Hard Light Productions Forums
General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: Polpolion on November 20, 2006, 04:11:22 pm
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I find it pretty useless. It was said to have a huge payload and everything, but the only advantage it has over other bombers is it's ability to carry the helios and heavy armor. And the heavy armor is negated by it's size and speed. Its payload is the same as other bombers, you'd think it would at least have the payload of a boanerges.
What do you guys think of it?
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*sigh*
Where's my flamethrower?
EDIT: If you really know how to fly an Ursa then speed isn't a problem. Plus, take into account that the Ursa was entered into active service THIRTY-TWO years before the Boanerges. And the Boanerges sucks. Give me an Ursa or Artemis D.H. any day.
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We all know the Ursas crud. Its obvious. Its a fact that stares us in the face every time we see an Ursa. But we still find a way to love them. Wierd, huh?
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By "we," you mean "you," right?
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EDIT: If you really know how to fly an Ursa then speed isn't a problem. Plus, take into account that the Ursa was entered into active service THIRTY-TWO years before the Boanerges.
And taken into account how it's twice the size of a Medusa but has the same missile capacity? ::)
If you really know how to fly an Ursa, then you're flying a Boanerges. I'd hazard a guess that it was cheaper than the Ursa was too.
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EDIT: If you really know how to fly an Ursa then speed isn't a problem. Plus, take into account that the Ursa was entered into active service THIRTY-TWO years before the Boanerges.
And taken into account how it's twice the size of a Medusa but has the same missile capacity? ::)
Um, when the Ursa was made, it was made specifically to carry the Harbinger bombs, and the Harbingers are HUGE. The Ursa NEEDS to be large in order to carry them. The Medusa can't carry the Harbingers. Yes, they both have 3 missile banks, but so freaking what? Almost every bomber in the game has 3 banks. Almost every bomber can carry the same number of missiles and bombs.
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I personally like the fact that the Ursa has a Kayser turret. I've gotten more kills out of "Slaying Ravana" for ships I never shot than I would have imagined.
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@cobra
Let's look at it this way.
The Medusa has a 50gb hard drive. It can at most fit 5 separate 10gb files on it. The Ursa has a 100gb hard drive, but it can only fit 5 separate 10gb files or 2 25gb files on it. The other half is just wasted space.
Sound retarded?
Exactly.
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@cobra
Let's look at it this way.
The Medusa has a 50gb hard drive. It can at most fit 5 separate 10gb files on it. The Ursa has a 100gb hard drive, but it can only fit 5 separate 10gb files or 2 25gb files on it. The other half is just wasted space.
Sound retarded?
Exactly.
You bet it sounded retarded. It made YOU look retarded, too. Can you possibly get any dumber? That doesn't even make sense!
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Coming from you, that doesn't mean all too much. :)
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Says the person who's earned the title "Think, then post."
Seriously guys, keep it on topic.
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Sorry Stratcomm, I just wanted to respond to his crappy flame.
Besides, I was simply stating that I was not insulted because I was flamed by someone who is backing up their argument with opinions. :nod:
Back on topic, if the Ursa can carry the HUGE harbinger, and it's capacity is the same as the Medusa's, and virtually every other bomber, why can't they all mount the Harbinger? Because the Ursa has more space? Then why can't it fit more tsunamis or other missiles?
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CANON. For god's sake, canon!
EDIT: Oh, right. Don't forget the various loading mechanisms inside the bomb bays.
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Since when does the Ursa have the same payload as the Medusa? What is this nonsense?
Ursa is better on easy or very easy where it doesn't matter how much damage you take.
Edit: er... the other way around. It's better because it only matters how much damage you take, and not how well you dodge. Or dodging is less useful, anyway. Yeah. Dodging is less useful.
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CANON. For god's sake, canon!
EDIT: Oh, right. Don't forget the various loading mechanisms inside the bomb bays.
Yeah, how about that? I never said it should be changed. I was just whining very annoyingly about it. And anyway, why didn't you say that in the first place? We could have avoided this mess entirely! ::)
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:wtf:
I'm done. I'm just done with this thread. I've tried to explain to you why an Ursa apparently has the same payload as a Medusa, which, in fact, it doesn't. Instead you've been stubborn, completely ignoring what I've said and posting crap that doesn't make sense. And finally when I state that the amount of freaking harbingers and tsunamis the Ursa can carry is only due to canon and a certain story behind it (and possibly, game engine limitations), you turn around and blame the entire argument on me?
Psh.
