Author Topic: BP: War in Heaven discussion  (Read 918354 times)

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
Right, I don't want to use my own opinion, but...

How does the GTVA like their threat exigency stuff, used against real Shivans? Did the end result of the threat exigency thingy work as expected? Was there room for improvement? Did it fail horribly?

The GTVA's pre-Sol invasion doctrine was never engineered for fighting the UEF in mind. So...I don't want to factor them in, because they're unrelated.

Well, the TEI ships laid a severe beatdown on most standard Shivan forces in AoA. They still were heavily outmatched by superdestroyers and juggernauts, however. Something tells me that a defensive operation, a la Capella in FS2, would be far more succesful with the new ships. Shock jumping Chimeras and Bellaphorons, subspace missile strikes, precision jumping, better and faster fighters, even more destroyers with HUGE hangar bays (the Titan), more powerful beams, ship-ship missiles, expanded logistics capabilities with the GTL Anemoi, and who even KNOWS what came of any recovered ETAK data, as far as potentially disrupting Shivan communications and jamming their weapons is concerned. Also, I am sure plenty more was learned about subspace travel via the whole rebuilding-a-knossos operation, so the GTVA could very well have extremely advanced subspace tracking, able to detect Shivan ships way before they even appear. And who even knows what the Vasudans have come up with militarily...

The possibilities are endless, really.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2011, 09:08:33 am by Insomniac34 »

 

Offline The E

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
Right, I don't want to use my own opinion, but...

How does the GTVA like their threat exigency stuff, used against real Shivans? Did the end result of the threat exigency thingy work as expected? Was there room for improvement? Did it fail horribly?

TEI succeeded, in that it gave the GTVA a new, more powerful and more flexible fleet. Its success can be seen when you look at the 14h Battlegroup, and how it was able to cope with being stranded in another universe all of a sudden, defeating a Sathanas, a Lucifer, and a number of Destroyers over the course of a few days.

Quote
The GTVA's pre-Sol invasion doctrine was never engineered for fighting the UEF in mind. So...I don't want to factor them in, because they're unrelated.

Okay, you may want to clarify that statement a bit, because I have no idea what it is you're trying to say.
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Offline Luis Dias

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
I think his point is that the ships weren't developed with the UEF in mind.

 

Offline starlord

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
true, but remember the vishnans helped: the orestes would not have lasted long against the lucifer...

 

Offline -Norbert-

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
The Lucifer, a demon and several smaller ships. And we don't know how many ships the Orestes and consorts destroyed before Bei rode in with the Vishnans.
That they were able to drive the Lucifer away several times (they wouldn't say "everytime we manage to damage it, it jumps" if they did it only twice) and not lose any ships in the process shows how good those ships and crews are.

 
Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
Plus, Lucifer aside, these were the ships that managed to quickly destroy a Sathanas Juggernaut with minimal losses, using the tactics they were built to take advantage of (shock jumps), again not to mention the potentially vast amount of other Shivan craft the Orestes and Temeraire took out offscreen. And they arguably had even less intel to work off of than the forces in the SSI.

These TEI ships are the real deal, and I think its more then safe to say their designers achieved their objectives.

 

Offline -Norbert-

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
I agree.... untill the Shivans adapt anyway, but I guess we'll see in BP 3.

 
Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
Just finished AoA.

I'm so very glad that I grabbed an Ares instead of the Eriynes (sp) fighter. Did you know that an Ares can survive a direct impact with a Shivan Cruiser's primary beam cannon? I finished the final mission with 1% hull and no sensors.

 

Offline Droid803

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
What difficulty
(´・ω・`)
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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
No idea. Whatever standard is. I haven't played with the difficulty settings.

 

Offline Droid803

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
Easy, then. which means you have twice as much HP as you actually have due to 50% damage reduction.
So, it would actually have killed you almost twice over :P
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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
Probably. It's just the only fighter I've ever stared straight into a main beam and gotten shot and lived. I went from 100% to 1%. Pow! I lol'd.

 

Offline Androgeos Exeunt

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
The Lucifer, a demon and several smaller ships. And we don't know how many ships the Orestes and consorts destroyed before Bei rode in with the Vishnans.

Even after Bei and the Vishnans come in, the Hyde tends to get destroyed by the Boreas, because everyone else is busy dealing with the Lucifer.
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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
So whatever was the reason for Capella's Supernova in the Blue Planet continuity anyway? 

I mean, in the standard one (without the preservers or the specific reason for Shivans existing), it is speculated as being for opening a way back home (maybe to "shivantown"). 

But that doesn't really work in Blue Planet, considering both the revealed purpose of the shivans as well as their nature. 

Spoiler:
At the end of AoA, the dialogue between the great preserver and that Dante makes it seem as though they are both "higher plane" entities (at the least, the Vishnans are from the experiences Bei has with them).  I don't know what manner of requirements are in place for either side to "inject" new ships into the universe from their own realm, but any way I can think of to involve Capella only leads to me questioning why the shivans would "open up" that area when they already had enough juggernauts to wipe the area clean, especially if "opening up" that star would have also allowed the Vishnans to begin sending ships into that region of the universe. 




 

Offline Flak

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
I never got hit by a Rakshasa beam before though, but I know a Deimos and Diomedes beam is an instant death.

 

Offline -Norbert-

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
In the BP continuity the blowing up of the star might have been a warning to the GTVA.
"Know that we can even blow up your stars. There is no place were you can hide and you can't defeat us, so behave yourself or die!"

Also any information about the Vishnans existing outside of the universes and only projecting themselfs into one of their choosing comes directly from them. Information that they pretty much loaded directly into the receipients brain, before his mind was plugged out of his body and either transplanted or projected into a ship. Who can tell what else they did with Beis brain in the process....

That's why I think we don't know wether Beis information is really true. And even if it is, we still wouldn't know if the Shivans are the same, or "only" a corporeal species fully dependant on subspace to travel around and get in reinforcements, wether they come from another sunsystem, galaxy or reality.

 

Offline Androgeos Exeunt

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
I never got hit by a Rakshasa beam before though.

I have, in retail. Instant death, even on Very Easy, flying a Seth.
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Offline crizza

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
This is the most frustrating thing...rushing towards a shivan capship, maxim blazing away at their beamcannons...and all the sudden BAM, it simply smacks you up^^

 

Offline Destiny

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
So...why don't you guys fly out of beam firing arcs on approach? Like approaching from another direction (does not apply to Deimos).

 

Offline ssmit132

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Re: BP: War in Heaven discussion
This is the most frustrating thing...rushing towards a shivan capship, maxim blazing away at their beamcannons...and all the sudden BAM, it simply smacks you up^^
All you need to do is to "avoid the beam and you won't get hit, pilot." :p