[Snail]

As much as I'd hate to say it... I agree with Hades here.

There are two extremes here, this style of HTL'ing and VA's Loki... I don't really think going so far in either direction is advisable.

[Mobius]

Looking forward to the upgrade!

[Droid803]

Smooth the wings more, bro. I can still see corners.
Clearly, you have polies to spare

[Cobra]

Man, you guys are dicks. Most of the detail you're all talking about is present in normal maps. There's only a few 'recessed' areas on the map, and they're already modeled. Shut the hell up and take what you get, and if you don't like the outcome, fix it yourself.

[Dragon]

Wings could use smoothing, that's pretty much everything this model needs.

[Droid803]

Man, you guys are dicks. Most of the detail you're all talking about is present in normal maps. There's only a few 'recessed' areas on the map, and they're already modeled. Shut the hell up and take what you get, and if you don't like the outcome, fix it yourself.

When has a little constructive criticism hurt anyone.
Noone just said "IT SUCKS." We gave suggestions!

[mjn.mixael]

Man, you guys are dicks. Most of the detail you're all talking about is present in normal maps. There's only a few 'recessed' areas on the map, and they're already modeled. Shut the hell up and take what you get, and if you don't like the outcome, fix it yourself.

When has a little constructive criticism hurt anyone.
Noone just said "IT SUCKS." We gave suggestions!

To that I respond with these two posts.... both of which annoyed me a bit and it's not even my project...

That's it?

That looks like a 'high poly' fighter model from 2004. Add more detail, smooth it a it, anything to make it look less like a half-ass high poly model. The gunpoints look like nothing was changed from the retail model and there's almost no detail (seriously, model the panels already on the map).

[Aardwolf]

Continue being annoyed, then, because I agree with Hades on this one.

[mjn.mixael]

... There are far more constructive ways to put things..

Hooray for internet anonymity!

[Aardwolf]

See, it's like this...

Consider the HTL Myrmidon model. What, you say? You didn't know there was an HTL Myrmidon model? A lot of people don't even realize the model in the mediavps has been improved from the original.

Well this model (were it released as-is) would be just the same; nobody would even notice it had gotten upgraded, because the improvements are so insignificant. Or worse, it might actually be regarded as worse due to the fact that instead of taking inspiration from the original's textures, it's got random doodads added arbitrarily.

Edit: that second bit about the random doodads was more of a re-phrasing of what Hades said (which you so callously ignored) than an expression of my own views of it

[Droid803]

See, it's like this...

Consider the HTL Myrmidon model. What, you say? You didn't know there was an HTL Myrmidon model? A lot of people don't even realize the model in the mediavps has been improved from the original.

Well this model (were it released as-is) would be just the same; nobody would even notice it had gotten upgraded, because the improvements are so insignificant. Or worse, it might actually be regarded as worse due to the fact that instead of taking inspiration from the original's textures, it's got random doodads added arbitrarily.

This.

To that I respond with these two posts.... both of which annoyed me a bit and it's not even my project...

*snip*

That looks like a 'high poly' fighter model from 2004. Add more detail, smooth it a it, anything to make it look less like a half-ass high poly model. The gunpoints look like nothing was changed from the retail model and there's almost no detail (seriously, model the panels already on the map).

To the second one read the bold. There's a suggestion, no?

[Galemp]

I'm hesitant to model the detail on the actual texture because I think a good normal map would do a decent job. And I was planning on taking a modest approach to this anyway. Droid and Dragon are right, I do have polies to spare, and I'll try a few more things on here.

[Vasudan Admiral]

Oh come on fellas, not this again. It's not hard to phrase things politely. If you don't want to just generally piss off the modder, then don't try to. Snail this is mainly directed towards you due to the 'that's it?' remark, but there's an undercurrent of disrespect from some other people here too.

Now sure Galemp's a tough man - he can take it, but he also shouldn't have to. He's done more for the community than most people in this thread (myself included) combined. New modders especially though... if you give them that sort of 'constructive criticism' they won't hang round for long.

Just be friendly and respectful of other people and their work.

[Droid803]

If you can't really think of anything to add that can't be on the normal map, then I'd just round out the curves a bit more, maybe add some details to the guns, but they'll probably be like 4 pixels large tough...(but anyone that opens the model can tell its definitely high poly when the gun barrels have detailing!)

Maybe put some machinery in one of the pods, and a Vasudan Pilot in the other.

You could also probably model in the "grill" like area behind the cannons so it'd look better than just a normal map.

[Snail]

I'm very sorry I acted like a dick. My actions were completely out of line and I apologize unreservedly for my deplorable actions.

[Kolgena]

To be fair, the original concept of this fighter doesn't lend itself to being pretty. Besides, it's a Dollar Store fighter vasudans chuck out as ML16 fodder.

I think Galemp would need to make some stylistic departures if he wants to make it look much better; extra polies to get things less angular isn't going to boost appearance that much. I'm thinking things like make the cockpits more stretched ellipsoids and less rounded bricks, or remodeled wings for a more tapered and fluid appearance.

So, it's either hardcore canon or less canon but more pretty. I'd accept anything Galemp puts out based on his judgment of where the balance should lie.

[Admiral Nelson]

It would be nice if the Vasudan pilot model could be fit in there.  That huge panoramic cockpit lends itself to showing off the presumably doomed Vasudan within.

[Mobius]

That would be nice!

[Titan]

Just suggesting, it might still be an idea to put the detail in the model, at least a good part, as there are still tons of people who can't use normal maps.

[The E]

No. A good main diffuse map, supplemented by hinted detail on the model is preferable. In the end, if you can't run the shaders, you probably shouldn't ask for more model detail.