Hard Light Productions Forums
Modding, Mission Design, and Coding => The Modding Workshop => Topic started by: Assassin on June 11, 2003, 12:34:44 pm
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To all the modellers that are renowned for making the greater ships...
How did you get to the level of expertise you are at now? I have some good ideas and imagery in my mind for what could be some good ships, but my modelling skills just don't match my imagination. I know you all must have faced this situation when you were just starting out, so how did you deal with it? Did you aim for the sky at the beginning, trying again and again until you got it right? Or did you put these more ambitious projects on a backburner, stalling your creative talent, while making more simple models until your skills were good enough?
RSVP :)
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Personally, my designs got more complicated as I got better and understood more of what I was doing.
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hey! what about us unreknowned modellers who aren't known for any ships? Don't we get a say? ;)
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Practice... and advice, from books and other people who know what they're doing. Last week I learned how to turn edges. :nervous:
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Originally posted by mikhael
hey! what about us unreknowned modellers who aren't known for any ships? Don't we get a say? ;)
Meh, go ahead. Sorry for my discrimination! :yes:
GE - I still don't know what turning edges is, unless it simply means selecting an edge and changing its rotation, lol..
Keep it coming everyone!
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I tried doing any model I thought of, despite my lack of skill.
After several tries you'll get the model right..belive me...
*lots of tries...
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Tons of practice. As for any special models - I promptly forgot about them. :D :o :p
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I have to say just learning as you go. In fact when I started I didn't have a clue what to do. I didn't know how to select a vertice or move stuff. it was bad.
First ship ever made by me:
(http://swooh.com/peon/hotsnoj/First.gif)
One of my first sites and lots of my first models (http://rain.prohosting.com/hwfreak/Index2.htm)
My latest ship (I can show you since most of my ships now are part of campaigns):
(http://swooh.com/peon/hotsnoj/N-1_starfighter_01.png)
Tons of practice. As for any special models - I promptly forgot about them.
Well that's basicly alls I do. I think of a cool ship then I go and try modeling it. And I usally find a new way to do models too. :nod:
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It is a lot of practice. The first ship I ever made was a cylinder with wings! Then I discovered the extrude tool! :D
Now that I've found a way to 'circumvent' some of the constraints of the engine, things are getting more complicated!
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Originally posted by Killfrenzy
It is a lot of practice. The first ship I ever made was a cylinder with wings! Then I discovered the extrude tool! :D
Now that I've found a way to 'circumvent' some of the constraints of the engine, things are getting more complicated!
LOL!
Luckily for me, I knew a bitabout TS when I first started to make FS models. My first model was a cruiser I used in an ani before.
It looked good.
However, at that time I didn't know nothing about PCS and concave faces, so it took time to get it in game...:D
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i started with already good skills in photoshop, and none at all in modelling, but making sw ships means a lot of reference, you already know what your result should be, so i always aimed at the best possible, obviously while learning the best became better, easyer to reach, and sometimes even working in game:doubt:
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sw ships?
you mean like making a conjectural design in PSP\PS?
that would be an idea, since I fall under the category of newb modeler, I'll have to try that :)
seems vectors would be the best way to start, I made a REALLY cool Unreal texture for grins and giggles, it was some futuristic status panel, it rocked man :D
Bob
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sw=star wars
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ah, spiffy, thanks :)
*kicks self*
Bob
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Hey, thanks for the replies everyone.
This has frustrated me a bit. I have had some really artistic ideas in my mind for ships I could make, heck, I've even designed a new race, but the end result in Truespace is always well below par and so my motivation for doing these ships has shrunk considerably. It would be a wise idea to stop making illustrious alien designs for now and work on some reasonably simple Terran craft (Although I have a sweet idea for a new Shivan Corvette or Destroyer) until my skills are much better.
What is the process of design some of you modellers use? I'm considering the best way of approach as doing a few sketches and concept designs in rough, then picking the one I like the most and drawing it to scale with a grid, then deciding on what primitive objects would be needed for what part of the ship and how I would manipulate those primitives.. then going ahead and making it, and then tweaking it a bit until it looks "right" in 3D. Sound like the way to go?
(PS. UV Map and texture every object of the model before sticking it together into one, or texture it after its all one big object?)
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Well I use a a preset object, like a plane or circle. And then I work my way from there.
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Originally posted by Assassin
Hey, thanks for the replies everyone.
(PS. UV Map and texture every object of the model before sticking it together into one, or texture it after its all one big object?)
use an unwrapper and uvmap the model after it is perfectly working in game
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Originally posted by Assassin
How did you get to the level of expertise you are at now?