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The Ursa is after all an older design. It is fairly mediocre in FS2 (the Sekhmet is equal or better in almost every way) but was great for its time in FS1. As was said earlier, the Medusa is weaker and can't carry harbingers even if it's actual capacity is only slightly less, and it wasn't all that much faster or more maneuverable anyway. The Ursa also has the extra primary weapon mount.
And I might add that the way this thread has proceeded is ridiculous. A good example of what's wrong with this place these days. :rolleyes:
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I <3 Ursa.
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The Ursa is after all an older design. It is fairly mediocre in FS2 (the Sekhmet is equal or better in almost every way) but was great for its time in FS1. As was said earlier, the Medusa is weaker and can't carry harbingers even if it's actual capacity is only slightly less, and it wasn't all that much faster or more maneuverable anyway. The Ursa also has the extra primary weapon mount.
Indeed. The Ursa was the bomber to fear in FS1. In FS2, the times and technology have changed, and the Ursa is more obsolete. It doesnt even compare with the Medusa, though. Not at all, it's far more powerful.
You people forget to keep things in context. This game isnt and never was about ships being as fast as a Perseus with as much power as an Ursa. Balance, and playability play a major role in what makes FS so great. Many of you forget that.
And I might add that the way this thread has proceeded is ridiculous. A good example of what's wrong with this place these days. :rolleyes:
Indeed again. Cut the flaming. (Cobra, if you have nothing nice to say, or disagree, either say nothing, or say something politely.) This kind of behaviour is what I'd expect from elementary schoolers. Either grow up, or shut up. More flaming will end up with this thread being locked. It's far too diseased as it is to cut out the cancer and hope to start anew.
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The Ursa rocks... but I prefer the Medusa... when it comes to heavy bombing though... the Ursa is the best Terran bomber... granted the Zod and Shivan bombers are better.
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Uh... I have to side with Cobra on this one.
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I think that if they added another turret on the bottom of the Ursa and made the top speed 50, It'd be A LOT better. I'm not quite sure how balanced that would be, thought.
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Well, it depends on if you want a maneuverable bomber, or a bomber that's practically a sitting duck with 10 meters of hull. Me, if I had to fly a bomber, I'd pick the sitting duck because you should have a decent fighter escort that can take out fighters that are attacking you while you pound the crap out of a capital ship...
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You're missing the point. It was extremely expensive and impractical to even use an Ursa in combat, let alone make a version that was maneuverable and fast.
Context!
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It was only used once in the FS campaign, and never necessary in FS2.
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It was used 3 times in FS1, and several more times in silent threat.
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Are you including the last two mission of FS1 and the last one of Silent threat?
because i always flew an ursa in those.
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Black Omega you flew an ursa. Great Hunt Delta wing was present in ursas. Good luck Delta wing was present in ursas. Secrets revealed in ST also featured a plethora of ursas. Hardly an insignifigant bomber.
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5 primaries, lots of shielding and hull, 3 missile banks which you can load ith anything your heart desires, a KAYSER turret.... what's not to like?
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The Ursa is after all an older design. It is fairly mediocre in FS2 (the Sekhmet is equal or better in almost every way)
Pity they never let you fly it then :D
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Yes, it was like flying with a dead elephant on your back, but the Ursa more than made up for it with payload and shielding in FS1.
And in FS2, I love that kayser turret.
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Plus, there's something just so visceral about using that shoot-from-the-hip triple gun to nail enemy fighters at long range. I had a ton of fun picking off HOL bastards back in Black Omega with that thing. :D
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-has a turret
-5 primaries/2 banks
-can carry temps
:yes2:
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Medusa
$SBank Capacity: ( 40, 80, 80 )
Ursa
$SBank Capacity: ( 80, 80, 80 )
Same capacity?
:confused:
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I think he meant 3 slots, which is a stupid comparison method.
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Agreed.
It doesn't matter how many slots there are, does it? The Myrmidon has 3 shots, does that give it the same capacity as the Ursa?
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Actually... Myrmidon can carry Helios'...
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Sure, but not many. (1 in each bank? Or was it 1 in both of the first and 2 in the last?)
Oh, and that also counters Cobra's comment about the Ursa being big because it has to carry Helios/Harbinger.
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The latter, but his argument was still moot.
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Im guessing that in FS2 the Boanerges is the (intended) replacement for the Ursa, right?
If i recall correctly, the tech room desc. gives the impression that the Boanerges is easy to repair and maintain...therefore cost-effective, which im guessing the Ursa isn't.
not sure about armor and shielding...i believe the Ursa can take more damage?
also, i believe the ursa was slower, but handles better in game? (cant really check ATM, as my computer's connection to the residence hall network is f***ed and i am in the computer lab downstairs.)
