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Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: aldo_14 on September 19, 2004, 12:14:05 pm

Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 19, 2004, 12:14:05 pm
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/FiveMinutes.html

like a) anyone cares and b) anyone would listen

But no doubt it'll start a nice violent discussion.  Blame bluesnews.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Fineus on September 19, 2004, 12:29:01 pm
Wow, isn't it fortunate that neither is actually real and therefore it doesn't matter one bit.... Phew.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Singh on September 19, 2004, 12:30:30 pm
yeah....
before I'd bother.
Now all I can say is that the Shivans would pwn both, some way or the other :P
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Lynx on September 19, 2004, 12:32:02 pm
Another reason not to touch Stardestryer .net not even with a ten foot pole. Those people there are so fanatic I'd imagine it's even unhealthy beeing in the same room with one of those.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Blitzerland on September 19, 2004, 12:42:27 pm
Yeah. Shivans could easily crush both of them.

Wouldn't that be a cool movie, though? You would get to watch a Sathanas kill the Enterprise. :D

DIE, TREKKIES!

Then, PART TWO, watch a Sathanas kill a star destroyer!!!11oneone :D

DIE..uh...STAR PEOPLE! tthings...whatchmacallits
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Gloriano on September 19, 2004, 12:44:59 pm
Meh, I don't care about these VS things. Both SW & ST are good
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Mongoose on September 19, 2004, 12:49:43 pm
I like how they're using the numbers/scenes from the show as scientific evidence.  Did they not realize that this is science fiction, and that these statictics were made up by authors? :p  The Star Wars statistics, in particular, are so over-exaggerated as to be ridiculous.  A hundred billion gazillion bajillion jigawatts!!!!1 :p  I'm also a fan of both universes; who cares which ship would "beat" which ship?  Just take them as two separate entities, different but good.

And yes, the Shivans would own everything :cool:.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 19, 2004, 12:54:25 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Kalfireth
Wow, isn't it fortunate that neither is actually real and therefore it doesn't matter one bit.... Phew.


Yeah, but you have to admit it's funny when they get their hackles up.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Clave on September 19, 2004, 01:05:51 pm
:lol: Absolutely!  I love these theoretical combats tho - it's a laugh to drop something like Gandalf vs Darth Vader into the conversation.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Fineus on September 19, 2004, 01:20:00 pm
Quote
Originally posted by aldo_14


Yeah, but you have to admit it's funny when they get their hackles up.

Oh yes, definitely. I mean I could probably engage in a half-hearted arguement about which franchises ships were more powerful but I wouldn't mean it. It'd just be for a laugh.

The ones who get passionate about it? Well they scare me.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 19, 2004, 01:35:40 pm
No!  You're wrong!  Cyber-Hitlers' Monkey-Clone could never beat the child of Predator and Supermans second cousin twice removed!
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Taristin on September 19, 2004, 02:04:29 pm
No! Pants-man is definately no match for man-man!
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Martinus on September 19, 2004, 02:31:38 pm
[color=66ff00]Spiff could own them all!!!1one
Or he could simply be shot down at the very start. :D
[/color]
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 19, 2004, 03:42:32 pm
Vat!? You dare defy ze might of ze United Federation ov Planets!? Ze mighty Enterprise veell come for you!

:p

Seriously, i like Vs debates (Note; debates, not bashing either side. There's the difference most people don't see). I'm a Trek geek and i'm proud of it! :D I enjoy a good debate about scifi subjects.