Practice. Then some more practice. Then a lot more practice. Then a lot of people telling me everything that was wrong with what I had done. Then more practice, plus some practice. Then some more criticism and practice. ;)
Seriously, I got started with AutoCAD back in the 286 days. 3d support was rudimentary, so you ended up doing a lot of projections, rather than actual modelling. I also had a backgrond in technical drawing and drafting, which helped a lot.
Later, I picked up Truespace2, which was incredible. It let me actually BUILD things. Most everything started out badly, but some of my work was actually pretty good. In the end, none of it was any good for any serious use (like modding) because it all depended heavily on high poly counts, and overlapping solids. I tried Lightwave and 3dsMax and couldn't stand either of them because, well, they weren't like Truespace.
When I took a Lightwave class, I discovered how much more you could actually do with a decent modeller could do for you and I haven't looked back. I've got a long way to go before I can approach most people on this board, but I'm not bad.
Most importantly for putting ships together for Freespace, I think, is working with other people. I can't do anything but model a ship, create the lods, turret models, debris and shields (IE, all geometry stuff). I also don't have a lot of really original ideas. But when you combine my modelling with other people's ideas and skills, you get stuff like the Raynor, or the Naga, my Herc1 and Mjolnir or my rework of Ryx's carrier. I couldn't have created any of those on my own, but working with/from others, good things happened.
I have some good ideas and imagery in my mind for what could be some good ships, but my modelling skills just don't match my imagination. I know you all must have faced this situation when you were just starting out, so how did you deal with it? Did you aim for the sky at the beginning, trying again and again until you got it right? Or did you put these more ambitious projects on a backburner, stalling your creative talent, while making more simple models until your skills were good enough?
RSVP :)
Yes, I aimed for the sky, and I turned out lots of crap. If I still have it, one of these days I'll post a picture of the Brute, a tug idea that turned into a fighter, and had absolutely no redeeming features at all.
Later, though after starting and stopping projects, and just basically trying to figure out how this or that tool worked (and more importantly, how it could be APPLIED), things started to come together.
One thing that really helped was learning how to patch up LtNarol's models that he made in Blender. They didn't convert very well into anything, and the geometry that blender generated was absolutely horrid. By cleaning up the geometry for him, I learned a lot about point by point and poly by poly handling of a mesh, and how to troubleshoot problems that might come up later in the ship modding process.
But mostly, its just practice.
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Great reply, thanks!.
Jack
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Of course, it just took me 5 days and 3 abandoned models to come up with a decent bomber design....... and the one I did settle for (and have started UV-ing) was done totally of the top of my head.
Methinks actually planning ahead may be a bit uneccessarry, as you often can't translate a drawing on paper to something which can be modelled......
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Originally posted by aldo_14
Methinks actually planning ahead may be a bit uneccessarry, as you often can't translate a drawing on paper to something which can be modelled......
You can, very easilly, if you have a scanner and some 2d graphics manipulation mojo. Its just a different skill.
I'm with you, though, Aldo. I like to design in 3d, throwing away geometry I don't like. I have a CD full of unfinished projects that I can pull out later for completion or transformation and inclusion in a current project.
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same for me, for the few artwork of original design I worked on I..uh.. let the model itself tell me how to continue... i don't know how to explain it better
but I think that concept drwaings may be useful anyway, probably not to strictly represent the 3d appearance of the shape you imagined, but at least to help you remind its characteristics
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Originally posted by mikhael
You can, very easilly, if you have a scanner and some 2d graphics manipulation mojo. Its just a different skill.
I mean mentally...for me at least, it's easy to come up with planar designs, but often hard to make them in a way that translates well to a 3d - and vice versa. Of course, i can't draw perspective images atall - a bit of a ***** when it comes to 3d design work.
i reckon....sometime the process of modelling throws up opportunities that drawing beforehand doesn't.
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[color=66ff00]Positive criticism is also a good tool for improving. If someone criticises your designs then you're free to ignore them as it's your idea of art. If however someone criticises your methods, then it's often good to listen as you might learn a better method of achieving what it is that you are attempting to make.
Common sense you would think but some people put pride above wisdom to their own detriment. I've learned a lot just from looking at other people's models. Lastly I think it's important to know your own abilities and potential, don't be put off because there are people who are naturally better at making models than yourself, other modellers make better models than I do, I don't feel bad about this I use it to push myself to try to achieve more.
If you're not having fun, then rest for a while. :nod:
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Originally posted by Maeglamor
If you're not having fun, then rest for a while. :nod:
This is probably one of the best pieces of advice there is on the topic. Listen to Maeglamor.