I can do this again. It's the choice of words I'm after here.
It isn't possible that the Sathanas fleet represented the entire Shivan race.
It is as possible as it is that they returned to their home through the Capella supernova.
Possible, not an absolute truth.
The Ancients encountered much, much more Lucifer-class warships (OK, possibly not exactly "Lucifers", but similar, shielded warships)
Again,
possible but not a fact, not a truth. Can be used in speculation ("I do think that the Ancients encountered several shielded capital ships") but can't be claimed as a fact ("The Ancients did encounter several shielded capital ships").
It is a canonical theory that the Shivans were "cosmic destroyers", so I'm calling that barbaric. Destroying a race for no reason would be called retarded and thus, my term "barbaric".
It is also canonical that the Shivans attacked the Ancients, who were a rather advanced race that had been conquering the galaxy mercilessly. A "barbaric" approach would have been to attack anything they came across, not just the Ancients.
It is also canonical that the Shivans attacked the Terrans and the Vasudans, who were rather advanced races that had been waging war with each other for 14 years. It is entirely
possible that, without the Shivans, that war might have eventually destroyed or at least ruined both races.
It is entirely
possible that "The Shivans are the great destroyers but they are also the great preservers". They destroy races that are too advanced for their own good, thus preserving lesser races.
Use your common sense. If they weren't Lucifers, they were similar, shielded warships that the Ancients couldn't harm
Again, very
possible but not a fact. If the Lucifer paved way with smaller craft, the Ancients might have been running low on morale, eventually abandoning all ideas regarding fighting them and then they could have been hunted by other, unshielded capital ships.
The Ancients described the Shivans as a "plague that can be harmed". So we could imply that the Shivans had a "plague" of Lucifers that could be harmed in subspace. Your statement about the Ancients never getting close to discover the Shivans' vulnerability is quite confusing. Wasn't it said in the cutscenes, "the destroyers darkened are skies like a plague that can be HARMED"?
Quoting is good only when it's accurate: "They are like the others. Strange, hideous, resisting, fighting. Only these were not like the others. They did not die."
"The destroyers that darkened our skies like a plague can be harmed. But we have no way to deliver the hurt."
What I was stating was this:
- the Shivans attack the Ancients
-
possibly only the Lucifer (and fine, yes,
possibly several Lucifer-class ships) with fighters and bombers engage the Ancients in direct battle
- the Ancients take note that the attacking ships are shielded
-
possibly there are Shivan cruisers or even destroyers somewhere, but the Ancients cannot engage them, because the shielded fighters, bombers and Lucifer(s) are already beating the crap out of them
- thus, the Ancients fail to notice that
some Shivan ships could be harmed in direct combat
And it is also
possible that the Ancient monologues neglected to mention that some Shivan ships were unshielded and could be harmed. And why not? Many ships still remained shielded and even if the Ancients could have taken some ships out, they couldn't stop a Lucifer. Or fighters/bombers.
On my part, this speculation was supposed to be completely irrelevant to the
fact that at some point, the Ancients discovered that shields did not work in subspace.
You are obviously debating hard canon facts, but there are times when you'll need to assume the unmentioned. For example, isn't it perfectly logical that the Shivans probably used ships similar to Lucy's (with shields, etc.)? This isn't canon, but as I said, use your common sense.
As I said, speculation can be interesting indeed. But the choice of words. Saying "This is how things
are..." gives the impression that you (think you) know better, even without canon information and facts. And that can be perceived as arrogant. If you say "This is how things
could be in my theory..." immediately should raise thoughts in other people. Thoughts like "Hmm. Your theory indeed sounds interesting, and I'm going to present some counter-arguments based on my own thoughts about the matter.", followed by some very lively discussion.
Choice of words.