[Davros]

youve missed out
vampire redemption and bloodlines
and the witcher

[TrashMan]

MoTB was crap. Better than NWN2? No way in hell. Everything in it felt so forces and rushed.


KOTOR1 was good, but better than DA:O or BG? impossible.

[Ransom]

That's what I'd have said about NWN2, but to each his own.

Although I completely agree that KotOR 1 doesn't even come close to Baldur's Gate.

[nvsblmnc]

I'm caught between Mask of the Betrayer and Anachronox.

I got a real sense of scale from MoTB which went far beyond anything in NWN2.  Anachronox gets my vote though.  Lost my copy years ago, but I've just bought a new one off Amazon for £3.  Runs perfectly on Vista Pro64 and I'd recommend it to anyone who wants to try something a bit different.

[Mr. Vega]

My vote goes to Mask of the Betrayer, with KotOR 2 as a close second. MotB was less ambitious, but it felt more polished than either of Avellone's other titles and explored some very interesting questions about faith that really struck a note with me. It also featured some of the most satisfying moral decisions I've encountered in a game.

Oh I thought MotB was really good, even though the disappointing ending blew the game's chance for real greatness. As anyone who read my earlier post in this thread on Morrowind can guess, I was really looking forward to

Spoiler:

the tearing down of the Wall of the Faithless.

Needless to say I was not happy at the end. Avellone! What the hell! That's two for three you've screwed up at the end! Remind me why I get my hopes up every time I play one of your games?

And the Spirit Eater bar was a bad idea, made even worse in execution.

[NGTM-1R]

Yeah, that's more or less why Mask of the Betrayer sucked in my view as well, Vega. :/ Though I'm not quite as militantly atheistic, in my case it was "this is being presented as a huge freaking injustice the whole game".

[Angelus]

Would be nice if you could add Planescape Torment, which i really liked.

[Jeff Vader]

Would be nice if you could add Planescape Torment, which i really liked.

I also thought about that, but PS:T is from '99, no? And this poll was about RPGs released somewhere between 2000-2009, no?

[Angelus]

True, but can't we let this one slip? I mean it's teh awesum! Please?

[Unknown Target]

Mass Effect 1 + 2.

[redsniper]

Hordes of the Underdark

[Mr. Vega]

Yeah, that's more or less why Mask of the Betrayer sucked in my view as well, Vega. :/ Though I'm not quite as militantly atheistic, in my case it was "this is being presented as a huge freaking injustice the whole game".

Ok, I'm not militantly atheistic in the sense that I think religion is evil. I respect and often admire the faith of others (if genuine). More often then not it leads to a deep belief in morality and altruism. But I have nothing but contempt for the idea of a supreme divine authority itself. By his very existence God denies us free will. So when ever I'm in a story with characters rebelling against gods, I'm instantly sympathetic. And if their motives for doing so are compassionate and altruistic, as Kaelyn's were? No hesitation. I'll fight in the trenches with her.

If Obsidian gives us a sequel to MotB with Kaelyn included, I'll forgive them for chickening out this time. But not before then. (Also, please no religious debate here)

I'm also stunned that Morrowind got so few votes.

[Ransom]

I disagree with MotB's ideology too, but to be honest

Spoiler:

I'm not so sure tearing down the Wall of the Faithless would have been the better ending. It might have been braver, and probably more emotionally satisfying, but I think it would also have been less mature. 'You can't change the world' is a disagreeable notion, but I wonder if the obvious ending wouldn't have been too easy.

But then again, we seem to disagree on a pretty fundamental level about how forceful a story should be with its philosophy. What you see as chickening out I see as tact. It may just depend on what one looks to get out of fiction.

That said, the main reason I took it over KotOR 2 was more to do with the experience of taking my character through that story than the story itself. Part of it may just have been because I'd gotten to know the character through NWN2, but I had more fun with the role-playing in that game than any other RPG I can recall.

And yeah, the Spirit Eater bar was an atrocious mechanic.

[TrashMan]

MOTB chafed me the wrong way. The whole basic story of the mask, the betrayer and the wall felt stupid to me - especially since it was tied to the character of the shard-bearer. How many titles and godly artifacts and great prophecies can one person possibly have/fulfill? If it was a completely new character, it would have been better.
And lets not even go with the schtick of killing off all of your previous love interests.
And then quite literally forcing a new one on you. Yes, I said forcing. That bald chick has been traveling with me for a week, I have 3 conversations with her and suddenly, at the end game, she's acknowledging my great love!?!?!? WTF??? I tried to be friendly, but stay away from any romance-looking options and I STILL get her throwing herself at me. After a week. A week.
at least with Elanee it was months before she made a move...

Frankly, the characters deserved...nay - DEMANDED more time and more development, more conversations.

[NGTM-1R]

Spoiler:

But then again, we seem to disagree on a pretty fundamental level about how forceful a story should be with its philosophy. What you see as chickening out I see as tact. It may just depend on what one looks to get out of fiction.

Oh, it's not tact at all.

Spoiler:

It's that they're not allowed to screw with the cosmology like that. I was aware of this the whole game; they're never going to let you tear down the wall. Forgotten Realms' creative directors are known for their iron-fisted behavior. Yet the game goes out of its way to make you want to tear down the wall, to ensure you see it as a worthy, perhaps the only worthy, culmination of the game.

But they never had any intention of letting you do it.

So no. The ending wasn't tactful in any way. It was stupid. The entire design of the game was stupid because it was all working up to that point where it must by necessity pull a bait-and-switch on you.

[CP5670]

The only games I have played in that list are Mass Effect and Fallout 3. I liked both a lot, but I would give Fallout 3 the nod for its superior gameplay and nonlinearity despite having a much weaker story.

I have never liked traditional RPGs, either because of their overused high fantasy settings or the overly random gameplay based around dice rolls. On the other hand, I love FPSs with RPG elements such as Deus Ex.

[JMN]

(...)much weaker story.

Highly debatable 

[Scotty]

No.  Not debatable at all.

[Mr. Vega]

that said, the main reason I took it over KotOR 2 was more to do with the experience of taking my character through that story than the story itself. Part of it may just have been because I'd gotten to know the character through NWN2, but I had more fun with the role-playing in that game than any other RPG I can recall.

Really? One of the big problems I had with playing MotB was that I couldn't get a feel for my character until I stormed the Academy, really. Whereas in KOTORII, half the entire story is dealing with choices that the Exile made in the past, I so I had a very good feel for her character early on. And her connection with Kreia was the closest one I've ever had between an NPC and a player character in a game. Thinking back, even with the restored content, only two characters that are really well developed - Kreia and the Exile, and only three others were really very interesting (Visas, Brianna, and to a lesser extent, Canderous). I liked Mira, but she just didn't get enough written for her. Atton's characterization was excellent at the beginning but he became quite boring by the end. Everyone else was filler. I never realized that playing through it though. That game lives and dies on Kreia's arthritic shoulders.

[mxlm]

Yeah, Kreia made KotOR II, and she was perfectly capable of carrying the game herself. It's Star Wars: Ayn Rand Versus the Universe.

Which is awesome.