Hard Light Productions Forums
General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: Pnakotus on September 22, 2004, 08:50:30 pm
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So, FS is great, I pulled down the SCP a few days ago and wasn't impressed; reinstalled FS1 and scared myself how crap it looked. I'm impressed now :)
I'm just curious about the whole Herc/Fenris high poly models. Who did them? Why did they stop? The Fenris model (while its responsible for killing load times) makes every single other model in the game and all its mods look like a pile of ****. Particularly the larger ships; I mean flying close to a GTCv is enough to make me want to cry.
I guess I could kind of understand people not wanting to remodel old ships, but the reality is that these are the ships that 90% of people will spend 90% of their time looking at. The Fenris is even a bizarre choice, since its barely in FS2 at all. So... I did a search, no big 'gah n00bs stop asking about high-poly models' threads, but I guess it might have something to do with a new model format that I've heard discussed? Anyway, this whole question was prompted by seeing a PVD bridge tower up close ... truly awful stuff. So whats the status on high-poly models? IMO fighters aren't as important, but you can spend alot of time near caps admiring those three vertices and that one texture tiled as far as the eye can see...
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:welcome:
Sorry dont know the answer to your question
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bobboau did the high poly herc
KARMA did the high poly fenris
I am not sure who did the textures for the fenris.
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Oh! Oh! My turn to do the welcome speech!! My cats wrote this...blame them. :D
Beware of Tabbies in the bushes, if you smell petrol, it tis probably just the old Apollo stuck in the furnace. If you smell fire, tis just some poor sap getting the crap flamed out of him. Feel welcome to try out the motion sensor-equiped-minibar...you'll be charged three hundred dollars every time you get within ten feet of it.
The Library was infested with Shivans back in '99, the roof leaks, the floor creaks, the garden is infested with man-eating garden snails, the cats have taken the observatory...so, that explains the assault rifle under your chair.
But don't think about using it. We ran out of ammo back in '01. Neverless, you'll never feel more welcome anywhere else. Yes, our staff is availble 24/7 to tend to your every need. But avoid the Shivans in the air ducts.
Enjoy your stay, but don't even think about leaving. You won't be able to. Freespace will not let you leave.
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so weird:wtf:
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Originally posted by Night Hammer
so weird:wtf:
So negative. ;)
Always nail the spleens to the wickets and ice the fobbers.
Spaz. :p
Anyways, welcome to Hard Light, Pnakotus!
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LOL
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:nervous:
*grin* Bobboau did the high poly herc? Is there anything he CAN'T do?
The few high poly models really stick out, and communities like this are usually full of Mad Modellers(tm), so I was surprised to see only a few reworked ships. Oh well. The retex job on the Fenris is exemplary; its now got detail it never even had before. Shame noone ever sees it :)
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Have you checked out Lightspeed's texture upgrades for the Fenris and Lev? Or for that matter any of Lightspeed's/DaBrain's/Turambar's texture upgrades? ;7 Makes old models seems new.
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Bob? Well...i've only been here a little while...but i'm pretty sure he can do anything he wants to do.
Magatsu1 the man, though. You'll figure out why, soon. ;)
As for Night Hammer...he has always hated me. I suspect rabies. :D
As for your question regarding Hi-poly models...they should be finished one day. No idea why they stopped, no idea why they did the Fenris and not the other cruisers...
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Originally posted by Axem
Have you checked out Lightspeed's texture upgrades for the Fenris and Lev? Or for that matter any of Lightspeed's/DaBrain's/Turambar's texture upgrades? ;7 Makes old models seems new.
Y'know, I've heard that. My searches didn't find anything and there's no download sticky. Link me? :)
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http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,26310.0.html
Enjoy!
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Originally posted by Blitzerland
As for Night Hammer...he has always hated me. I suspect rabies. :D
I dont hate anyone.
I hate your comments and cats
and Im all up to date on my shots thnx
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Originally posted by Axem
http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,26310.0.html
Enjoy!