They have the same amount of payload, yes?
So im guessing that the GTVA doctrine is that we phase out the Ursas for faster, more cost-effective heavy bombers, and have our new generation of fighters (Perseus + Erinyes) do point and heavy escort, so that we dont have to make them maneuvrable.
Sort of like what happened to the Aeolus class...good but expensive, and better to stick the Deimos class of 'vettes instead.
this seems like a stupid idea ingame considering the underwhelming intelligence of the wingmen, but in a RL situation, where our pilots are academy graduates and skilled in escort....idk
thats just my idea...
personally id take the ursa, due to its 5 gunpoints, 2 gun systems, and turret, vs the boanerges and its 2 gunpoints.....as a GTVA commander, id get some good pilots to escort my cheap Boanerges.
:blah: all a matter of perspective.
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$Name: GTB Ursa
$Short name: TBomb5
$Species: Terran
+Type: XSTR("Assault Bomber", 3017)
+Maneuverability: XSTR("Very Poor", 3018)
+Armor: XSTR("Very Heavy", 3019)
+Manufacturer: XSTR("Han-Ronald Corp.", 3020)
+Description: XSTR(" ", 3021)
$end_multi_text
+Tech Description:
XSTR("The GTB Ursa is the slowest bomber in the GTVA fleet. What it lacks in speed, however, it more than makes up with its massive payload. The Ursa was the first GTVA bomber designed specifically to destroy capital ships. With a rack of Helios bombs, in addition to a standard complement of Hornet missiles and Prometheus cannon, a squadron of Ursas can take out a destroyer. Ursas have the highest shielding of any bomber, along with a GTVI-designed hyper-dense hull. These help ensure that the Ursa gets close enough to deliver its payload and possibly even survive the escape.", 3022)
$end_multi_text
+Length: 41 m
+Gun Mounts: 5
+Missile Banks: 3
$POF file: bomber05.pof
$Detail distance: (0, 150, 550, 1300)
$Show damage: YES
$Density: 1
$Damp: 0.2
$Rotdamp: 0.55
$Max Velocity: 0.0, 0.0, 45.0
$Rotation time: 5.5, 6.0, 6.0
$Rear Velocity: 0.0
$Forward accel: 4.0
$Forward decel: 2.0
$Slide accel: 0.0
$Slide decel: 0.0
$Expl inner rad: 75.0
$Expl outer rad: 150.0
$Expl damage: 30.0
$Expl blast: 2000.0
$Expl Propagates: NO ;; If set to Yes, then when the ship dies, the explosion propagates through it.
$Shockwave Speed: 0.0 ;; speed shockwave expands at, 0 means no shockwave
$Allowed PBanks: ( "Subach HL-7" "Akheton SDG" "Morning Star" "Prometheus S" "Prometheus R" "Lamprey" "Circe" "Maxim")
$Allowed Dogfight PBanks: ( "Subach HL-7" "Akheton SDG" "Morning Star" "Prometheus S" "Prometheus R" "Lamprey" "Circe" "Maxim")
$Default PBanks: ( "Prometheus R" "Prometheus R" )
$Allowed SBanks: ( "Rockeye" "Tempest" "Harpoon" "Hornet" "Tornado" "Trebuchet" "Piranha" "Stiletto II" "Cyclops" "Cyclops#short" "Helios" "EMP Adv." "Infyrno" )
$Allowed Dogfight SBanks: ( "Rockeye" "Tempest" "Harpoon" "Hornet" "Tornado" "Trebuchet" "Piranha" "Stiletto II" "Cyclops" "Cyclops#short" "Helios" "EMP Adv." "Infyrno" )
$Default SBanks: ( "Hornet" "Piranha" "Cyclops#short" )
$SBank Capacity: ( 80, 80, 80 )
$Shields: 850
$Shield Color: 100 100 255
$Power Output: 4.5
$Max Oclk Speed: 60.0
$Max Weapon Eng: 150.0
$Hitpoints: 550
$Flags: ( "player_ship" "default_player_ship" "bomber" "in tech database")
$AI Class: Captain
$Afterburner: YES
+Aburn Max Vel: 0.0, 0.0, 90.0
+Aburn For accel: 0.7
+Aburn Fuel: 300.0
+Aburn Burn Rate: 80.0
+Aburn Rec Rate: 25.0
$Countermeasures: 40
$Scan time: 2000
$EngineSnd: 127 ;; Engine sound of ship
$Closeup_pos: 0.0, 0.0, -69
$Closeup_zoom: 0.5
$Shield_icon: shield-b05
$Ship_icon: iconbomber05
$Ship_anim: ssbomber05
$Ship_overhead: loadbomber05
$Score: 10
$Trail:
+Offset: 1.69 4.5 -11.3
+Start Width: 0.25
+End Width: 0.05
+Start Alpha: 1.0
+End Alpha: 0.0
+Max Life: 1.0
+Spew Time: 120
+Bitmap: Contrail01
$Trail:
+Offset: -1.69 4.5 -11.3
