Hard Light Productions Forums
Modding, Mission Design, and Coding => The Modding Workshop => Topic started by: Grug on March 03, 2005, 09:21:10 am
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*engage sick sense of humour*
I was thinking this could work for debris fields and ship debris after they blowup.
Human bodies.
It would be chilling to the bone to fly through a just blown up cruiser and have a few corpses bounce off your hull.
If the SCP guys got there animation code working, you could have a few kickers right after a large ship detonates.
Imagine jumping into a debris field of a fleet with pieces of ships and people...
Spooky.
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Alpha 2: Command, where's the SJ OMGWTFBBQ that Alpha 1 was supposed to destroy
Command: More Importantly where's the GTVA Colossus X-2000 Millenium Edition XP?
*suddenly a person with a Shivan stuck in his head hits Alpha 1's fighter, player screaMS and runs out of room*
*Shivans appear from nowhere and rip apart Alpha 2's fighter, 80 Shivan juggernauts jump in. Alpha 1 returns 5 Minutes later there is a debris field with a single Ares fighter flying out of it.*
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Venoms HTL ezechiel had a pilot as debris, IIRC......
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Really?
Kewl....
What about small clouds of blood.
Surely theres a better way to do it than the 'poofs' aka like in the nebula.
Something like fog would be kewl, but dynamic, so ships could be stained and leave a skimming trail behind them...
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I...er.... think you're taking this idea a bit far.
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Blood? Don't. FS is user-friendly. Bodies? What if you hit them? It will be like in X-wing Alliance, they will explode. What if it only disappeared? No, it looks stupid. Blood? [Go back to the beginning of the post]
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There is a POF of a Shivan floating around somewhere, and it comes in both living and non-living varieties. I think I have it on my hard drive, but I'll have to check.
However, the readme file for that Shivan makes a good point: consider the size of most FS ships relative to a person. At MINIMUM, an FS fighter is 20 meters long. People are so small, you're just not going to see them much.
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I guess size would be a problem, hence why you have them cluttered together in groups.
@TopAce, hence why I said if they had animation system implemented. What would be even better would be a ragdoll system akin to Doom3, HalfLife2 or FarCry...
Bloods probably too far, but it would be nice if there where dynamic nebula clouds around the place.
You could even hide in them.
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they would bounce of your shields.
duh.
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I guess you could make them have debris to, where when you shot e'm, the torso and head, and Butt and legs fly of in different directions.
Yes, I have fun in IL-2 shooting the pilots that have ejected.:devil:
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who wants to see a whole pilot floating in space, its more fun to se half a pilot floating in space :D
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lol true.
High res textures too, so you can see the terror in their faces of their last dieing moments... :p
Maybe if you wanted the half a corpse thing, it could have something like the damage on ships etc its blood coloured, so its drifting off with blood spilling into the void of space.
What would be funny was if there was a large group of them arranged in a sky diving formation. :p Like in a giant circle.
Maybe you could make a race level then, where you have to fly through the rings of people in space suits.
But if you miss and hit the sides a few people bounce of the hull and go flying off into the void... hehehe :p
...
So what if I havn't had any sleep in 38 hours...
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realistically, corpses would explode in space.
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Actually, they would freeze more than anything else; sudden decompression wouldn't break the skin or explode, etc. (http://www.jamesoberg.com/myth.html)
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Neither anwer is good.
First off, the pilots's suit can probably work as a spacesuit too.
Otherwise - no they won't immediatelly freeze in space. I already I explained that a million times so I won't go into that this time...
They won't explode - at least the body itself. However due to decompression they could suffer fatal lung rupture.
....which is moot since they will die of suffocation soon, if the pressure shock didn't knock them out.
