this game really care for the work they've put into.
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Has any of this music been implemented into the recent releases? (3.6.10, FSPort 3.1.1, ST:R etc etc)
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Not into the normal mediavps, no, but if you play The Procyon Insurgency, you'll hear a few of them. ;)
Oh, and I noticed that you're using Mobius' font scheme. If you want to use your own, use http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_colors#X11_color_names as a reference.
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Yeh I know how to change the colour, but its easier typing the mobius tag than (color=#9966CC)
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Yeh I know how to change the colour, but its easier typing the mobius tag than (color=#9966CC)
You're not allowed to use Mobius's tags though. You don't see anybody using Maeglamor's, or Black Wolf's, do you?
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Just out of interest, how do you earn a tag for yourself? Not that I want one, I'm fine with plain text.
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You have to have a good reputation on the forum, first of all. Then you have to establish a unique text style and use it consistently, for a long period of time, such that it becomes a sort of trademark. (And it has to be a trademark, not an annoying quirk.) Then your posts have to become noteworthy enough that people quote them often enough that a custom tag would make quoting easier.
No offense, but I don't think Grimper has fulfilled any of these requirements...
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I see...
Now that that's settled, shall we get back on topic?
I was listening to Briefing 2 Remaster Blaster last week and I was wondering if it's a file or an on-site recording...
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Not into the normal mediavps, no, but if you play The Procyon Insurgency, you'll hear a few of them. ;)
So... if I throw the mv_music.vp into the 3.6.10 mediavps folder, I will get better version of music in FS2, without having to go and play with tables or whatnot ?
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If your mod (mod.ini) refers to the mediavps folder.
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fs2betamainhall was the track included in the FS2 beta for it's Mainhall screen.
Where is fs2betamainhall? It's not in any of the downloadable zips...
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It isn't called fs2betamainhall in any of them. In extramusic.zip, the file you want is Main1 or Main1a. Main1 is louder.
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If your mod (mod.ini) refers to the mediavps folder.
Well, obviously ;) Gonna try it after ST:R, finally no cracks in FS music hopefully...
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Are there any upgraded tracks for Marauder, Strike and Monolith? :)
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I seem to have encountered problems trying to play the music.
Probably since I have nothing that can play or convert .ogg or .flac files. Solution? (probably mentioned before... but 16 pages is quite a hefty search)
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Audacity. Google it. The project hosted on SourceForge.net. Is full of win and awesome.
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Audacity, Winamp or XMPlay for Windows, Audacity or XMPlay + Darwine on Mac. Take your pick. :)
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VLC player will run ogg too.
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I forgot about Audacity. Convieniently, I already have it.
Thanks for that
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Use Winamp (http://www.winamp.com) if you have a Windows machine. It can read more formats than windows media player or musicmatch jukebox.
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You can also install the illuminable ogg codecs, which will allow ogg and flac to be played with a standard media player.
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Or just get XMPlay, which can read WAV, OGG, XM, IT, MOD, MO3, S3M and MP3 files without cluttering up your hard drive.
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Winamp can read all those formats, and finding codecs for it is easier.
Illuminable's oggcodecs is for media players that use DirectShow.
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I don't think Winamp can handle a multi-track module, though.
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I hate asking these questions... Regardless,
About what percentage of the music from both FS1 and 2 have been restored? I only ask this now as FSO 3.6.10 is nearing finalization (which I look forward to, by the way).
Apart from current problems with Turey's installer, an update with enhanced (and complete) music VPs would be truly smashing...
-Thaeris
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I'm quite oblivious to how the FSO team prioritises their improvement tasks, but I don't think music is a high-priority task. I mean, the originals still sound very good, and some of the HQ ones are messed up (no offence there).
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FSU (mistakes not withstanding) will always include whatever is available.
So, yeah. I thought I had more to add, but apparently not.
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Where do I put the file(s)?
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If it´s new default music then put it into "FreeSpace2\Data\music\". Is it for a new mod then put the musicfils to "Freespace2\your_mod\data\music\"
Peter
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Uhh, you might wanna check the date (and also the year) of a post before you respond to it.