But SD.net is too bad even for me *shrugs* Much like http://www.st-v-sw.net/ . It's just too much. It's simply hilarious to see how much time people put into something this unproductive.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: jdjtcagle on September 19, 2004, 03:47:35 pm
InVader ZIM!!!
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Corsair on September 19, 2004, 03:51:23 pm
Of course the Empire is incredibly better. :D
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Flipside on September 19, 2004, 03:51:25 pm
LOL Especially since they work in entirely different universes. I like the fact the author pretends to be nonchalant about the whole thing, as if they hadn't just typed up an entire page of text to prove a point that they 'really don't care about' ;)

Edit : Of course, looking at the stats on these ships, I'd certainly come to the conclusion that ST is the more 'realistic' of the two. A Star Destroyer would need something like an Omega Particle for power in the ST universe ;)
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 19, 2004, 04:40:29 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Flipside
Edit : Of course, looking at the stats on these ships, I'd certainly come to the conclusion that ST is the more 'realistic' of the two. A Star Destroyer would need something like an Omega Particle for power in the ST universe ;)

SW is typically male, the bigger the better. Even if it doesn't even make sense anymore.

:D

I just wuv generalizations :p
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: MetalDestroyer on September 19, 2004, 04:42:46 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Blitzerland
Yeah. Shivans could easily crush both of them.

Wouldn't that be a cool movie, though? You would get to watch a Sathanas kill the Enterprise. :D

DIE, TREKKIES!

Then, PART TWO, watch a Sathanas kill a star destroyer!!!11oneone :D

DIE..uh...STAR PEOPLE! tthings...whatchmacallits


You forgot The Yuzhan Vong from the Expended Universe :p
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Carl on September 19, 2004, 04:47:43 pm
Could Superman beat the enterprise?
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Flipside on September 19, 2004, 04:51:29 pm
Easy, he'd just fly through the Nacelles, and pop goes the Warp Core ;)

Although, I have to say, this person doesn't make the one comparison that makes the entire discussion pointless, which is 'What was the main race in each universe doing 5000 years ago'. Now SW vs ST+5000 years would be a more interesting comparison ;)
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Fineus on September 19, 2004, 04:59:21 pm
Quote
Originally posted by MetalDestroyer
You forgot The Yuzhan Vong from the Expended Universe :p

Ouch... game, set and match to Star Wars!
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Carl on September 19, 2004, 05:01:27 pm
He's making the mistake of only using one race vs. one race. The name of the discussion is "Star Wars vs Star Trek", not "The Empire vs The Federation". If he held to his original purpose, he would include Species 8472, or even Q, in which case Star Wars wouldn't stand a chance.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Flipside on September 19, 2004, 05:05:54 pm
Oh... go on then ;)

Not to mention he's also only compared comparative technology, i.e. Laser weapons, engines etc. Star Trek has things like Transporter tech, seemingly more advanced computer and holographic technology, advanced cloaking tech etc, etc. Theres no real way to make an estimate of the impact these techs would have.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 19, 2004, 05:13:28 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Flipside

Although, I have to say, this person doesn't make the one comparison that makes the entire discussion pointless, which is 'What was the main race in each universe doing 5000 years ago'. Now SW vs ST+5000 years would be a more interesting comparison ;)

Heh, so true. The Feds have Uber Time Travel o' D00M tech in the 29th century already :p

Empire has been there for 25,000 years, the Federation only for 200 years or so.

:D
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: vyper on September 19, 2004, 05:25:04 pm
Fed tech is more adaptable, more modular.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Flipside on September 19, 2004, 05:31:00 pm
Windows is teh 3mpire! :lol:

As an aside, can I just ask here, the second Death Star was larger than the first, and the first was the size of a 'small moon', which is presumably bigger than a 'large asteroid'.

If this is the case would not:

a) Such an object have a large effect on the gravitic tides of Endor, thus causing massive tidal and environmental changes?

b) The destruction of a generator powerful enough to create a laser that destroys planets have left Endor a flame-ravaged husk?

c) The destruction of a shield generator powerful enough to envelop a moon in orbit have had much the same blast area as a massive nuclear detonation?

Just curious ;)
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 19, 2004, 05:34:56 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Flipside
Windows is teh 3mpire! :lol:

As an aside, can I just ask here, the second Death Star was larger than the first, and the first was the size of a 'small moon', which is presumably bigger than a 'large asteroid'.

