Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: an0n on April 09, 2004, 05:28:53 pm
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3615189.stm
Bwuahaha: "Genocide".
That guy is my new hero.
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yes, that from our 'puppet government'
you know this might explian why we did all the stupid things over the last two weeks, this sort of thing might give them a bit of legitimacy, so long as we don't pull them from power.
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Now who's the tin-hatted nutter Bobboau? Eh?
Nah, just kidding. I actually would not be surprised if it were true, though I would be pretty damn impressed at their cunning.
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I think the Genocide is not an expression here. 45 deads and more than 100 injureds are 'Brutality', or 'Massacre'
OK, Massacre sounds a bit strong, I admit.
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woah! really? people are getting killed in a war? wow! i thought war was where we all go out and dance in the field and pick flowers!
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they're civilians. they're not supposed to die in war, and when they do it IS a big thing.
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Er, the war's over Carl. They're suposed to be peace-keeping and **** now, rather than this 'offensive operation' thingy. In theory.
Has it really been a year? That was quick...
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Thats cause you're safe at home. I'm sure the people living in Bahgdad felt every second of it.
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He lives in a student flat I'd hardly call that safe.
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Originally posted by TopAce
I think the Genocide is not an expression here. 45 deads and more than 100 injureds are 'Brutality', or 'Massacre'
OK, Massacre sounds a bit strong, I admit.
450 dead, learn to read.
Originally posted by Carl
woah! really? people are getting killed in a war? wow! i thought war was where we all go out and dance in the field and pick flowers!
The problem here is the war ended a year ago. Bombing towns in responce to the deaths of four cia age.. I mean civilian security guards and killing 450 people doesnt really go well with the idea of liberating people.
edit: in case anyone thinks I'm wearing a tin hat by thinking the cia would use a private firm to cover operations:
http://www.gwu.edu/%7Ensarchiv/news/20010430/northwoods.pdf
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Originally posted by Rictor
Thats cause you're safe at home. I'm sure the people living in Bahgdad felt every second of it.
Not my fault it got boring after the tank battles were over
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Originally posted by diamondgeezer
Not my fault it got boring after the tank battles were over
There were tank battles? Bugger! and there was me watching cartoons.
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Originally posted by diamondgeezer
Not my fault it got boring after the tank battles were over
Oh yes, I'm sure they daily crave that excitement they had during the invasion. Oh how they long for the good old days, when all the action you could ever want was right outside your window, or travelling towards your house at 300mph. Damn those bastard troops, they ought to be doing more to entertain the Iraqis. Maybe a few urban shootouts, a tank battle here or there. Thats just being rude guests, not putting sufficient energy in to keeping your hosts amused.
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I think he was makeing a sarcastic jab at the media sensationalism of it being presented as a form of entertainment
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A tank that goes 300mph?
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Originally posted by Gank
A tank that goes 300mph?
Whee.
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a tank _round_ that goes 300 mph
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Could've been caught on speed camera.
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Genocide is a much overused term now. People just throw it around like nothing.
Hitler and the Holocaust was genocide. The Turks and the Armenians was genocide.
This is not genocide. Neither is the IDF in the West Bank and Gaza genocide. Certain people need to learn the difference.
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A DU sabot tank round goes at about mach 4. 300mph is a little of the mark.
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maybe he was talking about one of the fighter craft then?
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Originally posted by Corsair
Genocide is a much overused term now. People just throw it around like nothing.
Hitler and the Holocaust was genocide. The Turks and the Armenians was genocide.
This is not genocide. Neither is the IDF in the West Bank and Gaza genocide. Certain people need to learn the difference.
Just wait till someone has the bright idea of committing xenocide.
Klendathu, anyone?
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Well, I wasn't being entirely serious with that remark , so you can imagine why I never bothered to look up the exact figure. I'm tempted to put in the sparrow quote from Monty Python, but as you can guess, I'm also too lazy to look that up.
Thats some zen **** right there.
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by an0n
Just wait till someone has the bright idea of committing xenocide.
Klendathu, anyone?
Ender's Game, anyone?
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/3613217.stm
lol
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Don't forget that it's fashionable to hate America. I don't put much value on the scientific value of that survey
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I've always hated America.
The only good thing they ever did was nuke Japan.
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Ye but they were off by a couple of thousand miles. They should've hit Berlin about a year or 2 earlier.
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They couldn't have. The air-defences around Berlin were too good.
IIRC pretty much every attack got chopped to itty-bitty pieces.
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Nah plenty of bombers got through, certainly close enough to successfully drop an a-bomb. Meh, what's done is done.
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It's not like they had a-bombs to spare. The bomber carrying the bomb was at too high a risk of being shot down :p
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Ender's game rulez!
Rictor: saying they're all civilians is patently dishonest and you know it.
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Originally posted by vyper
Nah plenty of bombers got through, certainly close enough to successfully drop an a-bomb. Meh, what's done is done.
Ya'll do know that "the bomb" wasn't ready for deployment until after Berlin fell, right?
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The funny thing is, if we had nuked Berlin, we probably wouln't have a space program as quickly as we did, as our rockets were developed by German engineers and scientists and based upon the V-2 rocket.