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It's stickied.
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It's stickied.
Whoops, forgot about that. Post deleted.
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:bump:
Did anyone else save the uploads on the first post? All the nukelol links are dead, Shackspace is gone, and the files weren't saved by The Internet Archive. The wiki also points to this thread on its Music (https://wiki.hard-light.net/index.php/Music#Other) article.
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Pretty sure we already use all the stuff from Dan in the MediaVPs.
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Pretty sure we already use all the stuff from Dan in the MediaVPs.
There's a few tracks missing, from mv_music, though. Did he only release some of the masters?
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Can't answer that. It was a long-ass time ago before I was in charge of FSU.
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What I'm seeing on his Soundcloud:
Battle tracks for Exodus, FS2 credits, FS2Brief04, and FS2Victory.
And a new score for the Capella Supernova cutscene. But that's it.
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Something like this?
https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/?dir=uploads/Multimedia/Music%20%28Streamable%29
https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/?dir=uploads/Multimedia/Sound%20%26%20Music%20Packs
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Something like this?
https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/?dir=uploads/Multimedia/Music%20%28Streamable%29
https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/?dir=uploads/Multimedia/Sound%20%26%20Music%20Packs
Uhh, Those are the originals, He was asking about Dan Wentz's newer remakes of the FS2 soundtrack. :p
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https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/?dir=uploads/Multimedia/Music%20%28Streamable%29/Dan%20Wentz%20-%20FreeSpace%20Redux
These are the ones. :yes:
EDIT: oh right and BP has a version of the FS2 mainhall music redux without the intro dialogue.
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Something like this?
https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/?dir=uploads/Multimedia/Music%20%28Streamable%29
https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/?dir=uploads/Multimedia/Sound%20%26%20Music%20Packs
Yes, that's it; thanks! I was looking specifically for "FreeSpace Music Pack (Extras).zip"; that was originally linked in the first post.
https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/?dir=uploads/Multimedia/Music%20%28Streamable%29/Dan%20Wentz%20-%20FreeSpace%20Redux
These are the ones. :yes:
EDIT: oh right and BP has a version of the FS2 mainhall music redux without the intro dialogue.
Thanks for the link. Although it is not what I was looking for, I have updated the wiki article with your link as well as the links provided by Nightmare.
EDIT: Mentioned the specific file I was looking for.
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Hmm. I downloaded that extramusic.zip but I can't find it. I don't think I would have deleted it, but it might be in an old backup or an obscure archive.
EDIT: Oh, "FreeSpace Music Pack (Extras).zip" on that SectorFiles page is probably it.
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47 items, unpacked size 118,718,087? If not I've got it in both .7z and .zip forms and can post a link if it's not available.
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FreeSpace Music Pack (Extras).zip: https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/download/dXBsb2Fkcy9NdWx0aW1lZGlhL1NvdW5kJTIwJTI2JTIwTXVzaWMlMjBQYWNrcy9GcmVlU3BhY2UlMjBNdXNpYyUyMFBhY2slMjAlMjhFeHRyYXMlMjkuemlw/h/283e61a75c03cc3bf4925dac0370ac7d
111.74 MB compressed.
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FreeSpace Music Pack (Extras).zip: https://sectorgame.com/fsfiles/download/dXBsb2Fkcy9NdWx0aW1lZGlhL1NvdW5kJTIwJTI2JTIwTXVzaWMlMjBQYWNrcy9GcmVlU3BhY2UlMjBNdXNpYyUyMFBhY2slMjAlMjhFeHRyYXMlMjkuemlw/h/283e61a75c03cc3bf4925dac0370ac7d
111.74 MB compressed.
Yes sounds right as the .zip is 111 MB, so apparently it's already available. :yes:
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Pretty sure we already use all the stuff from Dan in the MediaVPs.
There's a few tracks missing, from mv_music, though. Did he only release some of the masters?
We never got some of them, especially for FS2. The ones on his Soundcloud are great but use different instruments than the originals and sound quite different (sometimes better but not always), and are not in the media VPs last I checked. Some custom campaigns use them though.