Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Shrike on May 06, 2001, 07:59:00 pm
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Here's some of the background info I just put up on the Return to Neo-Terra (//"http://www.3dap.com/hlp/r2nt/") site. Thought you might be interested.
Continuous Beam Weapons
The first charged particle and photonic beam weapons were tested shortly after the GTI rebellion, thanks to data gathered on the weapons systems onboard both the Lucifer and Hades. However, teething problems with the technology led to slow development, and it was only when the Colossus project was underway did the first truly effective continuous beam weapons see service. However, these first generation beam weapons suffered from high power consumption, massive heat spikes upon firing as well as very high maintenance requirements. Despite this, they were rapidly refitted on various allied warships, as well as the new Sobek class corvettes. Within a few years, the first second generation beam weapons were deployed on the newly designed Hecate and Hatsephut class destroyers, Deimos class corvettes and Aeolus class cruisers. These weapons were only slightly more power efficient than first gen beam cannons, however, they were much more stable and were less prone to overheating and overloads during sustained use. Upgrading from first gen weapons to second gen was deemed a high priority, and as of the NTF Rebellion, the only class with the bulk being unrefitted was the GVD Typhon class, leading to it's reputation for overloads. A few scattered ships of various other classes were unrefitted, mainly ones that were nearing the end of their design lifetime.
GTVA continuous beam weapons are of two main types; photonic beam weapons, designed for and used primarily with Vasudan ships and power cores, and charged particle beams, designed for maximum effectiveness when mounted on Terran ships. Thanks to wartime research into the fields of high energy laser optics and superconductors, new third generation photonic beam weapons are now seeing limited trial service. However, development of these advanced photonic beam weapons is continuing, and GTVARAD has not comitted itself to clearing the weapons for use by BuWeapons as of yet. Post war development of particle acceleration technology has been more fruitful, mainly due the new mining colonies providing sufficient quantities of rare earth elements for high capacity superconductor development and deployment. These led to the construction of the first combat-effective neutral particle beams. These weapons are similar to a standard charged particle beam, however, they use neutral atoms, Deuterium in the case of the GTVA weapons, instead of charged ions. The means that the beams do not have internal repulsion dispersing them, boosting their effective range. Their drawback is that the weapons themselves are bulkier, and only select vessels can easily be retrofitted with the new neutral beam weapons. These include the Deimos and Aeolus classes, with the Norn carrier having been hurridly redesigned to mount the weapons. The Alcyone class cruiser is the first class of ship designed from the outset to be armed solely with neutral particle beams.
All of the older Aten, Fenris and Leviathan class cruisers that were sold to private concerns at the end of what the GTVA considered their useful lifetime were stripped of their beam armament. However, those used for defense or exploration are often rearmed with obselete first generation beam weaponry. All ships owned and operated by private concerns armed with beam weapons are required by GTVA law to register not just their ship but each and every beam weapon onboard.
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That sounds cool. Fenris's and Leviathans aren't outdated yet tho (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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Co-Creator, Project Omega18 ("http://qxmx.tripod.com")
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The Fenris is too flimsy for beam combat. Also, this is from 2373, 6 years post-Capella. Should have mentioned that.
As for the terran cruisers, if they were built during the Great War, they'd be over 30 years old.....a good time to either retire them or SLEP them. And seeing as the GTVA has newer, better ships, retiring them makes sense.
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Thats an interesting thing, all anybody seems interested in building is bigger and bigger destroyers with bigger guns/more guns/more fighters/etc. Realistically the first things that start showing up as far as new hulls and new tech are in the smaller ships because they're cheaper and take less time to build. The colossus took 20 years to put together and complete building, by the time they finished it, it was already almost obsolete. We need to see some new cruisers and corvettes. How about an Elint cruiser with a couple LRBGreens and an AWACS suite? an upgraded Aeolus hull with a lil more anti-cap punch and upgraded antifighter weaponry (longer range flak, EWWWWWWWW) =)
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(http://www.3dap.com/hlp/r2nt/alcyone_sil.jpg)
Too bad it's still classified, huh? Someone hasn't been to the R2NT site yet.
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As for flak, my favorite is standard flak...it'll blow you to kingdom come faster than heavy or long range, simply because it fires so damn fast.
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All flak rules (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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This is really cool, Shrike. Cool stuff. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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Heheh, why not combine standard, heavy and log range flak into one Super Flak??? (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
Actually I named it as Ultra Flak... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Originally posted by Mr. Fury:
Heheh, why not combine standard, heavy and log range flak into one Super Flak??? (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
Actually I named it as Ultra Flak... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
How about UberFlak? =)
And actually, I had been to the site, I just didn't see any actual information to go along with the pretty sillhouettes. But I like it.
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If it aint broke, break it!
> Now working on the Last Starfighter MOD <
[This message has been edited by morris13 (edited 05-07-2001).]
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Cruiser, especially Leviathans are still in good service. I'd trust a proven combat Levithan any day (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Fenris's, you're right, weren't made for beam combat. It takes one direct hit from an Orion's forward beam cannon to take it down.
