Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Joey_21 on July 25, 2001, 01:24:00 pm
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I'm not sure if this has been brought up before but remember one of the Bosch cutscenes in which Bosch was sighting a star feeding off of another star? Well, I was watching a TV program last night about supernovas. According to that program, the star getting hydrogen (or whatever material) is a white dwarf orbiting a red giant (or maybe two different stars in the cutscene). When the white dwarf feeds off the red giant long enough, the white dwarf will collide with the red giant and will cause a supernova. This could indicate a possible supernova beyond the 2nd Knossos.
This adds more to the mystery. Discuss.
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Could have interesting implications, but I don't buy the astronomy. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif) Supernovas are purely a factor of mass, and if there is enough combined mass, maybe...but chances are, there isn't. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Two stars running into each other could provide supernova conditions...
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wasn't your second star a black hole?
Never heard about a star feeding from another one...
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Originally posted by venom2506:
wasn't your second star a black hole?
Never heard about a star feeding from another one...
That's according to what I heard on TV last night...
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Mr. Astronomy Fan here...
I'd type all of info about this subject here, but I'll just refer you to this web site ("http://astron.berkeley.edu/~bmendez/ay10/cycle/cycle.html") since I'm not in the mood right now since several people just got laid off at my company... and I just barely survived.
But not to change the subject, check out the site. There are Type I and Type II supernovas. Yes, stars (binary) can "feed" (one star pulls gas from the other) off each other.
Joe.
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Well, supernovas ocurr do to stars getting older, that's one of the stars death scene... the other is expanding to a gigantic, and therefore to a white dwarf and then to black whole... well, when there's a binary star system, these never collid instead they orbit around each other, and I believe(not sure) that they do not exchange matter between them so I dont think that a supernova would occur there....
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Originally posted by Raven2001:
and I believe(not sure) that they do not exchange matter between them so I dont think that a supernova would occur there....
But we have visual proof in the cutscene that the star is actually feeding off the other star... plus, astronomers know about this too (as I seen last night)
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but i'm pretty sure it's a black hole, since the big star is a normal sunlike one, and the other one is too small to be another star, and you can't have a white dwarf there, coz it means it would have been much bigger before and the 2 stars would have been too close, and then you'll answer that it's the same thing for the black hole, and you're rright, and damn, I have nothing to reply to that, lol
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Aren't black holes invisible? (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Type I supernovae (I think I got them right) can only occur when there's a white dwarf secondary, a black hole will not cause a supernova.
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Hed Munkeez. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/spineyes.gif)
The way I done learnt it, nebulas form systems over millions of years... Never heard the SN part, but I dunno... Maybe the Shivans are sorta regenerating systems, not just destroying them...
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When stars die or when they are first being formed, they are Red Giants.
When low-mass stars die, they become red giants and then collapse into white dwarfs.
When bigger stars die, they have more mass, and collapse further than white dwarfs and the pressure is enough to start fusion of heavier elements, and the explosion of energy from that gives you your supernova. What's left afterwards is a nebula and a neutron star.
When REALLY big stars die, you get the same thing, except instead of a neutron star, you have a black hole. And a bigger nebula. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
Just in case that clears anything up...If the cutscene WAS showing a black hole next to a red giant, a common occurance, then I guess it means that there was a supernova in the area, but a very, very, very long time ago. Billions of years sort of thing.
Oh yeah- REAL nebulas aren't like pea soup. You probably would barely be able to tell you were in one. It would obscure vision, but only VERY slightly. If there was a real nebula like in FS2, it would probably actually be a protostar, where the dust is starting to gather to form a star, but isn't dense enough to have started any reaction.
Just throwing this out on the off chance it helps. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Sushi- the OTHER white meat!
Accelerate your game-Velocity Mod ("http://sushicw.homestead.com/files/freespace/velocity.htm")
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Yes, they are Type 1. The white dwarf "feeds" from the other star, getting hydrogen from, and when the amount of it reaches a certain mass it produces a sudden burst. It has nothing to do with collision, and if I remember well, the stars aren't even destroyed, so this circle could go on for several times. This type of explosion isn't comperable with the Supernova explosion, I mean in size.