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So where's Frank Poole? ;)
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Originally posted by aldo_14
Actually, they would freeze more than anything else; sudden decompression wouldn't break the skin or explode, etc. (http://www.jamesoberg.com/myth.html)
that site is so inacurate in some areas, well, not inacurat but for example
No-gravity myth #2: For those fascinated by the possibilities of "war in space, Earthside analogies have been stretched beyond the breaking point. The oft-repeated idea of "shooting down a satellite" falls into that category because a satellite struck by a weapon would retain its speed and hence would stay in orbit, dead or alive, whole or in pieces.
Now i personaly dont think that when anyone says "Shooting down satilites" that they mean the satilites actualy going to fall, it's simply a term that evolved from earlier flying vehicles.
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Blow Up
Special-effects wizards love space vacuum scenes. In Total Recall (set on Mars) and a dozen other Hollywood space westerns, movie makers take the standard gory approach of painfully puffing torsos and grapelike bursting eyeballs to show what happens to a human thrown out into open space. Such an imaginary fate is enough, wrote veteran spacewalker Michael Collins in his lyrical autobiography Carrying the Fire, to make a spaceman think long, encouraging thoughts about "the little old ladies and their gluepots" who assemble each NASA spacesuit by hand.
But one Hollywood director, Stanley Kubrick, was much more accurate about this (and so much else) in his 1968 cult classic, 2001: A Space Odyssey. Deep-space voyager Bowman outwits the psychotic autopilot HAL by jumping into an open airlock without his helmet and then boarding the ship to lobotomize the mutinous microchip. Actually, author Arthur C. Clarke got it right first, back in the 1950s: He knew that the physical toughness of the human body allows it to resist deformation even in a full vacuum. A human will suffocate and double over in pain from the bends -- and lapse into unconsciousness in just seven seconds -- but at least the eyeballs won't pop out.
"What you should expect is to fart a lot," notes a space-medicine expert at Cape Canaveral.
In a spaceflight tragedy in 1971, three Soviet cosmonauts went to vacuum in shirt sleeves during an accidental depressurization during their return to Earth. Recently released top-secret Soviet space films show them receiving emergency resuscitation after landing. They had gone without air too long -- about 30 minutes -- to be revived, but their bodies were not physically deformed by the exposure to vacuum.
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Read the link aldo_14 before writting about it - or at least do a proper quote.
It doesn't mention freezing anywhere, and rightly so since it won't happen.
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Originally posted by Flaser
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Read the link aldo_14 before writting about it - or at least do a proper quote.
It doesn't mention freezing anywhere, and rightly so since it won't happen.
I read more than one source, y'know. And I said 'more likely to freeze than explode', which is correct. What I did not say, was 'freeze to death'.
I am fairly confident that a body floating in space is more likely to freeze, than to explode. I believe floating about at potential temperatures of absolute zero can do that.
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The low pressure wouild make your blood boil before it froze.
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I was mulling over this a long time ago.. I'm not sure bodies are good ideas as such, but if you wanted to go into (really great) detail you could get some interesting stuff being scattered around a ships debris field. I rather fancy the idea of the larger capital ships ejecting their reactors into space shortly before exploding (to try and soften the blast for any escape pods in the area)... heck you could even have small escape pods jetting out of the stricken ship and rapidly opening subspace portals in an attempt to escape...
Of course, it depends what kind of detail you want to go into ;)
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Didn't someone discuss coding an auto-launch of escape pods at some point? Of course, in FS there's the slight problem that not many ships actually have EP launch points......
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That's true of course - I suppose it depends where you are when the pods launch... if you're staring straight at the launch point it'd look ****e.
Otherwise if you have them move (very) quickly and jump rapidly it'd just look really quite good. Heck you could even make the pods themselves something small like a countermeasure model and shroud it in a glow (to imply speed). It'd jump before it could be inspected closely anyway...
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Originally posted by Kalfireth
That's true of course - I suppose it depends where you are when the pods launch... if you're staring straight at the launch point it'd look ****e.
Otherwise if you have them move (very) quickly and jump rapidly it'd just look really quite good. Heck you could even make the pods themselves something small like a countermeasure model and shroud it in a glow (to imply speed). It'd jump before it could be inspected closely anyway...
