Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Warlock on August 17, 2001, 06:05:00 am
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In my other thread WEvil told me that the Xanthus name was also in use in the Babel Effect. I took a peek at their site and the only referrence I saw didn't even look close to my ship,...which being BE is Ace's campaign and I'd told him a while back when creating the Xan I'd allow him to use her, would have been cool.
But if the Babel Effect's Xanthus isn't the same ship, AND I'm not listed in the credits for her, please change the name dude. You know for fact that the Xanthus was designed and named long ago, and we ALL choose her name right here. In Fact I think it was Setkeh who actually picked "xanthus" which I decided on (sorry if it was someone else...lol)
So please correct this matter ASAP (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
Thanks
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
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You were gone from the FS community for a period of time and a carrier class vessel was required within tBE.
I contracted wEvil to design a new ship similar, and the namesake was kept due to it's being worked into the plotline.
If you demand a mention in the credits, I will give you a special thanks.
However the ship design is wEvil's and the name is solidly worked into the plot.
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Ace
Staff member FreeSpace Watch
http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/ ("http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/")
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Originally posted by Ace:
However the ship design is wEvil's and the name is solidly worked into the plot.
It's just a name.... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
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:rolls eyes:
Shrike, the mythical bits are worked in is what I meant, foo! (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
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So you're saying that when someone's offline for a total of 30 days because their X g/f went stupid and shut down their phone or whatever else happens that their projects then become open and fair game? Ummm no. It's his ship his credit...MY name...sorry dude. You KNEW the name of MY ship LONG ago. Thus why you went through the effort of revolving a plot line around it is lost upon me.
But damn how would ANY of you feel if something you've worked on for months was just "tossed to the wolves" simply because you had problems getting online for short time?
God forbid if I'd been in one of those cities having cafe's blown apart by idoits with TnT in their lunchboxes (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
In short, Ace it's simple, you knew what you were doing from the start so I've no problem requesting you remove MY ship classification name from your camapaign especially when it's not even the right ship (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
So it's a point of honor (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Good day
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Look, if you have this much of an issue about this, handle it over E-Mail, the good folks here don't need the hassle.
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Ace
Staff member FreeSpace Watch
http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/ ("http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/")
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To me since it's something I'm woring on WITH most of these folks...i've no problem voicing my opinions here. Don't worry,..I don't intead to incite flames here. There's no need....you're wrong..done.
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Warlock
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DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Well thanks for clearing it up in ICQ.
Sorry pppl but Ace informed me that noone can claim names to their own designs. So I guess we'll start seeing everyone's cool names being used by 15 different designs.
*shrug*
Sometimes I do indeed wonder why I ever bother to HELP anyone in here when they turn around and dick me like this. No worries, after GOTP's out they'll only be one official name to deal with.
Thanks for showing some honor and respect Ace...or lack there of.
So anyone else care to steal a design name of mine while we're at it? Speak up now please!
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Warlock
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Ooh, I want to make my ship the Xanthus as well! In fact, I'll name all of them the Xanthus! Mine enemies will be befuddled beyond belief! (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
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Warlock as I said over ICQ here's the easiest solution to the problem we can all be happy with:
You get the credit for the initial concept and name you deserve in tBE's credits.
For continuity which you are concerned over, wEvil's design is a variant of the ship class which you can use for your own projects.
Any problems with that arrangement?
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Ace
Staff member FreeSpace Watch
http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/ ("http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/")
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hem... I bet I should hide myself... *cough*hydra chimera gaia scylla*couh* (the only one I knew was the hydra, but it was a request, I didn't choose the name). Nobody never complained about that, they should, it seems to be such a big deal...
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Yeah, but the names themselves aren't important to the MT story, but we had them first anyhow (Hydra and Chimera anyhow) ....most importantly though, they're not even GTx ships, which does make a difference. (IMO)
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Originally posted by Shrike:
Yeah, but the names themselves aren't important to the MT story, but we had them first anyhow (Hydra and Chimera anyhow) ....most importantly though, they're not even GTx ships, which does make a difference. (IMO)
Bah, if I wanted to do my b1tch, I'd say I posted pics of them first (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif) But I really don't care. I don't remember who gave his ship the name Aegis (a GTC too, btw) after I did it, and so what? I just don't care... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
names are just names, I didn't copyrighted (?) anything...
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There's a BWO ship called the Aegis, but it's something like SMCr....
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Glad to see at least someone agrees with me. Like I told Ace I felt that alot of the purpose to HLP was continuty in FS2 mods. If we all just go about grabbing whatever names and such we choose,...what's the point? Besides it's confusing as hell! Now when I post pics and info on MY Xanthus that's how I've gotta lable it...MINE.
