Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Rictor on May 02, 2004, 02:03:48 am
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Praise be to Almighty God; Peace and prayers be upon our Prophet Muhammad, his family, and companions.
This is a message to our neighbours north of the Mediterranean, containing a reconciliation initiative as a response to their positive reactions.
Praise be to God; praise be to God; praise be to God who created heaven and earth with justice and who allowed the oppressed to punish the oppressor in the same way.
Peace upon those who followed the right path:
In my hands there is a message to remind you that justice is a duty towards those whom you love and those whom you do not. And people's rights will not be harmed if the opponent speaks out about them.
The greatest rule of safety is justice, and stopping injustice and aggression. It was said: Oppression kills the oppressors and the hotbed of injustice is evil. The situation in occupied Palestine is an example. What happened on 11 September [2001] and 11 March [the Madrid train bombings] is your commodity that was returned to you.
It is known that security is a pressing necessity for all mankind. We do not agree that you should monopolise it only for yourselves. Also, vigilant people do not allow their politicians to tamper with their security.
Having said this, we would like to inform you that labelling us and our acts as terrorism is also a description of you and of your acts. Reaction comes at the same level as the original action. Our acts are reaction to your own acts, which are represented by the destruction and killing of our kinfolk in Afghanistan, Iraq and Palestine.
The act that horrified the world; that is, the killing of the old, handicapped [Hamas spiritual leader] Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, may God have mercy on him, is sufficient evidence.
We pledge to God that we will punish America for him, God willing.
Which religion considers your killed ones innocent and our killed ones worthless? And which principle considers your blood real blood and our blood water? Reciprocal treatment is fair and the one who starts injustice bears greater blame.
As for your politicians and those who have followed their path, who insist on ignoring the real problem of occupying the entirety of Palestine and exaggerate lies and falsification regarding our right in defence and resistance, they do not respect themselves.
They also disdain the blood and minds of peoples. This is because their falsification increases the shedding of your blood instead of sparing it.
Moreover, the examining of the developments that have been taking place, in terms of killings in our countries and your countries, will make clear an important fact; namely, that injustice is inflicted on us and on you by your politicians, who send your sons - although you are opposed to this - to our countries to kill and be killed.
Therefore, it is in both sides' interest to curb the plans of those who shed the blood of peoples for their narrow personal interest and subservience to the White House gang.
We must take into consideration that this war brings billions of dollars in profit to the major companies, whether it be those that produce weapons or those that contribute to reconstruction, such as the Halliburton Company, its sisters and daughters.
Based on this, it is very clear who is the one benefiting from igniting this war and from the shedding of blood. It is the warlords, the bloodsuckers, who are steering the world policy from behind a curtain.
As for President ****, the leaders who are revolving in his orbit, the leading media companies and the United Nations, which makes laws for relations between the masters of veto and the slaves of the General Assembly, these are only some of the tools used to deceive and exploit peoples.
All these pose a fatal threat to the whole world.
The Zionist lobby is one of the most dangerous and most difficult figures of this group. God willing, we are determined to fight them.
Based on the above, and in order to deny war merchants a chance and in response to the positive interaction shown by recent events and opinion polls, which indicate that most European peoples want peace, I ask honest people, especially ulema, preachers and merchants, to form a permanent committee to enlighten European peoples of the justice of our causes, above all Palestine. They can make use of the huge potential of the media.
I also offer a reconciliation initiative to them, whose essence is our commitment to stopping operations against every country that commits itself to not attacking Muslims or interfering in their affairs - including the US conspiracy on the greater Muslim world.
This reconciliation can be renewed once the period signed by the first government expires and a second government is formed with the consent of both parties.
The reconciliation will start with the departure of its last soldier from our country.
The door of reconciliation is open for three months of the date of announcing this statement.
For those who reject reconciliation and want war, we are ready.
As for those who want reconciliation, we have given them a chance. Stop shedding our blood so as to preserve your blood. It is in your hands to apply this easy, yet difficult, formula. You know that the situation will expand and increase if you delay things.
If this happens, do not blame us - blame yourselves.
A rational person does not relinquish his security, money and children to please the liar of the White House.