If this is the case would not:

a) Such an object have a large effect on the gravitic tides of Endor, thus causing massive tidal and environmental changes?

b) The destruction of a generator powerful enough to create a laser that destroys planets have left Endor a flame-ravaged husk?

c) The destruction of a shield generator powerful enough to envelop a moon in orbit have had much the same blast area as a massive nuclear detonation?

Just curious ;)


I've read in some bizarre site that the Death Star would have created sufficient debris to devastate Endor.  However, I suspect this is was 'calculated' because the author really, really hated Ewoks.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Ghostavo on September 19, 2004, 05:38:26 pm
Gandalf vs Darth Vader vs Kirk!!!! :nervous: :D

This is like making a match Jehova vs Buda :D









(Buda wins) :nervous:
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Blitzerland on September 19, 2004, 05:43:17 pm
:lol:

This is getting pretty hysterical...
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Fineus on September 19, 2004, 05:52:41 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Carl
He's making the mistake of only using one race vs. one race. The name of the discussion is "Star Wars vs Star Trek", not "The Empire vs The Federation". If he held to his original purpose, he would include Species 8472, or even Q, in which case Star Wars wouldn't stand a chance.

But Star Wars has The Force. That has to count for something.

That said.. Q - being god like - is something of a power-gamers trump card in this conflict of franchises. I think he should be banned from use under some kind of WMD act ;)
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Carl on September 19, 2004, 05:55:49 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Flipside
As an aside, can I just ask here, the second Death Star was larger than the first, and the first was the size of a 'small moon', which is presumably bigger than a 'large asteroid'.


The Death Star was 120 km in diameter. the second one was 160 km.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Flipside on September 19, 2004, 06:01:03 pm
hmmmm... possibly not enough to have a gravitic effect as such then, but still, not a small object to have blow up in orbit ;)
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 19, 2004, 06:41:26 pm
And thus enters the Culture :D
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: vyper on September 19, 2004, 07:23:12 pm
[q]That said.. Q - being god like - is something of a power-gamers trump card in this conflict of franchises. I think he should be banned from use under some kind of WMD act [/q]

And our favorite Q would be likely to completely destroy the rebel's rationality with his cutting sarcasm. ;)
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 19, 2004, 07:30:22 pm
Heh, at least Q agrees Trek is full of technobabble :D

"Picard and his lackeys would have solved all this technobabble hours ago." -- Q

;)

And ofcourse the ever so hilarious talk to Worf;

"Eaten any good books lately?" -- Q

:p
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: vyper on September 19, 2004, 07:40:18 pm
"Please don't tell me the story of the boy who cried Worf!"
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Ford Prefect on September 19, 2004, 07:50:43 pm
This is the sort of thing I might have pondered with my friends when I was about eleven.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: silverwolf on September 19, 2004, 09:40:26 pm
heh a sath against a star destroyer would be a good match up. i keep telling my friend the sath would own even though a star destroyer has shields
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Sandwich on September 20, 2004, 12:58:12 am
http://www.ditl.org/fiction/hedportalforeword.htm
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: an0n on September 20, 2004, 01:19:22 am
I have a way to settle this argument once and for all:

The Empire would kick the Federation's ass because the Empire and it's technology are so grossly and stupidly overpowered that it doesn't even bear thinking about.

Multi-gigaton blasts from a ****ing laser (which can fire about 5 times a second) is absolutely and completely goddamn preposterous.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: an0n on September 20, 2004, 01:23:40 am
Also: Jehovah would wipe the goddamn floor with Buddah.

Jehovah = All-powerful, creator of the universe, person-to-pillar-of-salt, God of all mankind.

Buddah = Fat, bald, pacifist.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Cyker on September 20, 2004, 02:11:50 am
Actually I think they'd both just sit there and drink tea while chatting about what they're gonna do with the weather. :D

A comparison I'd rather see is with the Star Fighters!
That said, you almost never see fighter craft in 'Trek so smeg knows if they're any good!
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: HeX on September 20, 2004, 02:15:00 am
Sci-fi ubergeeks make me weep for the species. Like the thread at Spacebattles debating on whether Alderaan had a shield or not from still captures of it being blown up. It was several pages in length!!