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And the bomb itself was based largely on lifted German tech. Looking back, it's no wonder the Merkins joined the fight :)
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Originally posted by aldo_14
There were tank battles? Bugger! and there was me watching cartoons.
Damn, beat me to it.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/3613217.stm
lol
hehehehehe! Well, says it all really ;) And, considering 3 is a symptom of 1 & 2, it's nice to know that at least some people are on the ball :)
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Originally posted by Kazan
Rictor: saying they're all civilians is patently dishonest and you know it.
So there was military among them. What's your point?
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Well, once again, I can say only this.... In any other point in history, had an occupying force, be it China, Britain, Russia, Germany etc, occupied Iraq and been faced with a situation such as Fallujah, they would have flattened the entire town, civilians and all, with either artillery or air-strike.
This doesn't justify what is happening there, but let's try to bear this in mind ;)
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Stunaep: no there were insurgents ammoung them- paramilitaries
Flipside: nice to have a brit remind people to put things into perspective about us :D
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The great Power of the US is backfiring in their face. They use their massive might to crush tiny rebellions, and meanwhile make try to make everyone else out to be the bad guy.
This pacification is a genocide. Keep it up though, you cant stop now.
I really wish people would respect the Iraqi people and Government. They may have no laws or rights as of yet, but them being dictated how to live by the US is no different then being dictated by Saddam himself.
A tyrrant for a dictator? hmmm
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Let me remind your frothing at the mouth fools what genocide means
gen·o·cide ( P ) Pronunciation Key (jn-sd)
n.
The systematic and planned extermination of an entire national, racial, political, or ethnic group
So to commit genocide we'd effectively have to nuke every sunni or shi'te region there is - or we'd have to round them up nazi-fashion for death camps
KNOW YOUR TERMS BEFORE ACCUSING COUNTRIES AND THEIR SOLDIERS OF UNSPEAKABLE ATROCITIES
The newpaper above that called it "genocide" commited libel, you're commintting slander.
If someone picks up a gun and fires at soldiers - they're going to get killed or wounded, no doubt about it - it's the soldier's job to fire back, and they have training
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genocide
n : systematic killing of a racial or cultural group [syn: race murder, racial extermination]
Source: WordNet ® 1.6, © 1997 Princeton University
slightly different meaning here...... and remember that the perception of Iraqis may very well fit in with that - especially if the Us is bombing mosques and whatnot.
EDIT: to be more explicit, I don't think it could be considered genocide, anyways. However, the use of 'genocide' is deliberately emotive, and designed to get a reaction - as well as consideration over the morality of the tactics being used.
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I never stated that it was. 450 people or less ain't genocide. Its murder on a pretty large scale, but its not genocide.
edit: and not all of them were civies. but then again, not all of them were militants. And you have to take in to account the gorwing number of casualties as well as the 3000+ wounded. And then there's the US siege, which prevents food and water from going in to Fallujah.
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Rictor: if they picked up weapons it's not murder
"bombing mosques" - WE HIT THE OUTERWALL OF THE COMPOUND not the ****ing mosque itself, get your facts straight ignoramus -- you know WHY we hit it? because people were firing from behind that wall - soon as their fired from behind that wall it became a military target PLAIN AND SIMPLE
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Originally posted by Rictor
I never stated that it was. 450 people or less ain't genocide. Its murder on a pretty large scale, but its not genocide.
edit: and not all of them were civies. but then again, not all of them were militants. And you have to take in to account the gorwing number of casualties as well as the 3000+ wounded. And then there's the US siege, which prevents food and water from going in to Fallujah.
Kazan was referring to Lonestars post, i think
For reference (from link at top);
One Sunni Muslim member, Ghazi Ajil al-Yawer, said he was ready to resign over the Falluja crisis.
"How can a superpower like the US put itself in a state of war with a small city like Falluja? This is genocide,"
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and then several of you picked it up and ran with it
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Originally posted by Kazan
"bombing mosques" - WE HIT THE OUTERWALL OF THE COMPOUND not the ****ing mosque itself, get your facts straight ignoramus -- you know WHY we hit it? because people were firing from behind that wall - soon as their fired from behind that wall it became a military target PLAIN AND SIMPLE
It doesn;t matter. The normal Iraqi - or normal Muslim - does not go 'oh, they hit the outer wall - that's ok'. what they see, is a US aircraft firing into a holy building / compound. They see a giant blume of smoke and an explosion in front of a minaret. Simple as that.
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Originally posted by Kazan
Rictor: if they picked up weapons it's not murder
Excepted they might have the right since they're in their own friggin country and wants the US soldiers to get out? You're the first one to say you'd shoot at anybody invading your home, right? The USA have invaded Irak, it has to bear the consequences now. Many people said it'd turn that way ever before **** actually started the whole thing, it was pretty obvious. And they were right, that's gonna be bad, very bad :p
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slightly OT, but still..
US asks Al-Jazeera to leave Fallujah (http://www.islamonline.net/English/News/2004-04/09/article06.shtml)
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inappropraite - media shouls stay - even if they're potentially biased