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Hosted Projects - Standalone => Diaspora => Diaspora Multiplayer Open Beta => Topic started by: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 06:15:46 am

Title: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 06:15:46 am

Hi everybody !

I came across Diaspora at the end of last year! as a BSG fan i must
admit i'm blued by what you did with! :)
so, if i understood correctly, it is still in development?

despite all, I still noticed some big flaws in its development,
in particular with the balancing of the stas of the weapons and the ships.

yes, given that BSG is more realistic and nervous than Star Wars, for example,
I overhauled the stats with performances set on those of our current fighters!
for a very nervous gamelay!
I was able to do it thanks to the fact that you have them the excellent idea to put an assistance
cannon firing! :)

however, I noticed a few shortcomings:

MULTI:
=> shooting assistance is not active for the multi ... :(
  which makes the game, with my balancing, unplayable ... so, it would be good if you could
  implement it for multi, thank you :)

OTHER:
=> for the physics engine of the game, 5 very important mechanics are missing:
  -be able to shoot cannons by strafant.
  - be able to shoot cannons in strafant, with the "glide" mode active.
  -It lacks the armor for ships, and the penetration rate of armor for weapons.
  - it lacks linear acceleration / deceleration, and srtafe for missiles.
  -and all a bunch of possible improvements for the HUD ...

these are some of my ideas for the HUD:
http://modsimul.spatiales.free.fr/galerie-star-citizen-hud.html


I would also like to point out that I have completely modified a 12ne of space combat games;
in which I revised all the flight statistics of ships and weapons,
wedged on those of current hunters, and more; my goal, being to make these games a lot
more nervous and realistic!
(on average, maneuverability between x2 and 3, acceleration x2 / 3, speed x1.5 / 2 ...)
So I know how to go about balancing this type of game properly!

I modified the following games:

- Independence War 2 - Edge of Chaos
- Wing Commander Prophecy
- StarLancer
- X-Wing Alliance
- FreeSpace conflict
- Conflict FreeSpace 2
- Wing Commander Saga
- BSG Diasopra

- Independence War 2 - Edge of Chaos Demo
- Wing Commander Saga Prologue Demo
- BattleStar Galactica - Beyond the Red Line Demo


here are my personal mods (totally free):
http://modsimul.spatiales.free.fr

Here is my Youtube channel:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZZje2IuV7aLRUi7eTQ-Jgw

You will find demonstrative and comparative videos between the following games:
Independence War, Independence War 2, BattleStar Galactica - Beyond the Red Line Demo
and Star Citizen.

I offer my help (if you don't mind) with stats balancing and design
of the HUD, (and possibly its graphics; yes, I am a graphic designer :)).

there you go, thank you in advance! :)

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Cyborg17 on May 20, 2021, 07:04:54 am

Quote from: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 06:15:46 am

MULTI:
=> shooting assistance is not active for the multi ... :(
  which makes the game, with my balancing, unplayable ... so, it would be good if you could
  implement it for multi, thank you :)

Fotg implemented it. What version of FSO are you using?

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 07:18:35 am

I use Open Beta v3.7.1, and the game version v1.1.1; there is a new version, then?

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: The E on May 20, 2021, 07:29:13 am

This is all pretty impressive work you did there, but I have to ask: Why aren't you using Knossos?

Looking through the mods you posted, you've spent a lot of effort recreating the modding toolset with hexeditors and the like; it would be a lot easier for people to use your work if it was on Knossos.

And, speaking more generally, it seems to me that you're doing FSO modding the really really old-school pre-FSO way by directly replacing tbl files. We have extensive mechanisms to allow modders to only change the aspects of the game that they absolutely need to change; see this page on the wiki for reference (https://wiki.hard-light.net/index.php/Modular_Tables).

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: wookieejedi on May 20, 2021, 08:26:21 am

Quote from: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 07:18:35 am

I use Open Beta v3.7.1, and the game version v1.1.1; there is a new version, then?

As in version SCP 3.7.1? Currently FSO/SCP is on version 21.3 (albite the version numbers were changed to match the year, but still much more progressed then 3.7). Autoaim does work in multi in more recent versions of FSO (including the current stable release).

Knossos is very helpful for getting the most recent version with just 1 click :)

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 08:50:03 am

"And, speaking more generally, it seems to me that you're doing FSO modding the really really old-school pre-FSO way by directly replacing tbl files. We have extensive mechanisms to allow modders to only change the aspects of the game that they absolutely need to change; see this page on the wiki for reference."

OK thanks for these notes :) ; but, it also works with the modification of .tbl, so it's usable by the team working on Diaospora, right?