Oh THOSE! I saw that, thought 'Glowmaps? Phsaw!' and moved on. That'll learn me. :)
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Bob also did a high-poly Deimos, but it isn't as well publicized (or as close to canon). It looks good, if you can find it. If memory serves, the Fenris was chosen because it uses templated textures and so deciding on what to detail was easy. It's also a tad overdone, and a larger ship at that level of detail would choke the engine. But the larger ships have not been done largely because they are so plainly tile mapped; adding detail to a tile either dissapears or becomes a high-profile change, which is something that no one wants to do only to be criticized for. You'll notice that the Fenris model, despite it's awe-inspiring high-polyness, actually doesn't look that dissimilar to the original. It's hard to get that level of detail on most of the FS models.
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Originally posted by Night Hammer
I dont hate anyone.
I hate your comments and cats
and Im all up to date on my shots thnx
You hate cats? And comments? Man, you'd be like, my worst enemy, if not for the fact you work on the Terran Vasudan War Project.
Can't believe you hate cats. Man...some people...so hopeless....why do you like dogs? Only desperate, sociopathic nerds who need someone to love them for no reason like dogs...sheesh.
I'd really dislike you if not for the fact you work on the TVWP (making you an immortal god, of course).
Back on topic: Pnakotus, i'll go do some looking-around on high-poly models for you. Not sure it will do any good whatsoever, but I like diving in and exploring the deep, dark alleys of the forums...
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:P Good luck then. The only other high poly model released I think was Nico's Perseus. There's the Myrmidon and Anuket too, but those are more edited from the original mesh than making it from scratch. Still good models though. :nod:
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Originally posted by Blitzerland
Back on topic: Pnakotus, i'll go do some looking-around on high-poly models for you. Not sure it will do any good whatsoever, but I like diving in and exploring the deep, dark alleys of the forums...
You're braver than most. In this case, I don't think you'll find a whole lot.
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Originally posted by StratComm
Bob also did a high-poly Deimos, but it isn't as well publicized (or as close to canon). It looks good, if you can find it. If memory serves, the Fenris was chosen because it uses templated textures and so deciding on what to detail was easy. It's also a tad overdone, and a larger ship at that level of detail would choke the engine. But the larger ships have not been done largely because they are so plainly tile mapped; adding detail to a tile either dissapears or becomes a high-profile change, which is something that no one wants to do only to be criticized for. You'll notice that the Fenris model, despite it's awe-inspiring high-polyness, actually doesn't look that dissimilar to the original. It's hard to get that level of detail on most of the FS models.
Yes, I'd considered this, particularly with the Deimos, where the tilemapping is most obvious. There really isn't much detail on a Deimos anyway; its a series of flat surfaces with small bits of cortex visible. How do modellers/skinners go about making this sort of thing look less crap? Is there a way to make the boxiness less sharp? In the case of the Deimos, its the naked polys everywhere that make it look bad, like the lower engine bay.
I was actually impressed that the Fenris was so detailed yet so indistinguishable from the original, if that makes any sense. I'm aware that that level of detail over an much larger ship would do bad things to the fps, but anything has got to be better than the geometry on the GVD.
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Originally posted by Pnakotus
How do modellers/skinners go about making this sort of thing look less crap?
By turning it into this:
(http://img35.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/diemos2-7.jpg)
(http://img35.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/diemos26.jpg)
(http://img35.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/diemos2-4.jpg)
(http://img35.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/diemos2-5.jpg)
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Originally posted by Jetmech Jr.
By turning it into this:
Oh yeah, that works. :eek2: Who's model is that, and where can I download it??:eek2:
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Its in this (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,25015.0.html) thread.
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Looks almost too detailed
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Its very nice, makes playing Homesick alot more fun ... which is actually the campaign that made me hate the original Deimos (since you spend so much time following it etc). The thread talked about a fighter bay; I don't see the controversy - the Deimos is what, 600 meters long? Homesick (for example) has 8 fighters, and its in frickin space so you just need a modern-day DD style chopper garage. Such a thing could be hidden just about anywhere on a 600m ship, although the wierd underside superimposed engine arrangement makes that area unusable. But I guess I'm just old fashioned :)
In that thread remodeling the Orion was mentioned; I think the Orion needs some tough decisions to be made about it before anything like that can happen. A minor remodel (for details like the sensor antennae, turrets etc) and a reskin would be enough IMO.