+Start Width: 0.25
+End Width: 0.05
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+Bitmap: Contrail01
$Trail:
+Offset: 13.93 0 1.97
+Start Width: 0.25
+End Width: 0.05
+Start Alpha: 1.0
+End Alpha: 0.0
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+Spew Time: 120
+Bitmap: Contrail01
$Subsystem: communications, 10, 0.0
$Subsystem: navigation, 10, 0.0
$Subsystem: weapons, 20, 0.0
$Subsystem: sensors, 10, 0.0
$Subsystem: engine, 35, 0.0
$Subsystem: b05-turreta,1,1.0
$Default PBanks: ( "UD-8 Kayser" )
$Name: GTB Boanerges
$Short name: TBomb21
$Species: Terran
+Type: XSTR("Heavy Bomber", 3029)
+Maneuverability: XSTR("Very Poor", 3030)
+Armor: XSTR("Very Heavy", 3031)
+Manufacturer: XSTR("RNI Systems", 3032)
+Description: XSTR(" ", 3033)
$end_multi_text
+Tech Description:
XSTR("The new GTB Boanerges has been assigned to elite bomber squadrons in the 3rd, 4th, and 5th Terran battle groups. The challenge of maintaining an aging fleet has motivated the GTVA to develop a new generation of ships able to withstand long-term abuse in the field. By maximizing shielding and payload (while offering enough maneuverability to make it a viable tactical unit), the Boanerges promises to remain in service for decades to come. One test pilot observed that the Boanerges handles better than any other bomber and has enough firepower to make it a formidable anti-capship weapon.", 3034)
$end_multi_text
+Length: 34 m
+Gun Mounts: 1
+Missile Banks: 3
$POF file: bomber2t-01.pof
$Detail distance: (0, 180, 350, 1300)
$Show damage: YES
$Density: 1
$Damp: 0.35
$Rotdamp: 0.55
$Max Velocity: 0.0, 0.0, 55.0
$Rotation time: 5.5, 6.0, 6.0
$Rear Velocity: 0.0
$Forward accel: 4.0
$Forward decel: 2.0
$Slide accel: 0.0
$Slide decel: 0.0
$Expl inner rad: 50.0
$Expl outer rad: 100.0
$Expl damage: 25.0
$Expl blast: 2000.0
$Expl Propagates: NO ;; If set to Yes, then when the ship dies, the explosion propagates through it.
$Shockwave Speed: 0.0 ;; speed shockwave expands at, 0 means no shockwave
$Allowed PBanks: ( "Subach HL-7" "Prometheus S" "Prometheus R" "Lamprey" "Circe" "Maxim" "UD-8 Kayser" )
$Allowed Dogfight PBanks: ( "Subach HL-7" "Prometheus S" "Prometheus R" "Lamprey" "Circe" "Maxim" "UD-8 Kayser" )
$Default PBanks: ( "Prometheus R" )
$Allowed SBanks: ( "Rockeye" "Hornet" "Tornado" "Trebuchet" "Stiletto II" "Piranha" "Cyclops" "Cyclops#short" "Hornet#Weak" "EMP Adv." "Infyrno" "Helios" )
$Allowed Dogfight SBanks: ( "Rockeye" "Hornet" "Tornado" "Trebuchet" "Stiletto II" "Piranha" "Cyclops" "Cyclops#short" "Hornet#Weak" "EMP Adv." "Infyrno" "Helios" )
$Default SBanks: ( "Hornet" "Cyclops#short" "Cyclops#short" )
$SBank Capacity: ( 40, 100, 100 )
$Shields: 850
$Shield Color: 100 100 255
$Power Output: 4.0
$Max Oclk Speed: 65.0
$Max Weapon Eng: 100.0
$Hitpoints: 325
$Flags: ( "player_ship" "default_player_ship" "bomber")
$AI Class: Captain
$Afterburner: YES
+Aburn Max Vel: 0.0, 0.0, 85.0
+Aburn For accel: 0.7
+Aburn Fuel: 300.0
+Aburn Burn Rate: 50.0
+Aburn Rec Rate: 25.0
$Countermeasures: 35
$Scan time: 2000
$EngineSnd: 127 ;; Engine sound of ship
$Closeup_pos: 0.0, 0.0, -51
$Closeup_zoom: 0.5
$Shield_icon: shieldbt-01
$Ship_icon: iconbomber2t-01
$Ship_anim: ssbomber2t-01
$Ship_overhead: loadbomber2t-01
$Score: 10
$Trail:
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$Trail:
+Offset: -9.5 -1.247 -15.68
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+End Alpha: 0.0
+Max Life: 1.0
+Spew Time: 120
+Bitmap: Contrail01
$Subsystem: communications, 10, 0.0
$Subsystem: navigation, 11, 0.0
$Subsystem: weapons, 20, 0.0
$Subsystem: sensors, 10, 0.0
$Subsystem: engine01, 17, 0.0
$Subsystem: engine02, 17, 0.0
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One test pilot observed that the Boanerges handles better than any other bomber and has enough firepower to make it a formidable anti-capship weapon.
