[Mobius]

I don't think the cost matters for the Shivans, generic Hive mind and alien theories don't tend to give cost so much importance. In my opinion it could be a pocket and versatile weapon with an exaggerated table entry(hitpoints, LRed).

[terran_emperor]

The lilith is IMHO essentially a flying beam cannon.

I reckon about 2/3 of it's space is dedicated to the focuing coils and reactors and other gizmos needed for beam cannons. The rest consists of the Subspace drives and normal space engine, heavy armour, defence turrets and a small command area.

[Droid803]

Yeah, its just a Shivan Mjolnir on engines.

[Mobius]

I think it must have some command ability...I mean, the fact that it has an overkill weapon it doesn't make it an "all muscle, no brain" thing.

Try to imagine the situation...Shivan ships get separed, a group of Cains and Rakshasas remains with a Lilith. Which ship should partially tke control over them?

[FreeSpaceFreak]

The one with the biggest command centre

[Mobius]

Which should be the strongest one too, IMO...

[Droid803]

Which should be the strongest one too, IMO...

That's too obvious. Its should be on the weakest one so noone notices it.

[ShadowGorrath]

Which should be the strongest one too, IMO...

That's too obvious. Its should be on the weakest one so noone notices it.

And so that anyone can kill it easily.

[Snail]

Which should be the strongest one too, IMO...

That's too obvious. Its should be on the weakest one so noone notices it.

And so that anyone can kill it easily.

Unless you're playing along, you didn't notice he was joking.

The Lilith could be used for commanding other ships, and as seen in FS1 even a Cain (the Taranis) could do so.

[terran_emperor]

Shivan General #1: The Terrans Expect our command ships to Destroyers or bigger. Lets make them the last class anyone would expect.
Shivan General #2: Cain, Lilith or Rakshassa?
Shivan General #1: Erm I would say Cain because even a Cain can do the job of being a command ship, but i'll go with a Lilith...their tough SOBs. 
Shivan General #3: They may anticipate that we hide our C-ships by making them cruisers. Have either of you heard of hiding in plain sight? It means make the command ship the obvious choise - like a Ravana or Lucifer. Because its sooo obvious the will overlook it.

Random Shivan: Those will never work because those suggestions are too too crazy. Make the command ship a pathetically weak fighter like a basilisk or Aeshma. No one with any sense would ever think of or expect that

[admiral_wolf]

The Lilith is an awful bugger to take down.  I need to send at least 4 bombers and 8 fighters to ensure destruction of the target.  That's what I send for destroyers.  Heaven only knows what will happen if this so called "Corvette" class of war vessel gets built.  Damn GTVI and GTA/PVN High Command can be so difficult at times..

[Droid803]

Oh, I just got it.
In retail FS and FS2, Cains and Liliths are visually identical.

Shivan General #1: Erm I would say Cain because even a Cain can do the job of being a command ship!
Shivan General #2: Then lets slap some extra armor and a bigger guns on it.
Shivan General #1: Now, that, is thinking.

[Mobius]

Uhm the Shivans have been quickly dispatched when, without the Lucifer, there was nothing controlling them.

[Snail]

Uhm the Shivans have been quickly dispatched when, without the Lucifer, there was nothing controlling them.

That's not canon, that's commonly accepted fanon. Give me some canon evidence and I'll believe you.

The Lilith is an awful bugger to take down.  I need to send at least 4 bombers and 8 fighters to ensure destruction of the target.  That's what I send for destroyers.  Heaven only knows what will happen if this so called "Corvette" class of war vessel gets built.  Damn GTVI and GTA/PVN High Command can be so difficult at times..

Wow, only 12 small ships to take down a destroyer? No wonder you and your piss weak Galatea got vaporized.

[Mobius]

FS2 Intel entries?

BTW check INFA Internal...

[Snail]

FS2 Intel entries?

Quote said intel entries.

BTW check INFA Internal...

I don't know which smiley or wisecrack one-liner would be good enough for this occasion, so I guess I'll just check anyway.

[Mobius]

"32 years after the Great War, we still know almost nothing about the Shivans.

Physically, the Shivans have multiple, compound eyes and five legs with claw-like manipulators. Their insect-like carapace does not appear original to the creature's physiognomy, suggesting the Shivans are a cybernetic fusion of biology and technology. The integrated plasma weapon also exhibits properties of an organic-artificial fusion. The weapon may be a kind of focusing device powered by the energy of the being itself, though this point is the subject of heated controversy.

These details are cited as evidence that the Shivans could not have evolved as the Terran or Vasudan species had, but that they were likely constructed by another entity. Only a handful of Shivans have ever been captured, and all research on live specimens ended with the GTI's Hades rebellion in 2335. The results of these studies remain highly classified.

Though the Shivans are obviously xenocidal, their motives and origins have yet to be determined. According to Ancient artifacts, the Shivans seem to possess some kind of sensitivity to subspace disturbances. We do not know if the Shivans returned to this corner of the galaxy by chance, by cycle or pattern, or by their detection of Terran-Vasudan subspace travel. 

Xenobiologists know very little about Shivan society. A leading hypothesis is the hive mind theory, arguing that Shivan society is broken down in specialized functions driven by a collective intelligence. The most convincing evidence supporting this theory is the behavior of Shivan forces following the destruction of the Lucifer, the turning point of the Great War. Other experts caution against attributing insectoid properties to the Shivans, regardless of their appearance and behavior. Shivan communication seems to occur in the electromagnetic spectrum, though efforts to decode their transmissions have yielded no meaningful results to date."

[Snail]

Alright then.

Still, the Shivan fleet wasn't in complete meltdown, the Hellfire fleet did in fact try to regroup and plan a strategic attack.

[Mobius]

That can be connected to what I said about the Lilith a few posts ago. The Hellfire was a Demon, the strongest ship among the one that remained.

[Droid803]

It says 'the behavior of Shivan forces', rather than explicitly state that they were quickly dispatched.
You assume they were quickly dispatched, but there really isn't any canon evidence. It states it supports the hive-mind hypotheses, but really, destroying all the flagship of any fleet would throw the forces into disarray, especially if they were spread out and proper chain-of-command couldn't be reestablished.

Btw, Mobius, I'm confused about which side you're on again >.>