Its a bit odd that noone has done any Vasudan or Shivan ships. Vasudan ships don't appear to require much detail, what with all their curves. The GVD would be a major project tho, given its bizarre geometry.
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Originally posted by Night Hammer
Looks almost too detailed
Compared to the original, anything would give that impression :) I like it, probably because I can't imagine what else someone would do with the huge flat surfaces on the original.
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What other hi-poly stuff is in the works?
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there was a persius made by Neco before he left, but Nico's relese policy wasn't as liberal as mine, so I don't know if he relesed it or not before he left.
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There was a hi-poly Medusa being worked on. A thread containing some wip images was created at about the same time Bob showed off his Deimos. There's also Nico's Perseus, but there actually is a finished pof for that. I believe Karma has been occasionally working on an improved Lucifer. There was one released for Inferno, but it has no shield mesh and has considerably more turrets. I've also seen starts on the Seth and Thoth, but they've never gotten too far.
Later!
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I have starts on sevral ships, never realy get anywere with them though, I think the Dragon re-mod is closest curent one I have and it only has like 40% geometry if even that.
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HTL remodels bore the **** out of me, to be honest, I always prefer to work on original models.
Even when it takes almost 2 months to texture a fecking capship *grumble*.
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Originally posted by Bobboau
there was a persius made by Neco before he left, but Nico's relese policy wasn't as liberal as mine, so I don't know if he relesed it or not before he left.
He released it. I know cause I use it :)
Check out the thread where he said his goodbyes.
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Such a shame...But yeah, it was released, and it's a lot of fun to play around with :D
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Off the top of my head, High poly ships are
Perseus (Done)
Herc (done)
Fenris (Done)
Anukhet (Done)
Deimos (Done)
Myrmidon (Done)
Mjolnir (Modelled, textured)
Triton (Modelled, textured)
Medusa (Modelled?)
Alastor (Watchdog?) (Modelled?)
Seth (Modelled?)
Thoth (Modelled?)
Lucifer (WIP)
I'm sure there are others that I've missed though.
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Someone should rebuild Nico's perseus with a normal cockpit - it's a shame I can't use it because of his modelled cockpit.
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Originally posted by Lightspeed
Someone should rebuild Nico's perseus with a normal cockpit - it's a shame I can't use it because of his modelled cockpit.
?
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To add to BW's list; Raptor was working on a new Aleous. :)
Anyways, as of yet unreleased HTL Triton:
(http://www.sectorfiles.com/ti-file-dump/VasudanAdmiral/Triton-HTL_WIP4.jpg)
(http://www.sectorfiles.com/ti-file-dump/VasudanAdmiral/Triton-HTL_WIP5.jpg)
Slightly outdated in-game shots:
http://www.geocities.com/vasudanad/Triton2.txt
http://www.geocities.com/vasudanad/Triton1.txt
It's completely finished (has been for a while) except for the new turrets - waiting on Raptor for them since he'd finished modeling them, but he seems to have vanished for the time being. :\
Incidentally, I did the texture work on the fenris and completed it for in-game use. :)
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That triton actually looks very nice. Of course, the original was such a ****ing mess it wouldn;t be hard.
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I found a crapload of stuff...but it looks like you guys have posted most of it. Fricken' school. If only I had more time...I would have beaten you to it!
Well, there's got to be some lost model out there...and i'll find it!
*Dives into murky, old, forgotten parts of the forum
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Originally posted by aldo_14
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It's ugly, and prevents a nice reflective cockpit 'cause there's no texture on it.
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I am working on the Hecate. It will probably be a while before I have anything worth showing though.
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Someone fix up the perseus and Triton for in-game use then :)
Oh, and remember: Try keeping the number of textures used on the model low - consider baking parts of it. Using two large textures is A LOT faster than using several smaller ones.
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And it will probably look better ;)
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Not really. It allows for MUCH better transistions and general style, but the overall resolution will definately be worse than with tiled mapping. That's why a hybridised form would be ideal :)
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Hey Pnakotus, welcome to HLP. :)
One of the reasons the Fenris was chosen was because its textures and hull design lend itself well to a high-poly rework. It's not covered in repeating textures, like the Deimos, so doing the work on it actually results in something more substantial than repetitive greebles. It's also smaller, so for the amount of detail being aimed for, it didn't take an exorbitantly long time (though it did still take a fairly long period to complete, from mesh to textures).