The rest observed that its mediocre armor and lack of any defensive turrets make it a sitting duck.
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Although the Ursa and Boanerges appear to have the same total secondary capacity, the Boanerges is actually better in that respect as far as bombs go. If a secondary weapon's size doesn't divide the ship's capacity exactly, FS2 rounds up to the nearest integer, which results in the Boanerges being able to hold 3/7/7 Cyclops bombs while the Ursa carries 5/5/5. The Boanerges is even better with the Helios; not only does it carry 2/4/4 instead of 3/3/3 but it has an even number in each bank, so you can fire off all the bombs in a shorter amount of time (5 "launches" instead of 6).
The Ursa is after all an older design. It is fairly mediocre in FS2 (the Sekhmet is equal or better in almost every way)
Pity they never let you fly it then :D
I think it actually only appears once in the entire campaign, in loop1-1 (Rebels and Renegades), and even in that there are only four of them. :p It's used in several multiplayer missions though.
[edit] never mind, it's in one other mission too as a reinforcement wing. I never bothered to call them in. :p
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Also, the boag is no more manuverable than the ursa, meerly has 10m/s on it, which actually makes it worse for dogfights as its turning radius is greatly increased. the ursa has a net missile storage of 240, same as the boag (though less evenly distributed than the ursa), has a turret, and the ursa has 70% more armor plus a second primary bank (and 2.5x gunpoints). Ursa wins.
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Meh, I leave the bombing to the capable ( :lol: ) ai, and just beat the crap out of the fighters. Leave capships to capships.
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Also, the boag is no more manuverable than the ursa, meerly has 10m/s on it, which actually makes it worse for dogfights as its turning radius is greatly increased. the ursa has a net missile storage of 240, same as the boag (though less evenly distributed than the ursa), has a turret, and the ursa has 70% more armor plus a second primary bank (and 2.5x gunpoints). Ursa wins.
Plus the ursa's afterburner is 5m/s faster allowing it travel short distances faster.
Meh, I leave the bombing to the capable ( :lol: ) ai, and just beat the crap out of the fighters. Leave capships to capships.
I do the exact oppisite, bomb the hell out of the capships
then I end up killing most of the fighters anyways cause all my wingmen are dead :lol:
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Boanerges remember is more of a striking weapon while the Ursa is meant to last. If you want to absolutely pummel a cap ship with a heavy bomber strike the Boanerges is perfect. But it needs fighter cover. The Ursa is more rough and tumble...the area may not be clear but send in the Ursa's anyways and it can pummel whatever it needs to.
Two different concepts of assault. I prefer the Boanerges due to smaller size, slightly faster speed over the distance, and bigger potential load over a shorter period of time. But I can see why folks would like the Ursa as well.
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Most people seem to have been disappointed with the Boanerges. I'm one of them. Despite the tech description, the Boanerges really does not seem to handle better then an Ursa. It also lacks the Ursa's second primary bank, having only a single two-gun set of primaries. In most anti-capital missions you'll want a Maxim primary, and dogfighting with a Maxim is an exercise in futility most of the time. This leaves you to fall back on your secondaries for anti-fighter protection, an uncomfortable situation, as secondaries run out. (And if you're not going after caps, why are you in a heavy bomber anyways?) It also does not seem to have a significantly stronger set of shields or a much stronger hull then an Ursa. Its only saving grace is that it has larger secondary bays and so can put a greater amount of weight on target before it runs dry...but sometimes this really does not seem enough to justify its use.