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Co-Creator, Project Omega18 ("http://www.subspacezero.com")
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Has anyone tried making massive multi-ship beam arrays
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Co-Creator, Project Omega18 ("http://www.subspacezero.com")
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Me, but I failed (problems with the tbls) (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/frown.gif)
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Philippe "Skippy" Villiers - ICQ: 103116541
The future isn't known
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Originally posted by QXMX:
Has anyone tried making massive multi-ship beam arrays
SEXPing? It would be easy enough....
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Yeah, invulnerability and all.
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Originally posted by QXMX:
Cruiser, especially Leviathans are still in good service. I'd trust a proven combat Levithan any day (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Fenris's, you're right, weren't made for beam combat. It takes one direct hit from an Orion's forward beam cannon to take it down.
Ever seen a combat proven leviathan get hit be a BFRed? It turns into recycled combat proven hull parts (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
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We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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You're askin for trouble if you're sending a Leviathan up against something that has a BFRed (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Besides, just about every ship heads to the scrap heap when it's hit with a BFRed (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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Co-Creator, Project Omega18 ("http://www.subspacezero.com")
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Just explaining wy everyone's been making destoryers in stead of cruisers for the most part. The biggest change in FS2 from FS1 was that the shivan's armada simply got stronger.
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
Do or Do Not,..There Is No Spoon
Ghosts of the Past Forum ("http://pub10.ezboard.com/bdeathangelsquadronforum.html")
Ghosts of the Past WebSite ("http://deathangelsquadron.net/GhostsofthePast/ghostsofthepast.html")
To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Destroyers = BUFFTs
Work it out.
Slow in sidereal space and likely slow to charge their drives, sluggish....
Cruisers and vettes are so much bettter....mm...speed, awesome fire density, none of those puny fighter things onboard....
I'm definately a 'small ship' guy when it comes to FS2.
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Originally posted by Shrike:
I'm definately a 'small ship' guy when it comes to FS2.
I agree. I think that the last encounter that the GTVA should give them pause to reconsider their building strategy. They built the biggest, buffest thing they could imagine and it got fragged by one of apparently hundreds of Sathanas. If the GTVA is going to compete with the shivans, larger and slower is not the answer. The shivans have an immense advantage in firepower, but don't use very good tactics. It would seem to me that the most effective warship that the GTVA could build would be a fast, highly agile corvette supplemented by equally quick cruisers with precision intersystem jump drives. Not only would these be quicker and more efficient to build, but against the shivan ships with very limited firing arcs, a ship of this type could make a jump into firing range BEHIND the shivan vessel, and beat the crap out of it while it was trying to turn around. A group of half a dozen corvettes and cruisers used in this way would represent a much more credible threat to a Sathanas than even the Collossus did, since they would be able to avoid the enemy's vastly superior firepower.
In short, a BFRed doesn't do any good if your target is never in its firing arc.
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:cough: looks like someone is onto the Laomedon Conclave's plans... :cough: (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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Ace
Staff member FreeSpace Watch
http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/ ("http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/")
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I'm surprised no one has really commented on the ideas I put forward.
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Why do the Vasudans and Terrans use completely different beam technology? Minor differences in the construction of the weapon would result in the color differences, so its not really nessecary that Vasudan beams and Terran beams use a different technology base, although i suppose that depending on how different the underlying principles that the power grids on the ships are built with might have some effect, beyond a certain point power is just power. you may need a converter to use US electric appliances in Europe, but its not like you need an electric razor that operates on a completely different set of principles.
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Eh, coolness factor. Besides, I prefer particle beams to lasers. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/lol.gif)
Personally, if the spamtik hadn't used photon beam cannons I would have called them all particle beams.... lasers in FS are glowing balls of energy, not beams like they should be. (WTF?)
[This message has been edited by Shrike (edited 05-09-2001).]
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The FS1 cannons are merely called lasers in the tables, they are plasma pulse cannons.
The ML-16 and similar weapons are pulsed due to the frequencies and exited particle elements used. (they merely appear pulsed)
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Ace
Staff member FreeSpace Watch
http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/ ("http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/")
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Originally posted by Ace:
The FS1 cannons are merely called lasers in the tables, they are plasma pulse cannons.
The ML-16 and similar weapons are pulsed due to the frequencies and exited particle elements used. (they merely appear pulsed)
So why is the HL-7 specifically called a Xaser? That's short for X-Ray laser. Virtually all of the FS weapons are laser-based as well. Until you can offer some conclusive proof that they're not lasers at all, I'll call them lasers. (even though they're stupid pulse things and not beams)
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I stated that the ML-16, HL-7, and such *are* laser based technologies, this is a known fact. (M=Medium H=Heavy L=Laser)
The majority of Capital ship pulse weapons are *not* lasers.
The Colossus did have some pulse laser turrets, but the heavier pulse weapons on capital ships are plasma based.
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Ace
Staff member FreeSpace Watch
http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/ ("http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/")
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I'll accept the capship plasma turrets.
Thanks for sharing the first time around mr. inside info.