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Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Nico on February 20, 2004, 01:46:35 am

Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Nico on February 20, 2004, 01:46:35 am
you're gonna like sword of mana ( well, if you have a GBA, which I don't :( ):
(http://www.micromania.fr/news/images/20040218/sword001.jpg)(http://www.micromania.fr/news/images/20040218/sword002.jpg)
(http://www.micromania.fr/news/images/20040218/sword003.jpg)(http://www.micromania.fr/news/images/20040218/sword004.jpg)
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: demon442 on February 20, 2004, 06:47:51 am
damn...I need to hurry up and beat Golden Sun 2...
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 20, 2004, 10:05:23 am
Secret of Mana is one of the greatest tile based action RPGs ever. They did such a great job of hiding the tile grid.

I'll be getting the GBA Mana game, without a doubt. :)
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: diamondgeezer on February 20, 2004, 10:22:41 am
As a Zelda worshipper (Link to the Past in particular) I really ought to get hold of a Mana game or two...
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: kode on February 20, 2004, 10:34:17 am
I'm gonna get sword of mana right after I beat fire emblem, metroid fusion, advance wars 2 and golden sun 2.

yeah.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 20, 2004, 10:34:19 am
Yes, yes you should. It is superior to Zelda in every regard (and the source of some of its toys).
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: diamondgeezer on February 20, 2004, 10:38:49 am
Don't take offence if I don't believe you about the superiority in every way
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Nico on February 20, 2004, 10:44:30 am
Well I agree with mike on this one, I liked Secret of mana much more than zelda ( well, the gameboy one, never played the others ).
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: diamondgeezer on February 20, 2004, 10:46:53 am
Being a hardcore Zelda fanboi rather helps in preferring Zelda games :nod:
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 20, 2004, 10:48:10 am
I don't, DG. Some people fail to see the superiority of the Flux engine, too. I just figure its their loss.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: diamondgeezer on February 20, 2004, 10:50:21 am
Guess what? I don't even know what the Flux Engine is. It's so good, I've never heard of it :)
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Nico on February 20, 2004, 11:26:51 am
Iwar2 engine.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: magatsu1 on February 20, 2004, 03:46:25 pm
It didn't get such a great review in Edge recentely..
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 20, 2004, 04:05:23 pm
Bah. Its the best space combat engine ever made--so far. If only they'd used Flux for X2. Oh, and if only X2 hadn't been an economic model with a half assed space combat engine attached.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: magatsu1 on February 20, 2004, 04:36:50 pm
Oh sorry, I meant Sword of Mana.

I read about X2 but never did find it. I got Freespace 2 instead.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 20, 2004, 07:57:22 pm
You're better off. X2 == TEH LOSE
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Bobboau on February 20, 2004, 11:25:41 pm
were are some of those screen shots again (X2)
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Setekh on February 21, 2004, 03:57:22 am
(http://img.gamershell.com/imagefolio/gallery/Space_Sim/X2/Image162.jpg)

(More at Gamer's Hell (http://www.gamershell.com/hellzone_Space_Sim_X2.shtml))
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 21, 2004, 10:54:34 am
Yeah. Pretty, huh? Shame the game is absolute ass. :(
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: aldo_14 on February 21, 2004, 11:02:10 am
Wouldn't mind having that cockpit in Fs, natch.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Nico on February 21, 2004, 11:43:08 am
Noooooooo, 3D is bad, you want a 2d cockpit!!!!!!!1111oneoneone

:rolleyes:
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Setekh on February 23, 2004, 06:20:37 am
What's so ass about X2? I mean, I hear it's just a game that's neither here nor there in terms of its central experience (when you wanna shoot stuff, you've gotta fly there for eons; when you wanna buy stuff, you have to shoot stuff; when you wanna swear, you get on the trail of something good, which turns out to be a pants-worthy waste of time). Did you buy it?
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Drew on February 23, 2004, 08:45:33 am
ugh...back on topic....
the secret of mana was ugh.... the storyline sucks compared to zelda......
the combat system was kickass tho
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 23, 2004, 01:01:28 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Setekh
What's so ass about X2? I mean, I hear it's just a game that's neither here nor there in terms of its central experience (when you wanna shoot stuff, you've gotta fly there for eons; when you wanna buy stuff, you have to shoot stuff; when you wanna swear, you get on the trail of something good, which turns out to be a pants-worthy waste of time). Did you buy it?


Unrotunately, yes, I did buy it. :(

The flight and combat model is very arcade-ish. This turns me off, for obvious reasons. Somehow, they made the flight feel like Freelancer's mouse-flight, even with a joystick. This is a BAD thing. The combat is, on average, as shallow as Freelancers bounty missions. To this, they bolted on the economic model--or rather, they bolted THIS onto the economic model. The flight/combat engine is obviously an afterthought. They did make it pretty though.

The place where the game shines is the economic/resource model. It turns out that this is the real point of the game. Its spectacular--in a space combat game. In a 4X game, or an RTS game, it would be shallow and boring.

Then there's the animation... wow. This is where the game shines again--only not in the way you'd want it to. It shines like a glistening, still wet and steaming horse dropping. Not only is the animation stiff, its poorly modelled and very poorly paced. The voice acting is enough to make Biohazard/ResidentEvil 1 look positively Oscar-worthy. The writing is a notch worse even than that.