From the tech room description the Boanerges is really not meant to be better than the Ursa, but rather to be at least as good, the main driver for its adoption being reducing the maintenance burden. IMO the Boanerges is the better pure bomber, assuming that all heavy bomber wings are escorted by fighters, as they should be (but sometimes aren't), if you want to dogfight as well as bomb then you should really be using a light bomber like the Artemis or a Zeus, not a heavy bomber at all
A crucial line is crossed in the Boanerges. Previous heavy bombers were incapable of dogfighting. The Boanerges is incapable of defending itself.
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I prefer speed over firepower. It took a little bit to get used to the Inferno ships, but I much prefer them over the retail ships. Bombers I don't like all that much in a firefight because they're slow, they take time to deliver their payload, and interceptors can pwn their oversized butts. I see why bombers are useful, but they should warp in later into the firefight, rather than be destroyed by interceptors or fighters. And shivan bombers.......make good paperweights.
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And shivan bombers.......make good paperweights.
You wouldn't say that if you saw a wing of Vindhyachal bombers warping in... And to your horror a rain beam rips apart the convoy you're protecting...
:shaking:
Granted, however, the Shaitan, Nahema and even Durja are pretty crap, but if you're distracted by a few Hydras or Gorgons then they rip your flagship to pieces.
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Only 2 of all those you mention are canon. The rest are invalid for this debate. Just as someone can make an uber shivan bomber, I can make an even better terran/vasudan/lizard ship (Stats wise). So whatever point you were trying to make is moot.
canon vs canon only
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Uh... Don't drag 3rd party stuff into a canonical debate.
Edit: Damn, Raa wins.
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Then the horror of 4... seraphim... nvm :D
I prefer the ursa. The AI has NO defending capability (except as meatshields), and can't bomb worth anything. All the AI ever does for me is keeps things from shooting me. Then they die, and I die. But I get off some bombs in the meantime. Between the extra guns, the heavier armour, and the turret, the Ursa holds up far better then the Boanerges.
And in MP I bet that you get shredded either way, and should fly an artemis.
Classic... Inferno shivan bombers... :ick: any time those bombs hit, you are done for. Really, 10 or so bombs to drop a destroyer, 50 for a super destroyer... there may be a problem.
And don't mention the Vindhyachal.
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Perhaps people need to start playing on difficulties such as Medium and Hard to see that the AI is a lot more than they make it out to be.
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I always try to play on hard, and at worst (i.e. last mish of transcend) switch to easy.
And I know the AI is useless, because they never attack the sathanas :D
No, really, it's that the people in Transcend only survive because of invulnerable tags.
Only time I saw AI owning was in ITDoH when you have the Admiral AI vs. the Lt. AI or so. That, is hilarious.
Really, the AI is fine, just people get killed way too easily when it shows its potential :p
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You can edit the AI... but not in this discussion.
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You have to issue some well timed commands to get decent AI bombing runs. Order them to chase the nearest fighter while you take out the weapons subsystem.
Then order them in formation and fly to a good approach angle on the offending capship and then order them to attack your target. This usually results in a massive volley of bombs that won't be shot down, which in turn isn't very healthy for the capship in question.
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In Slaying Ravana I find that taking Alpha wing to a position directly above the Ravana before ordering an attack greatly increases the amount of damage they do before succumbing to interceptors / beams.
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In Slaying Ravana I find that taking Alpha wing to a position directly above the Ravana before ordering an attack greatly increases the amount of damage they do before succumbing to interceptors / beams.
I find equipping them with Ursas makes them not die at all.
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I discovered that as well.
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How do you guys die? I mean, I'm playing on medium, but that shouldn't make too much of a difference (does it?). I don't usually care how maneuverable it is for some reason, but the Ursa is just so slow! IIRC you gain 10 m/s with the boanerges. If I have a choice, I usually go with the Medusa unless I really need that larger secondary capacity.
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So... you mock the Ursa for being useless, and then choose a bomber which is even worse? :wtf:
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The Medusa is the best bomber for that mission I've found.
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No mission was specified :nervous:
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It was in the context... but okay... Slaying Ravana
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So... you mock the Ursa for being useless, and then choose a bomber which is even worse? :wtf:
What I'm saying it's kind of like saying the collie is horrible, and then going off to commission a Deimos.
You can get a lot more corvettes for the price of one juggernaut.
Besides, the Medusa severs it's purpose just as good if not better than an Ursa does its (assuming an assault bomber is what I think it is). Come to think of it, it might be better than the Boanerges, too.
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Sekhmat FTW.
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I find it pretty useless. It was said to have a huge payload and everything, but the only advantage it has over other bombers is it's ability to carry the helios and heavy armor. And the heavy armor is negated by it's size and speed. Its payload is the same as other bombers, you'd think it would at least have the payload of a boanerges.