Ace I appreciate the offer for credit to the name,..but dude that doesn't solve the fact you yanked my ship class name,...FULLY knowing I'd taken it merely because I wasn't around for a short time. That's why I really feel no remorse about you having to re-write alot of plot line...you KNEW it was MY name when you started.
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Get over it! Some of you guys are way too obsessed.
Just have some fun.
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If this were merely about a match or something it'd have been dropped. But it's not it's about something I've been busting my *** over for well over a year now. Thus it's a bit more personal than "just a game".
Hell ask Thunder...Shrike...Styxx,...Set,..any of them...they'll tell ya when I started I didn't know how to handle crap with modding,...now I've worked up to all this and I don't like seeing MY work comprimised.
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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The number of cool names in the world are limited. Sometimes the same name for two totally different things appears, through no fault of any one but the fact that the name sounded cool at the time, and still does.
So relax. It is only a game, not a piece of art. Well, it could be art, but even artists sometimes use the same name. Yours will likely be more remembered because you've now made a big deal out of the name, but is that what you want it really remembered for? For you being all pissy about it? No, you want it remembered for being a great ship.
"Warlock's Xanthus." Think of it that way. Now take real pride in your accoplishment instead of harping on the details.
Don't be the next plaintif on Judge Judy.
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I know there is a method, but all I see is madness.
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You're not getting any money from it so don't worry.
Besides, it is an excellent model, who cares about the name. I think it's great and many others agree. That's all you should be worried about.
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Okay, this is about as silly as they come. Well, maybe not quite, but very very close.
The issue here is not a model, not a unique piece of material, but a name, based in Greek mythology. Nobody here can lay claim to the name and fighting over who had it first is completely unconsequential. There is already overlaps with so many other ships (several examples have already been mentioned) and with good reason for those overlaps. Everyone is trying to adhere to Volition's naming convention and using mythology as the source.
Both ships can be called Xanthus as someone could just as easily call another ship GTF Gologotha or GTB Golgotha or whatever. If there isn't already a ship out there with that name. Heck, there is a Ceres in BWO and someone else named a weapon platform Ceres I believe. Nobodys mad, nobodys even said anything I think. We didn't know and probably neither did the other author and the point is that it really doesn't matter.
No intellectual material was infringed apon and I think this issue is pretty moot. Both can call their ship Xanthus.
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hehe there have been 3 mods named Thor.
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Originally posted by Carl:
hehe there have been 3 mods named Thor.
I guess its because its one of the olny gods that (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/v.gif) forgot (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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Calvin (Calvin & Hobbes):
YAAH! DEATH TO OATMEAL!
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Head Campaign Manager in Knossos Campaign ("http://www.vidavision.com/entertainment/drzer0/index.html")
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"You have been overloaded with knowlage my young friend" - untouchable
[This message has been edited by Dr.Zer0 (edited 08-17-2001).]
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Originally posted by IceFire:
We didn't know and probably neither did the other author and the point is that it really doesn't matter.
In Warlock's defense, I think this is just the point. It is true that many mods have had their names over-written, but unknowingly; in this situation, Ace knew full well that Warlock had chosen the name. I think that's the root of this particular problem.
As for the Thor thing, I think there was an Odin and a Thor in Silent Threat. Remember the Jotunheim? Rogue GTI ships used a Norse naming convention.
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Set hit the nail on the head.
If it were "Sorry didn't know you were using that name" it's be no problem.
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Warlock
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DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Originally posted by Setekh:
In Warlock's defense, I think this is just the point. It is true that many mods have had their names over-written, but unknowingly; in this situation, Ace knew full well that Warlock had chosen the name. I think that's the root of this particular problem.
As for the Thor thing, I think there was an Odin and a Thor in Silent Threat. Remember the Jotunheim? Rogue GTI ships used a Norse naming convention.
Jotunheim?!?.... Oh... HEEEEEEEEELLLLLL!!! I'm fed up with names, I'll pay someone to find them for me soon... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
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I'm sorry i even came along :0/
Seriously, my designs' name was origionally the "havok" (and still is - i'm working into it and make it movie-quality atm...its maxxing my machine out quite badly though..i have to hide bits im not working on to stay above 2fps..heh)
I like the design of your ship, warlock, and im sorry i dug the issue up but it was going to happen sooner or later.
The way all this is going modders are going to start having to sign contracts and such to work on projects....maybe someone should draw up some "rules" of one sort or another so IF something turns a little sour like this we have some guidelines to follow?