:welcome:
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Originally posted by Black Wolf
Seth (Modelled?)
Thoth (Modelled?)
Both in the bin I'm afraid, along with 5-6 others.
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Originally posted by Jonathan_S47
I am working on the Hecate. It will probably be a while before I have anything worth showing though.
Good luck. That ships an absolute disaster.... V really dropped the ball with a fair number of the FS2 terran capships.... the Aeolus is a mess too. Even the Deimos has textures that don't line up properly.
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Originally posted by aldo_14
Good luck. That ships an absolute disaster.... V really dropped the ball with a fair number of the FS2 terran capships.... the Aeolus is a mess too. Even the Deimos has textures that don't line up properly.
With the Hecate its sometimes difficult to even know what tex is supposed to be on each hull element... and all the textures are so crap, and continue the [V] tradition of not having a design lineage. Like, the Hecate is based on... what? Who agrees it should just be textured like the Aeolus and the Deimos, and not like some bizarro-turtle?
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But it's purple! You've got to give props to the purple destroyer!
Ok, the Hecate's maps do suck royally and the ship looks like it was designed by a drunken monkey with a 2-inch crayon, but it's still got promise, honestly. It's configuration isn't that bad, if you chop off a couple of the wings.
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I prefer the pre-GTVA color of terran ships: BLUE!!111oneone
Especially...the Orion. Awesome ship.
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The Hecate is what happens when you have a bunch of drunken Terran engineers consult with some high-on-halluciogens Vasudan engineers on their destroyer design.
Nevertheless, it kinda grows on you.
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Yep, I like the wings...instead crying over spilt paint some clever engineers should returret the thing - practical and more canon tasty IMHO.
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Originally posted by Pnakotus
With the Hecate its sometimes difficult to even know what tex is supposed to be on each hull element... and all the textures are so crap, and continue the [V] tradition of not having a design lineage. Like, the Hecate is based on... what? Who agrees it should just be textured like the Aeolus and the Deimos, and not like some bizarro-turtle?
:hopping: :mad:
I think you're completely wrong there.!!!!11111oneoneoneOMIGOD
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The Hecate is clearly designed based upon a squashed cockroach, not a turtle. :p ;)
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:lol:
I always thought the Hecate looked like a dog.
Yeah. I know the ship is messy to say the least. That’s why I picked it!
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The UV mapping is uberly messed up, but the model itself and the textures are okay.
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Nah, the models also a mess. The side fins aren't even properly joined to hull.
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True and if you look at some of the ANIs there are supposed to be something like a half-dozen turrets on each one. The bugger could actually defend itself if it was returreted. To my way of thinking a destroyer's firepower should be divided into two areas: a. Anti-Cap and b. anti-bomber. Forget fighters because it's own complement can sweep them and they can't really do a lot of damage if they are dodging a dozen fighterkillers(not clusterettes but 12 mother missles)
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The Hecate doesn’t seem to properly use the turrets that it has already got. I have watched several fighters fly right by one of the top flak turrets and it never tried to open fire on them. It just sits there.
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Originally posted by Black Wolf
Off the top of my head, High poly ships are
Perseus (Done)
Herc (done)
Fenris (Done)
Anukhet (Done)
Deimos (Done)
Myrmidon (Done)
Mjolnir (Modelled, textured)
Triton (Modelled, textured)
Medusa (Modelled?)
Alastor (Watchdog?) (Modelled?)
Seth (Modelled?)
Thoth (Modelled?)
Lucifer (WIP)
I'm sure there are others that I've missed though.
Are all of these in the Media VPs?
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Originally posted by ubermetroid
Are all of these in the Media VPs?
Nay, unfortunately only a couple of them are 100% finished, and AFAIK the Perseus wasn't officially released before Nico took a break from FS.
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Perseus was released in his goodbye thread.
And in all fairness, i could really do a better job on the Anuket spell it right! :p. In fact, some day I will. The right way, though, with bumped braces where the straps are on the bottom of the collector, and perhaps even the rotating thingamajigger will have a recessed portion.
And hopefully, I won't screw up the UVing this time around. >.> I think I may know how to fix that, though.