Had he been truthful about his claim for peace, he would not describe the person who ripped open pregnant women in Sabra and Shatila [reference to Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon] and the destroyer of the capitulation process [reference to the Palestinian-Israeli peace process] as a man of peace.
He also would not have lied to people and said that we hate freedom and kill for the sake of killing. Reality proves our truthfulness and his lie.
The killing of the Russians was after their invasion of Afghanistan and Chechnya; the killing of Europeans was after their invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan; and the killing of Americans on the day of New York [reference to 11 September] was after their support of the Jews in Palestine and their invasion of the Arabian Peninsula.
Also, killing them in Somalia was after their invasion of it in Operation Restore Hope. We made them leave without hope, praise be to God.
It is said that prevention is better than cure. A happy person is he who learns a lesson from the experience of others.
Heeding right is better than persisting in falsehood.
Peace be upon those who follow guidance.
OK, I suspect this is going to be getting quite a few poo-poos, but oh well. I just looked up the full text of the truce offering, prompted by an article that quote some of it. I must say, its quite surprising. There are quite a few good points in there, despite all the "God be praised" crap. If you showed me this text, and didn't tell me who it was from, I would not have suspected bin Laden. I have said that no one is above criticism, and the opposite applies as well. No one's views should be immeditaly disqualified regardless of validity.
And before we get a chorus of "Terrorist SUPPOTRER EVIL EVIL!!!!", let me just head it off. No, I don't condone 9/11 blablablabla you should all know this by now.
I just found it interesting that quite a bit of the religious Islamic rhetoric is not present in this text. And we're running dangerously low on political threads, we're down to like 3 or 4. Think of the children!!
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"We pledge to God that we will punish America for him, God willing."
i didnt even bother reading the rest. pretty much proves hes a deranged madman.
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all this proves is that he watches western media and knows the retoric you use.
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Originally posted by Jiggyhound
"We pledge to God that we will punish America for him, God willing."
i didnt even bother reading the rest. pretty much proves hes a deranged madman.
in which way?
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Rictor, what happens the next time a terrorist says he will stop bombing you if you do such and such? Will you bow to his wishes? Agreeing to this 'truce' will only encourage more terrorism since it shows that nations can be held to ransom and will do what the man with the gun says
Originally posted by Lightspeed
in which way?
Um, cos he wants to kill westeners in the name of his god?
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Originally posted by Rictor
Bin Laden Letter:
Which religion considers your killed ones innocent and our killed ones worthless? And which principle considers your blood real blood and our blood water? Reciprocal treatment is fair and the one who starts injustice bears greater blame.
Good question. :doubt:
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One nation, under God
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exactly :nod:
yes well you should be happy becase at last you shall know peace in your time.
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Yeah, but that never says that Muslim blood isn't real blood, or that their lives are worthless. Meh. I'm not arguing. Every country out there is guilty of something...
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Britain sure is. And I, for one, am damn proud of it.
Civilizations are built with the bones of barbarians.
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Meh, I respect him for his ability to do something about the global exploitation that the 1st world establishment has forced upon everyone else.
However, the truth is we are quite ready for a fight, and more than capable of winning. The only down side is we have leaders like Tony Blair and George **** ****ing it up.
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Originally posted by diamondgeezer
Rictor, what happens the next time a terrorist says he will stop bombing you if you do such and such? Will you bow to his wishes? Agreeing to this 'truce' will only encourage more terrorism since it shows that nations can be held to ransom and will do what the man with the gun says
Coming from an englishman thats kind of rich, your governments sitting down daily with terrorists in the north.
And when the terrorist is offering a truce saying you stop killing us and we stop killing you, the truce isnt that unpalatable. Unless your one of the twats that believes Bin Laden and his cave dwelling bandits are out to take over the world and convert us all to Islam or kill us.
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Uh, one of the basic tenets of Islamic belief is that of Islamic rule.
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Uh-huh, tolerance of other religions is also one of the basic Islamic beliefs. But lets not kid ourselves, Bin Laden hasnt the capability to take over the muslim world, where he has large support, let alone the entire world.
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[q]your governments sitting down daily with terrorists in the north[/q]
Kinda different. We got fed up with the constant expense of fighting a war against the IRA since we didn't have the kind of free hand the US et al has in this war.
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I thought it was more the three mortar bombs that landed in the front garden of no.10 that got the ball rolling but there ya go.