What do you guys think of it?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/exterm.jpg)
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Sekhmat FTW.
The Sekhmat is so much better than any other bomber in the game, it's almost unbalanced.
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Shivan and Vasudan technology. Both make better reactors than Terrans. Combined... well, Sekhmat ftw. :p
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Now if only you could spell it.
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Yeah, it's a little sad to see the same spelling error three times. :D
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GVB Sekhmet. From memory. Love that bomber...and it gets almost no play in the main FS2 campaign...although there is a great Vasudan co-op mission where you use it.
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There are actually two missions like that in a sense, as it was also a popular ship (some would argue the best) for Rebel Intercept in the PXO days. It actually used to be one of the most commonly used ships in TvT games. Almost everyone used either that or the Herc II.
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Yeah, it's a little sad to see the same spelling error three times. :D
Ehh, Ive seen it spelled both ways... I dont remember how FS2 spells is, since I haven't played it in ages.
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GVB Sekhmet. From memory. Love that bomber...and it gets almost no play in the main FS2 campaign...although there is a great Vasudan co-op mission where you use it.
Doesn't it get absolutely no play in the main campaign?
the only time you even see it is in the first SOC loop, when they attack the Iceni.
IIRC they dont even carry bombs...just hornets.
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Because if they had bombs, the Iceni would have been toast.
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GVB Sekhmet. From memory. Love that bomber...and it gets almost no play in the main FS2 campaign...although there is a great Vasudan co-op mission where you use it.
Doesn't it get absolutely no play in the main campaign?
the only time you even see it is in the first SOC loop, when they attack the Iceni.
IIRC they dont even carry bombs...just hornets.
This is very true. Virtually no play in the main campaign at all and while its not quite as versatile as the GVB Bakha its definitely the better straight out assault bomber. It can even dogfight fairly well.
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GVB Sekhmet. From memory. Love that bomber...and it gets almost no play in the main FS2 campaign...although there is a great Vasudan co-op mission where you use it.
Doesn't it get absolutely no play in the main campaign?
the only time you even see it is in the first SOC loop, when they attack the Iceni.
IIRC they dont even carry bombs...just hornets.
This is very true. Virtually no play in the main campaign at all and while its not quite as versatile as the GVB Bakha its definitely the better straight out assault bomber. It can even dogfight fairly well.
It can dogfight better than a Herc II
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What is truly funny, is that if you had an Ursa with Helios second mission... well, say goodbye to the Iceni.
And on anything above medium, say goodbye to survival 0.o
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What is truly funny, is that if you had an Ursa with Helios second mission... well, say goodbye to the Iceni.
And on anything above medium, say goodbye to survival 0.o
You can disable the Iceni in that mission with just an SDG
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The Romans Blunder + SDG
"I fear your valiant efforts to stop me have failed, pilots. You would be well advised to question the wisdom of your leaders. Helm, engage subspace drive."
"Uhh...helm?"
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Wow, you were able to disable it? How? I've set my Myrmidon to full engine power and afterburners and I can't get closer than missile range.
BTW, in FS1 any kind of bomber is worthless. In FS2 there's a big gap between what damage a fighter does to a ship and what a bomber can do, but in FS1 even the Harbinger is relatively weak and you can actually get more damage in on a capship by flying your Apollo real close to the enemy destroyer and firing away with both barrels of Prometheus. Harbingers and Tsunamis are crap because 1) you need a lock to fire them, 2) they get shot down, and 3) they have a godawfully long reload time.
My capship killer of choice is the Athena, which can carry 20 Phoenix, which don't need a lock to be fired and can do a surprising ammount of damage (about 1% hull loss on any destroyer). Just get real close to the target and fire away at point blank, ordering in the support ship every few seconds.
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What is truly funny, is that if you had an Ursa with Helios second mission... well, say goodbye to the Iceni.
And on anything above medium, say goodbye to survival 0.o
You can disable the Iceni in that mission with just an SDG
Doesn't matter, it warps anyway. And it's indestructible
:D Don't ask.
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its indestructible?
I shot it with a BFRed and killed it...
i dont think its ever indestructible, really....
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What is truly funny, is that if you had an Ursa with Helios second mission... well, say goodbye to the Iceni.
And on anything above medium, say goodbye to survival 0.o
You can disable the Iceni in that mission with just an SDG
I've tried that, but was never able to completely disable it. I loaded my Myrmidon with Disruptors in the quad-bank and went for the engines and disabled it, only to find that the remaining engine subsystem seemed impervious. There may be an event designed to ship-invulnerable the Iceni it it gets down to just one engine subsystem.