Well.... I wonder if you could do it by simply making the pods emerge from a point occluded to the player - i.e. the opposite side. But I'm not sure that's much better or feasible. At least you could use the fighterbays on an Orion, etc, I guess.
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I always thought the pods in game where rubbish. They are huge ie take ages to lad up so are not very practical for escape, they are way to slow to get away and they take to long to jump getting shot down.
Escape pods should be the oposite o all off these things!! Someone should definately remodel them as smaller faster podes that just burst out of a dieing ship in a flurry and are gone! Not givving you time to see where they came from (as ship is dead) and jump out before you realise they are just capsuels with an engine glow?
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Originally posted by aldo_14
I read more than one source, y'know. And I said 'more likely to freeze than explode', which is correct. What I did not say, was 'freeze to death'.
I am fairly confident that a body floating in space is more likely to freeze, than to explode. I believe floating about at potential temperatures of absolute zero can do that.
Absolute zero my....whatever.
For the millionth time: There is NO TEMPERATURE IN SPACE!
Temperature is a macroscopic term to indicate the internal energy of atoms in a given space.
If there are no atoms, it's pointless to use the term temperature.
Any body in space - including drown pilots - only loose and gain heat through irradiation. Any solid object slowly radiates on the full EM spectrum - loosing heat.
Any body also recieves energy radiated.
If the pilot was on the shiny side of things and close enough to the star (Mercury through Mars distance) he could heat up and eventually evaporate.
In the shadow of something or farther from the sun he would freeze.
It's a matter of heat management or the balance of the recieved and irradiated energy - this is true for any given spacecraft.
This is the reason why the shuttle has to immediately open it's cargo bay once in orbit, since it needs the radiators inside exposed to manage its heat.
As for the boiling blood - it would boil if the it was exposed to space. However it would stay in the pilot's body and therefore remain under pressure (though the blood from his ruptured lungs may evaporate).
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excuse me, but when a ship explodes, it explodes, as in a huge fireball of death that rips apart the super strong alloys the ship is made off like tissue paper. any bodies caught in that would be vaporized, so body debris is unrealistic.
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I think escape pods would be a good idea. Just make them launch from the dock ports + hangars if no EP launch ports are designated.
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I rather prefer the idea of launching them from the occluded side to the player... for instance the Fenris has no launch bay but I like to think they'd still have a couple of escape pods launch in the event of an emergency.
Plus a striken destroyer could just look damn cool with about 10 to 20 of these things launching from the far side of it as it detonates.
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but that wouldn't make any sense.
There's Alpha I! Launch all pods on the side OPPOSITE to him! It's standard protocol for all races.
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The absolute easiest way to deal with it would be to place invulnerable escape pods within the ship's volume at the moment it blows. Then they move out radially from the center to a random distance within a set range, and engage subspace drives. That way it looks like they come out from behind the ship's armor plating, and you don't have to worry about generating points for them to emerge from.
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Originally posted by Carl
but that wouldn't make any sense.
There's Alpha I! Launch all pods on the side OPPOSITE to him! It's standard protocol for all races.
Who cares about whether it makes sense or not? It'd look cool - and lets face it - FreeSpace isn't real :p
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i suggested once that you put in small cylinders as debris, and texture them to look like lifeboats. not escape pods, lifeboats. the escape pods in FS are more like shuttles, so lifeboats would be like in Alien: Ressurection (you know, the aliens go in it and the captain throws a grenade in it. like those), and the ones on the PoA in Halo. the escape pods get the non-essential crew out, and the lifeboats are last chances. it'd look cool, be system-efficient (low poly and a single texture map) and make ship destruction slightly more believeable.
this is all IMO, of course :p but i'd like to do that.
[edit] oh, yes, i know they'd go drifting off into the void of space and would never be seen again, but think about it - clear the battle area and all... they probably stop drifting after a while with maneuvering jets or something... also, the player probably won't think about that too often :)
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LOL @ this. To all those who were debating earlier:
Some guy asks a simple question "Can this be added" and all those "Professors" start debating whether or not it is scientifically possible.
