Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: vyper on June 04, 2005, 08:22:41 am
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I never heard of this until reading this article http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0603-32.htm , and I wondered how many of you had.
[q]In 1967, Liberty was the most sophisticated intelligence-gathering or spy ship in the U.S. fleet. On June 8, during the Six Day War involving Israel and its neighbors, Liberty was in international waters of the Mediterranean Sea off the coast of the Sinai Peninsula when it was attacked without warning by Israeli aircraft and torpedo boats.
The attacks on the lightly armed vessel began with aircraft cannon, rocket and machine gun fire, and napalm. Following the air strikes, Liberty took a torpedo amidship. When crewmen lowered life rafts to rescue personnel and in preparation for abandoning ship if necessary, the torpedo boats machine-gunned the life rafts and crewmen.
All told, the attacks lasted a little over two hours. During that time, Liberty 's calls for help reached the U.S. Sixth Fleet, despite Israeli jamming efforts, and the carriers Saratoga and America launched aircraft to assist the beleaguered vessel. But that help never arrived. The aircraft were recalled on direct orders from the White House.
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What the Israelis did was unconscionable, but understandable. They reportedly believed Liberty was transmitting intercepted Israeli military radio traffic to the Egyptians. They also reportedly feared that information about Israel's plans to seize the Golan Heights from Syria would be revealed. So they felt justified in waging an act of war against the country that had sustained it politically and financially from its inception and still does.
It's worth noting, too, that some Israeli pilots refused to fly on the mission, knowing the target was an American ship.
The United States' behavior during and after the attack is even more unconscionable. When the carrier pilots were recalled from their mission to aid Liberty, it marked the first time in naval history that an American rescue mission had been canceled when a U.S. vessel was under attack. [/q]
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:wtf: That's just odd.... I hadn't heard about it. Doesn't it make the Israelis enemies of Freedom(TM), who must be crushed at all costs?
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Well lets see. America has :-
1) Given them money to buy weapons.
2) Supported them in attacks against other middle eastern states.
Sounds right on track :D
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Gotta love LBJ:wtf:
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Originally posted by redmenace
Gotta love LBJ:wtf:
LBJ?
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Yea I saw that on the history channel once strange story indeed.
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Originally posted by Lt.Cannonfodder
LBJ?
President Lyndon B Johnson = LBJ
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Gotta wonder why he let this happen? oh I remember, jewish americans vote democratic. Scumbag politicians.
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Cause Bush is all about not helping Israel right? :rolleyes:
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I don't know how you got into you head that I like bush. I hate him as much as the next guy. Probably for different reasons, though. Bush is a douche as much as LBJ, John Kerry, Bill Clinton, FDR and as much of a moron as Jimmy "peanut farmer" Carter.
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Originally posted by redmenace
Gotta wonder why he let this happen? oh I remember, jewish americans vote democratic. Scumbag politicians.
I doubt they do these days. The republicans are more likely to push support for Israeli military issues.
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Honestly, it is about the same. The moment democrats would turn their backs on the state of israel there goes NJ, NY, and Florida.
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Originally posted by redmenace
I don't know how you got into you head that I like bush. I hate him as much as the next guy. Probably for different reasons, though. Bush is a douche as much as LBJ, John Kerry, Bill Clinton, FDR and as much of a moron as Jimmy "peanut farmer" Carter.
I didn't say you liked him. Just that Rebublicans are pretty big on the ignore anything bad Israel do thing too.
Quite why you singled out the Democrats for it when all American presidents are guilty of it is beyond me.
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ok, Reagan, Ford, Nixon etc.
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Originally posted by redmenace
Honestly, it is about the same. The moment democrats would turn their backs on the state of israel there goes NJ, NY, and Florida.
's why Hillary is a senator here in NY; we have a large Jewish population, and she's always been big on kissing their asses.
In fact, here in Rockland County, we have the Palisades Interstate Parkway... the entire road is beat to crap and worn out, except for the 3 or 4 exits where the jewish population is highest. :doubt:
Hillary/Schumer = :no:
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And many jewish families have money. And politicians love money. Especially from high society types.
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Well, I don't know how well that stereotype fits; There are tons of poor jews here. TONS. But what constitutes a family is different. I've seen cases where what you would normally consider to be 5 or 6 families, are all really one large one. Father and mother, their 5 children, and their children's spouses and children all in one roof. It does help to pool the income; and truth be told, it has to here, because even the run down homes in the "bad" neighbourhoods are ~450-600,000....
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Originally posted by redmenace
Gotta wonder why he let this happen? oh I remember, jewish americans vote democratic. Scumbag politicians.
Hey, hey, LBJ, how many Jews did ya suck up to t'day...
:wtf: That's just odd.... I hadn't heard about it. Doesn't it make the Israelis enemies of Freedom(TM), who must be crushed at all costs?
No. This is just proof that LBJ was a dumbass.
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http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/liberty.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident
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That's all well and good, but machine gunning crew getting into lifeboats is not accidental.
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Originally posted by vyper
That's all well and good, but machine gunning crew getting into lifeboats is not accidental.
Nor is it factual:
[q]from the Wikipedia article
Details in dispute
Israeli ships' actions after the torpedo hit: The American crew claims that after Liberty had been torpedoed, Israeli boats circled the ship firing machine guns at descended (unmanned) life rafts and sailors on board the ship. Israelis claim they recognized the ship as American immediately after it was hit and ceased fire. The former point of view was expressed by many of the crew members, while the latter one is reinforced by the statement the ship's captain gave to the Navy Court several days after the attack.
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Not that I'm saying that the whole FUBAR'ed situation was "OK" or anything like that, but let's not start claiming as fact things that aren't factual.
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I'd be interested in reading that statement. I wonder if he actually denied seeing that or simply didn't mention it.
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I didn't know a lot of the details about that attack... which proves to make very interesting reading. I'd always just heard that the Israelis mistook it for an Egyptian ship and had bombed it or something like that.