It makes me sad. So very very sad.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: NGTM-1R on September 20, 2004, 02:22:15 am
The shield generator doesn't really blow up...it kinda falls over.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: an0n on September 20, 2004, 02:35:35 am
I think the one thing we can all agree on is that regardless of how many Gigawatts every laser blast from an ISD puts out, or how many Photon torpedoes a Sovereign class starship can handle - the plexiglass windshield of Starbug would be little protection.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on September 20, 2004, 02:53:57 am
Both Star Trek + Star Wars figures are a bunch of baloney anyway.  What they talk about and write about is bull**** compared to what we see on the screen.

A more interesting Versus:

Shadows versus Shivans


bwahahahaha
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: HeX on September 20, 2004, 02:55:37 am
This is why Charles Sheffield has two definitions for futuristic fiction in his book "Borderlands of Science". Science Fiction and Science Fantasy.

Science Fiction has alot of grounded basis in reality and current theory where as Science Fantasy consists of a futuristic setting and plenty of technobabble that means nothing.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 20, 2004, 02:57:33 am
oh, what have I unleashed?  Please forgive me..........
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: an0n on September 20, 2004, 02:58:24 am
Honorverse = Science Fiction

Silent Running = Science Fantasy.

I always considered SciFi to be inventing an advanced world characters could interact with. While SciFantasy was basically about getting the point across. Y'know, Outer Limits kinda stuff.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Slasher on September 20, 2004, 04:34:32 am
Quote
Originally posted by Flipside
hmmmm... possibly not enough to have a gravitic effect as such then, but still, not a small object to have blow up in orbit ;)


The Death Star(s) probably would have less mass than a real moon too given its material composition and overall structure (more hollow spaces).  

That site should do Gungans vs. Ewoks.  Or 3PO Protocol Droids vs. Tribbles.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Sandwich on September 20, 2004, 06:08:22 am
Picard vs. Kirk!

....oh, wait...
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 20, 2004, 06:09:28 am
Quote
Originally posted by Sandwich
Picard vs. Kirk!

....oh, wait...


didn't they make a film of that?
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Turnsky on September 20, 2004, 06:28:32 am
i know one person that could kick all their collective asses!..

Alpha 1!! :p
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 20, 2004, 06:58:50 am
Quote
Originally posted by Cyker

That said, you almost never see fighter craft in 'Trek so smeg knows if they're any good!

Eh :wtf:

Did you not watch the Dominion War? :p Entire squadrons kick Cardassian and Dominion ass in Sacrifice of Angels. The single greatest battle in ST :D

I mean, "Galaxy wing 9-1 and 9-2 " says a whole lot. :D Hundreds of ships, wings of fighters all flying across your screen. Beams and torpedoes flying in all direction, ships burning and exploding.

;7
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Rol on September 20, 2004, 07:46:24 am
they are wrong
lasers no matter how strong dosen“t penetrate the navigation shields of federation ships
the ships are immune against this form of energy
and federation can destroy a planet with a single shot using a soliton wave

or think SW vs the borg the battle lasts 1 minute than the borg adapt ---> goodby SW

in the ST universe are much more powerfull techs like tricobalt torpedos , gravimetrical charges , subspace warheads , cloaking , subspace weapons

and transwarp is much faster than SW travel

ahhhh I must get back the real world  ;)
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Ghostavo on September 20, 2004, 08:11:23 am
So what remains is stupidly powerful weapons vs stupidly powerful shielding and armor... interesting... :nervous:
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Ratri on September 20, 2004, 08:35:34 am
Have you checked this out?
Racism in Star Trek:http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/Racism.html (http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/Racism.html)

Communism and Star Trek:
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/Trek-Marxism.html (http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/Trek-Marxism.html)

The guys on that website have some serious issues.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 20, 2004, 08:54:55 am
The guy is a moron, we know. :lol:
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 20, 2004, 09:39:56 am
w00t!  space commies!
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Omniscaper on September 20, 2004, 11:57:20 am
Speaking of Enterprise VS Sathanas, have you folks seen these little screenshot comic short I put together nearly a year ago.?

