[leoben]

I think I brought this up in an ancient thread but it may have gotten lost, something I haven't been able to wrap my head around, and maybe I'm not alone with it. Some of the thoughts are random in order, I apologize for that.

Uhm, yeah, spoiler alert in the below.

To recap:

- For reasons not known to us (at least I'm not convinced there's a clear explanation who or why), the 14th gets pulled into an alternate universe where the shivans nuked humanity, one ship left standing (vishnan agenda?), Bei has encounter with vishnans, crazy 'I'm the ship itself' experience
- 14th barely escapes shivans, big fight between vishnans and shivans, talking about a grand design of the brahmans of old where the shivans and vishnans are clearly not on the same page
- vishnans 'banish' shivans from...where exactly? This universe? This dimension? From time? From a specific place?
- vishnans instruct bei to bring enlightenment to their people
- WiH - 14th establishes beachhead, Tevs invade. Laporte emerges as someone whose mind is being 'shaped' by Ken (a shivan 'entity with agenda not fully understood)
- Ken claims the only way to save humanity is to 'destroy' the GTVA. Emphasis on destroy, not defeat. The people that live in that society too? Or just the leadership? That was on the surface of his agenda when he was a human during FS2, no? Take the vasudans with it?
- Ken keeps telling Laporte that humanity has failed a test, and that would ultimately lead to humanity's extinction unless she assembles an army and destroys the GTVA.
- We're getting a similar vibe from Bei's conversations, since the vishnans haven't been in touch with them since the war started. They fear it's a sign for things to come, but don't exactly know what it means.
- Several conversations I've seen theorize that the shivans are now back at carrying out the vishnan great psyche's will, which is to eradicate humanity, that has failed some sort of test. So the shivans are now best buddies again with vishnans?
- On that note, in the last mission of AoA, it seems that there's a singular manifestation of both the vishnans and shivans. So 'someone' gets banished. But in Wih, the shivans are described more like a collective consciousness that can be manipulated, directed, used even. So which one is it?

Some things don't add up for me. If the vishnans think that humanity isn't worthy, what does that mean? Do they let them to their own fate? Or they instruct the shivans to pull a reaper-style invasion on them? Is that already on its way and Ken stalled it somehow? Or the shivans still have their own agenda? Has Bosch's consciousness altered the shivans in a way that allows humanity another chance? And that's achieved by destroying the GTVA? Would that serve at all to convince the vishnans of something?

So Laporte meets Bei - two nagari 'champions', on opposite sides? On the same side? Did she really meet Bei? How the f*** did Bei override Ken's signal? Or was that just by accident? That's a bit suspicious to me.

At this stage, I have no reason take Bei's nagari experiences at face value, but I kinda don't want to do that for Laporte either.

And there's that eternal darkness thing. Plus the GTVA and UEF end-contingency plans. We know very little about SHAMBALA, which is supposed to give the UEF a conditional victory, but we know pretty much nothing about MORPHEUS.

Who displaced the 14th to that alternate universe and to what end?

OK let's start there. Feel free to address any of the above (or none of it lol).

Apologies for the rambling, but had to start this somehow.

[niffiwan]

... but we know pretty much nothing about MORPHEUS.

I'm pretty sure that MORPHEUS is a purge of all Vishnan compromised "elements" in Sol. Could be really ugly.

[-Sara-]

SHAMBHALA, in Buddhist and Hindu culture is a secret, secluded land where all is pure and peaceful. This can be three things in my mind:

• Destruction of all subspace corridors. If nobody can travel, nobody can fight eachother. This is flawed peace, as each planet will probably end up in a state of civil war.
• Isolation of Earth, closing any access to it. This might be victory to the council, as they can return to their peaceful, isolated existence, which for them has worked before just fine.
• Access to a place outside of conventional reach, either a non-corporeal Nagiri realm (as we have seen before), or a physical place elsewhere (perhaps residing in subspace itself).

MORPHEUS in ancient myths was a shapeshifter, who appeared in dreams matching that which one desirese, but its true visage was that of a winger demon.

• Best case scenario, it wakes up a bunch of sleeper agents, perhaps harkening back to the GTI era.
• Worst case scenario, there were no Vishnans speaking to Sol, it was some Nagiri type communication by the GTVA all this time giving false hope, while needing Sol to stay united while its alone. I mean, what's more demoralizing than your icons or gods actually being your enemy, whispering lies in the guise of sacred advise from behind a bush?
• Likely scenario, I'm simply wrong.
• Insidious scenario, kitten holocaust.

[Phantom Hoover]

If you haven't already you should definitely read this stuff, it's an ARG we had that gives a lot of interesting glimpses of the GTVI's perspective. They're just as ****-scared of the Vishnans as they are of everyone else.