I thiink you hit the nail on the head when you mentioned non-linear earlier. If something is non-linear but detailed enough then who needs a plot.
Non-linear games, however, often present a watered down quality over their more linear brothers. Instead of the writers and developers focusing on the main plot and gameplay, they're scattered all over doing mini-quests and alternate paths. It can weaken the game as a whole when you see some parts being more refined than others. I'd rather a stronger central plot than a lot of weak lines you can follow.QFT. I never finished the first chapter of Baldur's Gate because I got annoyed at how many side quests there were.
Plot makes for replayability.Seconded. I think the Metal Gear Solid games are a good example of this. Granted, they aren't completely linear; there are different ways to get through every area and fight every boss, but they certainly aren't open-ended games. You basically just sneak and fight your way from cutscene to cutscene and that's okay. I think just the story and atmosphere are enough to make them replayable.
By non-linear I didn't mean side quests, I meant stuff like multiple endings. I don't mean multiple endings where you can choose at the end no matter what your previous actions, I mean like the endings branch out in the middle of the game.I've always really disliked the concept of non-linear games for this very reason. (As a kid, I completely despised those "choose your own adventure" books; I kept going back and reading every little possible option before trying to move on. :p) I'd infinitely rather play through a carefully-crafted storyline, being led along by the writers, than just cast out on my own, trying to figure out which of twenty quests/story threads I want to follow. (Incidentally, this is the same reason why I'd never consider playing a trading-based space game, but that's another story.) I freely admit that I have nary a creative bone in my body, but that's fine by me; I'd much rather be told a story than help make it myself.
Non-linear games, however, often present a watered down quality over their more linear brothers. Instead of the writers and developers focusing on the main plot and gameplay, they're scattered all over doing mini-quests and alternate paths. It can weaken the game as a whole when you see some parts being more refined than others. I'd rather a stronger central plot than a lot of weak lines you can follow.
Do any of the plot people have games they've replayed just for the plot, even when actually disliking the core gameplay?Well, neither plot nor open-ended replayability will save a game if it just sucks. :p
Do any of the plot people have games they've replayed just for the plot, even when actually disliking the core gameplay?
Do any of the plot people have games they've replayed just for the plot, even when actually disliking the core gameplay?A good number of the games I've replayed fall under this category. The MGS titles, for instance, I have far more fun watching the cutscenes than actually playing. But I think this is mainly just because I'm not much of a gamer.
Do any of the plot people have games they've replayed just for the plot, even when actually disliking the core gameplay?
A couple. Not many. Consider that it would be rare to see very much of the plot when you dislike the core gameplay and it's obvious. The only one that immediately comes to mind is Homeworld 2. Doubtless there are more amidst the vast quantity of games I have floating around.
However you're missing the existence of the large "meh" quality gameplay and good plot category.
Must admit, Gameplay will always come first, good plot and no gameplay is far harder to play than good gameplay and no plot, after all, look at Tetris, Pac-Man, Warning Forever etc,
QFT. I never finished the first chapter of Baldur's Gate because I got annoyed at how many side quests there were.
What I'm waiting for is for the industry to finally integrate gameplay and story, so that there isn't this (ultimately unnecessary) divide being 'the game' and 'the fluff'. Games shouldn't be designed around having 'gaming bits' and 'story time' but should wrap them up and bundle them together so that the actual gameplay tells the story, which is far more effective than reading a block of text between episodes in Doom or whatever.
What I'm waiting for is for the industry to finally integrate gameplay and story, so that there isn't this (ultimately unnecessary) divide being 'the game' and 'the fluff'.While it depends on the genre, I daresay this is already being done in some ways. In Half Life 2 Episode 1, if you use the "commentary" function, you'll notice that the developers went to great lengths to draw the players attention to certain features in the game which told the story. So if you actively tried to avoid them it was possible to play through and not pick up much storyline, but for the most part it was put right infront of you for you to realise "hey, I'm playing the game and it's telling me the story".
i.e. FreeSpace 2, hmm? For example, the Sathanas emerging from the wreckage of the Knossos, Bosch escaping past the Colossus, the first use of the ETAK device?
Do you see what I'm talking about? Sure, simple level design tells me "you're going to all these new places because it's the last segment of the game and we need new content to excite you". However, this merges with a higher game design principle to become something more. The change from free, short-length, hub-based, (sort of) non-linear gaming in the first two-thirds/three-quarters of the game to the linear, circuitous track that you follow in the last segment really emphasises, in my view, the desperation of the Prince's fight against the inevitability of fate.
It's beyond just having Alyx or Breen in the game with you, talking and acting on screen... it's a meta-game consideration, where the very design of the game itself reinforces the message that the developers want to put forth. That's what makes games different from 'interactive movies' or what-have-you; that is where the potential of games to be even greater story-tellers than books or cinema lies. Now, Warrior Within doesn't take it far enough, or even very far at all, but it's still going places that I want to be.
:wtf:
I don't think he will notice your response. This thread is over six months old. :p