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The IRA were competent terrorists. None of this 'suicide bomber' stupidity.
Nor were they murderers. They almost always phoned in a warning.
They went for actual terror as opposed to just killing people.
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[q]I thought it was more the three mortar bombs that landed in the front garden of no.10 that got the ball rolling but there ya go.[/q]
Nah that just got the British public wanting to show Ireland what a real "bomb" looks like. From about 30 000 feet.
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What and slamming airliners into a skyscraper and the heart of US the military is incompetence?
And yes the are murderers, the killed innocent people, and not always with a warning.
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Originally posted by Gank
Uh-huh, tolerance of other religions is also one of the basic Islamic beliefs.
Oh yes, and that's why, in North Africa, muslims are daily forcing people to take the First Pillar of Islam(Profession of Faith), and if they don't, they kill.
I was always under the impression that Islam taught intolerance.
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I find it amusing how everyone keeps going back to Islam etc, rather than money. Hmm.
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Religion = Tax Exempt Status.
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Originally posted by DragonClaw
Oh yes, and that's why, in North Africa, muslims are daily forcing people to take the First Pillar of Islam(Profession of Faith), and if they don't, they kill.
I was always under the impression that Islam taught intolerance.
Really, cite some examples please. I have an aunt who lived in tunisia for 20+ years and she never was persecuted. Methinks its ignorance that gives you your impression of Islam, if you actually read up a bit on the religion and its history you might have a different opinion. The golden age of Judaism took place about around 8-11 ad, under Islamic rule for example.
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Originally posted by DragonClaw
Oh yes, and that's why, in North Africa, muslims are daily forcing people to take the First Pillar of Islam(Profession of Faith), and if they don't, they kill.
I was always under the impression that Islam taught intolerance.
And I can quote you huge numbers of examples of the leaders of countries like America trying to force people to live under the rules of their religion.
Same crap, different religion.
Try actually learning about Islam before bashing it as being different to bible thumping christianity cause it really isn't.
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I don't think he was, he didn't mention christianity once.
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Originally posted by Lightspeed
in which way?
I find it unlikely he knows what God wants, and isnt letting his own personal agenda against america influence his decisions. If this is what he truly believes, I find him to be pretty insane, wouldnt you agree?
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My point is that fundementalist Islam is the same stupid beast that Fundementalist Christianity is. It's the fundementalist part that causes the most problems. Nothing to do with the religion itself.
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Its just that fundementalist christianity has the US army and goverment to hide behind and influence, why its not perceived to be a problem by 'the masses' in all their ignorance and naivety.
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Originally posted by vyper
Meh, I respect him for his ability to do something about the global exploitation that the 1st world establishment has forced upon everyone else.
However, the truth is we are quite ready for a fight, and more than capable of winning. The only down side is we have leaders like Tony Blair and George **** ****ing it up.
You want to fight him, despite the fact that, as far as I can see, you support to some degree that for which he is fighting?
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dg: Two things. First of all, I have no great love for bin Laden. I have more reason to hate him than you. And secondly, he never threatened to bomb me. America != The World. I for one can look past all the "they hate freedom" crap and see that there is a very concrete reason why 9/11 happened. AFAIK, bin Laden wants US troops out of the Middle East, specifically Saudi Arabia. He also hates America's unconditional support for Israel, and the sufferig that inflicts on the Palestinians.
What happened in Spain was not appeasement. It was well known that part of Zapatero's platform was the withdrawl of Spanish troops. Furthermore, over 90% of the population were against the war. It was perfectly natural that Aznar would be kicked out in the next election. Aznar's party is whats left of a very oppressive government which ruled over Spain in a dictatorial manner for many years. The Iraq war was the last straw apparently, and the PP got punished for going against the will of the people.
also, "men with guns" have been imposing their rule on the world for quite a number of years now. Where have you been?
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[q]You want to fight him, despite the fact that, as far as I can see, you support to some degree that for which he is fighting? [/q]
I admire the vague sphere of ideology that says everyone should be treated properly and not exploited. However it's in my best interests to continue the exploitation.
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You, sir, give me hope for the future of mankind. I just can't help but bubble with enthusiasm and delight when I see such a fine example of humanity as yourself.