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Natch, that's a Nova. A type I supernova does destroy the white dwarf, and type I SNs are in fact overall the brighter of the two types. (a max of only about 10e44 joules emitted)
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...Ok. thats when we know too much on the subject (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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Originally posted by Raa Tor'h:
...Ok. thats when we know too much on the subject (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
I agree. Now lets discuss the outcome of our look on what we know so far about solving the mystery of the shivans. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by Raa Tor'h:
...Ok. thats when we know too much on the subject (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
Nah, it's called 'I happen to have an astrophysics book with that info.' (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Bah!
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but wouldn't that mean Capella is a binary star system? i'm pretty sure it isn't.
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Originally posted by Carl:
but wouldn't that mean Capella is a binary star system? i'm pretty sure it isn't.
It isn't. I'm talking about the system beyond the second Knossos. The system where you almost get squished by a Sathanas. (Yea! That system! (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif) ) That system is where Bosch was during that cutscene and that system is binary and that system also has the other star feeding star material off it. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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na-ah. that those stars were blue. the cutscene ones were yellow and white.
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Originally posted by Joey_21:
That system is where Bosch was during that cutscene and that system is binary and that system also has the other star feeding star material off it. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Wasent that in Sirius System or some other system in that cluster (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/confused.gif)
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Originally posted by Carl:
na-ah. that those stars were blue. the cutscene ones were yellow and white.
Possible (another) Intercrack screw up cutscene.
Originally posted by Dr.Zer0:
Wasent that in Sirius System or some other system in that cluster (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/confused.gif)
I don't know. I think Bosch was already beyond the portal by that cutscene. I can't remember though. But by the looks of the picture below, it looks like Bosch was actually in that system...
denebsystem0.tripod.com/mara2stars.jpg
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Originally posted by Shrike:
Natch, that's a Nova
Yep, you are right, just checked an old book of mine. It requires a red giant and a white dwarf.
Originally posted by Shrike:
Nah, it's called 'I happen to have an astrophysics book with that info.' (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
(http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Originally posted by venom2506:
Never heard about a star feeding from another one...
not unheard of in binary systems, but it probably was a blackhole - the companion star had blown to pieces
recent research has also shown that supernovae can happen in even low mass stars - and turning into white dwarfs can happen to even ultra-heavy stars.... i guess it just depends on factors we cannot detect at distance at this time
[This message has been edited by Kazan (edited 07-26-2001).]
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Originally posted by RKIF-DragonClaw:
Aren't black holes invisible?
Only at the singularity, which, depending on the black hole's charge and whether or not it is spinning, can be either a single point or a huge, thin donut shape (kind of like a hollow frisbee).
A black hole floating along in space will be invisible, technically, but its effects on everything around it can sometimes be seen. Firstly, black holes bend light from behind the viewpoint around them, so there is a light distortion around the gravity well with black at the centre (no light can escape from there). If there is gas or matter within reach of the black hole's gravity, an accretion disc will form, where material heats up and gives off radiation as it moves closer to the singularity.
In this example, we can see there is a (possible) black hole there, as its effects on the star next to it are obvious.
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the current big suspect is cygnus X-1, thats appears to be a binary star system with one of the heavy masses giving off massive X-ray emissions.
Black holes CAN be visible, it depends on how massive they are. While it hasnt been directly observed, some phycisists beleive that a low-mass black hole would distort space so suddenly (when the gravity well goes vertical) that virtual particles would be ripped apart and the black hole would actually emit a particle and lose it from the holes' mass.
So small black holes could actually be radiating particles and energy at a high rate.
I'd reckon the bosch cutscene was a white dwarf binary system. Neutron stars magnetic poles concentrate ions into a stream that would be pretty dangerous if you were that close to one.
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Originally posted by Carl:
but wouldn't that mean Capella is a binary star system? i'm pretty sure it isn't.
I think this is a case of what's good for the game but isn't true in reality.
The real Capella is actually four stars ("http://einstein.stcloudstate.edu/Dome/constellns/capella.html").
Joe.
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Originally posted by wEvil:
Black holes CAN be visible, it depends on how massive they are. While it hasnt been directly observed, some phycisists beleive that a low-mass black hole would distort space so suddenly (when the gravity well goes vertical) that virtual particles would be ripped apart and the black hole would actually emit a particle and lose it from the holes' mass.
So small black holes could actually be radiating particles and energy at a high rate.
This is Hawkins radiation, named after the famous scientist that discovered it. And not only the small black holes, all the black holes emmit this radiaton. Its the way the universe will die. In the very very very distant future all the matter will be absorbed by imense black holes and after even more time than that this black holes will explode giving only energy.