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WEvil...nothing here was your fault bud (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif) Just so you know I hold nothing against you, Ace got you to design a ship for him, but he choose to use my ship's design name.
Sides I'd rather this have come out now than after I started releasing Ghosts of the Past demos and betas and have someone tell me "Hey you copied Ace's ship idea!" or some crap.
I know alot of ppl may not agree with me at all....but my view is simply when you work so long and hard on something it's rather upsetting to see someone knowingly rip it off...in full or even in part. I spent my first 2 months painstakingly emailing every single mod designer of any mod I wished to make ANY use of and if they did't reply telling me it was fine to use...I haven't.
I'm not even trying to get into copyrights and all that crap...it's much simplier ppl,...respect for your friends, fellow designers,..and this community.
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Warlock
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DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Het War, long time no see.
What's been happening in GOTP anyway, I haven't heard from any of you fors so long that I forgot about it.
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Burn Baby Burn!
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Hey Wild oh yee of dialog design! (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Don't worry buddy we'll grab ya once we've got the new GOTP site up here at HLP and Eth's into mission design phase (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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Warlock
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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It is true that many mods have had their names over-written, but unknowingly; in this situation, Ace knew full well that Warlock had chosen the name. I think that's the root of this particular problem.
I'll rebut this one since it makes the most sense. As I understand it, Warlock was to make the model for Ace (am I wrong) and when he disappeared Ace got a new modeler. Or maybe it was Ace just noticed that he dissapeared and used the name....but thats not the point. I originally told Ace (when I talked to him) that he should just change the ship name a be done with it. But he's looked up the mythology and incorporated it into the campaign. Some depth, perhaps small, will be lost with a name change and under the circumstances, I can't see that Ace has done Warlock any wrong.
Fingers are getting pointed and I once again emphasize that its just a name either way.
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Since my talking with Warlock to give him credit to avoid "rip off syndrome" and keeping the names as they are doesn't seem acceptable, and since as IceFire has said it is just a name, I've worked on siphoning through mythology to get a replacement which works.
Balius more then works since it is Xanthus' twin wanderer and won't require anything.
I do feel that a better arrangement could have been worked out, however as it is I will fully thank Warlock for the new name.
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Ace
Staff member FreeSpace Watch
http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/ ("http://freespace.volitionwatch.com/")
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Originally posted by IceFire:
I'll rebut this one since it makes the most sense. As I understand it, Warlock was to make the model for Ace (am I wrong) and when he disappeared Ace got a new modeler. Or maybe it was Ace just noticed that he dissapeared and used the name....but thats not the point. I originally told Ace (when I talked to him) that he should just change the ship name a be done with it. But he's looked up the mythology and incorporated it into the campaign. Some depth, perhaps small, will be lost with a name change and under the circumstances, I can't see that Ace has done Warlock any wrong.
Fingers are getting pointed and I once again emphasize that its just a name either way.
Actually Ace was assisting me with some texturing ideas before I finally kept the current set. For his assistance I was going to allow him use of the Xanthus in his campaign, giving him the completed ship before the release of GOTP which would be the only full release of the Xanthus.
Hence my reason for being upset, aside of him giving ideas and playing around with some texturing, which I was and still am thankful for, Ace didn't play a role in the creation of the Xanthus carrier.
I'm sorry if some of you guys feel I'm being big headed or just plain wrong here. But it was reasons such has this that I'd had my doubts abut ever truely releasing any betas or even too much of GOTP's storyline.
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Warlock
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Oh War, I had a question for you.
Thanks for the Dunbar mod you gave me a while back. I've got to the point in ATH where I need to use it but there's no table entries for it and I don't know enough to create my own. If you have some free time can you send a table file for it.
Cheers.
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Burn Baby Burn!
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Captain's Log - Stardate 200108.17
G'day Warlock.
I downloaded your Xanthus and it looks great (even though no skins were supplied). So what I did was add some textures to fullfill my imagination. I think my new skin for the Xanthus looks great (especially the engine area). I added some subsystems and a thruster effect too. Warlock, if you would like this or if you would like to just see some screenshots I made of it, feel free to drop me a line at [email protected].
End log.
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WildFire: I'll do what I can bro...you can use the entry for the Arcadia for now thou...since the version you have doesn't have any weapons or the shields yet. So it really only sits there and just about any tbl data that flags it as a station will do.
Capt: Sure I'd love to check it out. Sorry I forgot to place the textures in with it lol,..if you take a peek Set put up an image of the Xanthus that shows her real textures.
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Warlock
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DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
Do or Do Not,..There Is No Spoon
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together