FreeSpace is SCIENCE FICTION. We can break ALL of Newton's laws if we want to, we can say humans reproduce from eggs if we darn well please. Fiction is whatever we want it to be, so get out of the space science NONFICTION departments already.
We need human debris.
Why?
So that joke campaigns can have Vasudan transports after battles collecting Headz, of course.
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hehe. Another Greg yeah! :p
Interesting suggestion with the head collection though... hmmm. :p
But lifepods would be interesting. Maybe you can set a random number like the wave delay for a ship.
Because there would be moments where no-one escapes such as kamikaze runs and other assorted fanatical or immediate destruction.
But if that was implemented you could make a joke mission where you jump to a mysterious point where all the lifepods ever ejected end up arriving. So theres a highly clutered asteroid field.
Ok maybe fighter pilots wouldnt last the explosion, but surely in a larger ship with propogating explosions and such there would be some bodies that arn't incinerated.
Too bad the geomod thing never took up... beam weapon cuts a ship in half and then debris and people spill out from the exposed hull.
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Originally posted by Kalfireth
Who cares about whether it makes sense or not?
a very large number of people.
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Yeah?
Ah well... nuts to 'em. I'm all for being realistic where it's possible but if this is going to go the way of the whole... "could a Star Wars ship take a Star Trek ship (insert pages of arguement about energy, distance in space and the fact that Star Wars weapons ignore Star Trek shields here)..."
...and you can count on me laughing at whoever gets involved.
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With gigaton-level beams and bombs being thrown about, the crew of a destroyed starship would be turned into quarks in the destruction of their vessel. And the idea of blood in FS is so ridiculous it shouldn't be discussed, even in a campaign like Deus Ex Machina.
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Well, we could potentially replace the existing glowing particle animation with a little blood poof... then have our ships bleed every time they get hit. :D
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"If it bleeds, we can kill it..."
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Bodies in space. Interesting. "Alpha 1! Scan those bodies."
Originally posted by Kalfireth
"If it bleeds, we can kill it..."
I love the Predator movie :D
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me too ^_^
as for Grug: no, i meant put those 'lifeboats' in the debris of the .POF file. it'd just create the illusion of lifeboats, while being easy on system resources and not needing any new code. methinks it's a good idea...
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Originally posted by Kalfireth
...and you can count on me laughing at whoever gets involved.
Oddly enough, as soon as you say that, Woolie chimes in. :rolleyes: :lol:
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Hehe, bleeding ships would be interesting. Maybe some organic race or something.
Come to think of it Shivan ships look slightly organic...
I like the idea of cloud debris fields though. It would add a very big element to the gameplay if you could have small clouds or small nebula in a mission that blocks line of sight and sensors.
Can you imagine how kewl it would be to set up ambushes in nebula clouds. Or being the victim of one?
"Alright Convoy change course to station Polaris, we ne- Oh My God! It's an ambush!"
*Cruiser emerges from giant dust cloud and charges beams*
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Originally posted by Grug
Hehe, bleeding ships would be interesting. Maybe some organic race or something.
Come to think of it Shivan ships look slightly organic...
Shadows... I hope that effect can be done.
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There was a build a long ago, which had shadows implemented. Search in the SCP forum(not the recent builds forum)
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Context, TopAce, context. B5 Shadows.
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The Shadows have come for TopAce!:drevil:
(http://www.b5tech.com/shadows/shadowships/batlcrab.jpg)
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Yeap. I meant B5 Shadows. But thanks anyway, TopAce :)
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Did Shadow ships bleed...? *is ignorant latecomer to B5*
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Yeah.. They bleed black blood. Or so to speak...
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I thought they kind of shuddered and screamed and blew apart as the token money shot of the Whitestar cutting through one with a full frontal barrage was shown ;)
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lol.
Do we have any pics of them bleeding?