Finally, there's the ship designs. Those I've seen... well, they're bad. There's a few interesting bits, but they're all ruined by being attached to truly hideous designs. Honestly, they'd have done better hiring some HLP modders to do the ship and station designs.

The one thing I can't complain about, though, is the space scenery. Its stunning to look at. I mean, absolutely gorgeous. Its not as dark as Starlancer, nor as bright as Iwar2. The planets, nebulae and stars in the background look someone distilled the pure essence of old  school sci-fi pulp and painted the sky with it. I mean its STUNNING. :)

So, all in all, Steak, X2 is ass, and I regret buying it. As much as I dislike Freelancer, I dislike X2 even more. :(
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Lightspeed on February 23, 2004, 01:06:30 pm
X² looks crap. Even FSretail had some better effects than that.

Ugly compression artifacts on some of the backgrounds, nebulae looks really silly, heavy perspective distortion at the FOV edges, crappy bumpmaps, ****ty models, low-poly planets, need i say more?
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 23, 2004, 01:09:37 pm
Wow. I don't recall it looking like that at all, Lightspeed. Maybe I need to boot it up again and see if my memory is at all accurate. I remember it being absolutely gorgeous.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: aldo_14 on February 23, 2004, 01:47:52 pm
I hope you keep receipts, Mik


:D
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Nico on February 23, 2004, 02:56:13 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Lightspeed
X² looks crap. Even FSretail had some better effects than that.

Ugly compression artifacts on some of the backgrounds, nebulae looks really silly, heavy perspective distortion at the FOV edges, crappy bumpmaps, ****ty models, low-poly planets, need i say more?


That real time demo ( the engine is running but you can't play ) was definitively not like that.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 23, 2004, 03:01:39 pm
Quote
Originally posted by aldo_14
I hope you keep receipts, Mik


:D

I live in America. We can't return opened software unless its defective. :(
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: 01010 on February 23, 2004, 03:16:41 pm
Quote
Originally posted by mikhael

I live in America. We can't return opened software unless its defective. :(

Make it defective ;)
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Flipside on February 23, 2004, 03:31:44 pm
Actually, I quite like X2, but then, I liked Elite, which actually worked upon similar lines, you traded like crazy so you could afford to shoot stuff :)
It is basically a space-based role-playing game.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: 01010 on February 23, 2004, 03:38:34 pm
The large plasma accelerator was a waste of money, by the time I'd got it I could kill most things by letting them fly right into me, took most of the room in my Panther Clipper too.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 23, 2004, 04:28:59 pm
Elite was cool. X2 bites. Its poorly integrated and the it just doesn't play well. If they'd used Flux for flight, graphics and combat, and rewritten the economic model, the game would have been a hell of a lot better. Since the story is presented in such broken cutscenese (painful to watch AND to listen to), its hard to bring myself to suffer through the gameplay just for the story.

I can't beleive there's something worse than Freelancer :( At least with Freelancer, I'm willing to put up with the horrible flight model and combat model in order to get to the story.

Speaking of Freelancer, the game allows for trading and the like. Why is it that the only non-story missions are bounty missions? Its damned annoying.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: aldo_14 on February 23, 2004, 04:55:19 pm
Quote
Originally posted by mikhael

I live in America. We can't return opened software unless its defective. :(


bit bollocks, that.  Act the idiot and pretend you can;t get it to work on your system, so they eventually get fooled into thinking you don't know your arse from your elbow.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: Flipside on February 23, 2004, 05:09:15 pm
Well, I think a lot of the economic modelling stems from the upcoming release of X-Online. A bit of a cheeky move that, since X2 won't be compatible with it, but was more a test of technology. X suffered from 'Top End Overkill' as well alas, but I haven't gotten all that far yet ;)

I think the choice of 'Khaak' or whatever for the 'enemy' was a bad call, considering it's pronounded 'Kack'. It really does give new meaning to being knee deep in the kack :)

I wish I could drag this thread back on topic, but I've never heard of Secret of Mana, sorry.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: mikhael on February 24, 2004, 12:05:22 am
Secret of Mana, AKA Seiken Densetsu. The story of a young boy who picks up a narky sword, unleashes hell, and has to go and save the world with the help of a beautiful girl and a bouncy... um... magic thing. Oh and a flying, fluffy, four winged dragon. :)

All in all, the absolute BEST action-RPG ever. Think of it as multiplayer version of the SNES Zelda game, but with better graphics, a groovy interface, and snazzy snazzy enemies.

Even thought he game is tile based, Square did an incredible job of hiding that fact from the player. All the art is done in tiles, but instead of using a tile grid, they used a pixel grid. That meant they could place graphics anywhere. Sprites moved on the pixel grid too, so there was never the constrained tile grid feeling like you had in Link to the Past, or the Final Fantasy games.
Title: Did you like Secret of Mana?
Post by: ChronoReverse on February 24, 2004, 01:04:41 am
And Seiken Densetsu 3 was even better.  More responsive controls, better art and music, and Angela (ahem)