Every oppresor in the history of mankind has been overthrown. Methinks that if its your welfare you're worried about, you ought to distance yourself from the side which has immense historical odds stacked against it. Or perhaps you are conceited enough to think that this particular oppresor will win, where some the greatest minds in human history have failed.
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Originally posted by Bobboau
all this proves is that he watches western media and knows the retoric you use.
Who needs spies, when you got CNN :D
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Originally posted by Rictor
You, sir, give me hope for the future of mankind. I just can't help but bubble with enthusiasm and delight when I see such a fine example of humanity as yourself.
Every oppresor in the history of mankind has been overthrown. Methinks that if its your welfare you're worried about, you ought to distance yourself from the side which has immense historical odds stacked against it. Or perhaps you are conceited enough to think that this particular oppresor will win, where some the greatest minds in human history have failed.
It's not one mind in this scenario.
We've lasted this long, I'll take my chances.
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Personally, I'd glass the entire middle-east if I thought I could get away with it.
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:yes:
To quote that dude in independence day..
'nuke em. Lets nuke the bastards'
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......but then, I'd glass France if I thought I could get away with it.
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No argument there of course....
i like the language, its sexy, even though its a bugger to learn.
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[q]To quote that dude in independence day..
'nuke em. Lets nuke the bastards'[/q]
You realise, I now have to find that soundtrack, put it in my cd drive, rip it, and listen to it because you mentioned it? :hopping: :p
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*cough*Spice Girls: The Movie*cough*
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Mwhuhuhuhu
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I hadn't noticed it had a worthwhile soundtrack.
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[q]*cough*Spice Girls: The Movie*cough*[/q]
Die.
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Originally posted by Jiggyhound
No argument there of course....
i like the language, its sexy, even though its a bugger to learn.
The people are just arrogant pricks though.
Yes of course, you must have a lot of time one your hands, having met every single person in France. Have you ever even been there, or is this just Fox News speaking through you?
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nah, just my own distorted views on the french, im a sucker for the tabloid slander of foreign peoples :p
im sure the general population are quite nice people
and fox news? Sorry , but we british arent that 'privaleged' to have *FOX* news, just the good old impartial BBC.
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:lol: :lol:
Nevermind, I just thought of something. None of you will know what it means...maybe Icefire.
Originally posted by Jiggyhound
im sure the general population are quite nice people, its the politicians and those who ive seen in the media who I dont particular hold any feelings of fondness for.
That would imply that there are certain politicians of which your are fond....:wtf: :wtf:
I mean, there's bull****ting, and then theres bull****ting.
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Ok, stop taking every I say to damn ****ing literally. A large mass of the British population tend to suffer from mild xenophobia, through which we tend to make fun of other countries, especially the French. SO STFU. I'll edit my posts if that makes you ****in happy.
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I never took it literally, calm down. It ok to hate on the French, they have the world escargo. And being British, you have a valid excuse at least, never quite got over your crushing defeat at World Cup 98, eh?
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im not a particualrily big football fan actually.
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Originally posted by Rictor
I never took it literally, calm down. It ok to hate on the French, they have the world escargo. And being British, you have a valid excuse at least, never quite got over your crushing defeat at World Cup 98, eh?
Watching them get sent home after the first round of the 2002 World Cup made up for any problem I may have with the french.
Especially the bit where they put Zidane on in the last game despite him being injured. I did actually wonder at what point they'd have decided not to do it. Maybe if his leg was in a cast, or maybe if he was in a wheelchair :D
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Originally posted by Rictor
I never took it literally, calm down. It ok to hate on the French, they have the world escargo. And being British, you have a valid excuse at least, never quite got over your crushing defeat at World Cup 98, eh?
Seriously: Shut the **** up.
'98 was a fix anyway. They sold something like 90% of all tickets to French people, on the grounds that they were trying to stamp out ticket touting and hooliganism.
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Originally posted by Jiggyhound
and fox news? Sorry , but we british arent that 'privaleged' to have *FOX* news, just the good old impartial BBC.
FOX is called sky news over here
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Yeah, but we get FOX News too. It plays sporadically on one of those useless channels.
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Originally posted by an0n
Yeah, but we get FOX News too. It plays sporadically on one of those useless channels.
So that'd be most of them then wouldn't it?