[niffiwan]

*Imagines a Sanctus or Hyperion being attacked by a Mentu, lolbachs a'blazing.

Yeah, no. The Zods would definitely have better cruisers by then, right?

Right?!

EDIT: I know cruisers are basically being phased out, but it stands to reason they'd have some type of light combatant.

Wasn't there an Aten in the final cutscene of WiH p1? 

[MatthTheGeek]

I say again, think Aeolus or Hyperion here, especially the Hyperion. Those SBlues aren't incredibly powerful, but they're enough to kill a cruiser quite quickly (Forced Entry)

After so many playthroughs of FE, I have yet to see anything else than the Labouchère and the Téméraire kill a cruiser...

[-Norbert-]

*Imagines a Sanctus or Hyperion being attacked by a Mentu, lolbachs a'blazing.

Yeah, no. The Zods would definitely have better cruisers by then, right?

Right?!

EDIT: I know cruisers are basically being phased out, but it stands to reason they'd have some type of light combatant.

Wasn't there an Aten in the final cutscene of WiH p1? 

But who can tell what they are used for now. Maybe they use them as heavy freighters or APCs or AWACS or who knows what now. Or it could even be a new ships that only looks like an Aten (in-universe anyway. I'm pretty sure in FRED it is a normal Aten).

[MatthTheGeek]

IIRC the BP team said they were used as Pulse gunboats.

[niffiwan]

I wonder why they wouldn't refit the Mentus rather than the Atens though... although I guess the Tevs did keep the Leviathons around as picket ships so the Atens may fill a similar role... in a flimsy fashion 

[MatthTheGeek]

Cruisers have always been useless in the anti-cap role (at least for everyone that isn't Shivan). In a sense, the Zods deigned their cruisers correctly : no big, energy-hungry useless SGreens/SBlues.

[Hades]

Cruisers have always been useless in the anti-cap role (at least for everyone that isn't Shivan). In a sense, the Zods deigned their cruisers correctly : no big, energy-hungry useless SGreens/SBlues.

Bad thing is the Mentu has fairly bad turret coverage and poorly placed turrets. It's only got three turrets on the bottom, for example.

The Aeolus is better at both anticapital and antifighter because of good turret placement and coverage.

[Commander Zane]

The Mentu would be a pretty good cruiser if the AI were smart enough to roll to bring its weapons to bear instead of sitting at whatever orientation it happens to be at when attacked.

And if it actually had any weapons to bear.

It has three flaks and 3 AAAs. And its anti-warship beam armament isn't all that much less effective than what you'd find on a Terran cruiser.

Implying the Mentu even has capital-grade beams when it actually doesn't.

[LordPomposity]

The Mentu would be a pretty good cruiser if the AI were smart enough to roll to bring its weapons to bear instead of sitting at whatever orientation it happens to be at when attacked.

And if it actually had any weapons to bear.

It has three flaks and 3 AAAs. And its anti-warship beam armament isn't all that much less effective than what you'd find on a Terran cruiser.

Implying the Mentu even has capital-grade beams when it actually doesn't.

That would be the joke.

[Hades]

I wonder why they wouldn't refit the Mentus rather than the Atens though... although I guess the Tevs did keep the Leviathons around as picket ships so the Atens may fill a similar role... in a flimsy fashion 

It's cheaper. The Aten by now is most likely an upgraded (including armor and engines and all that jazz) version of the old while being extremely cheap and mass produceable.

[Commander Zane]

It's a piss-poor joke then since if they did have even a single SVas they'd be outperforming the Fenris and Leviathan two-fold.
Not to mention the Fusion Mortar isn't terribly bad either, it'll destroy damaged targets if you allow the Cruiser to keep firing.

[fearsom]

Id open up a direct line to Khonsu and say "We are in contact with higher beings. Stop helping those warmongers." Should have a positive effect considering Vasudan mysticism.

[The E]

Id open up a direct line to Khonsu and say "We are in contact with higher beings. Stop helping those warmongers." Should have a positive effect considering Vasudan mysticism.

Assumes Vasudan Mysticism is the same as human Mysticism. Assumes Vasudans would listen.

Also, please do not bump old topics.

[Aesaar]

Id open up a direct line to Khonsu and say "We are in contact with higher beings. Stop helping those warmongers." Should have a positive effect considering Vasudan mysticism.

And what if the higher beings are lying to the UEF?  What if the GTVA has a better idea of what they really intend?

[crizza]

Just edit a retail mission where a Mentu appears and swap it with the version which has a SVas...kicks ass

[CT27]

Here's my thread that discusses strategy ideas for the GTVA:

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=79335.0

[SaltyWaffles]

Building a Sanctus, Karuna, Narayana, or Solaris takes a long time; this isn't WW2 where build times for new warships were on the order of a few months.

Out of curiosity, why is that (not counting the Solaris for obvious reasons)? Not 'a few months', but something along the lines of 6-12? In wartime, with warship construction being a (or one of) top priority, what about the dynamic enforces a significantly longer warship construction time with 24th century technology and abundant infrastructure (before Darkest Hour, of course)? Even with regards to the Sanctus, which is both an older, more common, and simpler design that was geared towards cost-efficiency and ease of construction in the first place?

For ships the size of the Narayana and up (roughly speaking), it's definitely understandable that the required time for constructing it and the scale of its construction would make it too vulnerable and static a target to be practical after a certain point in the war.  But even for cruisers? Outside of the particulars of this war making most of the UEF's infrastructure unusually vulnerable, what part (or parts) of the process holds up the others?

[The E]

Building Cruisers only makes sense if those Cruisers would be more than target practice.

Also, if most of the shipyards that could build military vessels are occupied with either repairing ships or refitting them (Remember, the Narayana-class didn't start the war as an Artillery vessel; At least some of them had to be fitted with railguns first), then building new vessels may just not be possible or feasible.

[General Battuta]

I'm pretty sure there's some new warship construction underway even to this point in the war.

[QuakeIV]

To go along with the initial purpose of the thread;

If I were in the UEF's shoes at the end of the latest War in Heaven installment, I would likely replace Byrne and fold third fleets assets into second fleet while making Calder subordinate to Netreba.  The Martian and Jovian fleets had been doing an admirable job in my opinion however the Jovian fleet was well slaughtered by the end of the latest installment and the benefits of operating independently would likely be limited.  Byrne's definition of a 'defensive posture' seemed to amount to effectively ignoring all calls for reinforcement outside of the orbit of the moon until the last second, which so far as I can tell led to a lot of avoidable territorial/space asset losses.  At that point the policy would just be hold out until the secret project finally comes out of the oven.

If I were in the GTVA's shoes I would find a way to dump as many fleet assets into the Solar theater as possible to get the war over with already.  Sure it would be 'risky' since they would probably run out of supplies eventually due to the Sol gates limited capacity (IIRC anyhow) however at that point they could simply directly attack everything at once and end the war fairly promptly.  The UEF would simply be saturated with full scale attacks on all of their fleet assets since so many of their ships had already been destroyed.  If the UEF managed to survive somehow then so much of their fleet would be annihilated that the depleted GTVA reinforcement ships could simply stroll out of the system at a leisurely pace while Steele's assets covered their withdrawal.

Thats what I'd do anyways.  Obviously this could be completely infeasible since I don't have access to all of the relevant information regarding the capabilities of the Sol gate, the GTVA fleet, the UEF fleet, its project, or political opposition to sending several additional GTVA destroyer groups on a little outing.

edited for clarity