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Even if you could disable the Iceni it would still jump out. It's using a departure cue not an ai-warpout order.
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oh...isnt that the engine subsystem that simply has no hitpoints?
thought that was on the Sathy, but i guess i could be wrong...
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I doubt you could really disable it, though. Even on Very Easy spamming Tempests in addition to HL-7 fire I fell about 20% short on the last engine.
The SDG doesn't work for that job because it'll eat through your energy much too fast for you to disable the Iceni.
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I doubt you could really disable it, though. Even on Very Easy spamming Tempests in addition to HL-7 fire I fell about 20% short on the last engine.
The SDG doesn't work for that job because it'll eat through your energy much too fast for you to disable the Iceni.
You can't even pick your loadout in that mission...so im assuming we use ~+w here....
IMO the Iceni is simply built for you to see only its tail section as it warps away...sort of adds to Bosch's mystique.
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The Romans Blunder + SDG
"I fear your valiant efforts to stop me have failed, pilots. You would be well advised to question the wisdom of your leaders. Helm, engage subspace drive."
"Uhh...helm?"
Someone plays on very easy :p
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lol ive never actually disabled the Iceni....i just thought it would be funny if it did happen
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You disable it in the mission before.... Place of Chariots I think?
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I doubt you could really disable it, though. Even on Very Easy spamming Tempests in addition to HL-7 fire I fell about 20% short on the last engine.
The SDG doesn't work for that job because it'll eat through your energy much too fast for you to disable the Iceni.
You can't even pick your loadout in that mission...so im assuming we use ~+w here....
IMO the Iceni is simply built for you to see only its tail section as it warps away...sort of adds to Bosch's mystique.
We're talking Mission 2, you're talking Mission 3. In mission 2 when you find the asteroid base, attack it, cause it to break-up, which releases the Iceni, there's a brief window of opportunity to attack its engines, but it jumps out before that can be done.
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I am convinced it can be done... I just don't have the patience to try over and over again.
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It can, however it has an impropor departure que to trigger it to warp regardless, so you will fail the mission. you also need to cheat to do it.
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They should have just fixed the engines before it does jump out.
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It can, however it has an impropor departure que to trigger it to warp regardless, so you will fail the mission. you also need to cheat to do it.
One of the missions where you canot proceed if you do what Command says.
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Nope. The Iceni will still jump if you manage to disable it.
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It can, however it has an impropor departure que to trigger it to warp regardless, so you will fail the mission. you also need to cheat to do it.
One of the missions where you canot proceed if you do what Command says.
Which one?
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ursa was the first bomber I grabbed, I saw "heavy assault" and "5" and figured "wow, that's gotta be better" I managet to take out the fighters that were making my life suck and get my cyclops's in <my first play through, I hadn't started actually reading stuff yet and getting acclimated, hadn't even realized what the 5 meant>
I still like the ursa and have since used it on missions on hard difficulty with success
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The Ursa would be a lot better if the AI didn't suck at escort...
EDIT: Actually that's kinda irrelevant, as in multiplayer, your escort (assuming it's human) is (usually) good. Maybe I'm just using it on all the wrong missions...
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Really, my issue is the AI doesn't target bombs worth squat. I mean, it randomnly fires, even when you're supposed to take out something.
And my opinion of the AI = Meatshields
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Playing above Easy ftw.
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Playing on hard now ftl :( (was med. not the skill leval easy)
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Really, my issue is the AI doesn't target bombs worth squat. I mean, it randomnly fires, even when you're supposed to take out something.
And my opinion of the AI = Meatshields
blob turrets target bombs juuuuust fine. :)
even on medium.
the AI are meatshields....waves of shivan bombers anyone? red circles all over your wingmen display anyone?
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Actually, I tend not to have that big of a problem with my wingmen at medium and above (where I almost always play).
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My experience with wingmen has been that unless you distract the enemy they have a horrendously short lifespan.
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My wingmen die at about the same times at almost all difficulty levels, except it is more noticeable at the higher ones.
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I'm a horrible individual because I just invincible my wingmen, eventually I'll get good enough I won't have to, but my hp is enough to worry about
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Wingmen are born to die, just like every other life form.
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Really, my issue is the AI doesn't target bombs worth squat. I mean, it randomnly fires, even when you're supposed to take out something.
And my opinion of the AI = Meatshields
blob turrets target bombs juuuuust fine. :)
even on medium.
the AI are meatshields....waves of shivan bombers anyone? red circles all over your wingmen display anyone?
Sorry, I meant firing. Like... they don't aim where they fire bombs.