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: karajorma on May 20, 2021, 09:11:28 am

Auto Aim was deliberately turned off in multi and IIRC never worked in medium difficulty which is the default for TvT anyway.

But it's also worth mentioning that since multiplayer didn't work that well, Diaspora multi never took off so we never really balanced it properly.

I'm certainly more than happy to work with anyone who has ideas on how to improve the game.

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Colonol Dekker on May 20, 2021, 11:28:52 am

Needs more 6 👍👍

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: The E on May 20, 2021, 12:13:15 pm

Quote from: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 08:50:03 am

OK thanks for these notes :) ; but, it also works with the modification of .tbl, so it's usable by the team working on Diaospora, right?

What you're doing works, yes, but it also makes it very hard to see what you actually changed.

Seriously, I strongly recommend you join the HLP discord and get started on converting your work to Knossos so that it's easier for people to check out your work.

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 02:47:12 pm

At Karajorma :

"but it also makes it very hard to see what you actually changed."

ok, so Diaspora is still developing?
and are you very interested in my mods?
or can I make a list of my proposals for the game mechanics?

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 02:50:38 pm

At "The E" :

"HLP discord"?

ok can i see an invitation please?
and where can I download "Knossos", precisely?



"but it also makes it very hard to see what you actually changed."

while waiting for the conversion of my modifications here is what I modified:

* ai.tbl:
 - almost all of the data.

* Ai_profiles.tbl:
 - $ Player Countermeasure Life Scale
 - $ AI Countermeasure Firing Chance
 - $ Player Damage Factor
 - $ Player Subsys Damage Factor
 - $ Predict Position Delay
 - $ AI Turn Time Scale
 - $ Glide Attack Percent
 - $ Circle Strafe Percent
 - $ Glide Strafe Percent
 - $ Max Aim Update Delay
 - $ Player Autoaim FOV

* ships.tbl
 -line "+ Type:" to "+ Missile Banks:"
 -line "+ Reorient Max Forward Vel:" to "+ Reorient Max Rotate Angle:"
 -line "$ Density:" to "+ Glide Accel Mult:"
 -line "$ Allowed PBanks:" to "SBank Capacity:"
 -line "$ Power Output" to "$ Countermeasures:"

* weapons.tbl
Guns:
 -line "+ Description:" to "+ Tech Description:"
 -line "@Laser Length:" to "$ Cargo Size:"
 -line "+ Weapon Range:"
 -line "$ Allowed PBanks:" to "SBank Capacity:"
 -line "$ Power Output" to "$ Countermeasures:"

Missiles:
 -line "+ Description:" to "+ Tech Description:"
 -line "$ Mass:" to "$ Outer Radius:"
 -line "$ Armor Factor:" to "$ Lifetime:"
 -line "$ Cargo Size:"
 -line "+ Turn Time:" to "+ Min Lock Time:"
 -line "$ Weapon Hitpoints:"

there you have it, overall :)

so, the Diaspora team are interested in my mod?

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: The E on May 20, 2021, 03:00:57 pm

Here's a discord link (https://discord.gg/QFdueKEYrN)

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Anardil on May 21, 2021, 06:24:20 am

ok, thanks Tke E :) ; I will come to your Discord next week !

have a good weekend and have a good game !

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: karajorma on May 21, 2021, 06:53:11 am

Quote from: Anardil on May 20, 2021, 02:47:12 pm

At Karajorma :

ok, so Diaspora is still developing?
and are you very interested in my mods?
or can I make a list of my proposals for the game mechanics?

Diaspora is still in development. In fact, the pace of development has increased recently. I'm definitely interested in mods to the game if they are popular with the wider community. Get stuff working with Knossos, see what the other players think and then we can talk some more about whether to make things official.

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Anardil on May 25, 2021, 05:43:02 am

at Karajorma:

ok, thank you for these clarifications Karajorma :)
and you, did you take the time to play around with my mods for Diaspora?

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: karajorma on May 25, 2021, 10:11:54 pm

I will try it. But I've been silly busy recently.

That said, I tend to go with feedback from the public over stuff like this. Just cause I like or don't like the changes doesn't mean everyone will feel the same.

Title: Re: Proposal of help for the balancing of weapons and ships.
Post by: Anardil on May 26, 2021, 06:21:01 am

"Just cause I like or don't like the changes doesn't mean everyone will feel the same."

yes I understand ; However, it happens that people lack decernment and impartiality in their judgments, for lack of knowledge, on a particular subject ...
but hey, it is noted; tell me when you have tried my mod
enough to have a good gameplay potential.