Part 1
http://dynamic3.gamespy.com/~bridgecommander/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=13314&highlight=sathanas

Part 2
http://dynamic3.gamespy.com/~bridgecommander/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=13341

Its PIC HEAVY and its so old that some of the screenshots have been overwritten by modders.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: TopAce on September 20, 2004, 12:29:33 pm
Star Wars Vs. Star Trek debates have been going on since both universes appeared. You don't have to look very far to know which universe I prefer. This is simply pointless, both fan sides(Star Wars & Star Trek) have their own preferences and disliles in the universe they prefer. I would love to fly with an A-wing, but I simply can't stand the Ewoks. I cannot say anything about Star Trek, I saw one or two episodes of the TV series, so all I could say is that that universe is a bit odd. The FS universe appeared strange and alien for the first sight, I simply had to get used to it. Even if I saw more about Star Trek, I would still prefer Star Wars since I know it far better and I have been grown up by that universe and the games/books based on it. The time I spent with SW confirms and immobilizes my addiction.
I don't find comparing and dissecting two different universes a good idea. No offence, really, but a debate like that is heavily flammable at HLP. It is just like opening a thread about 'Pro-choice vs. Pro-life'. I would predict a two-day lifetime for such thread.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on September 20, 2004, 12:46:30 pm
This thread reminds me of a comment someone said not too long ago, I think it was on another forum but it may been on HLP.

To answer the question of who would survive, in Star Trek vs Star Wars, or in Babylon 5 vs Star Trek, or whoever vs whoever.

The answer is they both would, because the two would never, ever meet. So there's no point arguing about it.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: TopAce on September 20, 2004, 12:48:16 pm
http://dynamic4.gamespy.com/~freespace/hlp/item_show.php?itm=474
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on September 20, 2004, 01:01:23 pm
Yup, that's the one!
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 20, 2004, 01:12:01 pm
That's why they are called 'hypothetical' debates. If you can't see the point don't be such an ass and just leave.

At least thats what I would say if someone came to me with such a dumbass comment during a debate. It's like saying "Freespace isn't real so why should you care who wins the war?" :p
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 20, 2004, 01:13:56 pm
It's also why they're stupid.  They don't exist within the same 'universe'. so even the numbers for comparison have different meanings.  Unless you create a 3rd, neutral, universe for comparison, it's completely arbitrary & pointless

EDIT; I mean, by all means aregue away. Just don;t ever expect to 'prove' yourself right to anyone other than yourself.
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Flipside on September 20, 2004, 01:20:51 pm
They're good for getting rid of the last few litres of fuel from the flamethrower ;)
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Tiara on September 20, 2004, 01:23:46 pm
Well, some people find it fun to jerk off to naked pictures of Ivanova and Janeway (:ick:). Thats about as unproductive as debating this.

But I think it's fun. So you better back off before I'm gonna chop off your dick and take away your jerking privelidges. :drevil:
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: aldo_14 on September 20, 2004, 01:26:08 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Tiara
Well, some people find it fun to jerk off to naked pictures of Ivanova and Janeway (:ick:). Thats about as unproductive as debating this.


Helps keep Tissue manufacturers in business, tho.

:nervous:
Title: Star Wars Vs Star Trek in 5 minutes
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on September 20, 2004, 01:41:36 pm
Well, if you want to be hypothetical about it, here's my argument, adapted in part from a statement made by JMS (B5-creator).

If Star Trek and Star Wars were to meet, their weapons would fire at the strength of plot, and their hulls would resist weapons fire with the durability of plot. And ultimately, whoever had the most plot power would win the day, which would probably be the neither of them as any cross-over movie/TV series would probably result in a tie or a peaceful resolution so as to give SW+ST fans a lot of eye candy, but to not piss either of them off.